Heresy 3.0 in Spring/Summer

[Astartes Consul]

They did drop Angron Transfigured on a random Friday, after the WarComm site had gone down on the Thursday afternoon, so ultimately, anything is possible...

[Mandragola]

1 hour ago, Gaz Taylor said:

While it is nice to have FAQs, unless it's something really game breaking, as a group you can muddle through it. You shouldn't have to, but it's not the end of the world.

This is a good point. Heresy's rules do have some issues in theory but they don't necessarily come up that often in real games and, when they do, players can usually find their way around them. You have things like the fairly common convention of only using one dreadnought per thousand points, for example. The panoptikon pack is a good example of the community doing good work to fix some problems - though as you say it shouldn't have to.

 

This is something I've had to adapt to when writing reviews. There have been times when a rule has seemed really broken, or to make no sense at all. I've probably made too much of some of these issues in the past*, when players are then able to get round them pretty easily. 

 

At the moment Heresy is a fun game. The lore and models are fantastic. The community really gets behind it and events are successful. There's gross imbalance between factions and units though and a lot that could be improved by a new edition. Personally I think that, while a big FAQ would be nice (and it's dreadful that we haven't had that support), the problems go a bit further than that and could best be fixed by a new edition. I hope that it comes in a form that the community can get behind.

 

*Not the Shattered Legion rules though. Those really are awful.

[Astartes Consul]

1 hour ago, Mandragola said:

This is a good point. Heresy's rules do have some issues in theory but they don't necessarily come up that often in real games and, when they do, players can usually find their way around them. You have things like the fairly common convention of only using one dreadnought per thousand points, for example. The panoptikon pack is a good example of the community doing good work to fix some problems - though as you say it shouldn't have to.

 

This is something I've had to adapt to when writing reviews. There have been times when a rule has seemed really broken, or to make no sense at all. I've probably made too much of some of these issues in the past*, when players are then able to get round them pretty easily. 

 

At the moment Heresy is a fun game. The lore and models are fantastic. The community really gets behind it and events are successful. There's gross imbalance between factions and units though and a lot that could be improved by a new edition. Personally I think that, while a big FAQ would be nice (and it's dreadful that we haven't had that support), the problems go a bit further than that and could best be fixed by a new edition. I hope that it comes in a form that the community can get behind.

 

*Not the Shattered Legion rules though. Those really are awful.

 

Agree with a lot of this - my experience playing Heresy in a friendly, chilled-out gaming group environment is that a lot of the rules as written problems rarely crop up. Through a combo of everyone agreeing not to be cheesy about things, as well as certain lists/combos generally not being seen. The latter is more of a problem I guess, as having RoW and units that are too broken or too weak to use isn't indicative of good game design. On a personal note, I've got some flyers I'd love to use, as well as several boxes of OOP Cadians that would make the basis of a great Militia detachment, but it's hard to be motivated to build something that you know is going to be crushed.

 

On the one hand, groups needing to self-correct to make a game workable suggests that the core game needs rebalancing. On the other, this is something that has happened with almost all GW games, across multiple editions. 

 

I do think that the corrections needed to the written rules would be extensive enough to merit a new rulebook, though. It would be a very long and complex set of FAQ and Errata to cover everything. That's ultimately what I'm hoping for.

[01RTB01]

2 hours ago, Astartes Consul said:

They did drop Angron Transfigured on a random Friday, after the WarComm site had gone down on the Thursday afternoon, so ultimately, anything is possible...

Random?! It was Valentine's Day. Love for the love god!

[Lord Marshal]

I'm still going with the theory we'll get a CGI trailer that will more-or-less show what we'll be getting, without presenting the physical models. In that way they'd technically not be incorrect in saying there's no Heresy models being previewed. 

 

And then they might do a sneaky Heresy Thursday with a single MkII like they did back at 2.0.

 

Edited March 26 by Lord Marshal

[01RTB01]

6 minutes ago, Lord Marshal said:

I'm still going with the theory we'll get a CGI trailer that will more-or-less show what we'll be getting, without presenting the physical models. In that way they'd technically not be incorrect in saying there's no Heresy models being previewed. 

 

And then they might do a sneaky Heresy Thursday with a single MkII like they did back at 2.0.

 

 

Unfortunately "the internet" will no doubt react to the 'no heresy ' in the preview as fact and kick off. 

 

I'm in total agreement with what you've said and expect this to be the case. Patience on behalf of people wouldn't go amiss as the preview is tomorrow. Not overly long to wait at all. 

[Mogger351]

4 minutes ago, 01RTB01 said:

 

Unfortunately "the internet" will no doubt react to the 'no heresy ' in the preview as fact and kick off. 

 

I'm in total agreement with what you've said and expect this to be the case. Patience on behalf of people wouldn't go amiss as the preview is tomorrow. Not overly long to wait at all. 

That's what reddit did, except they sort of celebrated and decried any mention of a 3rd ed.

[sarabando]

1 hour ago, 01RTB01 said:

 

Unfortunately "the internet" will no doubt react to the 'no heresy ' in the preview as fact and kick off. 

 

I'm in total agreement with what you've said and expect this to be the case. Patience on behalf of people wouldn't go amiss as the preview is tomorrow. Not overly long to wait at all. 

well why shouldnt they? if offical sources have said a specific game wont be talked about at a reveal show people have a right to be upset, they are passionate after all. Now the issue comes from if this is "it wont be shown" or "it wont be shown *wink*" because frankly people in my community are getting pretty bored of being misled for hype. 

[StratoKhan]

Last year there was no Heresy at Adepticon. So GW are being consistent in that regard.

[Matcap86]

30 minutes ago, sarabando said:

well why shouldnt they? if offical sources have said a specific game wont be talked about at a reveal show people have a right to be upset, they are passionate after all. Now the issue comes from if this is "it wont be shown" or "it wont be shown *wink*" because frankly people in my community are getting pretty bored of being misled for hype. 

 

Eh, the only reason people are upset is that internet rumors said there's something big happening. GW does nothing wrong here. (I'm also annoyed there's no Heresy, but the only reason I got my hopes up were internet rumors not GW mismanaging expectations).

 

All I'm saying is: focus the annoyance at the right source. HH just got a ton of stuff released. Would it be nice if there was more? Sure. But it's hardly GW who led the community to believe that is imminent.

[Unknown Legionnaire]

Precisely. We had a steady flow of product for HH 2.0  -  regardless if one liked the aesthetic of the new(er) models or not.

 

And the rules at the moment, as they are, are QUITE alright, to be honest. Yes, sure, they could use a new and compiled FAQ,

yadda yadda, but if people (as in 'players') are so stupidly competitive or WAAC that they can't smooth out minor rules hickups in your gaming group, 

well then they should probably be playing a different game. 

 

And no, people have absolutely no reason to be upset, not over a game and / or it's release schedule (that wasn't even announced).

 

What is it with people and extremely short tempers and even shorter attention spans in this time and age ?

 

Personally, I'll stick to Heresy, regardless if it's 1.0 or 2.5 or Edition Pi ... because I'm invested in the story and modelling aspects.

 

And to no one in particular, but ... don't like the game anymore ? Go and 'play' a different one then. Easy as that.

[Jings]

On 3/25/2025 at 2:13 PM, Gaz Taylor said:

Personally I understand why GW creates new editions as it generates sales and it's always exciting when a new editions appears (well I think it is!). I understand why some people aren't a fan and also probably suffering from edition fatigue. I'd suggest a break or trying to play in a slightly different way.

 

The man bursts into tears. "But doctor," he cried, "this was me trying to play in a slightly different way!" 

 

I'm buying the expensive toys. I'm painting the expensive toys. When I can, I'm playing with the expensive toys. A new edition in and of itself isn't the issue, it's the speed at which they'll be coming out going forward. 

 

My biggest fear with edition churn is that it will lead to the same simplification and removal of options and granularity that has ruined 40k. GW have, in my mind, prioritised annual profit spikes from new editions over solid game development and I don't want to see it happen to Heresy. 

[Mogger351]

30 minutes ago, Jings said:

 

The man bursts into tears. "But doctor," he cried, "this was me trying to play in a slightly different way!" 

 

I'm buying the expensive toys. I'm painting the expensive toys. When I can, I'm playing with the expensive toys. A new edition in and of itself isn't the issue, it's the speed at which they'll be coming out going forward. 

 

My biggest fear with edition churn is that it will lead to the same simplification and removal of options and granularity that has ruined 40k. GW have, in my mind, prioritised annual profit spikes from new editions over solid game development and I don't want to see it happen to Heresy. 

Well they can't claim it's for balance since they haven't been doing that anyway for HH.

[Joe]

2 hours ago, StratoKhan said:

Last year there was no Heresy at Adepticon. So GW are being consistent in that regard.

 

Incorrect; 2024 had a short teaser trailer for the Mars book.

 

2023 was the Siege of Cthonia campaign book, and 2022 was the reveal of Heresy 2E and our first look at the new plastic Mark VI. Basically, every AdeptiCon that Games Workshop has attended has had Heresy content of some form.

[StratoKhan]

I stand corrected. 

[ZeroWolf]

1 hour ago, Jings said:

 

The man bursts into tears. "But doctor," he cried, "this was me trying to play in a slightly different way!" 

 

I'm buying the expensive toys. I'm painting the expensive toys. When I can, I'm playing with the expensive toys. A new edition in and of itself isn't the issue, it's the speed at which they'll be coming out going forward. 

 

My biggest fear with edition churn is that it will lead to the same simplification and removal of options and granularity that has ruined 40k. GW have, in my mind, prioritised annual profit spikes from new editions over solid game development and I don't want to see it happen to Heresy. 

I think GW understand that the markets for HH and 40k are different so will let SGs do what they want (as long as its profitable.. which it most be to still exist) so I can't see them adopting the 10th edition framework. 

 

For all we know at this junction, an edition change for HH just means little rules tweaks and clean ups. Issue is at this point, we have no official information, no official confirmation of anything happening to HH. All this were going off is rumours, and as the big lad himself says: " all rumours are lies till GW themselves confirm it on their channels"

[Mr Farson]

I think a lot of the gnashing of teeth comes around that marines have been neglected as of late in plastic kits.

 

Marine players make up the bulk of 30k and since the assault squad came out the generic content has really dropped off. The command squad ended up being a frame and the melee weapons were hilariously late.

 

Resin consuls are fine but don't really allow people to army build very well, the special characters revealed again don't plug the army building gap and poor salamanders still haven't had anything at all ( The only legion at all now)

 

 

[Jings]

7 hours ago, ZeroWolf said:

I think GW understand that the markets for HH and 40k are different so will let SGs do what they want (as long as its profitable.. which it most be to still exist) so I can't see them adopting the 10th edition framework. 

 

For all we know at this junction, an edition change for HH just means little rules tweaks and clean ups. Issue is at this point, we have no official information, no official confirmation of anything happening to HH. All this were going off is rumours, and as the big lad himself says: " all rumours are lies till GW themselves confirm it on their channels"

 

I don't think it would be an immediate change. It would be gradual, as with all things, but more frequent edition changes allow for more frequent gradual gameplay changes. 

 

I'm of the opinion that both flavours of Warhammer were given a soft reboot with the express purpose of simplifying the game for new blood and pushing existing players to start new armies. I think it's quite objective to state that that approach has been highly successful from a business point of view. 

 

My worry now is that GW have invested a lot into HH, but it's not getting the player crossover they expected. In the FLGS in my new town, it seems no one is playing g Heresy, but Combat Patrol and 40K are popular. If I were to hazard a guess, it's because the rules for Heresy are a lot more complicated than the mainline games and it puts people off. Now, for me that's fine, as that'd how I like it. But for a business, you want the game to be accessible (read: simple) to bring in a larger player base, and with it laying customers.

 

I wouldn't be too worried but for the fact Valrak has said it's a new edition. My present cope is that the new box will be replacement starter box with a slightly updated rulebook. That I could stomach. 

[01RTB01]

Interesting as I expected to see a trailer. Not disappointed though as we know it's coming regardless. 

[WrathOfTheLion]

2 hours ago, Jings said:

My worry now is that GW have invested a lot into HH, but it's not getting the player crossover they expected. In the FLGS in my new town, it seems no one is playing g Heresy, but Combat Patrol and 40K are popular. If I were to hazard a guess, it's because the rules for Heresy are a lot more complicated than the mainline games and it puts people off. Now, for me that's fine, as that'd how I like it. But for a business, you want the game to be accessible (read: simple) to bring in a larger player base, and with it laying customers.

I think their strategy is to appeal to different markets, however. Horus Heresy and Old World are there to offer a path of retention for older customers that they'd otherwise lose for that reason. That's at least the way I see them going.

[Gorgoff]

11 hours ago, Mr Farson said:

Resin consuls are fine but don't really allow people to army build very well, the special characters revealed again don't plug the army building gap 

What do you mean by that?

[Mr Farson]

53 minutes ago, Gorgoff said:

What do you mean by that?

Resin consuls are by and large a one off purchase or something you convert to make it fit into your version of your army.

 

Army building with units where you might buy in multiple boxes to make a bike force for example.

 

[ZeroWolf]

3 hours ago, WrathOfTheLion said:

I think their strategy is to appeal to different markets, however. Horus Heresy and Old World are there to offer a path of retention for older customers that they'd otherwise lose for that reason. That's at least the way I see them going.

This is how I see it. Looking at my area though, HH plays second fiddle to TOW (after 40k / AoS)

[Unknown Legionnaire]

16 hours ago, 01RTB01 said:

 Not disappointed though as we know it's coming regardless. 

 

How though ?

 

And please don't say Valrak.

 

From my (of course limited) understanding, there's still not hard facts.

 

Edited March 27 by Unknown Legionnaire

[Spagunk]

What kind of facts are you looking for?