Space Wolves refresh

[Joe]

I would highly recommend looking at previous mid-edition updates for products from the Specialist Games Studio, notably the two "big" ones; Middle-earth and Necromunda. Both of which had mid-edition updates that weren't marketed as new editions, but rather opportunities during which erratas, FAQs and other balance changes were applied.

 

MESBG has since gone on to have an actual new edition (after six years), whilst Necromunda has had various .5 (.2?) updates applied as new versions of the core box are released without shifting to a new edition. And Necromunda is rapidly approaching being a ten-year old system at this stage.

[TheMawr]

18 minutes ago, Joe said:

I would highly recommend looking at previous mid-edition updates for products from the Specialist Games Studio, notably the two "big" ones; Middle-earth and Necromunda. Both of which had mid-edition updates that weren't marketed as new editions, but rather opportunities during which erratas, FAQs and other balance changes were applied.

 

MESBG has since gone on to have an actual new edition (after six years), whilst Necromunda has had various .5 (.2?) updates applied as new versions of the core box are released without shifting to a new edition. And Necromunda is rapidly approaching being a ten-year old system at this stage.

 

Thats also a thing I find suprising, FW/SGS doesnt really do the edition churn thing, even horus heresy has had plenty of boxsets that did not switch the edition. It doesnt really fit their approach to rules, and its very clear they are still in control/free to tackle the games the way they want. ( because if they werent, removing the no model no rule thing would be far more likely to be enforced than having them adjust to the 3 year edition cycle.)

 

[HeadlessCross]

On 3/31/2025 at 2:14 AM, Karhedron said:

 

Special weapons are probably not too big a deal. No one takes Tactical squads over Intercessors for the single heavy and special weapon they can take. 

There's a whole multitude of why Tactical Squads aren't taken though. 

[Evil Eye]

Sadly heavy/special weapons are one of those things that seem to have fallen victim to scale/scope creep. In smaller games, a meltagun or plasma cannon in a squad could make quite the impact (and the added mobility and protection of a Rhino would make them even more scary). With average games having more and bigger models nowadays though, a single weapon on one infantry model is unlikely to make much of a difference.

 

Now personally I really don't like this and I think the scale/scope creep has been dreadful for the overall quality of the game (I've said before how the need to accomodate and balance around super-heavies at any game level has been a key factor in the skewing and oversimplification of 40K's design) but GW make too much money from selling bigger and more ridiculous models every chance they get, and short of a complete implosion of the current audience such that they have no choice but to abandon the hobby trumpet and try to win back fans of the more traditionally wargame-y design concept, it's not about to change anytime soon.

 

It is a shame, though; I always thought special/heavy weapons added a lot of character to units, same as Command for WHFB (I'm getting into Fantasy's 6th Edition and always make sure to give my units full Command, as even though they actually weren't all that important in 6E it's just too fun to have a banner, musician and champion in every unit). On the plus side, at least with 3D printing being a thing converting the newer models to wield printed weapons isn't too difficult, assuming you don't want to print the entire model.

 

On a tangent I really, REALLY hope Bjorn stays. I don't think he's likely to get the boot as quite aside from anything else he's such an iconic and well-loved character (not to mention the oldest living Space Marine who isn't a Primarch) that killing him off might actually cause riots in Nottingham. I suspect he'll get a new Redemptor-sized chassis, which would mildly annoy me but would be better than "Oh and then we killed him BUT LOOK ANOTHER SODDING PRIMARCH IS BACK PLEASE CLAP". Plus if anyone would deserve a massive bespoke Dreadnought hull it'd be Bjorn.

[Moonstalker]

Bjorn was my usual HQ when I first started playing 40k, the third kit I bought for my space wolves army (the first two being a box of Blood Claws and a box of Grey Hunters, sometime around 2003).  I don't want to see him go, but there's so much working against him.  GW has already cut regular dreadnoughts for normal marines, including the venerable dreadnought.  They've been culling character dreadnoughts.  We know Wolves are getting a data sheet cut.  Murderfang, Bjorn, and the SW Venerable Dreadnought all share the same kit.  It may mean nothing considering GW's issues with keeping anything in stock, but that kit is out of stock on the web store.  Personally, I just don't see him continuing to be a unit in the new dex.

 

That doesn't mean they will kill him off, however.  Eldar lost Karandras in their new dex; he's not dead, just Sir Not Appearing In This Episode.  Bjorn may similarly lose his model and have his rules sent to Legends, until such time as his return is narratively (or monetarily) suitable - like the return of Russ.  I suspect this is the route they will go, removing his rules and model but keeping him alive in lore.

 

Part of me wonders if there might be more foul xenos sorcery/the Emperor's divine touch/technology at play in his return.  I'm not sure if it would be a good thing or a bad thing to have Bjorn returned to health, Primaris-ized, fighting alongside Russ like he did during the Heresy, but it strikes me as something that GW might do.  It circumvents whatever they seem to have against character dreadnoughts, and a single character kit is cheaper than a dreadnought kit.

[Karhedron]

I wonder what the eventual space Wolves Combat Patrol will have? I wonder if it will have some of the rumoured Wolf Guard Terminators in it. Blood Angels had a DC themed army box with Sanguinary Guard and the new captain in the CP. Wolves look like focusing on PA infantry in the army box so I can see Terminators potentially going in the CP.

[RS1169]

2 hours ago, Karhedron said:

I wonder what the eventual space Wolves Combat Patrol will have? I wonder if it will have some of the rumoured Wolf Guard Terminators in it. Blood Angels had a DC themed army box with Sanguinary Guard and the new captain in the CP. Wolves look like focusing on PA infantry in the army box so I can see Terminators potentially going in the CP.

Good shout. If they go big standard infantry instead of terminators I can see blood claws being the troop and then like 6 head takers with the pups  and WGBL. Follows close to the recent EC one of lord, 10 infractors and 6 faultless blades

[TheNicronomicon]

1 hour ago, RS1169 said:

Good shout. If they go big standard infantry instead of terminators I can see blood claws being the troop and then like 6 head takers with the pups  and WGBL. Follows close to the recent EC one of lord, 10 infractors and 6 faultless blades

I like your reasoning but I'm not so sure about the Headtakers being in there. Faultless Blades weren't in the army box, so a player who bought the CP after buying the box would be adding an additional battleline unit plus a whole new unit.

If the two releases are symmetrical, then maybe there's another elite unit coming. Maybe Wolf Scouts to pair with Wolf Guard Terminators?

Now which character do you think they'd add? Hoping for the wolf priest, personally. (Maybe we'll get the terminators, the priest, and a pack of Wulfen?)

[WrathOfTheLion]

GW does like to be inconsistent in those boxes, so we'll have to see what they do. Wolf Scouts were in the rumors for this release, and those have been fairly reliable thus far.

 

I do hope Bjorn sticks around, he's always a favorite. I think I'd really rather see him released still as kind of a redone/rescaled box dreadnought, if they do ever redo that kit.

[Marshal Mittens]

Bjorn is, lore wise, holding the fort  down until Russ returns. I wonder if they will kill off Bjorn in thr return of Russ. Like he kept the light on all these years and can rest now that Russ is here.

Edited yesterday at 11:14 AM by Marshal Mittens

[Dark Shepherd]

Bjorn strikes me as the type of model that non Wolves or even non marine players would buy in large numbers because of his significance

 

Have doubts he'd get a quad build kit like at present. Generic Wulfen dreads only came about with 9th ed codex so can see them going (and Murderfang)

 

As an aside I presume Wolves will still get a new upgrade sprue? Although maybe not on launch

Edited yesterday at 11:35 AM by Dark Shepherd

[Joe]

Dark Angels and Blood Angels both received miscellaneous upgrade sprues - however, unlike Space Wolves they don't have bespoke Troops choices in the same vein as Blood Claws / Grey Hunters. I reckon we'll still see a sprue, though.

[Nephaston]

2 hours ago, Joe said:

Dark Angels and Blood Angels both received miscellaneous upgrade sprues - however, unlike Space Wolves they don't have bespoke Troops choices in the same vein as Blood Claws / Grey Hunters. I reckon we'll still see a sprue, though.

Upgrade sprue is half wolf companions to sprinkle into the army like the headtakers.

[Grimtooth]

If they were to remove Bjorn, I doubt it will be a kill, but as mentioned, a fade out of general use into Legends only. 
 

There will be something like, “The process to awaken Bjorn from deep within the Awtt has become more difficult over the centuries and now he has fallen so deep into the cold dreams of his past battles, he is likely never to awaken from his slumber again.”

 

And then Russ comes back and wakes him up!

[sbarnby71]

17 minutes ago, Grimtooth said:

If they were to remove Bjorn, I doubt it will be a kill, but as mentioned, a fade out of general use into Legends only. 
 

There will be something like, “The process to awaken Bjorn from deep within the Awtt has become more difficult over the centuries and now he has fallen so deep into the cold dreams of his past battles, he is likely never to awaken from his slumber again.”

 

And then Russ comes back and wakes him up!

Something along the lines of well all the Iron Priests only know electric motors now, not much call for internal combustion anymore. I mean we could get the parts, but it's gonna cost ya, might be best to keep him as a weekend run-around.

[LittlePlasticHomies]

2 hours ago, sbarnby71 said:

Something along the lines of well all the Iron Priests only know electric motors now, not much call for internal combustion anymore. I mean we could get the parts, but it's gonna cost ya, might be best to keep him as a weekend run-around.

Sorry, the tariff on Baal-made dreadnought gas is just prohibitively expensive. 

[Deus_Ex_Machina]

23 hours ago, Evil Eye said:

Sadly heavy/special weapons are one of those things that seem to have fallen victim to scale/scope creep. In smaller games, a meltagun or plasma cannon in a squad could make quite the impact (and the added mobility and protection of a Rhino would make them even more scary). With average games having more and bigger models nowadays though, a single weapon on one infantry model is unlikely to make much of a difference.

 

Now personally I really don't like this and I think the scale/scope creep has been dreadful for the overall quality of the game (I've said before how the need to accomodate and balance around super-heavies at any game level has been a key factor in the skewing and oversimplification of 40K's design) but GW make too much money from selling bigger and more ridiculous models every chance they get, and short of a complete implosion of the current audience such that they have no choice but to abandon the hobby trumpet and try to win back fans of the more traditionally wargame-y design concept, it's not about to change anytime soon.

 

It is a shame, though; I always thought special/heavy weapons added a lot of character to units, same as Command for WHFB (I'm getting into Fantasy's 6th Edition and always make sure to give my units full Command, as even though they actually weren't all that important in 6E it's just too fun to have a banner, musician and champion in every unit). On the plus side, at least with 3D printing being a thing converting the newer models to wield printed weapons isn't too difficult, assuming you don't want to print the entire model.

 

On a tangent I really, REALLY hope Bjorn stays. I don't think he's likely to get the boot as quite aside from anything else he's such an iconic and well-loved character (not to mention the oldest living Space Marine who isn't a Primarch) that killing him off might actually cause riots in Nottingham. I suspect he'll get a new Redemptor-sized chassis, which would mildly annoy me but would be better than "Oh and then we killed him BUT LOOK ANOTHER SODDING PRIMARCH IS BACK PLEASE CLAP". Plus if anyone would deserve a massive bespoke Dreadnought hull it'd be Bjorn.

Bjorn will be retired and reborn in an upcoming, supersized Hammerfall bunker which he can operate. It all makes sense. Really. Just imagine how many wolf pelts and talsimans you can hang onto his structure. It´s the Wolf Time baby and desperate times demand desperate measures!

[TheMawr]

1 hour ago, Deus_Ex_Machina said:

Bjorn will be retired and reborn in an upcoming, supersized Hammerfall bunker which he can operate. It all makes sense. Really. Just imagine how many wolf pelts and talsimans you can hang onto his structure. It´s the Wolf Time baby and desperate times demand desperate measures!

 

But is that Hammerfall Bjornker pulled by thunder wolves.. that is the most important matter

[TheNicronomicon]

53 minutes ago, TheMawr said:

 

But is that Hammerfall Bjornker pulled by thunder wolves.. that is the most important matter

Literally did a spit-take at "Bjornker" so thjank yöu for that, brüder

[Commissar Greif]

On 4/1/2025 at 2:03 PM, Evil Eye said:

On a tangent I really, REALLY hope Bjorn stays. I don't think he's likely to get the boot as quite aside from anything else he's such an iconic and well-loved character (not to mention the oldest living Space Marine who isn't a Primarch) that killing him off might actually cause riots in Nottingham. I suspect he'll get a new Redemptor-sized chassis, which would mildly annoy me but would be better than "Oh and then we killed him BUT LOOK ANOTHER SODDING PRIMARCH IS BACK PLEASE CLAP". Plus if anyone would deserve a massive bespoke Dreadnought hull it'd be Bjorn.

I really don't see Bjorn dying at least until Leman Russ comes back. So much of his temperament and personality now hinges on his feelings of inadequacy and abandonment following Russ' journey to the Eye of Terror. It seems almost too obvious to have him die shortly after Leman Russ returns for that tragic final reunion.

[Wolf Guard Dan]

GW has to understand how culturally important Bjorn is to the space wolf players. They must keep Bjorn alive until Leman Russ is back to die in battle alongside his primarch.

 

If no Bjorn rules it increases the change of Leman Russ being back by end of 10th/early 11th. If Bjorn gets a new model we will be waiting awhile on Russ.

[Deus_Ex_Machina]

14 hours ago, TheMawr said:

 

But is that Hammerfall Bjornker pulled by thunder wolves.. that is the most important matter

Of course. But they pull in all directions with equal strength ensuring that the Bjornker stays in place. 

[Moonstalker]

Thought I would take a deeper look at who is staying, and who is going.  We know we're going to 20 datasheets, and the wait to know what's getting cut is probably getting to most of us.  So, I looked at the current roster of datasheets and started going through them with an eye toward what their model support was.

 

First, I want to look at Blood Claws and Grey Hunters.  We know we're getting new kits for these units, but what about the old kit?  Right now it's doing triple duty: it provides Wolves with the Blood Claw, Grey Hunter, and Wolf Guard kits, all from the same sprues.  That kit is going to get retired, and I think the implications from that are that we will lose Wolf Guard and all varieties of Wolf Guard Pack Leader.  They will have no models.  But that we get BC and GH implies to me that GW want to keep the core of the faction's divergence - the progression from Blood Claw, to Grey Hunter, to Long Fang - intact.  Wolf Guard has representation in Headtakers and Wolf Guard in Terminator Armor (who may receive a snazzy new name with their rumored new kit?).  Wolf Scouts and Long Fangs do not have kits, and that makes their placement a little uncertain.

 

Alongside the new WGBL and Wolf Priest kits, we've got Ragnar with his primaris-ized kit.  They're not really anything more than Reivers with an upgrade sprue in the box, but I believe Hounds of Morkai are staying.  It's possible we will have Hounds of Morkai as our elite wolf scouts.  Krom Dragongaze, the Iron Priest, and Ulrik the Slayer all have plastic kits, but are firstborn - I believe they will stay, though I think there is a very strong argument for the Iron Priest going (the Primaris Techmarine datasheet is largely identical).  The Stormfang and Stormwolf seem like they'll stick around, as much as no one really wants flyers this edition.  They're some of my least favorite models, but the Wulfen kit seems likely to stay.

 

Who is going?  Top of the list is Logan on Stormrider.  The rumors we have say that Logan is getting a new model and the sled is going.  That simplifies two sheets into one.  Aside from the many varieties of Wolf Guard Pack Leader that I believe to be going, we've also got several varieties of Wolf Guard Battle Leader without kits.  The characters on Thunderwolves either lack kits or have resin kits, which are likely to go.  Lukas has no current kit.  Arjac and Njal have resin kits, but are rumored to be getting new plastic.  Skyclaws have no current kit.

 

As stated earlier in the thread, I think the Space Wolves Dreadnought kit is getting retired.  Like the BC/GH/WG box, this kit builds multiple units/characters, but GW is moving away from the Castraferrum dreadnought in general and dreadnought characters in particular.  I think that's one kit and four datasheets cut.  So where does that leave us?

 

Staying:

Blood Claws (Confirmed new kit)

Grey Hunters (Confirmed new kit)

Headtakers (Confirmed new kit)

Wolf Priest (Confirmed new kit)

Wolf Guard Battle Leader (Confirmed new kit)

Ragnar (new, Primaris)

Hounds of Morkai (new, Primaris)

Njal (Rumored new kit)

Arjac (Rumored new kit)

Logan (Rumored new kit)

Wolf Guard in Terminator Armor (Rumored new kit)

Stormfang Gunship (Plastic)

Stormwolf (Plastic)

Wulfen (Plastic)

Krom Dragongaze (Firsborn, but plastic)

Ulrik the Slayer (Firstborn, but plastic)

Iron Priest (Firstborn, but plastic)

 

Going:

Logan on Stormrider (rumored kit change)

Wolf Guard (loss of shared BC/GH kit, Headtakers replacement?)

Wolf Guard Pack Leader - on foot, in TDA, with jump pack (no models, we're probably losing this mechanic entirely)

Wolf Guard Battle Leader - in TDA, on TWC (no models)

Lukas the Trickster (no model)

Skyclaws (no model)

Wolf Lord on TWC - (resin)

Canis Wolfborn - (resin)

Harald Deathwolf (resin)

Cyberwolf (resin)

Bjorn (retiring castraferrum multikit)

Murderfang (retiring castraferrum multikit)

Wulfen Dreadnought (retiring castraferrum multikit)

SW Venerable Dreadnought (retiring castraferrum multikit)

 

This leaves only four datasheets unsorted: Wolf Scouts (no kit), Long Fangs (no kit), Fenrisian Wolves (plastic), and Thunderwolf Cavalry (plastic).  I would like to think that TWC, Long Fangs, and Wolf Scouts are all going to make it to the included list and Fenrisian Wolves are getting cut, but one thing bothers me.  When GW have talked about the Headtakers, the wolves they come with are supposedly fielded as a "separate unit."  I don't know if this means that they will have their own datasheet.  Optimistically, though, I think this means the old Fenrisian Wolves kit (it is from 2011...) is being retired and you'll get your share of battle barks by bringing Headtakers and their pets.  And this means that my initial read would be correct, that we will maintain the BC -> GH -> LF pipeline with scouts and wolf guard.  But I could also see a world where scouts get cut with Hounds of Morkai as their replacement.

Edited 32 minutes ago by Moonstalker

[Grimtooth]

26 minutes ago, Moonstalker said:

Thought I would take a deeper look at who is staying, and who is going.  We know we're going to 20 datasheets, and the wait to know what's getting cut is probably getting to most of us.  So, I looked at the current roster of datasheets and started going through them with an eye toward what their model support was.

 

First, I want to look at Blood Claws and Grey Hunters.  We know we're getting new kits for these units, but what about the old kit?  Right now it's doing triple duty: it provides Wolves with the Blood Claw, Grey Hunter, and Wolf Guard kits, all from the same sprues.  That kit is going to get retired, and I think the implications from that are that we will lose Wolf Guard and all varieties of Wolf Guard Pack Leader.  They will have no models.  But that we get BC and GH implies to me that GW want to keep the core of the faction's divergence - the progression from Blood Claw, to Grey Hunter, to Long Fang - intact.  Wolf Guard has representation in Headtakers and Wolf Guard in Terminator Armor (who may receive a snazzy new name with their rumored new kit?).  Wolf Scouts and Long Fangs do not have kits, and that makes their placement a little uncertain.

 

Alongside the new WGBL and Wolf Priest kits, we've got Ragnar with his primaris-ized kit.  They're not really anything more than Reivers with an upgrade sprue in the box, but I believe Hounds of Morkai are staying.  It's possible we will have Hounds of Morkai as our elite wolf scouts.  Krom Dragongaze, the Iron Priest, and Ulrik the Slayer all have plastic kits, but are firstborn - I believe they will stay, though I think there is a very strong argument for the Iron Priest going (the Primaris Techmarine datasheet is largely identical).  The Stormfang and Stormwolf seem like they'll stick around, as much as no one really wants flyers this edition.  They're some of my least favorite models, but the Wulfen kit seems likely to stay.

 

Who is going?  Top of the list is Logan on Stormrider.  The rumors we have say that Logan is getting a new model and the sled is going.  That simplifies two sheets into one.  Aside from the many varieties of Wolf Guard Pack Leader that I believe to be going, we've also got several varieties of Wolf Guard Battle Leader without kits.  The characters on Thunderwolves either lack kits or have resin kits, which are likely to go.  Lukas has no current kit.  Arjac and Njal have resin kits, but are rumored to be getting new plastic.  Skyclaws have no current kit.

 

As stated earlier in the thread, I think the Space Wolves Dreadnought kit is getting retired.  Like the BC/GH/WG box, this kit builds multiple units/characters, but GW is moving away from the Castraferrum dreadnought in general and dreadnought characters in particular.  I think that's one kit and four datasheets cut.  So where does that leave us?

 

Staying:

Blood Claws (Confirmed new kit)

Grey Hunters (Confirmed new kit)

Headtakers (Confirmed new kit)

Wolf Priest (Confirmed new kit)

Wolf Guard Battle Leader (Confirmed new kit)

Ragnar (new, Primaris)

Hounds of Morkai (new, Primaris)

Njal (Rumored new kit)

Arjac (Rumored new kit)

Logan (Rumored new kit)

Wolf Guard in Terminator Armor (Rumored new kit)

Stormfang Gunship (Plastic)

Stormwolf (Plastic)

Wulfen (Plastic)

Krom Dragongaze (Firsborn, but plastic)

Ulrik the Slayer (Firstborn, but plastic)

Iron Priest (Firstborn, but plastic)

 

Going:

Logan on Stormrider (rumored kit change)

Wolf Guard (loss of shared BC/GH kit, Headtakers replacement?)

Wolf Guard Pack Leader - on foot, in TDA, with jump pack (no models, we're probably losing this mechanic entirely)

Wolf Guard Battle Leader - in TDA, on TWC (no models)

Lukas the Trickster (no model)

Skyclaws (no model)

Wolf Lord on TWC - (resin)

Canis Wolfborn - (resin)

Harald Deathwolf (resin)

Cyberwolf (resin)

Bjorn (retiring castraferrum multikit)

Murderfang (retiring castraferrum multikit)

Wulfen Dreadnought (retiring castraferrum multikit)

SW Venerable Dreadnought (retiring castraferrum multikit)

 

This leaves only four datasheets unsorted: Wolf Scouts (no kit), Long Fangs (no kit), Fenrisian Wolves (plastic), and Thunderwolf Cavalry (plastic).  I would like to think that TWC, Long Fangs, and Wolf Scouts are all going to make it to the included list and Fenrisian Wolves are getting cut, but one thing bothers me.  When GW have talked about the Headtakers, the wolves they come with are supposedly fielded as a "separate unit."  I don't know if this means that they will have their own datasheet.  Optimistically, though, I think this means the old Fenrisian Wolves kit (it is from 2011...) is being retired and you'll get your share of battle barks by bringing Headtakers and their pets.  And this means that my initial read would be correct, that we will maintain the BC -> GH -> LF pipeline with scouts and wolf guard.  But I could also see a world where scouts get cut with Hounds of Morkai as their replacement.

Sky Claws are literally the new Blood Claw kit with Intercessor jump packs tossed in it.