World Eaters Codex Leak

[Prot]

Well I'm shocked no one has brought this up, but the rules have been leaked. Kudos go out to hardcore Khorn channel Blog for the Blood god.

 

 

Some really bad news in here. I know the way I play World Eaters will change quite a bit (unit wise).  

 

But there's some hope, while Angron may very well be dead, there's some nice alternative stuff that could be cool.

[Rain]

There was a thread about it in News, but very few forum regulars play WE. The loss of A&C and FNP blessings had been leaked prior, but people were in denial about it.

 

Given some time to think about it, I think the biggest problems are S4 zerks, and loss of armywide FNP. A&C was unreliable anyway unless you played VoW, which is now much worse relative to other detachments due to loss of guaranteed A&C. Also, I don’t understand why Terminators were nerfed.

 

The best detachment is still probably Berzerker Warband as +2 str + 1 attack across the board when charging is very good, does not require additional conditions, (other than getting the charge off), and applies to things that don’t/can’t take a transport like Juggerlords, Demon Princes, Helbrutes, etc. It also lets you give zerks A&C for 1 CP. Juggerlord now accelerates his zerker squad to his movement, and grants 3 inch engagement range which will be fun, especially when they can reliably be given A&C.

Goretread looks like a lot of fun, but its bonus requires the unit to have disembarked that turn, making it much more conditional and limited. Disembarking and charging from a Rhino after it has moved for 1 CP is good, but BW  gives A&C to zerks for that same 1 CP which works similarly in practice when disembarking from a stationary Rhino. Big plusses for Goretread are the Fights First enhancement, vehicle reactive move, and being able to walk a Helbrute through walls.

 

 

[MadEdric]

I like what I see. The loss of A&C doesn't seem that bad to me, given that all units have +2" of movement. Basically getting a lesser movement boost overall, but it always being there instead of needing a roll for it is also good. Come on, in VoW, how potent do you think having Sustained and Lethal hits, plus Dev Wounds on your vessels will be? That seems like a scary combo to me.

Bezerker Warband is the winner here for me. Mainly because it, and VoW , are Detachments I have models to play with. The Cultist, 8bound, and Demon Detachments would require me to buy a large number of models I don't really want, but could see me working towards one of them. Especially the Cultist/monster focused one. I do love my monsters. Though I am not too keen on Detachments that focus on only a portion of units in a codex.

The Goretread detachment could be fun, I do have a few rhinos that still need to be finished to get that one really working. It really does want around 3-4 units in rhinos to start working.

All in all, I'm excited to see what my Sons of Daedalus can do when they were tempted by Khorne in their early days of lore.

[Rain]

The 2” movement was moved from BoK to being baked in. Obviously having it baked in is better, but it was a guaranteed bonus previously, so you always got it in the turns when it mattered.

 

While yes, VoW can stack 3 melee buffs (rolls permitting), it has to get to melee first, and it has no movement enhancing strats. It went from having guaranteed A&C on multiple units, to having no access to A&C at all, as well as no transport shenanigans like Goretreads. Dev wounds is rumored to be against infantry only, but if it’s against all, VoW will at least benefit from some guaranteed big-stuff killing power, which is otherwise a bit of a gap.

 

All told, VoW now mostly feels like Berzerker Warband but mostly worse.

[Prot]

With the potential death of Angron in this codex, I will probably add more characters, and this also opens up the transport detachment which I think could be fun with Lance. 

 

I did really think that the similar detachment in the Emperor's Children codex was really under estimated. So I'll probably give this a shot. (It will be a flashback to World Eaters of 3rd edition!)

[Ezekyle_Abaddon]

The Khorne Daemonkin detachment also looks like it might have some promise. If the wording is correct that Daemon units benefit from blood tithes, then both Angron and Eightbound get buffed there.

 

I'd imagine that points will come down across the board, which would makes us more hoardy, but not too much

 

Assuming angry ron gets big points, cut running a couple Bloodthristers + Him sounds like a great time in Khorne Daemons

 

Edit: Welp, this was moot as the wording specifies World Eaters and Blood Legion units, not the Daemon keyword

Edited April 25 by Ezekyle_Abaddon

[Archaeinox]

https://imgur.com/a/world-eaters-leaks-477mCAB?fbclid=IwY2xjawJ3HlZleHRuA2FlbQIxMABicmlkETFBNGJNSEN6bkNMQnN5OHk5AR7ePCPxQieMtyLRW1sqCY71X_bE5Mck_AdiP2w7oNH0XLpwgjxvIgE_vQiQnw_aem_tgJ3odlHMRvKKaTI_IgPUg

 

 

[Tallarn Commander]

Hmm, a bunch of my units got a shot in the arm. As Prot notes, the transport detachment really reminds me of how World Eaters was played back in the day. Now we just need to get our old Blood Tithe table back. 

 

I think that I'll have to give World Eaters a chance again after the Tacoma Open in July. Huzzah!

[Prot]

Re watching the Codex leak, plus looking at the Dataslates, I do think a few units need to be highlighted....

 

It's kind of glanced over, but I'm not sure I like what they did to eightbound/Exalted. Obviously everything losing FnP is really a huge nerf combined with losing it as a Blessing of Khorne ability.

 

The limitations of their weapons... It just feels weird, like they did it to keep the theme of simplification. 

 

Anyway, some quick thoughts:

 

- Angron. Not much to say here... still think this whole change is bad. Mort seems a lot better. Angron is potentially not going to see play in my lists, but I'll test him out to be sure.

 

- Defiler... I may actually try this unit again. Totally points dependent but potentially getting 'free' overwatch with flamers could be cool, plus moving through models. One of my big gripes with 10th is the ugly tables with tons of little boxes on the table... it's really hard to play larger foot print models now.

 

- Helbrute. Thankfully I saved mine. I never used it, but I have a feeling I will now.

 

- MoE: Losing Fights First...ouch. But at least me may get us a CP or 2.

 

- Spawn... still good. Reactionary move within 9" is a great scoring mechanism. 

 

- Goremongers. I understand a lot of people are all over the idea of having a 'cheap' unit with infiltrate.  T4 on these guys and Jakhals is great.

 

- Landraider BS4 but rapidfire... interesting?

 

- Icons of Khorne generate Bloodshed points now. (It's worth noting Goremongers cannot take one.) This is a nice little bonus for extra Blessing dice, but since they can't be held on to, it gets hard to manipulate an Angron revival roll. But it can be done.

 

- Rhino's: this goes with my earlier statement of my wanting to play 3rd edition World Eaters; the Goretrack Onslaught detachment is something I'll try for fun. (I still think Zerker Warband is probably going to be favoured, and Angron's only chance at success.) With Goretrack the Lance, and +1 to charge is pretty good, combined with the Rhino's ability to allow a disembark if something comes within 9".

 

 

 

 

[Prot]

Well to add to my thoughts... the whole codex is out there now. Every rules page, the dataslates, detachments etc.

 

Is anybody else out there as concerned as I am that Deathguard are appearing far superior in... melee!?

 

Here's a new batrep by Vanguard of DG vs WE. 

 

 

Beyond that batrep the stats don't look good. The points seem waaaay off, and the nerf to Zerkers and Angron seem to add extra validity to DG train. I think the popular take was the nerf to Angron, however I've always been a big Berzerker player, and I think the S4 base is really a deathblow to how I like to play the army. Watching the above makes me even more convinced they made a mistake on this. (Zerkers wounding PM's on a 5, PM's wounding Zerkers on a 3 (typical match up with base stats))

 

The thing that made the army to me, was having just a basic marine stat, but the extra strength. So I anticipate that if anything works from the codex... it will be leaning hard into Slaughterbound/Exalted/8Bound. I'm hoping I'm wrong.... Which is very possible, as it's early. 

 

Any other thoughts on this?

 

[Castle Wolfenstein]

1 hour ago, Prot said:

Is anybody else out there as concerned as I am that Deathguard are appearing far superior in... melee!?

 

 

 

Yeah, my friend who I get most of my games in against is a death guard player so thats the first thing I noticed. Plague marines hit harder in melee and obviously their shooting is infinitely better but yet they are costed the same as zerks. Also, I am extremely annoyed that Plague marines and DG terminators got boosted toughness while Berzerkers lost a point of strength.

 

100% agree on what you said about Berzerkers, It seems to me that they are pretty useless now outside of the Berzerker warband detachment and even then they arent great. The increased movement is great but not enough.

 

I guess I'm going to have to get some Jakhals, which is too bad because the models do nothing for me.

[Ezekyle_Abaddon]

Apparently, Goonhammer was able to get the munitorum field manual points early. Someone has gone ahead and made a spreadsheet detailing the point changes

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/u/0/d/194OgD-XrD_BVI6zaf6B6s7X4NrJ5xROZDFozjzeIbDg/htmlview#

 

Initial thoughts are that Angron, berserkers, both eightbound, and terminators are all overcosted.

 

180 for 10 berserkers is crazy now that they're STR 4. The buff to movement and blood surge do not justify keeping the pre codex points.

 

Angron is laughably bad at 385, he'd need to come down at least another 50 points to be worth considering for his datasheet now

 

The one unit I do like is the Helbrute at 120. I'd imagine this will go up as they were theorized as being one of the better units in the new codex, and they are very efficient at 120.

 

I gave up on committing to competitive play a long time ago, so I’m excited about the play style variety for chill game nights with the homies doing uga bunga-ing, but not much else.

I'll stick to CSM if I ever want to dive back into competitive and tournaments

[Rain]

Berzerkers require:

 

1.) The Berzerker Warband detachment;

 

2.) Getting the charge;

 

3.) An attached character (these have luckily gotten cheaper; MoE is 60 points now.)

 

Ironically charging zerks will be great counterplay to them. The MoE no longer grants FF, they only swing at S4 (and with 1 fewer A/model in BW), and they go down easier with no access to FNP. Also, while they do gain 6 inch consolidate, and a longer Blood Surge, getting into engagement range without charging is not really worth it unless you’re going into something very soft. I guess it prevents that unit from shooting at you, so there’s that.

[Dr. Clock]

Agreed on Zerks feeling a bit weedy at 180. I'd likely take 10 more if they were 160 or so, but will be fine with my 2x10 in Rhinos for now methinks. The brick of 20 is a neat idea, but it seems pretty fragile on account of being essentially impossible to meaningfully hide, and like 30% more points than just getting 10 in a bawks. Heck - the extra move from a juggerlord in 10 Zerks who just rapid ingress on a flank seem better than the brick of 20 to my eye even though 10 won't really benefit from the 'extra engagement range' rule.

 

After some fiddling and unfortunately just giving up on the idea of 8Bound overnight, my initial list to try out is:

 

Daemon Prince (Glaive)

2x MoE (1 w/ Helm)

2x10 Zerks

2x Rhino

2x jakhals

1x Goremongers

1x Helbrute

2x Spawn

2x Forgefiend

2x Maulerfiend

 

Basic idea would be Prince + helbrute and rabble going centre, flanking Rhinos with Spawn and Engines supporting. Just a small bump down overall seems warranted as this basically feels maybe 1 jakhals or goremongers short.

 

The comparison to Plague Marines at T6 now really is kinda depressing, although I can't say they didn't earn it from their time in the wilderness. Their army rule on its own gives stacks on stacks of debuffs, and then the detachment rules and broad synergistic datasheet rules kinda seem likely to explode stuff from there. I definitely like the extra move and surge for Zerks, but the army rule overall is just so random where DG feels so targeted.

 

Anyway - cautiously optimistic I guess is my vibe for this, although it's a shame they did 8bound so dirty (though they can be fixed by points drops is my feeling; like they CAN do something, just likely not enough for the points of a full daemon engine)

 

Cheers,

 

The Good Doctor.

[MadEdric]

I've been going over things and I think I like what I see over all. I'm not a fan of S4 on Bezerkers, but I'm seeing that as less of a detriment. 

I had already started playing my World Eaters as a more combined force with Fiend, Helbrute, and sometimes a Defiler and find the changes to shooting weapons to be interesting. Ballistic skill loss is offset by rapid fire, and feels fun for an army that wants to push forward, weapons blasting faster as they get closer to the kill.

I think all the Detachments could be fun to play, but run into the problem that I can't play 3 of them without a huge outlay of cash.

Cultist one would need me to buy at least 3-5 cultist types, some being trying to find how, or need to wait until GW releases Goremongers in their own box.

Deamonkin, well I have none and while I would love to be able to  add some Blood Crushers, needing to buy 700-1000 points of Deamons to play is another large price tag. 

I own 6 8Bound, that's all I really want., So actually it's OK as I'd never really want to play this one.

Bezerker Warband looks like the winner.  Goretrack looks fun, but I really need to finish a couple Rhinos (I started building 15-17 years ago) so I can play that one. I also Like VoW.

All in all, I'll be eagerly testing the detachments I can play and might slowly look into expanding my cultist base and I think painting up some Khorne Deamons could be fun. 

[Dr. Clock]

10 hours ago, MadEdric said:

Bezerker Warband looks like the winner.

Yeah - feels like there was definitely room for one that's 'vehicles generally' rather than transports specifically. I don't like 3 Rhinos in a list as much as I like 2... But I'd love to see the Khorne version of Soulforged Warpack or whatever, though perhaps maulerfiends really shouldn't have blood surge ; )

 

Heck, the Cultist one would be acceptable for that kind of thing if it applied to daemon engines of all sizes instead of just the Princes / Lord of Skulls...

 

Daemonkin and Goretrack seem good, but I need the 6 bloodcrushers to make Daemonkin a sensible option. Maybe in a few months, as I do have the obligatory 10 dogs and 20 'Letters from way back to get that option going.

 

Ah well - maybe we'll get an Engines down the road - in the meantime the significant Warband charge buff will continue to be the obvious choice purely through its wide applicability.

 

Cheers,

 

The Good Doctor.

[Prot]

Points will bounce around, and the true direction of this will come from tournaments. It still seems anyone wanting to play as a bunch of wild Zerkers running amok is probably going to be disappointed. Putting that theme on the shoulders of Angron is probably going to be a worse idea.

 

I thought the 8 Bound would have play... maybe I'm wrong. I suppose we're now days away from finding out! Let's hope for the best.