Grotmas Calendar 2025

[LSM]

19 hours ago, ursvamp said:

Dread Talons seem to be agreed on to be pretty much the weakest CSM detachment. So judging by today’s detachment (that’s just a tweaked version of that one, but with a new name for some reason), perhaps they are focusing on improving underused, or underpowered, detachments?

 

i don’t know enough avout AM to say anything about Grizzled (though it didn’t give me that impression). But maybe Harlequins and Death Company are in about the same boat as Dread Talons?

 

As far as Emperor's Children go, the 'Slaanesh's Chosen' Detachment has been a dud. I could see this 'Court of the Phoenician' being a similar retread.

 

(Basically, the 'Slaanesh's Chosen' Detachment rule: the first time in each player's turn that one of your character units destroys an enemy unit, afterwards it becomes the Favoured Champion - taking the title from whichever character unit was previously the Favoured Champion. The Favoured Champion can re-roll Wound rolls. So... an okay benefit, but only for a single unit, which you might get to use a turn later if another unit doesn't steal the Favoured Champion designation beforehand, or if the enemy doesn't prioritise it for destruction in their turn.)

 

 

Edited Sunday at 02:04 PM by LSM

[HeadlessCross]

38 minutes ago, LSM said:

 

As far as Emperor's Children go, the 'Slaanesh's Chosen' Detachment has been a dud. I could see this 'Court of the Phoenician' being a similar retread.

 

(Basically, the 'Slaanesh's Chosen' Detachment rule: the first time in each player's turn that one of your character units destroys an enemy unit, it becomes the Favoured Champion. The Favoured Champion can re-roll Wound rolls. So... an okay benefit, for a single unit, which you might get to use a turn later if another unit doesn't become the Favoured Champion beforehand.)

 

Yeah that detachment is easily bottom five detachments in the game. 

[darkseren1ty]

The serpents brood one is likely a harlequins detachment based on the leaked image from goonhammer. 
 

the court of the Phoenician is most probably a rework of slaanesh’s chosen. (The pic has a winged daemon prince). But it would be nice if it was a detachment that helped fulgrim a bit more. 

[ursvamp]

9 hours ago, LSM said:

 

As far as Emperor's Children go, the 'Slaanesh's Chosen' Detachment has been a dud. I could see this 'Court of the Phoenician' being a similar retread.

 

(Basically, the 'Slaanesh's Chosen' Detachment rule: the first time in each player's turn that one of your character units destroys an enemy unit, afterwards it becomes the Favoured Champion - taking the title from whichever character unit was previously the Favoured Champion. The Favoured Champion can re-roll Wound rolls. So... an okay benefit, but only for a single unit, which you might get to use a turn later if another unit doesn't steal the Favoured Champion designation beforehand, or if the enemy doesn't prioritise it for destruction in their turn.)

 

 

Well, that sounds… really bad :|

Thanks for the run through!  ^^

 

Hope you’re right, and they get a well deserved rework of it :) (or at least Something good and fun!)

Edited Sunday at 02:21 PM by ursvamp

[LSM]

1 hour ago, ursvamp said:

Well, that sounds… really bad :|

Thanks for the run through!  ^^

 

Hope you’re right, and they get a well deserved rework of it :) (or at least Something good and fun!)

 

Yeah, its... interesting conceptually, but of little benefit. (Potentially none, depending on the sequencing, as a unit can gain the bonus and then lose it before they have a chance to use it.) All character units do also get immunity to Move/Charge modifiers; which is handy, but doesn't come up that often.

 

It could be saved by Enhancements and Strats, but they aren't particularly wonderful either:

• Enhancements: re-roll Charges; force Desperate Escape tests; re-roll Leadership tests/+1 OC; model's melee weapons +1S/+1AP/[Precision]
• All Character units gain [Sustained Hits 1] against target enemy unit in the Fight phase. (But the army rule prevents Charging multiple Advancing units into one target.)
• When a new unit becomes Favoured Champions (ie. after they destroy an enemy unit), force Battle-shock tests 6" around them.
• 4+ Fight-on-death for a Character unit (3+ if Favoured Champions).
• Add 2" to the Charge move of a Character unit targeting an enemy unit already within Engagement Range of (a) friendly unit(s). 
• Surge Move of d6" after being Shot.
• After the Favoured Champion destroys an enemy unit, or a new unit becomes the Favoured Champion (ie. after they destroy an enemy unit), every Character unit gets +1S until the end of the phase.

 

I think the obvious fix is to give better bonusses to all Character units, with the type of bonus depending on whether they're the Favoured or not. (Like: +1S if not Favoured, a 5+ FNP if they are. But if the sequencing is going to remain - someone taking the status after attacking - then the bonus should be more defensive.)

 

Oh - and I forgot: Infractors, our basic Battleline unit, have the ability of... Wound re-rolls (re-roll '1' off Objective, re-roll everything on Objective). So if a Lord Exultant's with some Infractors and becomes the Favoured Champion, they likely don't gain any new benefit at all.

 

//

 

Blood Angels detachment up.

 

It plays with the concept of voluntarily being Battle-shocked for benefits, which coincidentally was something I've been mentioning in the EC sub-forums as a possibly good Detachment theme for the Third Legion. 

 

Edited Sunday at 04:14 PM by LSM

[Blindhamster]

1 hour ago, LSM said:

It plays with the concept of voluntarily being Battle-shocked for benefits, which coincidentally was something I've been mentioning in the EC sub-forums as a possibly good Detachment theme for the Third Legion.

 

It's also something already seen in Liberator Assault Group. And a wonderfully thematic rule. I like it a lot. 

Honestly this new detachment looks like a lot of fun, it swaps out the strength buffs of LAS for even more attacks and also armour pen.

[HeadlessCross]

That Blood Angels one is incredibly boring. There's little reason to use it over LAG or AI. 

[Indy Techwisp]

Well that confirms the leak beyond a shadow of a doubt.

 

Any idea why BA might have needed a second LAG Detachment?

[LSM]

8 minutes ago, Indy Techwisp said:

Well that confirms the leak beyond a shadow of a doubt.

 

Any idea why BA might have needed a second LAG Detachment?

 

Cynical take: someone in the dev team plays Blood Angels as their main army, and so had it on the brain.

 

(I assume this is, similarly, why CSMs now have eleven Detachments.)

 

These aren't "who needs help"; this is "what have I been up to".

 

Edited Sunday at 06:11 PM by LSM

[Indy Techwisp]

1 minute ago, LSM said:

(I assume this is, similarly, why CSMs now have eleven Detachments.)

 

Are we counting the Chaos Daemons Detachment for Belakor which allows you to take CSM along with the Daemons?

[Blindhamster]

37 minutes ago, Indy Techwisp said:

Well that confirms the leak beyond a shadow of a doubt.

 

Any idea why BA might have needed a second LAG Detachment?

Think it’s more a replacement for the death company one that kind of sucks

[HeadlessCross]

32 minutes ago, Blindhamster said:

Think it’s more a replacement for the death company one that kind of sucks

Honestly I don't even think it does that in an interesting manner. 

[Malakithe]

So far the CSM and BA one have been...side grades? of their current ones, kinda? i guess. They are definitely detachments.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

4 hours ago, HeadlessCross said:

That Blood Angels one is incredibly boring. There's little reason to use it over LAG or AI. 

Re-roll 1s to wound is pretty strong.

extra attacks likewise very strong.

 

theres a Strat that turns SG with spears into blenders.

18/33 attacks S7 AP-3 2D re-rolling wounds.

[Blindhamster]

1 hour ago, Malakithe said:

So far the CSM and BA one have been...side grades? of their current ones, kinda? i guess. They are definitely detachments.

Side grades is what they SHOULD be though, there shouldnt really be detachments that get released and are just obviously better than the existing ones, nor should they absolutely suck. They should be vaguely similar in power but tweaking themes and or playstyles for the faction. 

[HeadlessCross]

2 hours ago, Malakithe said:

So far the CSM and BA one have been...side grades? of their current ones, kinda? i guess. They are definitely detachments.

The CSM is straight up an upgrade and the Blood Angels one is a downgrade. 

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

1 hour ago, HeadlessCross said:

The CSM is straight up an upgrade and the Blood Angels one is a downgrade. 

How is it a downgrade?

[HeadlessCross]

2 hours ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

How is it a downgrade?

It's a downgrade due to the fact it offers less offensively than both LAG and AI, as well as those having most of the same tools in Strats. While it has auto fight-on-death for Death Company and a FNP (which would be cool on DC Dreads) that's not enough for a real coherent strategy that isn't already covered. 

 

It'll be taken and It'll win a few tournaments, but it'll be due to the strength of Blood Angels datasheets (which get more cracked with LAG and AI) themselves rather than the detachment. 

[Karhedron]

While not an upgrade, I don't think BA needed an upgrade per-se. It is an upgrade if you want to a DC-themed list without feeling like you are fighting with one hand tied behind your back. Personally I like it because I think it looks both reasonably effective and decently characterful.

[Sir Clausel]

Not all detachments needs to be uber powerful. You dont have to use the most optimized list and build all the time. But its not fun to use a bad detachment. So some power is needed. This BA detachment feels good! 

[Indy Techwisp]

So we've had a Guard Detachment that just feels like something they missed from the codex, a CSM Detachment that feels like it replaces the Nightlords one and a BA Detachment that feels like it replaces the Death Company Detachment with a LAG adjacent alternative.

 

For the upcoming ones, the Aeldari one is probably a Harlequin Detachment as speculated (is there an issue with the existing Harlequin one?), the SW one looks like it's going to be another crack at the Saga idea from the initial index and the EC one is probably a hyper-elite Detachment with tools to help Fulgrim.

 

That sound about right?

[Nephaston]

39 minutes ago, Indy Techwisp said:

For the upcoming ones, the Aeldari one is probably a Harlequin Detachment as speculated (is there an issue with the existing Harlequin one?), the SW one looks like it's going to be another crack at the Saga idea from the initial index and the EC one is probably a hyper-elite Detachment with tools to help Fulgrim.

 

Harlequins detachment has an infantry focus, while this one might lean on the weaver serpent type vehicles. Court of the Phoenican I can see being all-in on Fulgrim and Daemon Princes but that can go either way. Maybe third time is the charm on Sagas.

[Joe]

I haven't really been keeping up with the calendar, however I can surmise that Games Workshop must be doing something right / wrong, and people are very happy / angry about it.

[Karhedron]

2 hours ago, Indy Techwisp said:

the SW one looks like it's going to be another crack at the Saga idea from the initial index

 

The old Index list had 4 different Sagas, 2 of which have roughly translated to individual Detachments in the new Codex:

• Beastslayer needed little adjustment
• Saga of the Bold is thematically similar to Saga of Majesty in that it is Character focussed.

Saga of the Bear previously gave a 6+++ but building an entire Detachment around this feels a bit dull and not in line with recent Detachments as it has little interaction with the opponent's army. Saga of the Warrior Born focussed on horde killing with wide access to Sustained Hits so we might see something based on this.

[Rhavien]

4 hours ago, Karhedron said:

While not an upgrade, I don't think BA needed an upgrade per-se. It is an upgrade if you want to a DC-themed list without feeling like you are fighting with one hand tied behind your back. Personally I like it because I think it looks both reasonably effective and decently characterful.

That are my thoughts too. It's a fixed DC detachment which should actually work. It always feels bad if you've to take casualties before making use of your detachment rules. 

This one feels far more tempting with some nice strats on top.