40k New Huron Blackheart

[Evil Eye]

2 hours ago, Orange Knight said:

The model is a clear upgrade over the original.

In scale*, sure- but even in terms of detail the original was a fantastic sculpt, and this doesn't really bring anything new to the table. The pose is generic, the face is pretty damn awful and honestly, when I first saw it, I took a few seconds to realize it was Huron and not just a generic Chaos Lord.

 

The original is instantly recognizable and iconic, this new one...isn't. In fact it feels weirdly like a sort of "we have Abaddon at home" in some ways.

 

*Relative to other miniatures at least- proportionally he was one of the better pre-upscaled Astartes models out there.

[TwinOcted]

I really like him, and I'll pick him up whenever he's released separately from the inevitable FOMO box.

[Orange Knight]

4 minutes ago, Evil Eye said:

In scale*, sure- but even in terms of detail the original was a fantastic sculpt, and this doesn't really bring anything new to the table.

 

No, stop.

 

Lol I'm not having that. You might feel some nostalgia for the old model, but it was never some work of art sculpt and it's not brimming with amazing detail.

 

The new model is better, aside from the face - subjectively. And I say subjectively, because GW might want Huron to be some crazed monster, which would make his new face fitting.

[Redcomet]

4 hours ago, Robbienw said:

I would rate the 3 Huron models in this order of coolness.

 

1 - Forgeworld Huron

2 - new Huron

3 - old metal Huron.

The claw arm is some of the best resin casting I have seen from FW. 

4 hours ago, Robbienw said:

I would rate the 3 Huron models in this order of coolness.

 

1 - Forgeworld Huron

2 - new Huron

3 - old metal Huron.

The claw arm is some of the best resin casting I have seen from FW. 

[HeadlessCross]

25 minutes ago, Evil Eye said:

In scale*, sure- but even in terms of detail the original was a fantastic sculpt, and this doesn't really bring anything new to the table. The pose is generic, the face is pretty damn awful and honestly, when I first saw it, I took a few seconds to realize it was Huron and not just a generic Chaos Lord.

 

The original is instantly recognizable and iconic, this new one...isn't. In fact it feels weirdly like a sort of "we have Abaddon at home" in some ways.

 

*Relative to other miniatures at least- proportionally he was one of the better pre-upscaled Astartes models out there.

How is the old pose not generic?

[brother_b]

His mouth is way too wide to me. I wonder if he has a helmeted option but I doubt it.

[The Praetorian of Inwit]

I find it a lot better than the old model. Definitely a glow up overall I think. Not sure about the face though. Will the model have a helmet option? Its always disappointing when there is no helmet option. 

 

It would be great if GW could stop puttimg Tactical Rocks on so many characters though. Mix it up a bit GW. 

[Mogger351]

1 minute ago, The Praetorian of Inwit said:

I find it a lot better than the old model. Definitely a glow up overall I think. Not sure about the face though. Will the model have a helmet option? Its always disappointing when there is no helmet option. 

 

It would be great if GW could stop puttimg Tactical Rocks on so many characters though. Mix it up a bit GW. 

Huron doesn't generally wear a helmet due to the "pimp my face" attachments getting in the way.

[Blindhamster]

4 hours ago, Robbienw said:

Too much detail for you.

Not sure what you’re trying to get at by that?

 

its not the reason though, I found the pose awkward and the left arm weapon design was naff. Claw was cool. The tabard was wide and ugly and then I also disliked most of the old terminator models as proportions were particularly egregious.

 

as far as detail goes - one of my favourite models of all time is captain korvydae who was immensely more detailed.

Edited Friday at 07:36 PM by Blindhamster

[Mazer Rackham]

43 minutes ago, Mogger351 said:

Huron doesn't generally wear a helmet due to the "pimp my face" attachments getting in the way.

 

 

Checkmate, Imperial Haters! 

[Evil Eye]

2 hours ago, Orange Knight said:

Lol I'm not having that. You might feel some nostalgia for the old model, but it was never some work of art sculpt and it's not brimming with amazing detail.

 

Come on, man, even leaving aside all subjective matters and focusing purely on the objective, the detail level is about on par with the new one. I don't even think the new one has more detail on it; he's lost some in some places (chainmail loincloth replaced with fabric for instance). The sculpted detail might be microscopically cleaner compared to the metal one because it's been CAD-sculpted instead of hand-sculpted, but as far as metal sculpts go OG Huron is a really, really good one; one of the best Chaos Space Marine character models we've ever had IMO. I can't take anyone seriously that claims that it was "never some work of art sculpt" (which is a step above even "it's aged poorly compared to modern sculpts"- at least that one is sometimes true, though not in this case). As for "not brimming with amazing detail" (what a very meaningless, corporate-sounding turn of phrase) he's got as much detail as is appropriate for his size, and it's all well sculpted. Unless you're trying to argue that more detail is automatically better, which A: no it isn't (after a certain point, more detail just becomes visual noise) and B: new Huron doesn't actually have THAT big a detail jump anyway, if much at all.

 

There's been some very good plastic Chaos character upgrades, notably Fabius Bile (love that sculpt, especially the little orderly he has scurrying around with him) but this Huron isn't one of them. I'm sure he'll make good conversion fodder and he isn't Coteaz levels of downgrade, but he's certainly not a Mephiston-tier "knocked it out the park" either.

 

1 hour ago, HeadlessCross said:

How is the old pose not generic?

It's the perfect balance of dynamic and stoic, IMO. It conveys motion without being in the midst of an overexaggerated backflip. The way he's sculpted striding forward, about to lay down a curtain of flame from his Tyrant's Claw is extremely well done- it looks like a snapshot of him in an actual battle, as opposed to posing for the camera (badly). Also, you know, it's unique to him and not apparently copypasted from a digital asset library to the point the model looks like it's following a synchronized dance routine with a few other character models pulling almost the exact same pose.

[Robbienw]

29 minutes ago, Blindhamster said:

Not sure what you’re trying to get at by that?

 

its not the reason though, I found the pose awkward and the left arm weapon design was naff. Claw was cool. The tabard was wide and ugly and then I also disliked most of the old terminator models as proportions were particularly egregious.

 

as far as detail goes - one of my favourite models of all time is captain korvydae who was immensely more detailed.

Kovydae had a similar level of detail to Huron.  You may not know this, but he was also sculpted by Simon Egan.

The inner powerfist detailing on Huron was particularly well done.  You’ll never see anything quite like it in plastic.

 

[WrathOfTheLion]

I like the new sculpt, although I can see why others may not. It'll be interesting to see the other kit(s?) that come with him. It would be nice for a refresh of the CSM decal sheets, as it would be great if Red Corsairs were included on that again.

[sitnam]

49 minutes ago, WrathOfTheLion said:

It would be nice for a refresh of the CSM decal sheets, as it would be great if Red Corsairs were included on that again.

 

Maybe we could get an alternate transfer sheet for Red Corsairs and other Renegade warbands. The Purge/Scourge/etc

[WrathOfTheLion]

45 minutes ago, sitnam said:

 

Maybe we could get an alternate transfer sheet for Red Corsairs and other Renegade warbands. The Purge/Scourge/etc

That would be pretty sweet, but we haven't seen the main studio side of things do standalone transfer sheets in a while. A new one that removes Thousand Sons, who should have their own, and adds a couple warbands is what I think is the more likely scenario.

[HeadlessCross]

2 hours ago, Evil Eye said:

Come on, man, even leaving aside all subjective matters and focusing purely on the objective, the detail level is about on par with the new one. I don't even think the new one has more detail on it; he's lost some in some places (chainmail loincloth replaced with fabric for instance). The sculpted detail might be microscopically cleaner compared to the metal one because it's been CAD-sculpted instead of hand-sculpted, but as far as metal sculpts go OG Huron is a really, really good one; one of the best Chaos Space Marine character models we've ever had IMO. I can't take anyone seriously that claims that it was "never some work of art sculpt" (which is a step above even "it's aged poorly compared to modern sculpts"- at least that one is sometimes true, though not in this case). As for "not brimming with amazing detail" (what a very meaningless, corporate-sounding turn of phrase) he's got as much detail as is appropriate for his size, and it's all well sculpted. Unless you're trying to argue that more detail is automatically better, which A: no it isn't (after a certain point, more detail just becomes visual noise) and B: new Huron doesn't actually have THAT big a detail jump anyway, if much at all.

 

There's been some very good plastic Chaos character upgrades, notably Fabius Bile (love that sculpt, especially the little orderly he has scurrying around with him) but this Huron isn't one of them. I'm sure he'll make good conversion fodder and he isn't Coteaz levels of downgrade, but he's certainly not a Mephiston-tier "knocked it out the park" either.

 

It's the perfect balance of dynamic and stoic, IMO. It conveys motion without being in the midst of an overexaggerated backflip. The way he's sculpted striding forward, about to lay down a curtain of flame from his Tyrant's Claw is extremely well done- it looks like a snapshot of him in an actual battle, as opposed to posing for the camera (badly). Also, you know, it's unique to him and not apparently copypasted from a digital asset library to the point the model looks like it's following a synchronized dance routine with a few other character models pulling almost the exact same pose.

Okay so the way I'm reading it is:

1. His pose was generic because many different characters have the same pose of pointing their range weapon out with the other weapon out of the way. The only thing that didn't make it generic is the claw being the range weapon itself. 

2. That you also think there's an infinite amount of poses. 

[Laurence]

If we're going on old Huron art, I've always preferred his very first interpretation:

 

[Wispy]

tbh the only thing i liked about his model is his old silhouette without a cape.

[Evil Eye]

4 hours ago, HeadlessCross said:

Okay so the way I'm reading it is:

1. His pose was generic because many different characters have the same pose of pointing their range weapon out with the other weapon out of the way. The only thing that didn't make it generic is the claw being the range weapon itself. 

His pose was less generic than the new one because, without going into great depth talking about the finer nuances of posing and art theory, it was not shared almost 1:1 by several other character models.

4 hours ago, HeadlessCross said:

2. That you also think there's an infinite amount of poses. 

Technically, there are. There's a finite number of poses that work (which for this model, this isn't one) but there are considerably more good poses than GW actually makes use of.

 

Come on. You don't have to defend a literal copypaste job just because it's new. I know "old bad new good" is kinda your gimmick but...actually, you know what? No, this is getting dull now. Get new material.

[HeadlessCross]

1 hour ago, Evil Eye said:

old bad new good

That's literally what you're doing LMAO

 

You have yet to present anything objective for your points. 

[Marshal Reinhard]

The more I compare the two models, the more of a faithful translation of the old the new model seems to be.

 

Most everything has been kept intact: The flamer (melta?) claw, the canisters on the back, the broken halo, the axe with its own halo on the back, the eldar doodads, the potion bottles, the critter, even the battle damage on right of his armor where we see inner tubing.

 

The main differences seems to be: the addition of the cape, the change of the loincloth to actual cloth rather than chainmail, and of course that head, which I think reflected progressing head damage he's taken?

Edited Saturday at 02:49 PM by Marshal Reinhard

[Nephaston]

2 hours ago, Marshal Reinhard said:

The main differences seems to be: the addition of the cape, the change of the loincloth to actual cloth rather than chainmail, and of course that head, which I think reflected progressing head damage he's taken?

 

Iirc he taped his remaining skin over the metal part, Meaning it would eventually slough off, rot away, or dessicate and flake off. 

[Evil Eye]

8 hours ago, HeadlessCross said:

You have yet to present anything objective for your points. 

And you have yet to present any point at all. But I'll bite.

 

Objectively, fewer models share or resemble the pose of the old one than the new one. That's fact. If that bothers you or not is subjective but it is objectively the case that the new one has a less distinct pose compared to other concurrently available models.

 

Seriously, you're acting like I'm personally insulting the sculptor and his family and anyone who likes the model. I just don't think it looks good. If you do, that's fine. But getting bent out of shape because someone else thinks that the only real upgrade to the old one is scale is ridiculous.

[Mogger351]

Honestly I'm surprised it seems to be a divisive resculpt, generally it seems better. I'm more surprised at the number of people who aren't familiar with the character offering criticism of elements that are based around the character. "Why doesn't he come with a helmeted head" is something the seems to come up a fair bit for example, but is often fruitless.

[lansalt]

The new Huron model has technically all the correct elements, but somehow it looks off. It's less than the sum of all its parts.

I'd say it's a combination of his goofy face and the focus in the axe instead of his claw.