More 11th Edition Boxset Rumours

[Kilamandaros]

6 hours ago, ThePenitentOne said:

Not sure if anyone else has mentioned this yet... But the whole "Combining Narrative and Matched" thing really sounds like the death of Crusade.

 

Pick up games will be more interesting, which is nice for people who play them, but campaign games will be less so. If the concept of progression continues to exist at all, they're going to have to simplify it to the point where it's so dull, we might as well not even bother. It'll be the sort of hyper-simplistic prototype progression that existed in 4th edition when they started playing around with Combat Patrol and Kill Team in the BRB, because when it has to be usable in every game, that's about as interesting as they can afford to make it.

 

Agree fully, abandoning standalone Crusade books for generic 'narrative-lite' releases in the 500 Worlds style will be a massive downer and probably push me out of the hobby as well. We have a community of 50+ Crusade players where I live and having run numerous Crusades I can say that narrative and competitive players are totally different in what they want and need from the game, trying to smash those 2 groups together will never work. Was so looking forward to a new Crusade at release to follow up on Armageddon, similar to what they did with Leviathan. If the 'Return of Yarrick' pack is all we're getting that will be massive sadface from a lot of people...

[irlLordy]

Kinda surprised there was no mention of revamped Combat Patrol rules. Maybe that will be its own thing closer to the time.

 

I also found it funny that they only mentioned improved language support for the app update. The only update people care about is being able to see rules without having to buy a codex, basic QoL improvements aren't going to change anyones opinion without that.

[Marshal Loss]

Initial thoughts from a very tired Aussie:

• Trailer was good but not the best they've ever done, didn't blow me away like some of their previous attempts, but still great fun to watch. Some cool moments though and it was nice seeing somebody other than the smurfs occupy the lead position. The Chaplain's design is sick and I am really keen to see what his model looks like. 
• The models shown were solid but uninspiring. There are minimal tweaks to the Intercessor and we've already seen GW sell kits with the odd Mark VII helmet before so it's hard to get excited by "this kit has all sorts of nostalgic callbacks" when we can't see the full squad yet. The Ork is fantastic but also exactly what I'd expect. If they're going to show a single model for each side with the trailer, maybe pick one of the characters (e.g. the Chaplain, the literal face of the trailer...) or elite units for each side.

In terms of a new edition: meh. I've barely played 10th and the game has drifted a long way from the 3rd edition style paradigm I've loved for many years; things like free wargear and what feels like an infinite supply of re-rolls and damage buffs have turned the game into a bit of a circus. Some of the changes listed in the article sound really positive to me (e.g. objective circles being dead, stratagem restrictions) and others sound more questionable (70 more detachments? I guess maybe we'll finally get a Noise Marine one for EC, but this just sounds like a ton of bloat to me when there are already so many). Objectives changing based on the choice of detachment brings back memories of faction-specific secondaries. 

 

Hopefully they put out some nice terrain to accompany the new edition. 

 

Probably doesn't sound particularly positive from me, but we've known 11th was coming for....well since 10th dropped, so I'll wait and see what the full launch box and rules changes look like before getting too invested. But at least my existing codex still works so I can always give it a try if I'm tempted. 

[Captain Idaho]

It's the flanged knees for me, they're offensively absurd and appears to be a corporate decided design choice the way GW keeps to them. 

 

Anyway... this:

 

 

Emphasis mine.

 

So new edition is using ALL of the previous rules and adding even more?

 

Yay for bloat 

[Mogger351]

2 minutes ago, Captain Idaho said:

It's the flanged knees for me, they're offensively absurd and appears to be a corporate decided design choice the way GW keeps to them. 

 

Anyway... this:

 

 

Emphasis mine.

 

So new edition is using ALL of the previous rules and adding even more?

 

Yay for bloat 

I suspect that'll be the case until an army gets a new book, then it'll remove the old ones.

 

I'd add that there's plenty of detachments that people consider a dud and won't use atm, so it's just wasted words and won't be used unless they're "good" for some. So bloat is subjective.

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

I have to admit, there's a small, nihilistic corner of my soul that actually hopes GW will release the new vehicle under the name "Storm Speeder Land."

[Captain Idaho]

14 minutes ago, Mogger351 said:

I'd add that there's plenty of detachments that people consider a dud and won't use atm, so it's just wasted words and won't be used unless they're "good" for some. So bloat is subjective.

 

Well no one is arguing that the game is currently streamlined... 

[Jalleo]

21 minutes ago, Captain Idaho said:

It's the flanged knees for me, they're offensively absurd and appears to be a corporate decided design choice the way GW keeps to them. 

 

Anyway... this:

 

 

Emphasis mine.

 

So new edition is using ALL of the previous rules and adding even more?

 

Yay for bloat 

New and updated? Oh so I presume basically all the current detachments will be updated so its not anywhere close to 70 new detachments.

[Emperor Ming]

Streamlined with more bloat!

[Blindhamster]

1 hour ago, Robbienw said:

Its a shame the Intercessor isn't more firstborn looking, still too many MKX parts, in particular the ever present knee rims.  Blood Claws did it much better.  Hopefully the rest of the squad have a greater degree of old armour and this chap is the least modified.

im hoping for a solid mix of the two styles when we get the inevitable multi part kit. I’ve enjoyed making my own intercessors using actual intercessors, grey hunters and blood claws for that reason.

 

i would hate to see mkx completely go as it’s my favourite mk, but i enjoy the callbacks to earlier suits too so a solid mix (probably leaning slightly toward mkx as it’s meant to be “better” and more readily supplied) would be really fun.

 

Will have to wait and see.

[Mogger351]

18 minutes ago, Captain Idaho said:

 

Well no one is arguing that the game is currently streamlined... 

No, it isn't, but it's seemingly what the masses want.

 

GW couldnt move deathwatch into another book, they can't quietly remove a guard regiment thats not in production, they're afraid to remove people's characters and theres a wave of "GW wouldn't remove my new clearly HH branded custodes units or I'll yell".

 

If you want less bloat, people need to start accepting they can have less I suppose.

Edited 4 hours ago by Mogger351

[Toxichobbit]

5 hours ago, Marshal Reinhard said:

Also, since it'lll be brought up/has been brought up, and since I haven't met my "Well akkushually" quota yet:

 

John Intercessor is akkushually wearing a Mk. X helm. Only the frontal face plate with the mouth grill is older pattern. You can tell from the slanted ear design, that only Mk.X helmets have. This is actually a small detail I appreciate, since I've put out a lot of different full mark 7 helmets in my army, and there having been precious few ways to source these since their introduction with space wolf refresh.

 

But yeah, there's precious little mixed armor going on with this particular model.

 

The updated MkVI & VII in the Raven Guard and Space Wolf kits has the same ear design as well, but the MkVI & VII helms in the Sternguard kits don't. It seems we have MkX, mixed MkX/another Mk & then the original Mks. Hopefully the full Intercessor kit includes plenty of all those options.

[Marshal Reinhard]

15 minutes ago, Toxichobbit said:

 

The updated MkVI & VII in the Raven Guard and Space Wolf kits has the same ear design as well, but the MkVI & VII helms in the Sternguard kits don't. It seems we have MkX, mixed MkX/another Mk & then the original Mks. Hopefully the full Intercessor kit includes plenty of all those options.

Yes they do, making those helmets mk.x with older face plates as well. There are other differences mainly the ports on the back of the helm.

 

The helmets in the sternguard kit are actual bonafide wholesale older mark helmets, making them functionally indestinguishable from those in the older tactical sternguard devestator etc kits.

 

I've used pretty much all of on my guys in my army, save for the most recent mk.x with mk.vii faceplate that was first found in the space wolf kits. So I'm happy it'll be easier to source come this box.

 

Incidentally the slanted ears but mk.vii style face grill seems to have been Jes Goodwins original design choice for mk. Viii

 

 

So looking forward to adding this variant as well.

[KevDW]

2 hours ago, Mogger351 said:

GW couldnt move deathwatch into another book

Thats because GW did a terrible job of the inquisition book.  The edition is not out yet, still hopefull that it will be more streamlined in places and enable for more narrative fun even when playing competitively 

[Toxichobbit]

19 minutes ago, Marshal Reinhard said:

Yes they do, making those helmets mk.x with older face plates as well. There are other differences mainly the ports on the back of the helm.

 

The helmets in the sternguard kit are actual bonafide wholesale older mark helmets, making them functionally indestinguishable from those in the older tactical sternguard devestator etc kits.

 

I've used pretty much all of on my guys in my army, save for the most recent mk.x with mk.vii faceplate that was first found in the space wolf kits. So I'm happy it'll be easier to source come this box.

 

Incidentally the slanted ears but mk.vii style face grill seems to have been Jes Goodwins original design choice for mk. Viii

 

 

So looking forward to adding this variant as well.

 

I've got The Gothic and the Eldritch. Such a good book. But it's not just the ears, MkX borrows a lot from the original MkVIII design like the backpack cowl, the ankle circles (I think they're stabalisers but I can't remember where I read that) and the gorget. As does the old Deathwatch Vets in MkVIII they released in 7th (or was it the end of 6th)? If it wasn't for those awful Stormcast knee flanges, MkX would look a lot more like an evolution of MkVIII, just with a MkIV inspired helmet. I hope at least some of the new Intercessors don't have knee flanges. And we get some older Mk's of backback and breastplates too. 

Edited 2 hours ago by Toxichobbit

[Marshal Reinhard]

The presence of the knee flanges or not does not change the fact that mk. X is an evolution of what came before. Its even clearer when you see this was a direction Jes had in mind for several decades.

 

But regardless. John intercessor doesn't add anything strictly new but is welcome nonetheless. Here's hoping for further variation in the rest of his squad

[Orange Knight]

So the 1st Intercessor we've been shown is 100% Primaris MkX, except it has a different grill. His helmet isn't actually an older mark, only the grill is different, and the grill itself isn't Mk7 but a new variation that merely looks like the older designs.

Warhammer Community talk a game about older bits of armour being used, but I don't think the studio got that particular memo. All I see is a MkX variant, and variants of specific armour marks are nothing new. Look at the Horus Heresy and all the unique Mk4s, Mk6s, etc etc

The speeder in the video - I don't understand why it exists? It looks like the older Speeder variants and I see no unique weapons or wargear. I'm not sure what it offers that the 3 existing storm variants don't? I understand it might be slightly smaller/cheaper or larger/more expensive, but it just looks like further redundancy and bloat. If they are running out of ideas for the Marine faction, perhaps it's time to let a different army take the centre stage for the launch boxset? The Marines now have more speeder variants than some factions have vehicles in totality.

 

The Orks on the other hand - I have a good feeling about them! The weirdboy design in the trailer was very cool, and I even like that strange mech they were using.

[LSM]

4 hours ago, Jalleo said:

New and updated? Oh so I presume basically all the current detachments will be updated so its not anywhere close to 70 new detachments.

 

Hmmm... yeah, potentially some of the new Detachments will be along the lines of CSM's Nightmare Hunt (which is just a second take on the concept of Dread Talons). Eye of Terror: Reign of Iron is going to come with another CSM Detachment, and I assume it might similarly supersede Fellhammer Siege-Host.

 

Technically, these are new Detachments, and you can still play the old versions...  

[HeadlessCross]

8 minutes ago, LSM said:

 

Hmmm... yeah, potentially some of the new Detachments will be along the lines of CSM's Nightmare Hunt (which is just a second take on the concept of Dread Talons). Eye of Terror: Reign of Iron is going to come with another CSM Detachment, and I assume it might similarly supersede Fellhammer Siege-Host.

 

Technically, these are new Detachments, and you can still play the old versions...  

As I think about it, does Dread Talons even have a single advantage over Nightmare Hunt?