Prot's Iron Warriors.... are back.

[Malakithe]

Poor Defilers getting huge points increases...base is 320 now

[Tallarn Commander]

My Defiler has been so effective on the table lately that I'd probably still pay more than 320 points for it. 

[Prot]

On 6/23/2026 at 11:50 AM, Tallarn Commander said:

My Defiler has been so effective on the table lately that I'd probably still pay more than 320 points for it. 

 

I've been kind of bummed out at the Defiler situation.

 

The way I see it, and I freely admit this could be widely inaccurate, is that the Defiler is not only good, it's pretty much mandatory in a base CSM list. Now I say this putting myself in the 'Iron Warrior" semi-purist mode. I don't have Bile in my lists, I use Mutilators (amazing models) and I try to play true to the lore going back as Storm of Iron!

 

But that Defiler in other CSM armies can be incredibly potent. I pulled out my EC for a few games, it was so lopsided.... I just put them back away for a while and am sticking out the IW where I truly feel without the Defiler(s) I would probably not be competitive. 

 

So now I look back at the old defiler... and what was he... 140 points? Honestly it make me wonder if they had the same rules as the old Defiler for 140 points (but new model) I would use multiples. I think the old defiler kept going down in points but 1.) no one used that model, and 2) it wasn't available to all chaos factions.

 

Regardless, I know it doesn't matter, the wicked increases are here to stay. I'm glad you're getting a lot of mileage out of them. :) 

[Dr_Ruminahui]

Both Tallarn and I are people who fielded the defiler under the old rules (but with our own takes on the model) and I liked it, though I didn't feel it was truly competitive compared to things like the vindicator.  Given the new terrain layouts, the relatively slow speed and the large footprint of the old defiler, I very much doubt people would be fielding it without the new rules - if for no other reason than it would be very difficult to get into spots it could actually fit on the table.

 

Certainly for EC, although I never got to field it at its reduced points value, the Defiler fills a spot that nothing else really does.  For one thing, it allows me to pretend that EC are a mixed shooting/melee army like I envision it, though it really isn't any such thing.  I'm still holding out for a new codex to either reorient the army in the direction, or at least give EC more depth in the way the second World Eaters codex did for them.

 

Its unfortunate that so much of the codex's success at the moment is tied up in the masters of the maelstrom unit, which kind of leaves any CSM army without it as kind of B tier.  That said, I think they are still some good builds out there that don't focus on them (or defilers), such as veterans of the long war + murdertalon with some big termie bricks (which seem strong this edition, though maybe less so as Purge the Foe becomes less predominant) or Creations of Bile with mutilators and possessed.

 

I don't think you are wrong with your take on Defiler's, especially in the demon engines detachment, where it is basically necessary to make it viable.  Certainly at its lower points cost, there was nothing that could compete with it for versatility and fire power.  At its new points, I think there is room for other builds, I think you just need to pivot hard to take advantage of particular detachments to do so, and you probably do still want 1.  At 370 for the second, though... that's too expensive for me outside of a demon engine detachment list.

Edited August 11 by Dr_Ruminahui

[Tallarn Commander]

You all make some excellent points about the Defiler.

 

I'm participating in a summer casual league, so a Defiler would be out of place. To make up for the loss of the Defiler, when the league gets up to 2000 points, the points that would have gone into a Defiler are going into 4 Obliterators (or 2 Obliterators and 3 Mutilators). Admittedly they are not as effective as a Defiler, but they are in the spirit of the league and I'll be using Creations of Bile so at least there's that.

[Prot]

Well I'm still not sure what to do. My last few Iron Warrior games were so close and I literally win by a few points. I'm .... and I REALLY hate saying this, I'm very much out playing my opponents to do this. These are competitive opponent's and I think with the generic CSM dex the lean into Defilers is incredibly  mandatory. I do despise this.

 

That said I pivoted to a Landraider and a Defiler, and quality of life got a lot better. Trust me, whatever is in the landraider (and it can be a cannonball of a few different units if you like) goes basically untouched. The Defiler must die.... so you get a lot of elbow room with your landraider which honestly seems to be extremely well priced compared to the defiler. I just love the defiler as a model! That's the hardest part. I have 2 painted as IW, and I just love the models. I love the idea of playing a nearly Arkifane style list really... venom Crawlers, Forgefiends, all good. It's fun stuff to put out there, but the Defiler is something I think I've been waiting on for 5 years.

 

So I guess that's a long winded way of saying I'm being a baby about it, and I realize it. lol 

 

That being said I moved away from Emperor's Children even though I love that army, and I painted so much of it. I sold a few armies on Ebay and got .... a really decent amount of money and I was so close to putting my EC up there too, but I didn't! I can't do it. 

 

So I have this rule... play it or sell it. This has resulted in my selling probably 20 armies in the last decade, all for thousands of dollars, and thousands of points. This means it's time to field the EC!

 

My only issue is I love the new models and I have VERY little EC to paint.  My favourite unit was always the Flawless Blades. But with nothing but a Daemon Prince to paint now, I'm actually thinking of picking up a Defiler for the EC!  It would probably just be one, but I honestly don't think it would play that well. I typically plop a landraider in my EC lists to protect certain units and draw fire. But for the sake of painting something new, I MIGHT just pull the trigger.