Necromunda New Edition

[Lord Marshal]

We're going (back) underground.

 

 

 

Quote

The new boxed set includes two gangs – the Escher Blades of the Matriarch and the Goliath Forge Smelters – each made up of eight brand new plastic miniatures. 

 

Esher:

 

Goliaths:

 

Quote

There is a new Core Rulebook, which updates the game to be quicker, more streamlined, and more balanced. Campaigns have been tweaked to offer more flexibility to players, and dice rolls have been changed so each roll in the game matters.

 

 

Quote

The Core Set also comes with some Zone Mortalis: Ruined Factoria Pipes for your gangers to fight over.

 

 

Quote

A new edition with new rules means we have the opportunity to give the gangs and vehicles a refresh too. With the new edition, the rules in older publications will be getting replaced.  These two new books will let you use your existing gangs straight away.  They feature lore, gang information, fighter and equipment profiles, and rules for Hired Guns, Brutes, Hangers-on, and Pets.

 

 

And new starter sets for the House gangs:

 

Quote

The new edition is a great time to get started with Necromunda, and a range of Underhive Crew boxes is an ideal way to start a new gang. They each come with a selection of fighters, including Leaders, Champions, Gangers, and Prospects, and have a weapons & upgrades frame, so you have more choice of equipment.

 

Quote

 

Edited 21 hours ago by Lord Marshal

[ZeroWolf]

Ah if only I had someone to play this with

[Evil Eye]

Oh dear. Where to begin.

 

Firstly putting Necromunda on the edition churn machine, resetting the rules and invalidating all the content released so far is laaaaaaaaaaaame. I'd considered getting into Necromunda but I'm absolutely not willing to engage with it now.

 

Secondly, the dreaded "streamlining" was mentioned, which combined with the laughable board for the starter set suggests the game is being dumbed down into oblivion.

 

Thirdly, and I'll admit this is a more minor consideration, but female Goliaths...doesn't make any sense. They're supposed to be a gang of all-male vat-grown serfs with short and nasty lives. Like, that's their entire thing. And I don't see any male Eschers either. Like, you have 5 other gangs for female rep, one of which is entirely female (male Eschers are invariably stunted mutants). What was the point?

 

Yeah. Not impressed.

[Lord Marshal]

7 minutes ago, Evil Eye said:

Oh dear. Where to begin.

 

Firstly putting Necromunda on the edition churn machine, resetting the rules and invalidating all the content released so far is laaaaaaaaaaaame. I'd considered getting into Necromunda but I'm absolutely not willing to engage with it now.

 

Secondly, the dreaded "streamlining" was mentioned, which combined with the laughable board for the starter set suggests the game is being dumbed down into oblivion.

 

Thirdly, and I'll admit this is a more minor consideration, but female Goliaths...doesn't make any sense. They're supposed to be a gang of all-male vat-grown serfs with short and nasty lives. Like, that's their entire thing. And I don't see any male Eschers either. Like, you have 5 other gangs for female rep, one of which is entirely female (male Eschers are invariably stunted mutants). What was the point?

 

Yeah. Not impressed.

 

In fairness, the current edition of Necromunda is what, nine years old? I wouldn't call that a churn machine. Most non-GW games don't go that long without one.

 

I don't think female Goliaths are a new development, or at least, the Juves have had 'em for a few years now.

 

Edited 21 hours ago by Lord Marshal

[Zoatibix]

@Evil Eye There are already female Goliath models, so that ship has already sailed.

[Toxichobbit]

Streamline and balance are GW's buzzwords for making a game bland for the competitive crowd. If they've done that with Necromunda they've just killed the game. It's not in the slightest bit competitive and is closer to an RPG than a wargame - that's why people play it, not so they can have Kill Team with different models. I'll wait and see, but I have zero faith in GW not to screw this up. I should be excited by this announcement, but all I can feel is dread that they've ruined another game. And given the reaction on various Necromunda community sites, everybody else feels the same. The most positive responses I've seen are "I'll wait and see but I don't have much hope". 

[SvenIronhand]

The lack of a proper starter set is disappointing.

[Zoatibix]

Folks locally wanted a crunchy rules set with good campaign rules, experience tracking, etc, etc.  

It should be okay for different games to cater to different folks. Example, Warcry is a fun little game but it's definitely lacks the 'RPG / skirmish' vibe that Necrounda has.

 

[Firedrake Cordova]

I really like the new Escher with the flamer/chem-thrower, and the Goliath with the heavy stubber.  

 

It will be interesting to see the price of the crew boxes, as they look like they're a gang box and the expansion box..?

 

The pipe terrain looks really nice, although I do worry it's perhaps a little detailed for terrain, if that makes sense..?

Edited 19 hours ago by Firedrake Cordova

[Evil Eye]

20 minutes ago, Lord Marshal said:

In fairness, the current edition of Necromunda is what, nine years old? I wouldn't call that a churn machine. Most non-GW games don't go that long without one.

 

That is fair, I just think it's a bit of a shame to render that 9 years of content completely obsolete; especially given the generally very positive reception Necromunda had. It's not like with 40K where regardless of your thoughts of 8th, we absolutely needed some kind of reset after 7th collapsed under its own weight. 

 

As for female Goliaths I wasn't aware they were already present so I partially rescind my comment there. Still seems a weird choice to make though, but what do I know.

[Indy Techwisp]

Being honest, Necromunda being refreshed seemed likely at it had become the oldest of the 40k games by a sizable margin.

 

That said, I hope it doesn't simplify the game too much.

Necromunda being a granular campaign system with evolving stats is kind of it's entire appeal, so having the new edition be named Necromunda Skirmish feels like a misunderstanding of what people actually want from Necromunda.

 

Obviously we can only wait for the rules previews to start but based on how the various Necromunda communities have responded to the preview alone I expect if it does get "flattened" mechanically then any Warhammer Social media page is going to be a hellscape for a while.

[sitnam]

The boxset gangs remind me very much of a KT kit in terms of posing and every sculpt seeming fairly unique.

 

Hope we see more of these, I'd love another group of Cawdor to turn into cultists.

[Castigator]

7 minutes ago, Lord Marshal said:

 

In fairness, the current edition of Necromunda is what, nine years old? I wouldn't all that a churn machine. Most non-GW games don't go that long without one.

Nah it's had more upgrades than 40k has had in the last 10 years.

First there was the inititial 2017 release along with 5 gang books and they couldn't even be bothered to do a proper Delaque book for. Then they released an updated rulebook with new gang books. Then they released Hive Wars with a different rulebook. Then Dark Uprising with yet another rulebook. Then they released Ash Wastes which added more rules. Then they released the current hardback book which updated all of the core rules in one place. And then they released Secundas with a different rulebook again.
Let's not even get started with all of the campaign books, hopefully these won't become obsolete unlike the Cawdor, Delaque, Enforcers, Escher, Goliath, Orlocks, Van Saar, Squats, Corpse Grinders, Genestealers, Outcasts, Venators, Ash Wasters and Chaos Helots.
I have about 20kgs of books heading for the bin, so to say I'm  a bit miffed is an understatement 

[Indy Techwisp]

1 minute ago, sitnam said:

The boxset gangs remind me very much of a KT kit in terms of posing and every sculpt seeming fairly unique.

 

Hope we see more of these, I'd love another group of Cawdor to turn into cultists.

 

Just had a thought actually.

They could totally do all Female model boxes of Cawdor those edition.

We know Female Cawdor gangs exist, they just don't form mixed gangs.

Would be interesting to see considering they canonically style themselves on Sisters of Battle.

[Petitioner's City]

48 minutes ago, Evil Eye said:

Oh dear. Where to begin.

 

Firstly putting Necromunda on the edition churn machine, resetting the rules and invalidating all the content released so far is laaaaaaaaaaaame. I'd considered getting into Necromunda but I'm absolutely not willing to engage with it now.

 

Secondly, the dreaded "streamlining" was mentioned, which combined with the laughable board for the starter set suggests the game is being dumbed down into oblivion.

 

Thirdly, and I'll admit this is a more minor consideration, but female Goliaths...doesn't make any sense. They're supposed to be a gang of all-male vat-grown serfs with short and nasty lives. Like, that's their entire thing. And I don't see any male Eschers either. Like, you have 5 other gangs for female rep, one of which is entirely female (male Eschers are invariably stunted mutants). What was the point?

 

Yeah. Not impressed.

 

(1) Necromunda has had a semi-continuous edition since 2018, when the first collated rulebook and gangs of the under hive was published, but there have been new quasi-editioning within that period with eventually the current core rulebook from a few years ago. It's a big bloated mess, which can be great, but honestly this feels like a good decision. Any sense of editing churn being new to this is nonsense - Munda has had that churn within its "quasi-editions" since under hive and gang war 1 in 2017

 

(2) Tell me did you ever look at the original 2017 Underhive box, or the early 2020s gang war box, or Secundus last last year, etc. they looked very much like this - and like those, presumably this is a self contained box, a flat sheet and the bare bones of terrain (in 2017, some barriers and doors; in Hive War, some teeny walls; in Secundus, not much!). With each it was expected you also get all the other things that let you play normal Munda - but the boxes were self contained and very simplified versus the "actual" game. Again, what we see in this new box is nothing new, as a product, as the model of minis and a sheet is very familiar to anyone who bought three of the five starter boxes since 2017.

 

(3) The first female Goliath mini was in 2020. And female Goliath have been mentioned in novels and stories outwith that (for example Spark of Revolution). 2020's House of Chains establishes that house goliath is both a genetic lineage, of families some naturally born and many more vat-grown, as well as a cultural diaspora which welcomes non-genetically Goliath people into it. So plenty of women!

 

So, Mr Eye, you are six years out of date with one point and nine with another.

 

I mean I am both excited and worried about this, but that's been every new release since 2017 - it's a big old mess, brilliant and I can't tell you how many of my Munda books have been replaced by new books published not very long after they were. It's been a game of churn since it launched :) 

 

 

 

 

Edited 20 hours ago by Firedrake Cordova
=][= Keep it civil =][=

[Indy Techwisp]

2 minutes ago, Castigator said:

Nah it's had more upgrades than 40k has had in the last 10 years.

First there was the inititial 2017 release along with 5 gang books and they couldn't even be bothered to do a proper Delaque book for. Then they released an updated rulebook with new gang books. Then they released Hive Wars with a different rulebook. Then Dark Uprising with yet another rulebook. Then they released Ash Wastes which added more rules. Then they released the current hardback book which updated all of the core rules in one place. And then they released Secundas with a different rulebook again.
Let's not even get started with all of the campaign books, hopefully these won't become obsolete unlike the Cawdor, Delaque, Enforcers, Escher, Goliath, Orlocks, Van Saar, Squats, Corpse Grinders, Genestealers, Outcasts, Venators, Ash Wasters and Chaos Helots.
I have about 20kgs of books heading for the bin, so to say I'm  a bit miffed is an understatement 

 

Don't bin them.

Keep them so you can keep playing your campaigns if the new edition sucks ass and pray they let the Bloodbowl guys handle it since they seem to know how to refresh a granular rules system without flattening it into a pancake.

[Joe]

3 minutes ago, Castigator said:

I have about 20kgs of books heading for the bin, so to say I'm  a bit miffed is an understatement 

 

You could also just... not do that? You aren't obligated to throw old rulebooks out when a new edition rolls around - no one is holding you at gun point and saying you'll never be able to use them again. That's a comically daft position to take.

[Castigator]

1 minute ago, Indy Techwisp said:

 

Don't bin them.

Keep them so you can keep playing your campaigns if the new edition sucks ass and pray they let the Bloodbowl guys handle it since they seem to know how to refresh a granular rules system without flattening it into a pancake.

We were discussing this last week over our weekly campaign game. As long as Munda Manager doesn't do away with the files we'll probably be sticking with this edition

[Evil Eye]

15 minutes ago, Petitioner's City said:

(3) The first female Goliath mini was in 2020. And female Goliath have been mentioned in novels and stories outwith that (for example Spark of Revolution). 2020's House of Chains establishes that house goliath is both a genetic lineage, of families some naturally born and many more vat-grown, as well as a cultural diaspora which welcomes non-genetically Goliath people into it. So plenty of women!

Fair enough; weird retcon to make, not sure it really adds anything much but...sure?

Edited 20 hours ago by Firedrake Cordova

[Lord Marshal]

16 minutes ago, Castigator said:

I have about 20kgs of books heading for the bin, so to say I'm  a bit miffed is an understatement 

 

That's the thing about Necromunda though, of all GW's games, since it's not designed to be competitive, you really don't have to get swept up in the 'new edition hype' since nobody's attending Necromunda tournaments demanding you use the latest versions of the rules. The RPG comparisons are apt, because it's inherently more of a social experience than expecting to rock up for a 40k pick-up-game.

 

You and your mates just go "okay I wanna do a Necromunda campaign using my 20kg of 3rd edition books, you game?" and not need to worry that Derek wants to use 4th because there's a tournament coming up, or Bob only wants to use 4th because he's attending a pick-up-game the next store over and can't juggle the mental load.

 

Edited 20 hours ago by Lord Marshal

[Toxichobbit]

6 minutes ago, Petitioner's City said:

 

 

 

(2) Tell me did you ever look at the original 2017 Underhive box, or the early 2020s gang war box, or Secundus last last year, etc. they looked very much like this - and like those, presumably this is a self contained box, but expected you also get all the other things that let you play (the new) normal Munda. Again this is nothing new, and very familiar to three of the five starter boxes since 2017.

 

It's not a self contained box. The rulebook in this box is the same as the rulebook being sold separately, aka the main rulebook. They said that in the preview. This is a new edition and as they also said in the preview, a streamlined and balanced rules reset. They then confirmed on their blog that the previous books are all being invalidated. All 9 years of them. Some of the current gangs might be unsupported, at least at launch, because there's (apparently - not been able to find the source for this info yet) 12 gangs in those books and there's more than 12 gangs in Necromunda, even if you don't count the gangs like Venators, Helot Cults or GSC who never had official models. This is nothing like the previous box sets you mentioned. None of them were rules re-writes with GW's ever so delicate "balance" & "streamlining", rather they were additional content for the current games with occasional tidying up of the current rules. From what's been said by GW so far it sounds more like HH going from 2nd ed to 3rd last year, and we all know how well that went.

[Petitioner's City]

17 minutes ago, Evil Eye said:

Fair enough; weird retcon to make, not sure it really adds anything much but...sure?

 

Id recommend reading House of Chains! Early in modern Munda, when they did those twitch interviews with Ceri(iirc?) and then Wade, very early on we met JTY and Owen Barnes alongside Andy H. Barnes had worked with Hoare (and Bligh and French) for their FFG rpgs and had an especial talent for world building. I think all those ideas were thus bedded very early on into the edition, to that first year after Underhive and before the first "new" rulebook of late 2018, and the first art for the forgeborn was revealed a long time before the release. 

 

Anyway, I ramble, but I think Hoare, Barnes, and their colleagues then and since were trying to make this world function and make sense, within it's craziness, and thus Goliath became a lot more nuanced, varied and worldly. 

[Gorgoff]

Necromunda was a "books get replaced over and over again" :cuss:hole for years now so I stopped buying GW books a long time ago. 

So that isn't anything new but the word streamlining has fallen and also "blablachange to make every role count".

Sounds horrific to me because GW scarred me over the years by dropping these words and meaning taking away everything which made the games interesting. 

But we'll see. 

Those models look nice at least.

Edited 18 hours ago by Gorgoff

[Petitioner's City]

17 minutes ago, Toxichobbit said:

 

It's not a self contained box. The rulebook in this box is the same as the rulebook being sold separately, aka the main rulebook. They said that in the preview. This is a new edition and as they also said in the preview, a streamlined and balanced rules reset. They then confirmed on their blog that the previous books are all being invalidated. All 9 years of them. Some of the current gangs might be unsupported, at least at launch, because there's (apparently - not been able to find the source for this info yet) 12 gangs in those books and there's more than 12 gangs in Necromunda, even if you don't count the gangs like Venators, Helot Cults or GSC who never had official models. This is nothing like the previous box sets you mentioned. None of them were rules re-writes with GW's ever so delicate "balance" & "streamlining", rather they were additional content for the current games with occasional tidying up of the current rules. From what's been said by GW so far it sounds more like HH going from 2nd ed to 3rd last year, and we all know how well that went.

 

Oh I understand this, but it's still like those boxes too - the box isn't the full game, and I assume the gang lists in the box will be limited to what's in the box, rather those full ones in the separate publication (ie just like all those past boxes!). Therefore this is quite like Underhive and Secundus and so on :) 

 

As for the past nine years of books. I also own them all, every one. They are an edition (or possibly three editions between 2017, 2018 and 2023, or four if you consider 2020 as a kind of new edition too). But they are humongous, unwieldy. Heck there is still content from GotU which is legal (Slate, etc), and the 55 credit grenade launcher or the 55 credit bolter survives somehow since gang war 1 and 2, even before the late 2018 core books.

 

And the game - this huge collection of print and PDF - basically only functions in totality due to three websites (or two now, since Malo took  their break). 

 

You still have all the lore in your existing purple books, the art and the maps - they are still worthy and valid. But the game is such a mess - it always has been - and this feels like a good step. 

[Gorgoff]

Although I am fairly certain that GW will do the GW thing and change another of their tabletop game to a boring boardgame I do think a new start is necessary. I certainly don't know which rulebook is the current one for example. They made so much content that I lost track and a re-start could be good. 

But on the other hand they did say streamlined.... 

Edited 18 hours ago by Gorgoff