Space Wolf supplement AND POINTS leaked

[Karhedron]

It is a video review but covers our detachments, unit rules and points!

 

Saga of the Beastslayer is dead but Saga of the Greatwolf is fantastic for 2 DPs and allows us to bolt on something fun like Assault Brethren or Gauntlet Taskforce.

 

 

[Lathe Biosas]

This is the problem with being a Dark Angels player, we are so secretive that we never share our leaks... unlike the Wolves who openly share everything. 

[TiguriusX]

Oh ya...I can definitely make this work

 

SW should rise up with this codex.  Dunno how successful we end up but I feel competitive with what I have seen

[Wolf Guard Dan]

Don’t sleep on Wulfen Enhancement being “Adeptus Astartes”. It’s not longer space wolf locked. It opens up a lot possibilities. Beyond putting generic marine characters with Wulfen you can give that to a character and put him in a unit that’s not Wulfen. It would give that unit the Wulfen keyword. Combo that with murderfang fight in death aura and that makes a brick of assault terminators interesting. There’s a lot to unpack there. I suspect this might get errata’ed
 

I really like the new rules. Saga of the great wolf looks great. Changes to the characters give a lot of tools. Need to see the book in front of me. 

[TiguriusX]

After mulling things over...Logan is a must take and an amazing Chapter master with current rules

 

One example is Great Wolf + Terminator detachment

 

Logan with 10xSB/Chainfist vanilla terminators (CF let you kill monsters/vehicles and Logan can pick up the slack against other soft targets)

Deep strike in (turn 1 if you want b/c Logan keyword makes it a SW unit)
Rapid fire something to death with lethal sustain bolters (1 CP terminator stratagem)

Charge something else with +3 on the charge (+1 from SoGW assault doctrine buff;+1 from terminator detachment; +1 from a venerable dread)

If you live pick up the unit at the end of opponent's fight phase (1 CP CP terminator stratagem)

Repeat

 

This is gonna be an insanely powerful combo

[Moonstalker]

I'm really liking the doctrine buffs from SotGW matched up with one of the brethren detachments.  Particularly eyeing Assault Brethren.  Two turns of advance and charge with +1 to advance and charge rolls, that's a lot of mobility.  AoC, reactive move, baby Oath, assault and reroll 1s in dev doctrine, SusH1 and fall back and shoot/charge in tactical.  The SusH1:Non-monster/vehicle upgrade in Assault Brethren feels like it could be good on some newly upgraded Grey Hunters; upgrade two squads, split them, now you've got four squads with the upgrade.  Holding them as 10 man bricks to get the most out of something like Gene-wrought Might is also good.  Looking at something like 40 attacks of S6 AP-3 D1 SusH1 Lance.  Or you could maximize SusH with Eye of the Pack to reroll hits of 1 and 2.

 

I've been playing in a Crusade and in phase 1, at 500 points, I was using Legend of Saga and Song, and the +1 to charge rolls and uppy-downy for terminators were doing some good work for me.  So the terminator detachment here is tempting, but SotGW offers enough of the charge roll benefit that I think I can skip it.  At 2 CP, the -1 Damage stratagem might just be too expensive to use very much.  Armor of Contempt out of Assault Brethren still kinda fills the niche.  I've been using Saga of the Great Wolf now that we've upped to 1k and it has likewise been doing good things for me.  The buffed reactive move is very nice, guaranteed 4 inches.  Now that I've seen the prices on the upgrades in the dreadnought detachment, I'm less keen on it.  It's still a good detachment rule, some good strats, but I'm just not sure it makes the cut.  But SotGW still offers a small benefit for dreadnoughts, a strat to give them mobile.

 

I saw Goonhammer kinda gloss over one change to Headtakers, and I think they're sleeping on it.  You can keep your dogs with them, instead of splitting them.  This is something scouts could do, and it gave them a neat party trick where they could spring the dog forward and gain +3 inches threat range with its 10 inch move (maintaining coherency with the back of the dog's long base), then you could pull the scouts up those 3 inches with your pile in.  But scouts aren't really great at melee so it's not terribly important.  For headtakers?  Having an extra 3 inches threat range on your go turn is great, and you can choose during deployment whether you need that threat range or you need a cheap screen.

 

But yeah.  Pretty hyped to try out mass grey hunters/blood claws/terminators in SotGW/Assault Brethren.  Bring Logan and some dreadnoughts, and you can give those dreadnoughts reroll 1s to hit for shooting for one turn.

[TiguriusX]

47 minutes ago, Moonstalker said:

I saw Goonhammer kinda gloss over one change to Headtakers, and I think they're sleeping on it.  You can keep your dogs with them, instead of splitting them.  This is something scouts could do, and it gave them a neat party trick where they could spring the dog forward and gain +3 inches threat range with its 10 inch move (maintaining coherency with the back of the dog's long base), then you could pull the scouts up those 3 inches with your pile in.  But scouts aren't really great at melee so it's not terribly important.  For headtakers?  Having an extra 3 inches threat range on your go turn is great, and you can choose during deployment whether you need that threat range or you need a cheap screen.

 

 

 

The attached hunting wolves are also good ablative wounds for the unit

If you add a Wolf Priest to the squad you can potentially regenerate lots of hunting wolves over the course of a game

[Wolf Guard Dan]

I’m always taking saga of the great wolf. Really pleased with this detachment. I like having a hard decision on the 1DP. Taking Assault Brethren is something if I’m leaning into non-terminator units. If taking mostly terminators then terminator detachment makes sense. Turn 1 ingress and uppy downy. Five wolf guard terminators are the same cost as before with the toughness enhancement. But you pay more for ten. Maybe moving to five man units and including more vanilla terminator units? I’m glad to have to think a bit.

 

Nice point about head takers. I don’t think anything we got is busted. Seems strong though. And dark angels being busted will hopefully take GW’s attention the next couple rounds of errata.

[TiguriusX]

Just finished my first playtest with the new rules

Won against Aeldari list (purge)...the new rules feel competitive

Logan finally feels like a REAL chapter master...having all 3 doctrines always active for his unit was nice

The bad news is I faced a high mobility aeldari list so the 10 man harlies got the alpha into me (I tanked enough to wipe them)
Then I ate Yriel and friends out of a falcon
With Logan gone I had nothing to challenge the avatar so it found its way into my firestrikes (avatar moved 19" then charged on its go turn)
 

 

 

 

More testing needed to find ideal mix of detachments and interchangeable units

But the core is strong

Logan + terminator brick

3xFirestrikes

Battleline coming out of rhinos

Spoiler

2000	Total	Don't overwatch me bro (6" Terminator charge)
150	Logan
400	10xTerminators (SB/CF + CML)
150	10xBCs
190	10xGHs
100	Njal
190	10xGHs
130	Venerable Dread
160	2xFirestrike Servo Turrets with Autocannons
160	2xFirestrike Servo Turrets with Autocannons
160	2xFirestrike Servo Turrets with Autocannons
70	Rhino
70	Rhino
70	Impulsor
	Greatwolf
	Terminator
	Take and Hold

 

 

 

[Wolf Guard Dan]

How did the other infantry and Njal fair? Did you like the chain fists?

[Lathe Biosas]

Just wondering why you took so many Autocannon Firestrikes. 

[TiguriusX]

15 minutes ago, Lathe Biosas said:

Just wondering why you took so many Autocannon Firestrikes. 

36 overwatch shots hitting on 4

S9 AP1 D3 Twin linked 

 

it gives me open field control of an objective or lets me delete MSU moving to do actions etc.

 

the anti tank version isnt high enough volume 

 

 

 

Njal and GH were used as bait..I staged aggressively turn 1and forced him into my kill zone  otherwise I was running into his backfield 

 

Shining Spears and some dinosaur unit popped rhino and killed 7/10 GHs

 

firestrikes deleted them in my turn and njal went into hiding...late game njal scored me a ton of secondary points and his auto advance 6 was very useful...in an ideal game njal and GH advance to point blank to shoot them charge

 

 

Logan and chainfists killed a falcon easy but never got them into avatar because he avoided me

[jpwyrm]

18 hours ago, TiguriusX said:

36 overwatch shots hitting on 4

S9 AP1 D3 Twin linked 

 

it gives me open field control of an objective or lets me delete MSU moving to do actions etc.

 

the anti tank version isnt high enough volume 

 

 

 

Njal and GH were used as bait..I staged aggressively turn 1and forced him into my kill zone  otherwise I was running into his backfield 

 

Shining Spears and some dinosaur unit popped rhino and killed 7/10 GHs

 

firestrikes deleted them in my turn and njal went into hiding...late game njal scored me a ton of secondary points and his auto advance 6 was very useful...in an ideal game njal and GH advance to point blank to shoot them charge

 

 

Logan and chainfists killed a falcon easy but never got them into avatar because he avoided me

 

Who would have predicted the Firestrike Turrets would become a competitive choice? Let alone Autocanons one! Now I'm wondering how I can kitbash some for my own army.

 

I'm surprised the Venerable Dreadnought escaped the recent Legend purge. Do you think it's only a matter of time before GW finds out and retire him also?

[TiguriusX]

The list i am using with new rules is only 1690 total points under old rules

 

The increase in power we got makes it feel like a steal rather than a new codex tax

 

Logan getting the calgar experience with all 3 doctrines all the time is really fun with a brick of terminators...it is soooooo powerful. 

 

The only bad news is the 1 DP terminator detachment is a must take

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Moonstalker]

3 hours ago, jpwyrm said:

 

Who would have predicted the Firestrike Turrets would become a competitive choice? Let alone Autocanons one! Now I'm wondering how I can kitbash some for my own army.

 

I'm surprised the Venerable Dreadnought escaped the recent Legend purge. Do you think it's only a matter of time before GW finds out and retire him also?

 

I always thought rapiers would make a good proxy for Firestrikes, if I ever wanted to field some.  They're what Firestrikes really should've been, IMO.

[Wolf Guard Dan]

If you’re taking 10 terminators I recommend splitting CF/PF. 5 chainfist probably kills most vehicles. Logan and the power fists can probably take care of any spare wounds remaining.

[Orange Knight]

So Grimnar is very similar to Calgar now.
Str 10, damage 3 in combat, has access to all 3 doctrines at all times - very powerful.

I think the Headtakers are super interesting now, because their wolves are a part of the unit. You could have 6 Headtakers, 6 wolves and a character in a unit. That's 6 extra bodies to put the big hits on when you get into a melee.

 

[Karhedron]

2 hours ago, Orange Knight said:

I think the Headtakers are super interesting now, because their wolves are a part of the unit. You could have 6 Headtakers, 6 wolves and a character in a unit. That's 6 extra bodies to put the big hits on when you get into a melee.

 

The only downside is that blob cannot ride in a Transport because the Wolves have the BEAST keyword rather than INFANTRY. It isn't a deal-breaker since Doctrines give us access to Advance and Charge with +1" to both under SOTGW. Assuming Wolves keep their 10" move, that is an average 22.5" threat range.

[Apokalypsi]

Saw a topic on Reddit about combos that can get a turn 1 charge. The thought experiment was to get through No Man's Land so Wolf Jail can continue in 11th. A couple were give Wolf-Touched to a JP Captain and put him with Wulfen or Headtakers in a Scouting Impulsor.

 

I'm thinking Drop Pods are going to be prime for Wolf Jail and it should work in any detachments. Select Assault Doctrine turn 1 and bring in 3x Drop Pods each with 6 Headtakers along with a 5-man Grey Hunter pack. Throw a character in if you want. Unless I'm reading the assault disembark move wrong, that's 6 units that can come in anywhere 8" from enemy units and advance and charge.

[TiguriusX]

1 hour ago, Apokalypsi said:

Saw a topic on Reddit about combos that can get a turn 1 charge. The thought experiment was to get through No Man's Land so Wolf Jail can continue in 11th. A couple were give Wolf-Touched to a JP Captain and put him with Wulfen or Headtakers in a Scouting Impulsor.

 

I'm thinking Drop Pods are going to be prime for Wolf Jail and it should work in any detachments. Select Assault Doctrine turn 1 and bring in 3x Drop Pods each with 6 Headtakers along with a 5-man Grey Hunter pack. Throw a character in if you want. Unless I'm reading the assault disembark move wrong, that's 6 units that can come in anywhere 8" from enemy units and advance and charge.

 

If you REALLY wanna say YOLO and do turn 1 Wolf Jail you can do the following combo

 

Saga of the Great Wolf

Gauntlet Task Force using enhancement to ignore overwatch and reroll charges

Mass SW infantry (BC/GHs/Headtakers) coming out of drop pods (need infantry and SW keywords for the combos)

Logan Grimnar + Venerable dread

When it all comes together you need 7 on the charge
+1 charge from great wolf

+1 from venerable dread (dread can come on turn 1 thanks to Logan ability)

Charging needing a 7 is 58.33% or with rerolling 82.6% (you can have 3 reroll enhancements + 1 CP reroll using this combo)

You also need something that infiltrates to secure your landing zones or you lose due to deployment/scout combos

 

Edited Tuesday at 07:25 PM by TiguriusX

[Madic]

I'm looking forward to make a termie army. SotGW and the terminator detachment has everything except AoC and a lance strat. It saddens me however that I dont really see the point of taking wolfguard terminators at all. With an ancient the regular termies are as tough, sure they are more expensive but both tactical and assault termies (both flavors) absolutely slaughter whatever you send them into. Str 5 without lance and without rerolls really feels lackluster post codex release.

[TiguriusX]

3 hours ago, Madic said:

I'm looking forward to make a termie army. SotGW and the terminator detachment has everything except AoC and a lance strat. It saddens me however that I dont really see the point of taking wolfguard terminators at all. With an ancient the regular termies are as tough, sure they are more expensive but both tactical and assault termies (both flavors) absolutely slaughter whatever you send them into. Str 5 without lance and without rerolls really feels lackluster post codex release.

 

If we could take chainfists I think our faction specific terminators would be just fine as a side grade (trading AP+1 for transhuman if S higher without needing an ancient attached).

 

It's unfortunate they removed the bits from the new Wolf Guard Terminator box.

 

My old SW terminator boxes have SW specific chainfist bits...I will be using them all with Logan now

[Madic]

12 hours ago, TiguriusX said:

 

If we could take chainfists I think our faction specific terminators would be just fine as a side grade (trading AP+1 for transhuman if S higher without needing an ancient attached).

 

It's unfortunate they removed the bits from the new Wolf Guard Terminator box.

 

My old SW terminator boxes have SW specific chainfist bits...I will be using them all with Logan now

 

Yeah we won't get any new gear for them for years. They might bump strength to 6 or allow other characters to join them but points cost is the tool they have so I'm afraid wolf guard terminators will be the budget terminator for a foreseeable future which is a crime lorewise. 

Edited Friday at 10:00 AM by Madic

[Hear da Lamentation]

Wow - this seems to suck.

Are we really saying Wolf Guard Termies are the poor choice now?  I dont have the costs for new SM codex,

 

I've not done this before, but I'm all in on 10 temies + Arjac + Logan as my army anvil, so ...

 

10 WG Terminators with SS and Master Crafted (so 4W each)

1 Axe

2 PF and AC

Arjac

Logan

 

Vs

 

10 Terminators with ??? (What do you suggest equipment wise)

Arjac
Logan

(and would have to have ancient to get the -1 to W if S above T)?

 

What's the cost difference?

 

I was thinking of mixing and matching with WG termies (which might be a strength?)  

1 Axe, 2 PF + AC

7 SB + mcw

(to take advantage of Devastator Doctrine)

 

Or 

 

1 Axe, 2PF + AC

4 SB/mcw 3 SS

 

Or are the chain fists just blowing our WG out the water?

 

HDL

 

[Madic]

2 minutes ago, Hear da Lamentation said:

Wow - this seems to suck.

Are we really saying Wolf Guard Termies are the poor choice now?  I dont have the costs for new SM codex,

 

I've not done this before, but I'm all in on 10 temies + Arjac + Logan as my army anvil, so ...

 

10 WG Terminators with SS and Master Crafted (so 4W each)

1 Axe

2 PF and AC

Arjac

Logan

 

Vs

 

10 Terminators with ??? (What do you suggest equipment wise)

Arjac
Logan

(and would have to have ancient to get the -1 to W if S above T)?

 

What's the cost difference?

 

I was thinking of mixing and matching with WG termies (which might be a strength?)  

1 Axe, 2 PF + AC

7 SB + mcw

(to take advantage of Devastator Doctrine)

 

Or 

 

1 Axe, 2PF + AC

4 SB/mcw 3 SS

 

Or are the chain fists just blowing our WG out the water?

 

HDL

 

 

10 Tactical terminators with chainfists and cyclone missile launcher is 400p with an ancient 470 or 475 compared to 380 i think for 10 WGT but what logan does for that unit is insane. It will threaten anything, consistently one round c'tan, knights, even primarchs. The WGT will just hit so many brick walls witg str 5. I'm not saying they are bad. They are still tough but with the amount points you pay it needs to do more.

 

I think chaplains and librarians can join WGT now which can remedy this a bit but at that point assault terminators both hammer and lightning claws variants will do a much better job. Comparing a MC power weapon and a thunderhammer now is just silly.

 

If you already stocked up on WGT it's easy enough to just change the weapon loadout and just call em WGT with thunderhammers etc.