Some thoughts on the Lost Company

[spyrer2000]

Yeah, you could miss with the meltas, but then you could charge with the krak grenades and the WGPL's powerfist. With a bolt pistol, he'd get 6-8 Attacks on the charge, more than enough to take care of most tanks.

 

You're right in that the bikers would be more versatile (and normally, I'm all over that), but the Long Fangs are slightly better at focusing on tank hunting since they can target two each turn. Hmmm. Might be worth trying out the bikers and see if there's anything else I've missed.

[Mountain Angel]

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Long Fangs have a tendency to die early. If the bike squad in lieu of the Fangs could make up the difference then they are definitely worth considering. If someone could playtest this option that would be great!

 

B)

 

-MA

[sdfmacross2]

Well I've played a few games with my switch to bikes with 2 meltaguns and I like them. They actually have no problem targetting a tank on it's side and they actually make up their points cost if they destroy one tank. Long Fangs are so static and if you don't get first turn your opponent just moves them and then no more line of sight for long fangs. Like I posted earlier I had long fangs with 3 ML and with me switching to bikers I shaved enough points off to acquire 2 more wolves. Trust me you should try it. The one advantage that I definately saw off the bat is setting up the bikes last. This is so good. Your opponent puts all his tanks first and then of course you set up troops behind cover and then put the wulfen on the flank and wolves all the way up front because for me if I do get first turn those bad boys are charging somebody. Then your tankhunting bikes go last. Tell me the possibility of setting up your tankhunters last is not bad. You will always have that gap that your opponent has left open. Well trust me just switch out your long fangs with bikers with 2 meltaguns and see how it goes. The only problem I have right now is knowing when to gate and when not to. I've only played maybe 30 games total so I'm still learning.

[spyrer2000]

Good point. Tank-hunting Storm Claw bikers do gain a benefit from deploying last.

[Mountain Angel]

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If I weren't busy with my FT then I would definitely build another bike squad to see how they fare. Based on yer experience it sounds like you get more bang fer the points with the bikers over Fangs.

 

B)

 

-MA

[spyrer2000]

Quite possibly...which is a darn shame. I am >< this close to finishing my Long Fangs and I have only barely started any bikers. *sniff* *waaaaaaah* B)

[sdfmacross2]

Well looks at what 13th company lack. They lack tank-busting and mobility.

 

Long Fangs with 3 missile lauchers (notice how miss is in the word) = 150

 

Storm Claw bikers with 2 meltas = 128

 

With Long Fangs you do have long range firepower but they are so expensive and come on when was the last time you really used split fire. You have to put so much firepower into killing a tank because first you roll to hit, then to see if you pen, then roll for damage that's why I never split fire. Long Fangs are also static. I first thought that scout was so good because it meant I could move into a good position, but if I didn't win first roll then the opponent (any good one) would just annhilate them or move their tanks out of position to shoot at your guys. What tank out there is worth more than 150 points. Now let's look at Storm claw bikers with 2 meltaguns. I cannot stress the ability to have a tankhunter squad be one of the last drops in the game. You can analyze the weakness of your opponent by knowing where to gate and having bikers as backup. Any good player will shoot the wolves anyways because of the first turn potential charge. That leaves your 2 main tankbusting units free reign throughout the board. The Storm claw bikers are the best. The scout move 12, 12 regular move and 12 inch meltas and don't forget AP1 weapons are so cool. Basically there's no vehicle that can't be touch because remember you don't need to roll a leadership test for the closest vehicle. 3 bikers can even charge entire squads of say like eldar guardians or IG. You have great mobility and their way cheaper than a unit of Long Fangs. Trust me, playtest the Bikers and you will love it.

[Mountain Angel]

-Movement-

Let's break this section into the following groups:

 

Pre-game movement,

Normal movement,

Animal Rage,

Feet of Paw,

Teleporting (The Gate),

Turbo-Boost.

 

First it is important to take spacing between armies into consideration when using standard missions other than Cleanse from the V4 rulebook. All standard missions (other than Cleanse) mandate that models must be placed more than 24 inches away from each other.

 

-Pre-game movement

All your units have a free move prior to the game since the Scout universal applies to all members of the Lost Company. There is still some question as to whether or not the Scout rule applies to models on bikes or suited in tactical dreadnaught armour, so I will be conservative for now and assume they cannot.

 

Fenrisian wolf packs greatly benefit from the free move since they count as calvary and benefit from the Fleet of Foot universal rule. Your wolf packs count as fast attack so they will setup last. Therefore, you can place them closest to the enemy unit you wish to engage. If you have the choice consider targeting shooty units since they are the bane of the Lost Company. Only Fenrisian wolves can move 25 inches or more in one turn, and thereby achieve a first turn charge. Fenrisian Wolves can do so because they have:

 

- 6 inches pre-game move

- 6 inches first turn move

- d6 inches Fleet of Foot

- 12 inches charge

 

That totals up to 25 - 30 inches!

 

The free move is also very helpful for the Wulfen since they also have Animal Rage movement. If I am facing a shooty army I deploy my Wulfen behind cover, watch how the opponent deploys, then use the free move to push the Wulfen closer to the enemy.

 

Wulfen can only achieve a first turn charge in the Cleanse mission or a special mission because they can only move up to 24 inches. Here is the breakdown:

 

- 6 inches pre-game move

- d6 inches Animal Rage

- 6 inches first turn move

- 6 inches charge

 

That totals 19 - 24 inches.

 

Be on the lookout for enemy units that infiltrate too close to the Wulfen. If they are close enough you can charge them, then your werewolves are right up against the enemy battleline... which is where you want them to be. You can even charge vehicles with AV11 facing the Wulfen since they are S5. They will land so many attacks there is a fair chance you can destroy the vehicle on a glancing blow. The Wulfen then have a nice piece of cover to hide behind until the next turn. It's all about moving your army up as quickly and safely as possible to engage the enemy since the Lost Company excels in close combat.

 

Grey Slayers and Storm Claws can use the free move to cover some ground between them and the enemy. They are both slow when compared to Wulfen, wolf packs, and bikes... so every little bit helps. It is most often much better to start 18 inches away as opposed to 24 inches. Slayers and Storm Claws slowly make their way forward and form the second wave of your assault. Charging the Wulfen and wolf packs early on makes things much easier for Slayers and Storm Claws. It is important to note that the pre-game move for Grey Slayers puts them within rapid-fire range during the second turn, something most armies need Rhinoes to accomplish.

 

Long Fangs also benefit from the pre-game move. Deploy them behind cover then use the free move to pop into a nice piece of cover that has good LOS.

 

(Thanks to spryer2000 for his help here! B))

 

 

Next -> Normal Movement

[Wolf Lord Duregar]

I

[spyrer2000]

Mountain Angel, I think you may be a little confused about how Deployment works and the distances between models.

 

All standard missions (other than Cleanse) mandate that models must be placed more than 24" away from each other. In fact, I believe the exact wording is "no unit may be deployed within 24" of the enemy" or "no unit may be deployed more than 12" from the table edge." In either of these cases, models are more than 24" apart.

 

More than 24" apart means only models who can move 25" or more can achieve a first turn charge. Fenrisian Wolves can do so because they get 6" (pre-game move) 6" (1st turn move) D6" (Fleet) and 12" (Charge). That's 25-30".

 

Wulfen cannot achieve a first turn charge (except in a Cleanse mission or a special mission) because they can only move up to 24" - 6" (pre-game) D6" (Animal Rage) 6" (1st turn move) and 6" (Charge). That's 19-24". Even if you rolled maximum on Animal Rage, Wulfen cannot gain a first turn charge since they started out more than 24" away from the enemy units (again, in standard missions other than Cleanse or special missions).

 

It's important to note that the pre-game move for Grey Slayers puts them within rapid-fire range on turn 2, something most armies need Rhinos for. B)

[Mountain Angel]

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@ spryer2000 (I am gonna start calling you s2k B))

 

Where I play we still often use the old RTT scenarios, but I will go back and edit the content to account for the new V4 rulebook standard missions. One of my fav missions is Cleanse II!

 

:P

 

-MA

[spyrer2000]

Cleanse II is a fun mission, I like the diagonal Deployment Zones. Evan Lougheed told me a funny story once about how he came up with that.

 

MA, it's Turbo-boosters, not Turbo-charge, and they're just calling Fleet of whatever Fleet nowadays. B)

[Mountain Angel]

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Furious assault vs. furious charge... fearless vs. fearlessness... turbo-charge just sounds cool!

 

:P

 

-MA

[spyrer2000]

In a Cleanse mission, celebrate! Wulfen can now gain a first turn charge (19"-24" remember?) so if you line up your units right, you can throw down serious hurtin' in this mission. Generally, I think Cleanse is among the tougher missions for 13th Company to win, but there are some advantages here that shouldn't be ignored.

[Mountain Angel]

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Who would have ever thought that the free move can be so huge?

 

:P

 

-MA

[galaxyzen]

To all that have worked on the 13th Company Tactica,

 

GREAT JOB!!! I have spent the last 3 days waiting patienly during my off hours downloading the pages to read them, and it was worth the wait! You have all done a wonderful job, and you have given this old wolf some new insights. Even though I can't post as often as I like right now, I do come in and read when the North Star is in alignment with the third moon of Venus (this connectivity thing on the Big Blue really bites), so seeing some high-quality discussions really makes my day. You guys rock! Wherever I go next, I am going to drink an Ale in your memory. Actually, if I ever meet you, I'll buy you an Ale! Hats off, mates!

 

GZ

[Mountain Angel]

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Just wanted to let you know I'll start back up this weekend. Work is very hectic this week.

 

<_<

 

-MA

[Mountain Angel]

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I bumped this so I will remember to add the next section movement this evening.

 

;)

 

-MA

[Mountain Angel]

-Normal Movement-

Okay, we have already covered a lot of ground discussing the free move before the game begins. The free move is very important and is a great boon to the Lost Company, however normal movement is just as important. I will break down advice for normal movement at the unit level.

 

-Wolf Lord on bike

I typically take a Wolf Lord mounted on a bike with Fenrisian wolves as wargear plus a Storm Claw biker retinue. If you take the Fenrisian wolves then remember that the bikes cannot use Turbo-Boost. Turbo-Boost is definitely a new and big advantage for mounted units but I still like to take the wolves since they help to suck up wounds, are quite fluffy, and are also good in close combat. The Fenrisian wolves die quickly so there is still a chance that later in the game you can use the Turbo-Boost movement.

 

I use the mounted Wolf Lord and his crew as a reserve units. That is, they are held back from close combat until the second half of the game. This provides three turns to move them into a good position where they will be able to charge and create a lot of destruction. They are a very hard hitting squad and can punch right through an enemy unit on the charge. They can also provide a counter assault for another Lost Company unit already stuck in that needs a little help.

 

I will also use this unit to strafe enemy units with their twin-linked bolters should the opportunity arise. Four sets of twin-linked bolters are great against T3 units with relatively poor armour saves. The bikes can use their 12 inch normal movement to get within rapid-fire range and then unload. Also remember that the bikes can still charge the same turn they rapid-fire if need be. I take a lot of flamers for my biker unit, but if I am not positioned well to place the templates then there is still the option to shoot the bolters.

 

This is a very versatile unit and can do it all. One of your goals is to keep them intact until they are ready to join the mad frey of close combat. Therefore, the bikes should use cover to keep them out of sight from enemy firepower. Don't be afraid to ride through difficult terrain with the bikes since they have the Skilled Rider ability. This is another big advantage in your favour since they can move the full 12 inches through, into, and out of difficult terrain.

 

-Wolf Priest joined with Wulfen

Typically this combined unit is using both Animal Rage and normal movement to quickly engage the enemy as fast as possible. There will be times when there is a big stretch of open terrain ahead of them. Don't blindly run out into the open! Take some time to consider the distance they must cover first before they can charge the enemy. This is one of the main reasons why I take a full squad of fifteen Wulfen and give the Wolf Priest Balms and Healing Potions. If you think you can reach the enemy with half or more of the Wulfen still intact then it is probably best to move out into the open and head straight at the enemy line.

 

I can distinctly remember three games where I had to move out into the open with my Wulfen in order to reach charge range:

 

Cleanse vs. Tau

Once against the Tau my opponent declared he did not want to use any terrain. It was a fairly small table so I agreed. The Tau player cheated and placed his HQ first (Crisis Suits) right in the middle of the table so that they were just inside the corner of his table quarter. This forced me back the full 18 inches within my table quarter. He won the right to go first and then moved back his Crisis Suits, gaining another 12 inches of separation from my army.

 

I figured it would all come down to if he could more quickly kill my Marines during his shooting phase than my army could cover the distance between us. I spread out my army and kept moving straight forward, knowing that less than half my army could kill all of his in his close combat. To make a long story short about five Wulfen and the Wolf Priest plus my Wolf Lord biker and his full retinue reached his battleline around Turn Four and proceeded to wipe him out to the last model. All of his units that were on the rear table edge eventually broke and fell off the table.

 

Cleanse vs. Iron Warriors

I took a gamble and setup my Wulfen in clear LOS to his Vindicator, which was also setup just inside his table quarter. I kept the Wulfen all spread out from each other by two full inches and kept moving straight forward. His Vindicator had a couple of bad scatters, and as a result the majority of the Wulfen swept into his battleline untouched. This game ended in a very close draw.

 

Cleanse II vs. Dark Angels

Again I decided to line up all my Wulfen so that they were in clear LOS of the enemy and 18 inches away. Every last Wulfen was shot down in cold blood before they could charge. I lost a very close game, but could have won if I better managed the movement of my Wulfen during the beginning of the game.

 

Lesson learned -> This combined unit should also use cover to move through when surrounded by many enemy guns! Like the rest of the army, this unit benefits from rolling 3d6 and choosing the highest when moving through cover. So typically they can ignore the detriments of moving through difficult terrain, plus they will definitely benefit from a cover save.

 

-Rune Priest

I am a firm believer in using The Gate. Typically I will use it at least three to four times a game. My strategy is to deploy the Rune Priest along with the melta toting Slayers somewhere safe behind cover. The first turn they teleport beside an enemy tank(s) and open fire. As such my Rune Priest does not use a lot of normal movement. The Rune Priest (wearing a suit of terminator armour) will strike last when charging into difficult terrain since he cannot take frag grenades (the same applies to Wulfen). So be cautious!

 

-Grey Slayers and Storm Claws

Both of these two units are relegated to foot slogging unless you teleport one of them along with the Rune Priest. As such they will use normal movement to reach the enemy battleline. Again I remind you to use cover as much as possible if there a lot of enemy guns about the battlefield.

 

-Fenrisian Wolf Packs

These units should be charging the first turn due to the free move prior to the game and all their special movement rules.

 

-Storm Claw bikers

Please refer to my advice above regarding the Wolf Lord biker. If you choose to use them as a separate unit for assaults and/or tank hunting then they should also use cover. This is a small, expensive, and fragile unit.

 

-Long Fangs

I do not remember that last time I used normal movement for my Long Fangs, so hopefully I am doing something right. ;)

 

 

Next -> Animal Rage

[spyrer2000]

- The Rune Priest does not benefit from rolling 3d6 when moving through difficult terrain since he is wearing tactical dreadnaught armour. If you may see a juicy squad closeby to charge make sure you feel confident he can make it through any difficult terrain between him and the unit you wish to charge.

False. Check p. 50 in the 40K rulebook. All Independent Characters roll an extra die when moving through terrain, no matter what armor they are wearing.

[Mountain Angel]

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Heh... I knew that would eventually creep out and rear its ugly head. Pls be so kind as to not use this thread for debating how to apply the universal Scout rule for the Lost Company. I will respect the views and opinions of others, but we can discuss it elsewhere.

 

-MA

[spyrer2000]

I think you are misunderstanding me...I'm not talking about the Scouts rule at all here. Check p. 50 in the 40K Rulebook. All Independent Characters have the Move Through Cover rule.

[Mountain Angel]

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I meant MTC.

 

:)

 

-MA

[spyrer2000]

...then I am unsure as to the nature of your disagreement. All Independent Characters have Move Through Cover. The Rune Priest is an Independent Character. Therefore, he rolls 3D6 for difficult terrain tests. Claiming otherwise is simply wrong.

[Mountain Angel]

-Animal Rage-

Only the Wulfen benefit from this special movement rule. Each turn the Wulfen roll 1d6 during the movement phase and move that distance plus their normal movement towards the closet enemy unit. This movement ignores difficult terrain. This special movement takes place at the beginning of the Movement Phase. Thus, you can keep your Wulfen behind cover. Use Animal Rage to move the Wulfen through the intervening terrain as much as possible before you have to roll the dice for a difficult terrain check. The Wulfen must move first before any other unit when you use Animal Rage.

 

If the Wulfen are joined by the Wolf Priest then the independent character can decide whether or not to use Animal Rage. The extra d6 inches is very helpful for getting the Wulfen into charge range, which is where you want them to be!

 

You should use caution when deciding whether or not to use this added movement. A good roll of four or more inches can put you in charge range, while less can leave you out in the open with bull eyes painted on your werewolves' power armour. If you are not sure then it is far better to wait another turn when you have another six inches of normal movement available.

 

If the Wulfen are not lead by a Wolf Priest then you must roll for Animal Rage each turn. A wise opponent can use this against you by moving up cheap units, such as empty transports. This is why I typically do not take more than one pack of Wulfen... they are too expensive to be lead around by a cagey enemy general! If you are taking Wulfen as a Troop choice then it is best to keep your units spread out so they do not form bottlenecks as they press forward during the game.

 

 

Next -> Fleet of Paw