Codex: Red Dragons Mk. I

[neosonichdghg]

Well, I have completed the amount of fluff I deem necessary to compile into a Codex. As the title suggests, this is the rough draft and any comments whatsoever are welcomed. Expect changes in the future as I fix stuff, and there is a distinct possibility good suggestions here will be incorporated. Now, without further ado...

 

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Codex: Red Dragons

 

The Red Dragons chapter of the Adeptus Astartes has a long and noble history. Since their creation from the noble seed of the Dark Angels, they have traversed the galaxy seeking out the enemies of humanity. They crush heretics and xenos as they go, purging the Imperium of the galaxy

[neosonichdghg]

Oh come on guys, I spent forever on this stuff. Can I at least get a "dang, that's huge" or something? Anything?

[Brother-Librarian Akritedes]

"Dang, that's not very big." ;)

 

On a more serious note, it's pretty good, me thinks. Despite the unpreventable typos that sneak in, I rather liked it. Although, there was one in particular that had me stymied. Was it supposed to be "Gibraltar" or "Gibaltar"? The two seemed to pop up often enough for either to be the real name. :)

 

Other then that, the only bit was the scout character...Malovich. He looks like you based him off the Vindicare and gave him a few alternate things and took off most of the special rounds. Interesting choice, although do you think he may be a bit undercosted?

[neosonichdghg]

YAY!

 

Gregos is based off the Vindicare, and yeah I'm still working on the cost.

 

Tallarus is based off Shrike, just a little farther from the source and the points are better calculated.

 

Gribaltar is the name of the world. I'll go baack and fix as many as I can find.

 

Oh, yeah. You're evil!

 

EDIT: I only found one that was wrong, but that should be it.

[Hemal]

I actually like this - looks pretty good to me. how do the Dragons maintain Xenos tech though? And how about using the Chaos dex for the army? The enhanced skills of say Tank Hunting devs, the berserker skills of Khorne, the automatons of the Thousand Sons and battlesuit technology could all be taken from the CHaos dex in one form or other (infiltrating tactical squads = Spector suits, Tank Hunting devs = target locks etc, commander in Chaos Armour with wings and other demonic gifts = jet pack, noise marines = hybrid weapon systems)

[neosonichdghg]

I thought about using the Chaos codex, but I eventually decided against it. I may have another look at some point, but I'm probably sticking with the loyalist 'dex.

[Librarian- Melechor]

Fair enough. I like the overall idea, and how they destroyed their own ship to launch an attack, very cool. The Xenos grafting is well, heretical, but, it's sort of a fun idea, so keep up the good work. :)

[Tubal]

Oh come on guys, I spent forever on this stuff. Can I at least get a "dang, that's huge" or something? Anything?

I know it's long, it was too late to read it all when I saw it so I put in a subscription to remind me instead :P

 

One thing that I think could be improved is to add a mention of the techmarines earlier in the main fluff. The first mention they get is "countless tech-marines" without an explanation of why they should have so many. There's is one in Gregos's fluff but I think that is a little late.

Also, "countless" might be stretching it a bit. 50 or even a hundred tech-marines would be a LOT, but that's hardly without number ;)

Perhaps you could change it to something like "numerous"?

 

- A refractive shield that gives all energy weapons (pulse and las) firing at it -1 BS.

- An electromagnetic shield that gives +1T against shooting.

- Some sort of grenade.

- An ability to single out enemy unit leaders.

- Assault weapons, probably meltagun for crisis suits and storm bolters for charging FW squads.

- Special vibro weapons that shatter ceramics, giving Tau in close combat 1 weaker Sv.

- Preferred Enemy: Tau.

• First of all, preferred enemy is useless against Tau since they are going to be whooped so badly in CC anyway ;) (ie, marines already hit on 3+ on most Tau, I think).
  
• -1 BS doesn't quite fit in with any other special rules since 2nd edition, perhaps re-rolling 6's to hit instead? It would be similar to sharpshooters for guard, only the opposite. An electromagnetic shield should give an invulnerable save rather than an increased toughness. 5+ is a good number for troops, it would give them some protection from the heavier weapons in the Tau arsenal.
  
• An inventive grenades would be hard to come up with, especially since they are supposed to have limited resources to even maintain existing equipment, not to mention developing new. Explosives are handled with frags and kraks while gas grenades would be ineffective since Tau have enclosed helmets, likely with filters.
  Smoke would be an alternative though since smoke grenades are already available for vehicles. Just adapt existing stockpiles that are unused since the chapters rhinos are either damaged or simply not used due to the new tactics employed. They could simply count as being in cover for one turn.
  
• The ability to single out unit leaders is a bit powerful I think, at least with shooting. A squad with a heavy bolter would be absolutely guaranteed to kill the Shas'ui (I think =) of a squad in one turn.
  
• Vibro weapons. Again, save modifiers were removed in 3rd edition so reintroducing them would be a bit silly IMO, rending is perhaps more fitting. And anyways, Tau armour is a composite and shouldn't shatter by vibrations :)
  

Other things you could consider is cameleoline (+1 cover save), infiltration (of course) and move through cover.

However:

 

Have you considered a Deathwatch kill-team instead? I'm always for inventive fluff but I'm more sceptical towards homegrown rules. Using a kill-team would give you a legitimate unit to use even against the most beardy rules-fascist :)

They seem to fit quite well with what you want as well: Deepstrike no matter what (represents careful infiltration near enemy commanders), assault 3 heavy bolters (an AP4 Tau-killer, made using adapted drone hover engines perhaps), true grit to give them an edge in CC without sacrificing ranged power, all sorts of special ammunition (Kraken penetrator rounds with 30" range and AP4, yummy! Could be represented with solid-core ammunition or Tau tech), etc. The list goes on.

Special rules are nice but you need something to play against opponents that don't agree as well. You could convert the squad to work with both DW rules and your own and using the most appropriate set as the situation (or opponent) demands.

[neosonichdghg]

You're right, I do need to add the Techmarines earlier.

 

I love the idea of smoke grenades. That would be perfect, it would be to cover their advance under withering fire. Totally anti-Tau. But maybe modified Night Fight rules instead of cover, again them piercing power armor is not the problem. Massed hits are.

 

I wasn't saying to pick them off shooting, but in cc. Like, maybe you can select which of the models in B2B takes a wound. I was thinking it might be good for one Death Marine to be able to support an adjacent Death Marine, allowing several to all cooperate to kill one figure.

 

I do like the cameleoline, move through cover, etc.

 

What do you think of giving them meltaguns and storm bolters as special weapons?

 

Ooo, those DW rules sound nifty! Where can I get them?

[Tubal]

Ooo, those DW rules sound nifty! Where can I get them?

I think they are available from GW :)

Rules are in UK WD 306, for the US (or others) edition I don't know. Here's a link to it on mailorder anyway.

[neosonichdghg]

Dang it! I just spent my WH money on bitz!

[Gator_of_Bahamut]

Well I have already expressed my opinion about all the story elements I don't like, but you seem to have decided to stick with them. I won't argue there then, except I think you should keep more of the red heraldry, otherwise their name makes little sense. Oh yeah, and give your poor dragons legs, lol. Also, exploding the ship thing seems a bit cheesy. There is no medium in space to transmit the shockwave of an explosion. You mention the plasma propelling the other ships....but the amount of plasma needed to propel objects as massive as imperial ships (these things dwarf modern aircraft carriers and super tankers) would more likely MELT them than propel them!

 

Most of the problems I see are in your choices of words in some places,a dn a few story technicalities:

 

-> "The Red Dragons chapter of the Adeptus Astartes has a long and noble history."

- If it's so noble, why have they blackened their armor in shame. Maybe HAD a noble history?

 

- If the Dragons and the inquisitor could so easily escape Kratol, why couldn't the whole Imperial navy punch through to allow reinforcing? Kratol was a hive world, so that many billions of people would not be so easily abandoned when the Chaos forces were weak. Also, you mention the loss of a Thousand guardsmen in the escape. Why? Were they left behind? They don't man space ships.

 

-> "...fading from the visual memory of the Imperium like every other flare on the horizon."

- What are all those flares on the horizon, and why are they fading? Flares ATTRACT attention! Why do yours get ignored?

 

- What ever happened to Master Ryan? Why was he replaced by Tallarus?

 

-The Purifying Brotherhood recieved the approval of the Chapter Master, the Techmarines, the CHaplains, and all the Marines shouted their thunderous approval. If so, why are they so ashamed of their choice? I can understand subduing their heraldry for guerilla purposes, but why would they bury their banners in shame for something they were all so eager to do?

 

-> "The head Chaplain came forward next, clanking forward in massive jet armor."

- Redundant word choice. This may help.

 

-> "The day the chapter

[stormbringer_951]

If they had Dark Angels geneseed, wouldn't they be part of the Unforgiven ?

 

Stormie

[neosonichdghg]

@stormbringer - nope.

 

@gator -

 

Yeah, that's a better word.

 

The Chaos forces were spread out in a siege, and the combined forces of the Dragons, Inquisitorial forces, and IG were just enough to punch a small hole to get through. To actually defeat the Chaos forces, i.e. destroy a large number, would take far more resources than the Imperium was willing to commit.

 

The Guardsmen were lost in the ships carrying them when the Chaos forces snapped shut on them, closing the temporary breach.

 

Sorry about the flare thing. It was a nod to something in the 3ed rulebook. I'll make it go away.

 

Tallarus became Chapter Master after Ryan died. Not a big wierd thing, it was just a long period of time and they ended up with a new Master by then. It was really something like a millenia and a half that they hung out in the west. I should probably mention that.

 

They didn't like the Purifying Brotherhood, but they all realized it was the only way. Part of the reason they all agreed was simply to support Tallarus. Thinking about it, I should probably change the debate scene somewhat.

 

Thanks for pointing out the double forward. I'll fix it.

 

The sets are sets of servitors. I tried to allude to it when I mentioned G-whatever. I'll try to clarify it.

 

I'm trying to balance the Death Squads to about the level of Tyrannic War Veterans. I'm not planning to use everything suggested, I'm going to pick and choose a few. Probably smoke grenades, two assault weapons (meltaguns or storm bolters), BP + CC weapons, and Furious Charge.

 

This lines up nicely with the Tyrannic War Veterans. Smoke grenades ~ frag+ krak grenades. BP + CC ~ Bolters. Storm Bolter + Meltagun ~ Flamer + HB. Furious Charge ~ Counterattack.

 

On Gregos...With the extensive changes, I really don't think he's still too much like a Vindicare. One final change that might be good, though, is make his rifle AP4 instead of AP2.

 

I'm thinking it might be good to do the squads like this:

 

Tac Squads - Greek letters

Terminator Squads - Planets in history

Veteran Squads - Heroes

 

All right, you like? Keep the comments coming.

[neosonichdghg]

Okay, got those changes made.

 

The siege part now reads:

 

Inquisitor Argus and his entourage arrived during a rare lull and were greeted with much ceremony by Chapter Master Ryan once the Dragons and Guard helped them pierce the enemy lines in the southwest quadrant. After adding his forces to the Dragons

[Gator_of_Bahamut]

A lot of those things you just told me should be included in the fluffl. They may seem natural to you, don't assume people will follow the same leaps you took. Also, not everyone has been playing since 3rd edition.

 

If smoke grenades were fair for troops we'd have them. Try making them the same as the Tyrannic vets, just change the favored enemy, and drop the hellfire rounds. You still get a lot of bang for your buck with those changes.

 

Gregor shouldn't have any abilities with sniping a normal marine doesn't, like selecting the model. Stealing powers and abilities from somewhere else is one thing... making up something new will get you ejected from the game.

 

I like the change in the squad names, though.

[neosonichdghg]

The problem is, Tyrannic War Veterans are totally geared toward fighting Tyranids. They're good at standing and shooting, being charged, shooting at weak hordes, hunting monstrous creatures...none of these is good against Tau.

 

Well, I guess he didn't end up too much like a Vindicare, because you didn't recognize where the ability came from. Seriously, I started with a Vindicare Assassin and fooled around with stuff until it seemed right.

[Gator_of_Bahamut]

I don't knwo the states for a Vindicare, I'm relying other people for the comparison. Still, overpowering your creations will make people very :devil: .

 

The way I read it, they are better at in-close fighting than the Tau, and that's all you need. If, however, you chose to use the terminator honors for 10 points (awesome) each model could then buy some close combat gear. Let me try something here.

 

For approximately 180 points, you could have a 5 man Tauric war vet. squad.

 

Vet. Sgt. w/power weapon, plas pistol

3 marines w/ bolt pistol, ccw

1marine with flamer, ccw

 

That, and their regular abilities & gear, I think they could :P Tau up the :cuss . Don't forget that they can even use krak grenades as CCWs!!! Say goodbye to any crisis suits dumb enough to stick around!

 

Add a drop pod, and for a bit over 200 points you can drop them into one end of a Tau firing line and watch them march across it!

[StormDragon]

Fluffwise the drop pod doesn't fit in. Even if there are drop pods on their crashed ships they dont have any way of launching them. As long as they've got infiltrate they wouldn't need the drop pod anyway, and infiltrate fits in with the fluff really well.

 

The Death Squads are really crying out to be kill teams. That way they get access to all sorts of cool gear etc. And the sneaking around against insurmountable odds is what kill team is all about. Trying to fit them into a normal game seems to be causing some problems.

 

I suppose it comes down to the opponemts you regularly play if they are happy to play against you using your house rules cool.

 

Oh and good work on the fluff, I enjoyed reading it all :devil:

[Gator_of_Bahamut]

Oi! :devil: Forgot they couldn't drop pod. Maybe when they get off world...

 

The fluff revisions looks very good. Much better.

 

As for as your death squads, the grenades are looking reasonable...though you should specify that they cannot fire their weapons the turn they use them, and that it diserses a turn later. If they get move through cover and infiltrate, smoke grenades, AND furious charge...plus termi honors for 10....17 points ia a WEE bit cheap. I think 19-20 minimum is fair. Plus, the name is a tad cliche....

[neosonichdghg]

All right, maybe they are a little undercosted. I probably should raise it to 18 or 19.

 

The smoke grenades say "for one entire game turn", so I think that's handled, but I agree. They shouldn't be able to shoot. I'll change that.

 

I don't think the Tyrannic War Veterans can take Armory stuff just because they have Termy honors. In every other case that's true, the entry says so. Like in the Tac Squad. It says specifically that the Sergeant can take wargear if he gets Terminator honors. Thus, I don't think the Tyrannic War Veterans could get CC gear.

 

Maybe, though...Maybe I should keep the Tyrannic War Veterans, change them to have BP + CC weapons, change their special weapons, and give them Furious Charge instead of Counterattack. Like you said, that does leave a very powerful squad.

 

@StormDragon:

 

Yeah, I'm probably going to make a Deathwatch kill team out of them once I can get the DW rules. And thanks. I'm glad you liked it.

[Gator_of_Bahamut]

What the heck is the point of termi honors if NOT to give you access to the armory? Sure they make you a LITTLE better in combat....but you can get the same effects elsewhere.

 

I looked again, though, and I think you're right. LAME!

[neosonichdghg]

I dunno...an extra attack for 10 points that doesn't take up a weapon slot is pretty nice.

[Tubal]

A marine with an extra attack is almost twice as good in CC, so ten points is not all that expensive. Add to that the extra attack he gains for free for an extra CC-weapon (or true grit) and the effects of a power weapon... :tu: