Ideas and a Techmarine [ potential 1500pts ]

[ixupi]

So I want to make a fluffy/friendly/fun chapter, at least in my eyes. :P

 

The idea just spurred into my head when looking over the SM codex and looked at the traits and I had a calling. I want a techmarine lead army, using the wise traits; "scion of mars" and "heed the wisdom of the ancients." Which means to me at least I want LOTS of dreads and LOTS of guns. Shooty all the way without a doubt. But of course this is only a partially conceived idea, I need you folks to help me flesh it out! Now then on to business.

 

What I definately know thus far is i'd like to run the HQ as follows:

 

HQ-210pts-Techmarine upgraded to commander: x4 Heavy Bolter gun servitors / Servoharness / Ironhalo

 

I want the theme of the army to be of a hydra, the techmarine being the "master" of sorts, the paint job would be made so that each of the servo-arms(and the natural limbs) resemble that of a hydra's heads. The gun servitors themselves would be mechcanical creatures of reptile appearance if not just completely organic with modifications to rig the heavy bolters. So this is where you fellows come into play! What next? I'm trying to think of a name, i'll edit if anything comes to mind. Would it be worth slapping down 3 venerables for the hell of it? Is the idea a terrible one, let me hear all your input!

 

Thanks in advance for any help provided.

[Commissar Molotov]

Check out this topic and see if it gives you any ideas. You might get some flak - the Hydra is a symbol intimately acquainted with the Alpha Legion. Still, there's some very interesting ideas.

 

Here's a start:

 

- What geneseed are they?

- What founding were they?

- What is their chapter symbol/colour scheme?

- What is their Homeworld like, and what is the culture of the homeworld? (ie is it a Hive World, a Feral World, a Death World etc)

- Where in the Imperium are they based? (It may help define the kind of enemies they face most often.)

- What is their Combat Doctrine like? (do they prefer Close Combat or ranged fighting?)

- What is their Organisation like (do they follow the Codex or are they a bit different?)

- What is their Belief System?

 

See if you can answer these questions and you might be on your way to your chapter - we should be able to ask you further questions to develop your chapter. :P

 

Regarding the army list, it'll probably be a good idea to go bug Ironloki in the Army List Review forum. :P

[space wolf]

I think by answering these questions, you could help us and yourself out a lot.

 

Why is the chapter lead by a techmarine? is it because you like the bionics and such? do they have a close relationship to mars? could they perhaps be a secret militant wing of the Adeptus Mechanicus?

[ixupi]

Okay, thanks for the direction guys. I had some more time to think it over and I have some more ideas.

The whole idea of the techmarine leading is suppose to be a bit of a mystery factor, as in he "he's trainned as a techmarine, so he's of the adeptus mechcanius. He comes from [such and such] but there is an air of mystery around him." Being of course in his personality, a man who rarely if ever talks but when he does inspires those beneath him. I was looking into the fluff of the chapter the Iron Hands actually and something came to me. So maybe you can set me right on a few things? Iron Hands are an extremely technological chapter and even have the "ironfathers" to lead them, I read that after the Horus Heresy that the chapter of the Iron Hands formed a "council" of sorts, where the Iron Hands would be split up into say 8 independent units as to prevent total corruption in the case of treason. Provided that was correct information, it would be possible for my chapter to use the geneseed of the Iron Hands and simply by following the previous handling of structure, make it one of the "units" that make up the whole chapter. A few things scare me though, their homeworld would be Medusa, and Medusa is currently the global campaign? Or am I wrong? It makes me wonder if I should wait for the campaign to end if the Iron Hands are going to be a apart of it for fluff reasons.

[Commissar Molotov]

The whole idea of the techmarine leading is suppose to be a bit of a mystery factor, as in he "he's trainned as a techmarine, so he's of the adeptus mechcanius. He comes from [such and such]but there is an air of mystery around him." Being of course in his personality, a man who rarely if ever talks but when he does inspires those beneath him.

 

Okay, that's certainly interesting. Does this techmarine lead the chapter as a whole, or just the army you'll be playing on the table?

 

I was looking into the fluff of the chapter the Iron Hands actually and something came to me. So maybe you can set me right on a few things? Iron Hands are an extremely technological chapter and even have the "ironfathers" to lead them, I read that after the Horus Heresy that the chapter of the Iron Hands formed a "council" of sorts, where the Iron Hands would be split up into say 8 independent units as to prevent total corruption in the case of treason.

This is slightly wrong, though you're mostly there. ;) The Iron Hands Legion split into three after the heresy - into the Iron Hands chapter, the Red Talons and the Brazen Claws. The Iron Hands chapter then formed a great council. Rather than having one chapter master, each of the Iron Hands' clan-companies contributed a leader to the council. This meant that one man could not lead the chapter into heresy like Horus led the legions into heresy.

 

Provided that was correct information, it would be possible for my chapter to use the geneseed of the Iron Hands and simply by following the previous handling of structure, make it one of the "units" that make up the whole chapter. A few things scare me though, their homeworld would be Medusa, and Medusa is currently the global campaign? Or am I wrong? It makes me wonder if I should wait for the campaign to end if the Iron Hands are going to be a apart of it for fluff reasons.

 

So, do you want your army to be one of the Iron Hands' Clan-Companies, or a totally different chapter using Iron Hands gene-seed? Both'll have different consequences and effects to your ideas. (Your Techmarine-leader would likely become an Iron Father if you choose the Iron Hands clan-company route).

 

Regarding Medusa; Medusa is the homeworld of the Iron Hands. It's in the Segmentum Obscuras, near the Eye of Terror. Medusa V, the campaign-world, is in the Eastern Fringes, near Tau space. They're two totally seperate (and very different) worlds. ;)

[ixupi]

Okay, that's certainly interesting. Does this techmarine lead the chapter as a whole, or just the army you'll be playing on the table?

Not the entire chapter, just one of the units of the chapter in a similiar fashion of the iron hands forming the others. Though, there would be conflict amongst the three units within the chapter, mostly do to personal differences amongst the techmarine leaders and their "versions" of how the codex should be put into action.

 

This is slightly wrong, though you're mostly there. The Iron Hands Legion split into three after the heresy - into the Iron Hands chapter, the Red Talons and the Brazen Claws. The Iron Hands chapter then formed a great council. Rather than having one chapter master, each of the Iron Hands' clan-companies contributed a leader to the council. This meant that one man could not lead the chapter into heresy like Horus led the legions into heresy.

 

Thank you ever so much for clearing that up! The information was sparse and I didn't have a count to how much they split up. Very grateful. Which is interesting, but if one unit went chaos would the imperium recognize them as one or three?

 

So, do you want your army to be one of the Iron Hands' Clan-Companies, or a totally different chapter using Iron Hands gene-seed? Both'll have different consequences and effects to your ideas. (Your Techmarine-leader would likely become an Iron Father if you choose the Iron Hands clan-company route).

I actually want it to just use the geneseed of the Iron Hands and maintain connections with the original chapter. Mostly because I don't want the Ironfather role for the leader.

 

Regarding Medusa; Medusa is the homeworld of the Iron Hands. It's in the Segmentum Obscuras, near the Eye of Terror. Medusa V, the campaign-world, is in the Eastern Fringes, near Tau space. They're two totally seperate (and very different) worlds.

 

Thank god, load off of my mine. Might of had to built the army and try and ward off chaos down at the hobby centre! ;) Thanks for the help as it's just opened up another barrel of questions and possibilities.

[Commissar Molotov]

Thanks for the help as it's just opened up another barrel of questions and possibilities.

Well, that's what we're here for. ;)

 

Not the entire chapter, just one of the units of the chapter in a similiar fashion of the iron hands forming the others. Though, there would be conflict amongst the three units within the chapter, mostly do to personal differences amongst the techmarine leaders and their "versions" of how the codex should be put into action.

 

An interesting idea - a triumvirate of techmarine-leaders that command the chapter? That's got interesting potential.

 

Thank you ever so much for clearing that up! The information was sparse and I didn't have a count to how much they split up. Very grateful. Which is interesting, but if one unit went chaos would the imperium recognize them as one or three?

If one of the three second-founding Iron Hands chapters went to chaos, the Imperium would recognise them as three seperate organisations. The legions were split up to prevent any one man having too much power. Because of that, even though they don't have the same gene-seed, the commander of the Iron Hands would not be able to command the Red Talons or the Brazen Claws to do what he wanted (though they might do it out of honour/loyalty). If one chapter went to chaos (which they probably wouldn't, but for the sake of argument...) the Imperium would only try to destroy that one chapter, not all three.

 

I actually want it to just use the geneseed of the Iron Hands and maintain connections with the original chapter. Mostly because I don't want the Ironfather role for the leader.

 

Okay, that's cool. It's entirely possible for your DIY to be an Iron Hands successor chapter. However, it's said in the Iron Hands IA article that the Iron Hands are quite insular and don't communicate much with their successor chapters. As such, it might be difficult to have close ties with the Iron Hands themselves.

 

 

Any more questions? ;)

[ixupi]

Any more questions?

Thanks for dealing with me, i'm relative new to the whole 40k thing and despite massive amounts of reading, I don't trust yet what "I think I know" so what I throw at you is either just a newbs view or me double checking.

 

Okay, that's cool. It's entirely possible for your DIY to be an Iron Hands successor chapter. However, it's said in the Iron Hands IA article that the Iron Hands are quite insular and don't communicate much with their successor chapters. As such, it might be difficult to have close ties with the Iron Hands themselves.

 

Yes, I read that myself. Though, communication would be little more than loyalty and common worship practice.

 

I had an another idea as well though I don't know how herectic this would seem. How plausible would it be for a paticular techmarine(the one leading my DIY unit) to share a different belief. The Iron Hands being a very tech driven and with obvious connections their commanders would obviously have beliefs in the machine god. But it's been pointed out through the necrons and a few traitors that the machine god is a hungry god, that it only feeds and cares nothing about it's "worshippers" other than as food. Which makes me think, that what if the techmarine's(mine) view of it was as follows: He went to train as a techmarine to get a full understanding of the technology that was without a doubt important to survival. Though, he thinks that the marines that worship the machine god are slowly becoming "unhuman", insteading of worshipping the machine god, the machine god should be worshipping them kind of deal. Instead of technology mastering them, they should master technology. Other than his views of the Machine God as a "spiteful" one, he would be completely loyal to the emperor of course. His motto of sorts could even be something along the lines of "The emperor loves his children, not machines."

[Commissar Molotov]

That's alright - we were all relatively new once. Your ideas as a new player are just as valuable and valid as any of the grizzled vets here on the board.

 

Your ideas regarding the Machine God are very radical. However, you should (in my opinion) disassociate the 'Dragon' and any ideas of the C'Tan from the Omnissiah. I don't think many in the Imperium would know about the ideas that the Dragon could be the Onmnissiah, and any marine in a Mechaphiliac Iron Hands successor will quite likely be steeped in the Machine Cult. I don't quite know how he would gain the idea that the Machine God is spiteful or dangerous.

 

The concept that men should master machines seems a bit odd to me, but if you were to expand on it it could be the basis for an interesting idea. Though I'm just not entirely sold on it personally. ;)

[ixupi]

That's alright - we were all relatively new once. Your ideas as a new player are just as valuable and valid as any of the grizzled vets here on the board.

 

Your ideas regarding the Machine God are very radical. However, you should (in my opinion) disassociate the 'Dragon' and any ideas of the C'Tan from the Omnissiah. I don't think many in the Imperium would know about the ideas that the Dragon could be the Onmnissiah, and any marine in a Mechaphiliac Iron Hands successor will quite likely be steeped in the Machine Cult. I don't quite know how he would gain the idea that the Machine God is spiteful or dangerous.

 

The concept that men should master machines seems a bit odd to me, but if you were to expand on it it could be the basis for an interesting idea. Though I'm just not entirely sold on it personally. ;)

 

;) Yes, very radical. But I want to make it work, so i'll tone it down or warp it some. It just seems to be, that more and more that the Iron Hands would progress or even the marines the less natural they become and more machine, with bionics and technological implants. I don't mean in any way by their creation, after all that is what makes them marines. The techmarine would see the act are slapping more and more machinery onto a marine as dehumanizing them. That instead of humanity sacrificing it's flesh for the god, that the god should praise them for the blood of the heretric/xenos/daemon/mutant/traitors/etc. yadda yadda.

 

I suppose that yes, he wouldn't have the knowledge and even if he did it's only a half baked idea conceived up and most information pulled from lunatics. So he wouldn't go as far to say he is "spiteful" perhaps secretly he would go as far to say he was a "greedy" god. Perhaps the techmarine would hold marines in a greater light of the machine god? Instead of just being worshippers they are it's arms and legs. Sort of the equal to the marines being the Emperor's angels.

[Commissar Molotov]

But how is the Machine God greedy?

 

Your ideas regarding dehumanising are interesting, though. Perhaps the Techmarine could consider that they move further and further away from humanity - and they're trying to protect humans. It makes an interesting idea - that they give up that which they are trying to safeguard and protect. It's a noble sacrifice, a painful and arduous process, but one which they undergo willingly to serve the Emperor.

[ixupi]

But how is the Machine God greedy?

 

Your ideas regarding dehumanising are interesting, though. Perhaps the Techmarine could consider that they move further and further away from humanity - and they're trying to protect humans. It makes an interesting idea - that they give up that which they are trying to safeguard and protect. It's a noble sacrifice, a painful and arduous process, but one which they undergo willingly to serve the Emperor.

 

Greedy as in worship, bloodshed and committing their lives to the god would not be enough. That if they needed to sacrifice their lives to please a god, what does it amount to in the end, what meaning does a prayer have when you are a machine. Of course it would conflict with the techmarines teachings, because he would just be that much more loyal to humanity and the emperor. As you said, he put himself through what he did so that others later on won't have to, to protect and enforce what he believes at all costs. The more I expand this idea the more I love it, i'll dedicate the chapter to you once it's done. ;) Thanks for your help again.

[Commissar Molotov]

Perhaps the chapter-master should not be the techmarine, then? Perhaps the chapter master is the guy who's slightly anti-Omnissiah, and the techmarine cadre of the chapter are up in arms about it. Hardly about to turn traitor or something, but there's a lot of factional in-fighting and bickering amongst the chapter as people side for their more human nature or for the Machine-Cult and the Omnissiah. It could be a political thing (almost like Puritan and Radical within the Inquisition). In this way, your techmarine could be pro Machine-Cult, whilst a Captain might be anti Machine-Cult?

[ixupi]

Well the thing is, I mean provided I did it like the latter example I used. The techmarine wouldn't be anti-machine god. Just holds the marines in higher light than the average worshipper. Like as I said the Marines are the emperor's angels, the unit is the limbs of the machine god. Perhaps he believes even that the god wishes for their humanity for the reason previously given, because if they were all machine all the prayer would be, nothing but a robot essentially. I want to keep the control in the heads of the techmarines just because it fits the "setting" i'm trying to give the chapter, a sort of story of a group trying to further humanity whilst struggling with maintaining it themselves.

[Commissar Molotov]

Ah, I see. I guess if you work on the angle of "we sacrifice so you don't have to", then you've got a very strong theme. How about working on some of the other aspects of the chapter?

 

- What geneseed are they?

- What founding were they?

- What is their chapter symbol/colour scheme?

- What is their Homeworld like, and what is the culture of the homeworld? (ie is it a Hive World, a Feral World, a Death World etc)

- Where in the Imperium are they based? (It may help define the kind of enemies they face most often.)

- What is their Combat Doctrine like? (do they prefer Close Combat or ranged fighting?)

- What is their Organisation like (do they follow the Codex or are they a bit different?)

- What is their Belief System?

 

That might give us some more to work off.

[ixupi]

Ah, I see. I guess if you work on the angle of "we sacrifice so you don't have to", then you've got a very strong theme. How about working on some of the other aspects of the chapter?

 

- What geneseed are they?

- What founding were they?

- What is their chapter symbol/colour scheme?

- What is their Homeworld like, and what is the culture of the homeworld? (ie is it a Hive World, a Feral World, a Death World etc)

- Where in the Imperium are they based? (It may help define the kind of enemies they face most often.)

- What is their Combat Doctrine like? (do they prefer Close Combat or ranged fighting?)

- What is their Organisation like (do they follow the Codex or are they a bit different?)

- What is their Belief System?

 

That might give us some more to work off.

 

Typing it as we speak. ;)

[MikeH]

just a thought- perhaps they might take this view after being forced to hunt down more than one Techpriest by the Inquisition? They litteraly get forced to see what over worship of the Machine god drives the Tech worshippers to-madness, greed and even heresy