++Dasleah Astartes++

[Dasleah]

Well, I managed to dig up a few things here are there that I had started ages ago, all regarding of course the Adeptus Astartes (or some variation thereof) Whilst I do indeed plan to continue writing it and, Emperor forbid, finish it one day, until that happens I believe it would have more value being put out here for all the community to see and shape for their own (undoubtadley nefarious :jaw: ) use. I plan to add to this post almost constantly with all sorts of creative dead-ends and pointless ramblings, so expect it to be floating around for a while. Any and all comments, critiques and criticisms are welcome and encouraged. But first let me get this statement out there:

 

Most of this WILL be contreversial within the accepted 'norms' of Space Marine fluff.

 

I'm not about doing stuff that works, or fits into canon. I prefer to push the acceptable boundaries of canon 40k fiction, to see how far I can push it (and make it believeable) before it all turns to mush on me. I'm sure a few of you remember the last time I did this - I was the guy that wrote the Index Astartes : Female Space Marines that got featured on the The Jungle and started alot of debate, which was the entire point of it all.

 

Quick Linkage:

• Cults Of The Adeptus Astartes - Post Number 1, First Page. Last Updated : 03/05/2006 Status: Getting There, Slowly.
  
• Index Astartes : Female Space Marines - Post Number 8, first Page. Last Updated : 03/05/2006 Status : Relatively Complete.
  

Cults Of The Adeptus Astartes

 

All Space Marines, irrelevant of descendant Legion or Chapter, are all known to the Imperium at large through the name of the

[Nicili]

YES

 

This is amazing, i personally think at least one of these could relate to a DIY Chapter and be able to create alliances between chapters that would not have those previous links.

 

I also think this should become one of the common traits with a DIY, right up there with Founding, Geneseed, etc. These are perfect subsect alliances of the space marine entire force. Also there should of course be a limit to how many of these cults you could belong too, but i guess thats more of personal tastes, but i definetly think i will have at least one of these cults part of my chapter...(Centuria Astartes, hmm, or...maybe even Extimus Astartes)

 

All of these ideas are amazing, great work to you and whoever helped! You get a cookie...and a half!

-Nic

 

++EDIT++

This needs to be stickied...

[Dasleah]

Gawsh :cuss Thanks, glad you liked it.

I'm not really a rules man, but it did come across my mind that one could fold them into a set of Traits, or something. You'd have varying degrees of them, like say Bushido Astartes Major and Bushido Astartes Minor, which would represent how dedicated that Chapter is to that certain 'Path' or 'Calling' or something. But like I said, I'm not really a rules man, so I'll leave that to anyone willing (or mad) enough. ^_^

I wrote this all myself, but a big dollap of kudos must go to Nephren-Ka for starting a little something called the Aegyptus Astartes (which DOH I should remember to credit in the entry!) that first suggested to me the possibility of organising Chapters in broad cultural/social groups, as per their beliefs and practices. He's since abandonned the project, but it lives still.

 

I still can't help but feel that I've left some groupings out, though - well, apart from the decidedly obscoure, like Maori (Pacific Islander) Marines, and the like. I've got a Fire Cult set, perhaps I need to add a subsection to that, covering all elemental-worship Marines, or something.

[Rymeer]

Vitulus Astartes

 

Interesting Idea... explains my 'Crusading Lions' a bit more and their attitudes.

 

The Holy Great Lion of Terra Bless Thee,

 

Rymeer

[Nicili]

Hmm, just a thought to go along with your other ideas:

 

Lets say there is a such chapter known as "The Samurai of the Flame"; they would be Bushido Astartes Major, Caminus Astartes Minor. I think that would link the chapter to the chapters "Sun Lords" and the "Salamanders".

 

Also we dont need any rules. Of course you might want to twist current rules to sound/represent your 'traits', but i dont think true homegrown rules are actually needed.

Instead I find it closer to a fluff based supplement to current and new chapters alike

 

-Nic

 

P.S. If you want any input of help, just message me

[Darrell]

I'm a big fan of The Jungle and the Hindu marines featured though, although I don't agree with Kenton about female marines (I don't agree with anyone else supporting female marines, for that matter), but he has done some nice conversions with his models and writes good fiction for his Chapter, not to mention he has a lot of fun doing it. And that's really what matters, isn't it?

 

At any rate, I was curious about one section in particular featured in that list:

 

Vitulus Astartes

"As the Beast empowers our bodies, let the Emperor empower our souls!"

Long has the race of Man dwelt alongside the race of Beasts. They dwell forever in the far reaches of our world, silent and primal. Though decidedly savage and inhuman, there still exists a primal nobility in the beats of the our forests, mountains, skies and oceans.

 

Space Wolves

Ursine Brothers

Spider Lords

 

I'm working on a Chapter now, inspired by the Space Wolves (And a few other things) that focuses on bears. I'm curious about the Ursine Brothers listed there, do you happen to have a site on hand that would tell me a little more about them? Or is it just something you made up on the spot as an example? I'd be curious to know which direction the person took his Ursine Chapter while I'm working on mine.

[Dasleah]

As far as I can remember, there was a discussion a page or two back that was about making a Chapter themed around Bears, but for all I can recollect the name 'Ursine Brothers' is just something I made up on the spot. So feel free to use it, I don't mind. You might be able to find a few other names in the aforementioned thread.

[Dasleah]

And this is where it gets controversial....

 

 

...

 

 

Genetic deviance is common within the Chapters of the Adeptus Astartes. Despite the regular purges preformed by the Inquisition and the Cult Mechanicus, the continuing onset of mutation and psychic disturbance within the Imperium has resulted with the very recruits that a Chapter draws upon are inevitably tainted. This, normally, has little effect. But over time, the innate psychic imprint of the Chapter is implanted upon their gene-seed, resulting in mutation that often manifests itself to a form similar to the Chapter mythos and beliefs. However, some mutations owe their creation to circumstances more sinister. There have been instances where doomed Chapters have been forced to implant their gene-seed within foreign creatures so as to preserve it until it can be retrieved when the current crisis. Some are the result of the worst kind of Techno-Heresy: the direct and deliberate alteration of the genetic material by the Chapter for reasons unknown.

 

The reasons for the creation of female Space Marines are largely the sole knowledge of the Chapters themselves- to commit such a crime against the Machine God and the Emperor would require incredible circumstances just to consider it. Indeed, if such an option is considered at all, as the technology required to create such beings is rare and is often locked deep away within the most heavily armoured of Forge Worlds. A rare few know that it can be done-fewer still survive to tell the tale. Perhaps the Chapter, so desperately ravaged by war and mutation would seek to create a temporary vessel for their gene-seed to grow until such time they can rebuild their strength? Perhaps the Chapter itself was raised upon a great matriarchal world and it was inevitable that females were to be inducted? Or perhaps the reasons are darker still, whether by means accidental or deliberate? The reasons are as varied as the stars themselves.

Whatever the reason, the fact is that such beings do exist, despite the best attempts of the Cult Mechanicus. They view tampering with the gene-seed as a crime most terrible-as, to some extent, it contains a part of the Emperor's genetic material, although to a far lesser extent than the Primarches. Although not a patriarchal organisation, the Cult Mechanicus view the possibility that the gene-seed has been tampered with so much that it can be safely and repeatedly used within a female biological system with horror.

 

The main problem associated with the use of gene-seed within a female system is that fact that the hormone that the genetic material reacts to is testosterone, rather than oestrogen. This is primarily because the organs need adequate muscle stimulation to promote growth and development, while oestrogen has a less profound impact upon the body's muscular system than testosterone. Combined with the fact that the Emperor himself coded the genetics of the organs with a focus to make his armies on Terra stronger, faster and more aggressive (which is precisely the properties an abundance of testosterone causes within standard males), it makes the prospect of using such organs difficult. Indeed, the direct implantation of normal organs with result in the female body rejecting them, usually resulting in severe genetic corruption and extensive internal damage (usually resulting in death)

The original response to this problem was to introduce a series of carefully administered overdoses of several strength-enhancing drugs, along with a regular intake of testosterone supplements. While on the whole this was successful, it was not without its side-effects. Namely, the females that underwent the treatment were often violent and unhinged individuals, as along with their strength increase, an increase of aggression would accompany. Also, since implantation takes place during puberty when hormones are strongest and most numerous, it resulted in female Space Marines with underdeveloped bodies, their chemical therapy leaving them with bodies that are more chemically male than female.

Another, and perhaps the most preferred method, is the alteration of the organs to increase their efficiency and to work with, rather than against, the oestrogen. During puberty, the female body still produces testosterone-just in quantities far less than oestrogen. Using complex alteration, the organs are modified to operate with far less testosterone over time than usual. However, although they are far better at using the tiny levels of testosterone present, the process still takes longer than usual, so rather than implantation taking 6-7 years, it is not uncommon for the process to take 10-12 years, and even greater given other considerations. Obviously, the process of puberty is normally well finished at this point, depriving the organs of the hormones that they need, so the levels of oestrogen are kept constant for this period through hormone supplementation and regular chemical therapy. This results in female Space Marines appearing much younger than they actually are, as they are often well into their 20s before the implantation and training process is finished and complete to a level equal to their male counterparts. This process also keeps their bodies chemically identical to ordinary females, not taking into consideration the many other organs that they receive that actually make their bodies far superior than ordinary humans.

 

++Incoming Message.....++

++Transmitter - Astropath 9362529856/2551++

++Receiver - Astropath 3631763/486a++

++Author identified as Inquisitor-General Hael++

++Date 475/M.39++

++Thought for the Day: The Daemon is the Tool of the Heretic. Martyrdom is the Tool of the Loyalist.++

++Displaying.......++

 

Masters, it has so transpired that I have witnessed a most unusual sight, and I implore that an Inquisitorial Cell be deployed immediately so as to fully investigate the matter.

As you are well aware, after several incidents involving unregistered Xenos attack and frequent Chaotic intrusions, I have been assigned as commanding officer of the Ghaool V 122nd Regiment so as to better catalogue and defeat these new threats to the Imperium. My latest observation come under way when we were surveying a dead world believed to be connected to the [CENSORED TO PROTECT THE INNOCENT] when were beset by a large armed force of natives-foul Xenos they were, with skin of obsidian and stone, and they came at us as a great horde. With our supporting fleet on the far side of the system (they were forced to remain behind as the great energy outputs produced by their plasma drives would have almost certainly announced our arrival to any sentient beings in-system) I made a command on all channels for any Imperial-friendly vessels to come to our immediate aid (that I could do so with confidence simply furthers the fact that many Rouge Traders are consorting with Xenos most foul. We ourselves were forced to board several vessels and revoke their Free Trade Agreements after proving that they traded with alien races without informing the nearest Imperial authorities) Whilst my loyal troopers lay dying around me, within a few short hours we received supporting fire from low orbit, allowing us to sally out of our makeshift mountain fortress and scatter our foes. I hailed the vessel, and the encryption of the com-link identified the vessel as a Space Marine Strike Cruiser by the name of Exempla Termentia. Although they at first refused my calls for them to make planet fall, they eventually agreed and within the hour a Thunderhawk was dispatched to meet with me and receive the praise of a fellow member of the Emperor's fighting forces.

As the doors of the Thunderhawk swung open, I was ashamed to admit that my mouth hung agape at the sight before me. The.....Space Marines, if that was what they were, were female. The one that strode forward to meet me came without a helmet, her features instantly recognisable as that of a women, one in her late 30s by my reckoning, although given the ageless qualities of the Adeptus Astartes, it was safe to say that she was perhaps hundreds of years old. She was as tall as a Space Marine-perhaps a little shorter, and her modified Power Armour made her seem just as well built and strong as a normal Marine. Her hair was long and pulled back, and she came unarmed. Without taking her eyes away from me, she stalked up to me a stood directly in front of me, forcing me to crane my neck to maintain eye contact. She bent her head down and spoke but a single phrase - 'And so are we revealed.'

And they abruptly left. Our supporting fleet was still far off, operating on the lowest power output possible, so I could not pursue, and given that we did not expect orbital attackers, all our Delta-class ordnance was still on-ship.

Now that I am onboard, I submit this report and request that immediate action take place. The Skittari forces attached to my own have held their own counsels amongst their senior Priests and have not of yet.....'graced' me with an audience.

 

Your most humble servant,

Gallius Hael, Inquisitor-General

 

+++...+++

++End Transmission++

++Press Any Rune To Continue++

 

Organs of the Female Space Marines

 

While the Cult Mechanicus have yet to receive a full body for inspection, they have at least hypothesised the presence of several organs that would be unique to female Space Marines and their purpose within the female system:

• Phase 1 - Secondary Heart. While the presence of this organ is yet to be confirmed, it seems likely that like their male counterparts, they have an additional heart to better circulate their enhanced blood and to provide a reserve should the first one be damaged in combat. It is thought to be smaller than the usual heart, as the female chest cavity is on average smaller than that of the male, making space a premium. This has led several Magos to surmise that the heart may act as a supplementary heart, rather than an additional heart, acting in support rather than an independent organ.
   
   
  
• Phase 2 - Ossmodula. Believed to have the same purpose as the normal Marine organ. May be slightly less effective.
   
   
  
• Phase 3 - Yisceopa. The first of the unique organs, this organ is a direct gene-alteration of the male Biscopea. This organ is implanted at the back of the skull, growing into the brain and to a certain extent the spinal column. This organ is responsible for the prolonging of the puberty stage of the recipient, so as to continue a steady creation of hormones required for other organs that need stimulation to work. As a side effect, this also results in increased fertility within the young female Marines, and leads to a heightened sexual awareness and prowess (as is consistent with standard Homo Sapiens females of ages between 11-17) This, of course, has led to many urban myths about scattered temples of followers of Dark Gods giving into their base desires, but this has proved unsubstantiated as of yet. Like all Marines, they are not forbidden reproduction, but it is normally discouraged, as the Chapter is fearful of the genetic stability of the offspring. (Note-this phenomenon must also be present with male Chapters, although as of yet they are reluctant to make any references to this point of their initiation – but given the male reproductive urge is undeniably strong during puberty, the suspicion is elimination of a functional libido through either chemical or hypno-thereapy means)
   
   
  
• Phase 4 - Haemastamen. As per standard, this organ synthesises chemicals to enhance the efficiency of the Marines blood. Combining with the effects of proper training and the output of the Yisceopa, this also helps to stimulate and enhance muscle growth.
   
   
  
• Phase 5 - Kaliia Organs. The female equivalent of the Larraman's organ. Instead of providing an efficient clotting agent like normal, this organ promotes rapid skin growth and healing. As such, many female Space Marines have scarring, but it is normally indistinguishable from their normal skin, albeit with a slightly darker tone. This is one of the disadvantages of the organ-it is quite possible for a female Space Marine to bleed to death if the wound is large enough, whereas a normal Marine would simply form a large clot that would heal into a mass of tough scar tissue. Also, as the female mind is far more efficient when dealing with pain than the male, this implant is actually two separate organs that are implanted simultaneously. The first, being the one just described, grafted onto the Primary Heart, while the second is implanted into the brain from the top of the skull. This allows for a female Space Marine, given the right hypno-indocrination and chemical therapy, to completely shut off the pain receptors of their brains and bodies-although only the most veteran and seasoned of female Space Marines can do this for extended periods of time without fail.
   
   
  
• Phase 6 - Catalepsean Node. Believed to be far less efficient than normal, requiring female Space Marines to actually sleep more often than a normal Space Marine requires to.
   
   
  
• Phase 7 - Preomnor. As per standard.
   
   
  
• Phase 8 - Emoghopea. The female-specific mutation of the Omophagea. Allows for a Marine to 'learn' from the digestion of animal tissue. Has resulted in female Space Marines having a far greater sensitivity to the emotional aspect of this innate learning rather than physical memory (believed to be caused by the influence of the Phase 3 implant, which creates a controlled, prolonged puberty, a time where emotional influence holds most sway over the body) So, by the tasting of an animal, she is able to determine whether the target was confused, frightened, excited, enraged, or any other emotion, up to within 3 days of tasting the material. It is not known whether the same debasement that occurs with the male organ (the various blood-drinking and flesh eating Chapters) is present, but it is assumed that such female Space Marines do exist, albeit acting in a more psychological fashion than their more debased counterparts.
   
   
  
• Phase 9 - Multi-Lung. As per standard.
   
   
  
• Phase 10 - Occulobe. As per standard, although it is believed that due to the influence of oestrogen, it is believed that a female Space Marine's eyes can distinguish between more colours than a normal Space Marine with more clarity, with a comparable level of night vision capabilities (although it has been suggested that female Space Marines eyes can be more sensitive to bright light, due to the increase in optical cells that allow them to distinguish greater colour depth)
   
   
  
• Phase 11 - Lyman's Ear. As per standard.
   
   
  
• Phase 12 - Sus-an Membrane. No evidence of such an organ can be found within the current post-mortem examinations preformed on the bodies that the Cult Mechanicus have recovered. This is believed to the fact that it is a very complex organ, and with the current proficiency level of mechanical suspended animation technology, has been ruled redundant and not used by the majority of female Space Marines. Also believed to be influenced by the Phase 6 implant.
   
   
  
• Phase 13 - Melanochrome. As per standard.
   
   
  
• Phase 14 - Oolitic Kidney. As per standard, although it ca be assumed to be deliberately less efficient to prevent the Marine bleeding to death unnecessarily (see Phase 5)
   
   
  
• Phase 15 - Neuroglottis. As per standard, although it is suggested that this also alters the taste receptors for the Marine on an individual basis.
   
   
  
• Phase 16 - Juucinaroid. The female equivalent of the Mucranoid. Due to the influence of the Phase 5 implant, in addition to altering the sweat glands to create a heat-resistant liquid, this also aids in clotting blood by excreting a liquid that aids in blood clotting when exposed to oxygen. Unfortunately, it appears that this organ has mutated from its original purpose, also aiding in the supply of oxygen to the blood by 'absorbing' some of it through the skin (or, at least, more than usual than is found in standard humans). It is then entirely possible for a female Space Marine to die of suffocation if their entire body, externally, is deprived of oxygen for extended periods of time. They can operate normally for most combat purposes, but they rarely wear their armour outside of combat and formal occasions. Obviously, the more physical exertion that the Marine undergoes, the more oxygen they will be required to take into their enhanced system, increasing the risk. For that reason, initial training is conducted without much armour until appropriate hypno-therapy allows them to consciously alter their breathing patterns in all situations, and the general chemical efficiency of their bodies allows for them to function at oxygen levels less than standard.
   
   
  
• Phase 17 - Vanek's Gland. Instead of providing the saliva of the Marine with an acidic quality, it instead works in conjunction with the Phase 2 implant to greatly strengthen the teeth of the Space Marine. The female can then chew, rather than melt, their way through several materials, although not as effective as a male Space Marine may do so with his Betcher's Glands. This may have also been altered to take into account the heightened taste receptors brought on by the Phase 15 implants, so that the Marine can still actively taste and distinguish flavours, without the dominant acidic residue.
   
   
  
• Phase 18 - Progenoids. It is not known what the influence of large amounts of oestrogen has on the Progenoids, however it is believed that it serves the same purpose as the male equivalent-it must, unless female Space Marines have developed a method of storing and creating gene-seed without biological incubation and subsequent maturation.
   
   
  
• Phase 19 - White Carapace. As per standard Black Carapace, suitably altered to take the female figure and internal organ placement into consideration. Note that it is not literally white in colour, being closer to the original fleshy-black of the Black Carapace implanted into male Marines.
  

Of course, all the organs above have been altered to operate over an extended period of time with small amounts of testosterone and a far larger influence of oestrogen. The Cult Mechanicus are eager to recover a full specimen for examination, as it is quite obvious that female Space Marines are just as strong, fast, tough and efficient as their superhuman male counterparts, and the technology used to create them could be used to greatly enhance existing male organs with proper study and divination. And with all Chapters, it is theorised that some organs would have mutated from their 'Codex' behaviour, and some may have been lost altogether. Many of the above organs are based on theory and conjecture, the Cult Mechanicus having yet to receive remains that are in a complete enough fashion to fully determine and finalise the list.

 

 

Attendant Magos: Senior Magos-Genetor Neroii

• 1. Initial visual investigation leaves no doubt to the cause of death-the subject suffered incredible physical trauma that resulted in the loss of 37.8% of the subject body, consistent with the reported method of termination, having being caught in open ground by a mortar barrage. The taint of Chaos has not yet been determined, so at this point the subject is being treated as female, and the appropriate surgical methods will be used.
   
  
• 2. The chest cavity proved just as tough to open as any member of the Adeptus Astartes, requiring the strength of two of my Servo-Meds. The ribcage itself was fused in much the same way as a normal Adeptus Astartes, although with further testing it was revealed that the bone itself had less overall tensile strength than would be expected, but was still of a level far above that of a normal human. Examination of the organs contained therein have since been removed and placed into storage pending transportation to Mars for investigation by the Collegica Genetoria.
   
  
• 3. The brain itself proved to be largely intact, the lower torso and limbs having taken the majority of the damage. It proved consistent in size and mass of a normal Adeptus Astartes brain, although there was present a most unusual organ that sat below the apex, whose purpose I could not fathom with the resources available to me now.
   
  
• 4. The chem-lab has reported back. No sign of viral, bacteriological or toxicological contamination has been detected, and the hormonal patterns have identified the Marine as a female at birth. An excess of oestrogen was found, consistent with levels found within young females during puberty. DNA divination has determined that the Marine is within the ages of 30-35, an age comparable to a young Marine, although visual examinations place the subject in her late teens or early 20s at least.
   
  
• 5. In summary, it is my opinion that we have here a techno-heresy of the worst kind. The debasement of gene-seed to such a level so as to make the recipient female the equivalent of a member of the Adeptus Astartes must have utilised technologies either forbidden or forgotten. I shall meet with Inquisitor-General Hael to suggest that we begin our pursuit of our so-called 'saviours' anew and recover the black arts used to create them.
  

Magos-Genetor Neroii

 

Chapters of Renown

It is not known exactly how many entirely female Space Marine Chapters exist. If there are any great number of them, then they are keeping aloof and rarely communicating with Imperial organisations. The still respond to requests and Crusades (and other military campaigns) but they rarely make direct contact with the other forces, preferring to fight by themselves or in conjunction with other members of the Adeptus Astartes, male or female (members of the male Adeptus Astartes refuse to be drawn into discussion regarding the subject) so information is hard to come by. They still venerate the Primarch of who their gene-seed is based upon, although not as much as normal Chapters (note- remember that most female gene-seed is simply a genetically altered version of existing gene-seed, having been altered or debased by technology or circumstances. It is believed that the Apothecarion of Chapters with female Space Marines keep in close contact with each other to share resources and research) There are, however, several rumours that travel within the trade routes of the Imperium concerning 'Warrior Women' that can be placed within context with scattered battlefield reports and surveys.

• Platinum Wasps
  The Platinum Wasps are believed to be a largely Codex Chapter, with most reports suggesting that they are derived from Ultramarine stock. The colour of their armour is known to be a very light yellow (bordering on white), and true to their name, they have a silver and black wasp as a Chapter symbol. One of the few Chapters that are believed to consist fully of female Marines, it is not known whether this is through choice or circumstance. They have been most recently sighted taking part in the Ullyical Crusade as a frontline attack force, their Companies dropping directly onto enemy frontlines and securing advance bases. Casualties are high, but the full Chapter strength is believed to be in orbit to supplement attacks and provide covering fire. They have, of yet, refused summons by the Crusade's attached Inquisitors, whose requests that they be placed within holding pending investigation have been refused by the Warmaster, who has since been placed under investigation himself. The Wasps have since dug themselves in within the mountainous terrain surrounding the Hive-cities on Tyiooh VII, where extraction would prove difficult, if not impossible. Their fleet has since moved out of orbit and their current whereabouts are unknown but are still believed to be in-system.
   
   
  
• Grey Riders
  Believed to be derived from White Scar gene-seed, the Grey Riders are believed to have an equal proportion of female to male Marines. They are not divided into separate Companies as one may expect-like the Imperial Guard, the sex of the soldier is irrelevant, so it is just as likely to find a squad made of 1 female Space Marine and 9 male Marines as it is to find 1 male Space Marine and 9 female Marines in a squad. They possess all the ferocity and ability of their male counterparts, and the male Marines appear to hold no ill-regard towards them. This is believed to be due to the fact that no-where in the Codex Astartes or the teachings of the Emperor say that it is forbidden for females to become Space Marines-it has simply been, up to this point, biologically impossible. It is also believed that the current Chapter Master is female, with references to the 'Mother Wind' believed to be referring to the name that her Chapter has given to her, highlighting her speed and power, and also a great mark of respect. Current whereabouts are unknown, but given the nature of the White Scar gene-seed, it is safe to assume that they are speeding across the plains of some distant battlefield.
   
   
  
• Upsilon Dragoons
  Believed to be a 'Parade Chapter'-that is, one that is created more for show than actual combat purposes. The number of female Marines present are small, and interaction between the different sexes are discouraged. Females are organised into separate squads and into different Companies (although the Chapter can only muster just over a full Company of female Marines) As with all Parade Chapters, their armour is ornate and they have seen little combat duty, being delegated mainly to peacekeeping and ceremonial duties. It is believed that the inception of females into the Chapter came through the political pressure exerted by the matriarchal Houses within the Hive Cities on their home world of Upsilon V, as these Houses hold an influence over the resident Chapter that is viewed as unhealthy by the Inquisition, but do not act under the Chapters insistence that they remain an independent military power. The Chapter has so far escaped the attentions of the Inquisition due to the fact that the Chapter itself controls the incredibly precious Annalitium mines that are present on the planet. The Inquisition still maintains a high presence on the planet, but the Chapter will not submit to their wishes for their subterranean Fortress Monastery to be opened for investigation.
   
   
  
• Splinter Eagles
  The Splinter Eagles are the best documented example of inducting females into their ranks because they had no other option. One of the Marine Chapters sent to investigate a new Tyranid Hivefleet approaching from the galactic north, they faced the full fury of the Hive Mind are were forced to retreat, losing 87% of their Chapter strength in the process. However, at the command of the High Lords, the Chapter was forced to remain at the frontline and to divert the threat as much as possible until such a time that enough resources could be found to deal with the threat. As the years went on, the Splinter Eagles began to suffer more and more at the hands of the Tyranids, unable to generate enough recruits from the male population of the surrounding planets, as the conscription forced upon them by the High Lords made it so that every man of able body over the age of 10 was to be sent to the front lines. And so, the Marines have begun to induct recruits from the remaining female population who had not yet been called to act on the front line. Currently, the Chapter has a total strength of 5 Battle Companies to call on, and their Scout Company is one of the largest in known Marine history (a total of 348 Neophytes at last count, mostly female) The Chapter still suffers daily casualties at the hand of the Tyranid horde, and they are pushing the technology used to create Marines to points that are considered dangerous and with great risks that have not yet emerged.
   
   
  
• Crimson Spiders
  This Chapter is currently listed as MIA after the Inquisition managed to determine the location of their home-world and sent an Exterminatus Fleet to demand that they agree to submit themselves to the Cult Mechanicus and the Holy Inquisition. Instead, they fought their way out of the blockade and made for warp-space the instant they were clear. An inspection of their planet-based Fortress Monastery has revealed little, as the Armoury was detonated and their orbital docks were self-destructed. The planet has been declared Excommunicate Traitoris and is awaiting destruction after the local population rose up against the invading forces. It is also believed that the locals still harbour a small garrison of Crimson Spiders, both male and female, somewhere on the planet, but current interrogation has not revealed their whereabouts. What information that was gleaned from the ruins of their Fortress-Monastery has revealed that they consist of 58.9% Male marines to 41.1% female Marines, and are of currently undetermined (largely from the Chapter’s own lack of information concerning this matter within their own archives) gene-seed. They excel at infiltration and sabotage, and are especially fierce in combat. It has been confirmed that the Marines are heavily tattooed (with spider web like patterns) and use this as the basis for seniority in their Chapter, each Marine being allowed to add to their tattoos for every confirmed kill they make. Their distinctive dark-red Power Armour has since been sighted in orbit around worlds where other rogue elements of the Adeptus Astartes are thought to be currently in hiding.
   
   
  
• Ebony Foxes
  The Ebony Foxes are believed to be the Chapter that made contact and came to the aid of Inquisitor-General Hael (his report being shown above) They have flesh-coloured Power Armour and are believed to recruit from desert worlds, but for the most part are fleet based. It is not known why they made contact with the Inquisitor, which is an act that they knew would expose them to the Inquisition, but it is believed that it was a pre-meditated act, for they only made contact after they knew that the Inquisitor could not attack their vessels or pursue them. There have been scattered reports of Marines, both male and female, dressed in the Chapter livery of the Ebony Foxes preforming independent investigations on Dead Worlds, but the purpose of this is as of yet unknown. Given what little information there is about them, it is safe to assume that they are a very secretive Chapter, possibly from Dark Angels gene-stock, and so they inevitably have some dark agenda that they refuse to acknowledge. They have only taken part in a few military actions registered by the Imperium, and always arriving silently from orbit and leaving the moment that the conflict is over.
  

Chaos Female Marines

 

Beyond the reach of retribution, there still exists the tainted Legions of Chaos, whose very existence forever haunts and shames the very foundation of the Imperium, and forever are they marked as Heretics for it. Debasement and Heresy are the least of these traitor’s crimes, and so it perhaps comes at no surprise that there exist within the ranks of the Chaos Space Marine’s ranks creatures that we identify as female.

Of course, long have we been taught that the Traitor will often use many false identities and guises to confuse and tempt the loyal citizens of the Imperium, and so whilst they undeniably appear feminine, we can safely assume that many of them are using daemonic-spawned illusions, rather than being actually female.

The most common form of this is perhaps a defining trait for those who have been identified as worshippers of the False-God ‘Slaanesh’. This depraved entity seeks sensual perfection and satisfaction above all, and so many of his followers can lay claim, through daemonic gifts, to be both male and female.

The exact process of transformation is unknown, although several theories can be attributed.

• Warp Current Organs – This theory revolves around the natural organs contained within the Marine act as a natural conduit to warp energies. By consciously allowing the flow of psychic energy into the organs, a dedicated (and sufficiently trained) Marine could use this energy to alter and re-configure the natural DNA within his biological structure. The warp energy could then be forced to preform a mass cell-regeneration, causing the organs to mutate or revert to their warp-afflicted DNA structures. Indeed, such an act would prove unfathomably difficult to master, and for sake of convenience would be limited to two distinct biological structures – one male, another female.
  Of course, this theory assumes that the Traitor Marines have found someway to further create and develop organs unique to their own purpose, leading to the assumption that they have somehow created pseudo-Primarches, from which new organs with benefits beyond current Space Marine abilities can be harvested and created.
  
• Dual-Redundancy Organs The Marine has two sets of organs, one female, another male. Hormonal levels are activated and regulated dependant on what particular sex they wish to appear, or at least have the properties of. Physical, rather than biological, change would be brought upon by hyper-contracting or expanding the musculature of the subject, effectively changing shape but still conforming to the original’s size and mass, albeit in different proportions.
  
• Polymorphic Glands – The drug known as ‘Polymorphine’ is well known in Imperial circles, and its use is especially renown amongst the Cultists of the Callidus Assassin Temple. It works as a biological and chemical equivalent of the first theory, providing a genetic retro-virus that alters the user’s DNA and then forces a cell-replication to enact this change. It would also be supplemented with so-called ‘Expansion Organs’ that would be implanted and then ‘programmed’ to inflate or contract, thus increasing or decreasing physical size and shape. Over-dosage of Polymorphine, and use for extended periods of time, can result in permanent degradation of the original’s DNA, leading to often fatal hybrid forms.
  

...

There you go. Up in perhaps a few minutes will be updated entries for the Cults (++EDIT - Done!) Oh, and feel free to PM me regarding things like spelling, grammar. I do try my best, but as I know, that still isn't very good :P

 

*dives for cover*

[the_raptor]

I personally don't buy* female space marines, but that shouldn't stop people who like the idea.

 

* 1) I don't think it is likely that a lone chapter could figure out how to do it, even with a recovered STC fragment.

 

2) I think the claim that all male marines turn women off 40k is absolute rubbish. I have never seen many women being interested in wargames of any description anyway.

 

3) I don't think a female marine would look anything like a woman after going through the steps necessary for marine-dom. I think they would all be more muscled then arnie, and just as zealous and blood thristy as their male counterparts. So what is the point of them having different sex organs?

 

4) I don't think that them being biologically female will make any difference in their thinking and behaviour (masculinity/femininity is generally a culturally enforced mind set), which is the opposite of how many female marine advocates portray them.

 

5) I think having females around will interfere and change the warrior cultures of a marine chapter, few people take this into account (some even have mixed sex units). Even in the 41st millenium I doubt they have found a way to stop men acting like morons around women. There is a reason why nuns and monks were kept separated.

[Dasleah]

Time from post to first critiscm about female Space Marines : 1 hour, 3 minutes :P

 

I'm not here to try and demand that female Space Marines (fSM, for the sake of abbreviations) be included. Personally, I don't care either way. But I see the situation like this: You can get female IG. You can get female Inquisitors. You can get Eldar (including all variations thereof). Hell, even female Orks warranted an entry in their original fluff. I just can't take GeeDub's excuse of 'There aren't any beacuse of...um, boobies? Er, no ... it's because male organs don't work in female bodies! Just like in real life!'. So I've come along and thought to myself a way to include them.

 

I don't think it is likely that a lone chapter could figure out how to do it, even with a recovered STC fragment.

 

It was ... er .... um ........ DARK FOUNDING! *throws smoke bomb, jumps out window* Either that or a.) Chaos did it, b.) The Collegica Genetoria has actually done something for once, or c.) A rogue Inquisitor did it. :P

 

I think the claim that all male marines turn women off 40k is absolute rubbish. I have never seen many women being interested in wargames of any description anyway.

 

Perhaps the only representation of their gender within the sport are, essentially, nuns, that are subservient to the beck and call of their largely male Inquisitors? Females are rarely, if ever, portrayed as the equals of male soldiers in Warhammer. Why aren't there male Daemonettes? Surely a male can be beautiful, and sensual, without being female. But nope, we've got to have at least one example for every army to have cleavage :P

 

I don't think a female marine would look anything like a woman after going through the steps necessary for marine-dom. I think they would all be more muscled then arnie, and just as zealous and blood thristy as their male counterparts. So what is the point of them having different sex organs?

 

You'll notice in the first few paragraphs about how I work around this, and even reference the 'East Germany Female Swimmer' Syndrome that would normally occur if you got a Marine and pumped her full of steroids / testosterone. I haven't tried to turn them into male Space Marines. I've tried to make them FEMALE Space Marines. Hence the work-around of an extension to puberty and alteration of organs to work on less levels of initial testosterone.

And the point? The point is, well, that there's no point not to.

 

I don't think that them being biologically female will make any difference in their thinking and behaviour (masculinity/femininity is generally a culturally enforced mind set), which is the opposite of how many female marine advocates portray them.

 

I'm not trying to make them all girly-girly. Females can be just as hardcore and badass as any male. That's the whole deal. It ultimately makes no difference, as they're both Space Marines. One's just Male, the other Female. Each can be as 'feminine' or 'masculine' as they want. Their actions as warriors of the Imperium comes first, regardless of gender.

 

I think having females around will interfere and change the warrior cultures of a marine chapter, few people take this into account (some even have mixed sex units). Even in the 41st millenium I doubt they have found a way to stop men acting like morons around women. There is a reason why nuns and monks were kept separated.

 

And I can't buy your point of fSM 'perverting' the male SM culture. There were plenty of female warrior societies out there, and just as many that treated female warriors the equals of males. It's a pretty disturbing thought that in the dark reaches of the future, gender equallity has taken a step back. The average Man isn't a savage, and I doubt the average Space Marine is, either. In the Imperial Guard, females are recruited at the same rate as Males and inducted into mixed units as often as they're not. Believe it or not, not all males act like complete idiots at the suggestion of mammaries. Men will act like idiots, regardless. But in a Space Marine Chapter, it's debatable that Marines are no longer Men. For all we know, a Male Marine could have a functioning libido, sure, but on the flip side it's also likely that it's the first thing removed via chemical castration, or hypno-therapy.

[the_raptor]

Time from post to first critiscm about female Space Marines : 1 hour, 3 minutes ;)

 

I'm not here to try and demand that female Space Marines (fSM, for the sake of abbreviations) be included. Personally, I don't care either way.

 

If you bothered to read the first line of my post you would have noted I didn't care if people used them. I just don't buy your reasoning for having them.

 

But I see the situation like this: You can get female IG. You can get female Inquisitors. You can get Eldar (including all variations thereof). Hell, even female Orks warranted an entry in their original fluff. I just can't take GeeDub's excuse of 'There aren't any beacuse of...um, boobies? Er, no ... it's because male organs don't work in female bodies! Just like in real life!'. So I've come along and thought to myself a way to include them.

 

Can I have male Sisters of Battle then? Seems only fair. This is one of the main points, nearly all the armies in 40k are mixed gender (even if for most of them you can't tell or GW doesn't do many models), so why do you feel the need to turn one of the only all male armies into a mixed gender one?

 

And I can't buy your point of fSM 'perverting' the male SM culture. There were plenty of female warrior societies out there, and just as many that treated female warriors the equals of males.

 

Name them. There is a reason why the Amazon myth is so widely known. And that is because female warrior cultures are exceedingly rare. Historically most females did not have the attributes to be an equal warrior to a male (and child rearing made that even harder). In modern times as upper body strength stopped being the be-all-end-all of warriorhood (and we have cheap birth control), more women can function as soldiers.

 

There have been many cultures in which women where in political and religious control, but actual female warrior societies are rare.

 

It's a pretty disturbing thought that in the dark reaches of the future, gender equallity has taken a step back.

 

Oh yes, who would think that in the far future where people are flayed alive for saying "The ecclsiarchial taxes are a bit high this year", gender equality would have fallen by the way side. :rolleyes:

 

And don't cry gender equality. Your female marines are "just as strong, fast, tough and efficient as their superhuman male counterparts", have "heightened sexual awareness and prowess", have "far greater sensitivity to the emotional aspect of this innate learning rather than physical memory" when digesting animal tissue, and their "eyes can distinguish between more colours than a normal Space Marine with more clarity".

 

The only downside to your female marines is that their blood doesn't clot like a normal marines, and their bones are slightly less dense. Your female space marines are eight foot tall, ceramite and adamantium clad, Mary Sue's. If you want to use them fine, I don't have any real problem with the concept, just with the implementation. But don't expect to not get criticised for poor fluff, as that is the whole point of posting it on a discussion board.

 

P.S. Women don't play 40k much because 1) exceedingly few women enjoy war based entertainment of any sort (This is a cultural thing), 2) Those that do are turned off by being hit on or treated "special" by your average male geek. If GW "rebooted" 40k to be a paragon of gender equality and made 50% of the models in every boxset female, women would still not play this game in any real number.

[xRagex]

Putting aside the great fSM question, Dasleah I absolutely love this, the servitor chapters and the hive chapters. Its one portion of the SMs I'd never even thought about. I'd love to see a servitor chapter, a thousand souless 8 foot tall killing machines, literally. Now I'm going to go back to working on my chapter of rosey pink transvestite SM's The emperor's queens, why? Because I can and because no one has the right to tell anyone what a chapter can or can't be.

[Dasleah]

Just a few quick Wikis concerning females in combat, across history:

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Women_in_war

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women_in_combat

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_w...tion_in_warfare

 

If you bothered to read the first line of my post you would have noted I didn't care if people used them. I just don't buy your reasoning for having them.

 

Oh yes, I know. You simply raised some rather excellent points that I felt was my place to try and counter. Half of doing this IA was justification for those that have already done it, the other was to start some debate and make everyone at least think about the possibility, regardless of their final assumptions and conclusions. It's all about debate, baby ;)

 

Can I have male Sisters of Battle then? Seems only fair. This is one of the main points, nearly all the armies in 40k are mixed gender (even if for most of them you can't tell or GW doesn't do many models), so why do you feel the need to turn one of the only all male armies into a mixed gender one?

 

I have no problem with having 'male' Sisiters of Battle. Male monastic orders are perhaps more common than female ones in the real world, so it wouldn't be any stretch of my imagination if someone wanted to do an Adeptus Frateria, or something (Hmmm...actually, that's not a bad idea! It's MINE! MINE!)

 

Name them. There is a reason why the Amazon myth is so widely known. And that is because female warrior cultures are exceedingly rare. Historically most females did not have the attributes to be an equal warrior to a male (and child rearing made that even harder). In modern times as upper body strength stopped being the be-all-end-all of warriorhood (and we have cheap birth control), more women can function as soldiers.

 

There have been many cultures in which women where in political and religious control, but actual female warrior societies are rare.

 

See above for some quick linkage regarding female warriors. I know female warrior orders are rare, but that doesn't mean that they don't exist. Hell, we have the Sisters of Battle as a leading army in the 40k Universe. So we know they exist in the 41st millenium.

 

And don't cry gender equality. Your female marines are "just as strong, fast, tough and efficient as their superhuman male counterparts", have "heightened sexual awareness and prowess", have "far greater sensitivity to the emotional aspect of this innate learning rather than physical memory" when digesting animal tissue, and their "eyes can distinguish between more colours than a normal Space Marine with more clarity".

 

The only downside to your female marines is that their blood doesn't clot like a normal marines, and their bones are slightly less dense. Your female space marines are eight foot tall, ceramite and adamantium clad, Mary Sue's.

 

I personally find it hilarious that the Mary-Sue Dasleah is an eight foot tall warrior woman B)

I included the other aspects as from what I can research, they're all biologically true of females. Woman do have a higher threshold for pain, greater emotional sensitivity, greater colour distinction. The point about 'heightened sexual awareness' refers to the point that they must remain within a state of puberty to supply the hormone testosterone to their Marine organs. I didn't mean they're all a bunch of Naughty Nuns of Saint Valentine. I even referenced the fact that this phenomenom must be present within Male chapters, too. Gene-Seed is keyed to male hormones, and Marines are inducted at the onset of puberty. The logical conclusion from this is that puberty supplies the levels (or at least, frequency) of the neccessary hormones to allow the organs to 'seed'. As any red-blooded male knows, testosterone makes one antsy. That's why we were all so damn randy during puberty.

Of course, females go through puberty as well. Not having lived as a girl from the ages of 11 to 17, I can't really quote what it feels like during that time. But it is the accepted time that one's 'libido' engages, and hence commencment of sexual activity, just like males. Of course, how they counter this in female Chapters must be based on what they do in female Chapters. There are plenty of drugs out there that can supress libido, but most of them do this by removing the levels of testosterone from the blood stream, the hormone that is generally responsible for libido, in both males and females, which I've already stipulated is needed in the fSM implantation period.

I'm leaning towards hypno-therapy, a sort of 'psychic sterilisation'. By removing the psychological imperative to reproduce, it could counter the chemical imperative. But I don't know. I didn't want to stray so far from the 'template' of existing Space Marines. I could of done something completely different if I wanted to. I could of had them all a bunch of female Orygns with an overdose of Polymorphine to make them look more 'human' female :D

To just futher this all EVEN MORE (Oh! The eternal fluffy DRAMA!) I even though of doing a subsection regarding pregnency within the fSM, and generalising it to include all aspects of SM fertility, both male and female. But I think this would be even less welcomed than fSM, so I steered away from it. Might return to it, one day.

 

P.S. Women don't play 40k much because 1) exceedingly few women enjoy war based entertainment of any sort (This is a cultural thing), 2) Those that do are turned off by being hit on or treated "special" by your average male geek. If GW "rebooted" 40k to be a paragon of gender equality and made 50% of the models in every boxset female, women would still not play this game in any real number.

 

Again, I still don't buy the arguement of 'Girl's don't like Warhammer 'cause I say they don't' arguement. It's a sad thing that I can't rely on a female gamer's opinion to contribute here. And I'm not really aiming this IA:fSM at female gamers. I know my target audience is males, and for the most part, that's what it always will be (which is very sad, indeed) Video games are also experiencing this phenomenon, whereby female gamers are the greatest ever untapped market (as I'm sure they are with wargaming) The problem is that people tend to partronise female gamers when they start to show even a bit of interest. I'm not writing this to say 'You want to play? Then you have to play with the girl armies, only!'. I'm saying 'You want to play? Great. These are Space Marines. Enjoy" and the fact that they can then choose to play either male or female Marines is their choice, just like it's the choice of every male gamer.

 

Now I'm going to go back to working on my chapter of rosey pink transvestite SM's The emperor's queens, why? Because I can and because no one has the right to tell anyone what a chapter can or can't be.

 

And that, sir, is entirely the point. I'm just doing this so that you can have a fluffy justification to all those that try to tell you that you can't.

 

And now I'm off to do the Adeptus Frateria - Male Sisters of Battle! Keeee! B)

[the_raptor]

I just spent half an hour typing out a reply but the stupid board wouldn't format it properly (It just wouldn't make the quotes show properly no matter what I did to it). :angry:

 

To sum up: I don't believe the lack of fSM (or female oriented storylines in video games) has anything to do with the lack of female gamers. I think it has to do mainly with the fact that most women don't enojoy the types of games that most males do, whether this is biological or cultural is an excercise left to the reader. I think Dasleah's fSM has bits of bad fluff in it but I am not opposed to the idea of fSM's. I just think there are fundamental questions that need answering which are far more important then the physical transformation of a female into a spacemarine. I have no problems with female avatars or female gamers*.

 

This is a discussion board and if people don't want us discussing their fluff and any problems it has they shouldn't post.

 

I think his other Astartes are really bloody good.

 

* I was in an MMO group that consisted mostly of females or males roleplaying females. Out of character I don't hit on females, In Character I may flirt with female avatars regardless of the gender of the player.

[Dasleah]

I just spent half an hour typing out a reply but the stupid board wouldn't format it properly (It just wouldn't make the quotes show properly no matter what I did to it). :angry:

 

Yeah, the forum's a bastard like that, sometimes :( Oh well.

 

To sum up: I don't believe the lack of fSM (or female oriented storylines in video games) has anything to do with the lack of female gamers. I think it has to do mainly with the fact that most women don't enojoy the types of games that most males do, whether this is biological or cultural is an excercise left to the reader. I think Dasleah's fSM has bits of bad fluff in it but I am not opposed to the idea of fSM's. I just think there are fundamental questions that need answering which are far more important then the physical transformation of a female into a spacemarine. I have no problems with female avatars or female gamers*.

 

I'm not saying that not having fSm stops females from playing - I'm just saying it probably doesn't help :angry:

Oh, and as a general inquiry, what parts of the IA did you think were 'bad'? This was stuff I wrote more than two years ago, so I was expecting people to tear it to peices. I'd be more than welcome to know what parts need work, what needs to be added, etcetera. It's those 'fundamentals' that you mentioned that I'd really like to nail, so if you're willing to tell me, I'd be willing to listen.

 

I think his other Astartes are really bloody good.

 

Thanks very muchly ^_^

[Commissar Molotov]

I have no problem with having 'male' Sisiters of Battle. Male monastic orders are perhaps more common than female ones in the real world, so it wouldn't be any stretch of my imagination if someone wanted to do an Adeptus Frateria, or something (Hmmm...actually, that's not a bad idea! It's MINE! MINE!)

 

Only, under the decree passive, the Ecclesiarchy is forbidden from having men under arms.

[Gree]

Amazing..Centuria Astartes minor for me.

[the_raptor]

Oh, and as a general inquiry, what parts of the IA did you think were 'bad'? This was stuff I wrote more than two years ago, so I was expecting people to tear it to peices. I'd be more than welcome to know what parts need work, what needs to be added, etcetera. It's those 'fundamentals' that you mentioned that I'd really like to nail, so if you're willing to tell me, I'd be willing to listen.

 

I think some more info on the culture of chapters with fSM and how they integrate and function as a mixed sexed force would be good. I also think you would be better off being more mysterious about their origins and writing the "hows" of fSM organs as being a report from the AdeptMech (with more conjecture then fact). I also don't get your fluff piece, as the fSM refusing to meet with the Impies will get them in a lot less trouble then being revealed as fSM's.

 

 

I have no problem with having 'male' Sisiters of Battle. Male monastic orders are perhaps more common than female ones in the real world, so it wouldn't be any stretch of my imagination if someone wanted to do an Adeptus Frateria, or something (Hmmm...actually, that's not a bad idea! It's MINE! MINE!)

 

Only, under the decree passive, the Ecclesiarchy is forbidden from having men under arms.

 

What about eunuchs? :ph34r:

[Dasleah]

Yeah, I've been pondering about the Ecclessiarch being forbidden 'men' under arms. I suppose I could introduce some ritual castration or something :P :D But the Ecclessiarch is infamous for being 'flexible' when it needs to be. Look at the Crusade for Red Redemption (or whatever it is) The Ecclessiarch provides them with arms and means to get from A to B to fight, but don't officially endorse them as a fighting body. I'm leaning towards this as per the Adeptus Frateria. An unofficial fighting force that perhaps have a central 'world' (like Ophelia *insert roman numerals*) and use the Imperial tithes to raise and supply fighting regiments from the core of the Frateria. So an official Imperial force, but only listens to the Ecclessiarch.

 

On fSM: Yeah, I was thinking about what I could add to the article last night and I realised that I'd done alot of how, but not a lot of why. And that fluff piece does bother me too, I'll try and concieve something more mysterious and ambigous. Thanks muchly for the inputs, I'll see what I can do with them.

 

Thanks for all the imputs and everything! I'll try to get some basic input on the Adeptus Frateria up soon. :P

[NINmaestro]

Dasleah: this thing kicks ass. As for the conversation on "fSM" I think that its a fine idea. Who the hell hasn't tried to do this I think. I did once upon a time and got so much critiscm for trying. Oh well. could be worse. I support females in the space marine army. thats just my liberal nature. <_<

[Dasleah]

Why, many thanks indeed, NINmaestro ;) I sincerley apologise for the lack of updates for the past week - first week back of Uni and I'm pre-viz'ing like there's no tomorrow. But nonetheless, expect this thread to float up and down for quite a while as my interest comes and goes B) :cuss