Collaborative Chapter Creation Project II

[Darrell]

Alright, I suppose my curiosity will have to hold on for the time being.

 

Since Storm Giants don't seem likely, I'm voting for War Bearers. I can't imagine we'd get much more freedom than a Chapter most of us have never heard of before, and they definitely don't seem as "knightly" as the Castellans were.

[Commissar Molotov]

Right, so thus far it seems the two chapters most people have an interest in are the War Bearers and the Skull Bearers. I'd like it very much if we could arrive at a mutual (or mostly mutual) decision without the need for a vote. I have tremendous confidence in the ability of the frater to act maturely and reasonably - to come to an agreement without polls and the like.

 

I'd like to advance the suggestion that we pick the War Bearers, if only because of the Mortifactor overtones that have coloured the Skull Bearers thus far. Is anyone vehemently opposed, or would anyone like to advance an argument as to why we should pick the Skull Bearers? Remember that the end result of the project isn't as important as the community-building processes that comprise it, and that there will be other CCC projects. If you really like the Skull Bearers, the option is available to you to work on an IA for them.

 

So, what do people say - The War Bearers? ;)

[Ferrata]

Just adding some more thoughts to the pot.

 

Storm Warriors

- Storm would suggest a highly mobile chapter, either on the battle field or Space Bourne. Would this mean a high number of Bikers, Assault Marines, Drop Pods or Mounted Tactical Marines. My personal favourite is the last one.

- Warriors would suggest a combat theme, so a highly mobile combat force, the totally opposite of the Imperial Castellans.

 

Bar this, we have total freedom on the attitude of these Warriors. Honourable Fighters? Blood Thirsty? Death Seeking?

[Grimdarkness]

Right, so thus far it seems the two chapters most people have an interest in are the War Bearers and the Skull Bearers. I'd like it very much if we could arrive at a mutual (or mostly mutual) decision without the need for a vote. I have tremendous confidence in the ability of the frater to act maturely and reasonably - to come to an agreement without polls and the like.

 

I'd like to advance the suggestion that we pick the War Bearers, if only because of the Mortifactor overtones that have coloured the Skull Bearers thus far. Is anyone vehemently opposed, or would anyone like to advance an argument as to why we should pick the Skull Bearers? Remember that the end result of the project isn't as important as the community-building processes that comprise it, and that there will be other CCC projects. If you really like the Skull Bearers, the option is available to you to work on an IA for them.

 

So, what do people say - The War Bearers? ;)

 

I second the proposal.

[Darrell]

So, what do people say - The War Bearers?

 

That's what I vote!

[Bernhard Terroristos]

Greetings,

 

I apologize for my coming late into this discussion. I personally like the idea of War Bearer's as their is barely any fluff behind them, and it lends open to a very community-based discussion. The colour scheme and chapter badge, are very distinguishable but also lends an air in mystery to them. Do they always bear their "war" to the enemy, or do they think that they should alsways bear the brunt of any attack, and put themselves in the most optimum of danger?

 

More so, I agree with many of the board that the Skull Bearers, even due to their name are too remeniscent of the Mortifactors. It is a very interesting idea, and both would be equally supplied ideas by me, but due to personal opinion; I would have to go with the War Bearer's.

 

As this is a community-based event, and more importantly a community-building process as Commissar Molotov said; I would be willing to see any chapter of the two be done, that being a change in the definite tide or turn of events.

 

I don't wish to regress to votes, or poll's as I think as a whole, we, the community are able to make mature and on the go changes, and just like Space Marines, should be able to adapt to possibly any tactical situation in a split.

 

Overall, my choice is the War Bearer's. The Emperor Wills It!!!

 

Bernhard Terroristos

Edited July 10, 2006 by Bernhard Terroristos

[Cpt_Tiberius]

I'm going to have to say War Bearers as well. I think they have the right combination of cool name/heraldry & complete lack of background information. Plus, I really like axes.

 

Darell - As to the Storm Giants, don't take my stance as a disinterest in the Storm Giants. I've been intrigued with them for years. They are easily one of my favorite chapters. I appologize if my comments sounded in anyway antagonistic. You've been a great help on my IA project and I appreciate your opinion and definitely don't mean to get this project off on the wrong foot. :ph34r:

[Brother-Librarian Akritedes]

I vote War Bearers. Ignore the previous post, it was in error! You saw nothing, NOTHING! :ph34r:

 

This was actually one of the chapters we looked over on DI when we started our own collaborative project, which ended in the Dark Hands, who were finished and posted in this very forum some time ago by DI's own Nine_Breaker. I, personally, like them for the name, heraldry, and the sheer image they present. Plate armored men with axes cannot symbolise anything but war (or perhaps extreme lumber harvesting).

Edited July 11, 2006 by Brother-Librarian Akritedes

[Nine_Breaker]

Nine says that we should do War Bearers... And my will shall be done, or else. :ph34r:

 

The reason being that they look cooler...and...err...'nough said really.

Edited July 11, 2006 by Nine Breaker

[Zhivago]

So, what do people say - The War Bearers?

 

So be it. The point of them being distant from all kinds of assosations is true.

[Archangelus]

War Bearers it is then! :lol:

 

I am so looking forward to this:)

 

"ΠΟΛΕΜΟΣ ΠΑΤΗΡ ΠΑΝΤΩΝ" (Po-le-mos pa-teer pan-don) = WAR IS THE FATHER OF ALL (Heraclitus, 6th century BC)

Edited July 11, 2006 by Archangelus

[Zhivago]

So...assuming that war bearers are now chosen. What kind of chapter you imagine them to be ?

 

'We bear war to the borders of imperium' ?

 

Meaning that they'd be agressive chapter, conquerring xenos worlds and such and then leaving them to be.

After all, less there is enemies of men, the stronger the humanity is.

or

 

'We bear the war on imperium'

 

Meaning that they'd want to bear weight of war in imperium, working like white cells, to rush in where there is conflict with-in imperium and try to bear the pain instead of imperial civilians.

 

Or then we could ignore the name and come up with something else.

 

I'm kind of fan of the idea of them being agressive forces, prehaps fleet based, that wreacks terror and destruction to the enemeis of man.

 

That pic of war bearers seems to lack company insignia, unless it is coded in the colour of the twin axes.

 

I'd also like to seem them as codex-adheren't as today most of the DIYs here seem to be chanign thins to be exiting, dividing scouts and termies to companies seems popular.

Edited July 11, 2006 by Zhivago

[Archangelus]

In the Insignium Astartes there is a pic of a War Bearer. The company is shown by a coloured stripe on the helmet, I believe. Although the painted model from GW does not show the stripe...

 

I second the opinion that we should stay within the codex organisation with them. Depth of background does not need flashy special rules.

[Ferrata]

I agree with keeping them Codex and make their attitude make them stand out. I feel we should go for an alternative idea to the most obvious. It is easy to make an Aggressive combat army, but what about an army which believes it bears the weight of the Imperium on its shoulders, the wars of the Imperium, hence War Bearers. Maybe an army in a deep depression for the sins of the Imperium, bearing these sins and finding penance in war. Only by killing the impure may the Imperium be pure once more. Axes are also linked to executions, so maybe this could fit into the bearing of sins.

[Cpt_Tiberius]

Okay so here is what we know then...

 

Chapter Name: War Bearers

 

Chapter Badge: Crossed Axes

 

Chapter Organization: Codex (at least at one time)

 

Company Marking: Helmet Stripe

 

I agree we should keep them fairly codex, if not strictly so. As for a general theme for the army, I definitely see them as a "take the fight to them" type army, though not necessarily a close combat army like the BT or BA. Maybe they have taken a vow to be at the speartip of every campaign they join. I'd like to think of them as less "space KNIGHTS" and more "space SOLDIERS" guns and grenades over chainswords and tabards. Maybe the Axe is a potent symbol to them and they prefer it over swords as a badge of office?

 

As for recruitment, I'd like to have them be more like the IF, recruiting from several planets as opposed to one like the SW. Everybody seems to do the feral recruit thing, so recruiting hive gangers would be a new approach. Just my opinion.

 

And finally Geneseed. I'd say let's just stick with UM and move on as it's the most likely anyway (with a small chance of Dorn). Which brings us to founding. Do we want a newer founding or something older? Personally I'm fine with it either way.

[Archangelus]

Maybe they are "relief" force. Like the Badab war, when the chapters were rotated. Maybe they are there to stabilise the situation after the crusading glory boys destroy half the planet and then leave (root out any pockets of resistance, executing the responsible ones, etc).

 

Maybe they are the true master logisticians "sustaining" the war efforts accross a wide front.

[Zhivago]

Company Marking: Helmet Stripe

But how they designate veteran sergeants ?

 

If they go like

red helm = sergeant

white helm = veteran

(all with stripes to desginate company)

 

Prehaps split red/white helm with stripe ? Or indicator somewhere in armour, like inverted should pauladrons or black trims, or...

 

As for recruitment, I'd like to have them be more like the IF, recruiting from several planets as opposed to one like the SW. Everybody seems to do the feral recruit thing, so recruiting hive gangers would be a new approach. Just my opinion.

 

That would go on lines with being fleet based.

 

Maybe they are "relief" force. Like the Badab war, when the chapters were rotated. Maybe they are there to stabilise the situation after the crusading glory boys destroy half the planet and then leave (root out any pockets of resistance, executing the responsible ones, etc).

I think that is pretty much guard duty, marines are used as scalpel that paralyzes defenses, so that guard can crush it.

 

Maybe an army in a deep depression for the sins of the Imperium, bearing these sins and finding penance in war. Only by killing the impure may the Imperium be pure once more. Axes are also linked to executions, so maybe this could fit into the bearing of sins.

 

On the lines of my second suggestion which I considered bit "unfluffy", but it has potential.

Prehaps chapter has rituals in which captured enemies are beheaded under imperial/chapter banner. For their sin of existance and sin of being enemy of man.

 

Prehaps even.. now this is throwing ideas around 'executor chaplain' who adminsters the teaching of the chapter, guides brethren spiritually as is enbodiment of divine retribution ?

 

Or then just make the ritual performed by commander of current mission, much what soul drinkers do with chalice and brains. ewww

 

Axes might signify head-hunting but I think that aspect should be left for 'skull-bearers' :P

 

And when it comes to traits, I suggest we clamp them after we have chapter outlined. Not before :P

[iron father]

Axes can also be the fasces of ancient Rome, a symbol of authority.

[Grimdarkness]

So we have so far a fleet based chapter that recruits from "modern imperial worlds" like the Imp fists at necromunda.

 

why crossed axes for chapter iconography?

What do they use for squad marking codex or a variation?

Founding why not somewhere in the middle like the 10 to the 16 or 17 founding except the 13 of course. It will give them five to a couple thousand years history.

[Ferrata]

I do believe you are all running for the hills before you've found your footing. Getting into the detail about gene-seed/founding/recruition now will just need to be re-evaluated when you get to those sections. Really at this point you should be thinking about what kind of theme will be running through the chapter. Stating that they are a "Combat orientated force" isn't enough. You really need to hammer down the theme of this chapter, what makes them them. It is better to draw the picture before you start colouring it in.

[Big Woop]

The first thing that comes into my mind when I look at the colour scheme is the world wars: the ends justify the means, total warfare and so on, no illusions of chivalry just destruction.

 

Even though the armour is camo green I think the intention behind it should not be camouflage, that just seems contradictory to the idea of space marines somehow.

[Archangelus]

Not a bad thought! Total War! Maybe they are the extermination specialists. Maybe they are given a specific sector/section of space and were told to cleanse it by any means necessary. Anything non-human must die.

 

There was this quote from the Tactica Imperialis that the best and quickest way to win a war is to make sure that the enemy is not even aware that there is a war until it is too late.

 

Blitz-krieg type. Maybe heavily mechanized.

[Keyoz Devastrius]

The axe is a symbol of strength, and thunderbolt (just like a lightning it strikes down trees). The Roman fasces symbolizes the authority to decapitate.

 

The axe is a heavy and unwieldy weapon, but when it strikes it can get through thickest armor.

 

As space soldiers preferring guns over swords they would rely on fire power of their bolters ,heavy weapons and tanks - the battle axes of 40k - heavy and unwieldy but deadly.

[Ferrata]

Maybe the Axe could represent their manner. As Keyoz Devastrius said, axes are unwieldry, heavy weapons, maybe the War Bearers don't get on well with the Imperium. Maybe they just smash their way through the enemy and leave, not caring for the mess they leave behind. Imperial Forces don't like using them, but they get the job done.

[Hrvat]

Axe could maybe be used as a symbol of veteran status. If one becomes a veteran he gets an axe if he becomes a vet. sarge he gets a power axe. Swords and Fists would not be used.

 

I also like the total war scheme for them. Something like armies of the balkan wars in the 1990-tis. No constrains, no moral dilemas just brutal eficiency only in a high tech way.

 

Among some Slavic people notably among the Croats axe is a symbol of veteran soldiers that have fought long and hard and were awarded land and rights by their lords. So my idea for you guys would be that War BEarers older than 500 years that have in some way been crippled and can't perform 100% any more but are still strong and willing be formed into tutors left on worlds that WB fleet wisits to select and train new recruits.

 

More to come later.