Will CSM get the "Primaris" treatment?

[Commissar K.]

Decided to thake two bits of quote here because I pretty much agree with what you are saying and also have some opinions on where the short term future will indeed lead us.
 

I'm not saying anti-chaos chaos marine fluff doesn't exist.  I'm not saying that 'chaos marines can exist in the eye without being outwardly or inwardly changed in any appreciable way' is contradictory to (some) 

 

And no, I don't at all think future chaos kits should be a mix of ornate, gothic, mutated bits and plain ones.  That's a recipe for an utterly incoherent model range with no driving aesthetic what so ever.  No, lets have a strong, visually chaotic aesthetic, yes based on the dark vengeance models, albeit toned down for regular dudes so there's a distinction between the grunts & the elites.  And those who don't like it can buy 30k models, because those are in affordable plastic now and better represent the old/archaic but decidedly not chaotic aesthetic that the anti-chaos chaos folk like better than anything GW proper is going to do in a 40k line anyway.

 

 

Lack of poseability in more ornate kits might be a problem, sure, but I see that as a general problem with GW kits these days regardless of aesthetic.

 

 

 

 

I do think we'll see separate ranges / codeces for one or both of World Eaters and Emperor's Children, though, and then I expect a chaos counterpart to Primaris, plus new models for Huron, Bile, and Archaon, possibly in a triumvirate box with a narrative focus on the campaign towards terra, will arrive with a new basic CSM codex the following year.

Mind You, this isn't based on anything beyond wild speculation.  Similarly based on nothing, I don't think we'll ever see new models for basic chaos marines, bikes, or havocs.

 

I think the future (Chaos Cult) kits will be akin to the Death Guard in that some of them will not have much alternate poseability or adaptability. I think Games Workshop has a very clear plan for CSM and that's that they will have their visual Legion differences in looks turned up to 11. It's also what differentiates them from the regular Space Marines look. From my perspective what we ideally would see is:

- A Chaos Space Marines upgrade kit, seperate and workable for both older kits and Primaris Marines that basically is vanilla Chaos. It would work out for Alpha Legion, Black Legion, etc. what we could envision as "Chaos Undivided".
- An updated plastic Noise Marine kit, visual looks turned up to 11. This set will lack the old skool poseability but looks extremely dynamic. 
- An updated plastic Berzerkers kit, visual looks turned up to 11. This set will lack the old skool poseability but looks extremely dynamic.

Lego vs Dynamic designs
Another topic I think is very interesting and a side-topic here is that so far GW has shown either but never really was able to do both on the same model. Logical also because the one doesn't really allow for the other, not when pressed out of the same plastics. I personally like the Dynamic designs GW is going for and do think that this can be fantastic to apply more and more for Chaos. For sure there would be hand swaps available but I do think running Berzerkers and raving Noise Marines are better able to display a "Chaotic vibe". The same is true for compairing the latest Shadespire Bloodreavers to the "Lego" Bloodreavers. The dynamic in the Shadespire models just makes them look that much more scary but has less customisation options.

vs

Codex World Eaters / Codex Emperor's Children
I too hope this will happen and think it will eventually. Again though (and offcourse unfortunate for 40K Chaos fans) I don't see it happening any time soon but I can see it happening once all the main other factions have recieved their Codex update. At that point more is possible. In my opinion and expectation I think GW will consider this move somewhere now and next year so I think we might see something along those lines earliest 2019/2020.

Before the codex though a window of option does excist to have the main Cult units appear first. I think that it's possible that Noise Marines will be released first because they are in the Codex and difficult to obtain. Likewise I think many GW employees would also like to see new Berzerkers. 

Initially I hoped for these two kits to go alongside with the Codex Chaos Space Marines though so like you I also just base this on well basically hope for more :) 

[Sception]

We're tearing through codex updates at a right clip, though, and I don't anticipate that pace changing much.  Plenty of time to fit some knorne and slaanesh marines into the schedule.

 

I just pray that whenever the noise marines /do/ get their update, that the digital sculptors involved find the COURAGE and VISION to give them back their guitars.

[micahwc]

We know that Cawl used traitor legion gene seed. I think it would be way cooler some of the loyalist gene seed primaris turned, and the traitor gene seed primaris stayed loyal. How cool would it be from a fluff perspective to throw some primaris vrs marine action around?  Black Templar primaris that turn to chaos would be delightful.

[Panzer]

We're tearing through codex updates at a right clip, though, and I don't anticipate that pace changing much.  Plenty of time to fit some knorne and slaanesh marines into the schedule.

 

I just pray that whenever the noise marines /do/ get their update, that the digital sculptors involved find the COURAGE and VISION to give them back their guitars.

If they do give them back their guitars I'd instantly drop all my other projects and build up a 3k force of EC asap lol

[Evil Eye]

I wouldn't mind it, espeically if it means old Fabulous Bill Fabius Bile gets some time in the limelight. Seriously, Mr. "Walking Unit 731" needs a new model and something to do. Bring on the New Men, I say!

[Commissar K.]

I'm in for Emperor's Children with epic Saxophones too though :P 

[Slave to Darkness]

Nah Noise Marine with Violins, Cellos and Panpipes. 

[GreyCrow]

I'm in for Emperor's Children with epic Saxophones too though :P

The most epic Doom Siren ever

 

If I face a guy like this, I will concede automatically out of pure respect

[Panzer]

Noise Marines with bagpipes would be quite awesome as well. Truly Doom Sirens. :D

[Warpmiss]

If Fabius finally shows up with a new model plus new primaris-like CSM I am so building a Fabius Bile-themed army (full with models representing his original deformed creations).

[Panzer]

Fabius is the one special character I'm set on using 90% of my games. His fluff is just awesome and his rules interesting enough. A new model with GWs super detailed plastic? I'd buy....more than one lol

[GreaterChickenofTzeentch]

 

I'm in for Emperor's Children with epic Saxophones too though

The most epic Doom Siren ever

 

If I face a guy like this, I will concede automatically out of pure respect

 

Only if he's playing Careless Whisper on a Bluetooth speaker during the game. :)

[GreyCrow]

That, or the Epic Sax Guy loop for 10 hours !

[Commissar K.]

 

 

I'm in for Emperor's Children with epic Saxophones too though

The most epic Doom Siren ever

 

If I face a guy like this, I will concede automatically out of pure respect

 

Only if he's playing Careless Whisper on a Bluetooth speaker during the game.

 

 

That, or the Epic Sax Guy loop for 10 hours !

Likely all of the above at the same time, volume at 11.

 

I think tubular shaped weapons would work very well for the newer line though which indeed don't make it all to different from a saxophone or tuba even. With enough wires I think it could look really cool and integrated into the warrior, essentially giving that hard noise vibe or at least have the apparance of something that would make one hell of a noise :P 

 

Another interesting thing I think Games Workshop is playing with more and more is the design of scenic bases even further magnifying the effect a model has on the battlefield. So maby here we could even see blasts of energy/noise affecting the field. 

 

In terms of artistic design I think the work for Noise Marines looks cool but I would prefer some more organic shapes to appear on the warrior. One reason being that it's a Slaanesh follower and the other being that I feel the coolest Noise Marines would actually look very much integrated with their weapon. In a better way like the current Obliterator sculpts ;) 

 

All in all I love this art and design:

 

But would even like it more if a new design would have the weapon connected to the mouth through tubes. Basically making the noise marines some kind of new-techno Matrix style Banshee.

 

[Warpmiss]

From Graham McNeill's description of how the EC became Noise Marines in Fulgrim, I always imagined them as something far more gruesome than what the actual models show. This might just have been McNeill twisting the canon (I honestly have no idea) but I personally loved it.

[Commissar K.]

From Graham McNeill's description of how the EC became Noise Marines in Fulgrim, I always imagined them as something far more gruesome than what the actual models show. This might just have been McNeill twisting the canon (I honestly have no idea) but I personally loved it.

Yeah I too want to see them look more defined. I do think that in many ways the older models resemble some of the ideas but I personally think one of the cool ways to make them unique is to have them physically attached to the weapons, not by mutation but by lust basically. Being able to visually share their emotions with their weapons and more or less becomming one with them. This thinkering with marine, weapon and mutation would also fit some designs Fabius Bile could come up with. 

 

Again though, I do think that every fan of their lore and Slaaneshi designs could come up with their own likable variant. I do not mind the idea of them being equiped with guitars but at the same time I feel that route would lead to a more Mad-max style design. This is very cool but in my opinion also more suited for either Necromunda Warbands or Orruks. I tend to believe that Slaanesh worshippers would thake it a little further, which would be a less crude blend of Marine and Machine.

 

As this idea has now found a place in my mind I'll try to come up with a sketch tonight on how I'd like to see Noise Marines in their next form. 

For me the true Slaanesh vibe is really well represented currently in G.H. Gigers artwork. For sure the smoot Alien designs also clearly have affected GW's Tyranid look somewhat but at the same time I do think GW went a more organic path with them and much less machine. In that same vein though we allready see that many Tyranid parts would also look very well on Chaos Space Marines so I think my ideal look for them isn't even out of the realms of possabilities  

 

As a massive fan of Khorne, World Eaters and everything Blood God related I do think that the current Forgeworld design for World Eater Berzerkers is allready reflecting the vibe extremely well. Having said that those sculpts are offcourse quite old allready and I do think that something new there would also not look amiss. With the latest Berzerker rules and how well they can now find a place in any Chaos Space Marines list I even hope that Games Workshop has allready realized some stuff for them.

 

Khârn being the last Chaos Space Marine World Eater sculpt also allready embodies a ton of the design I love. In reality it's also not very difficult to make them look the way they are often portayed; hulking Chaos Space Marines with Gladatorial aspects, chains, skulls and obviously Chain Axes. The latest beautiful Khorne models I really love are Shadespire's Garrek's Reavers. The flesh-cut Khorne symbols are essential to their look and really portay the maniacal vibe they should have.  

To bring it back to the topic at hand though, the funny thing is that Chaos Space Marines are probably the least in need of something akin to the Primaris Space Marines. I also still believe that the prime reason for GW to create them at all is less because of true-scale reasons and more because "good" also needs heroes who do not look like inferior versions of their opponents. Likewise we also do not want to see "evil" portayed like a weak imp all the time.

[Warpmiss]

Yep, simply carrying around or being strapped to musical instruments would be more like that guy in the Fury Road rather than a Slaanesh thing. The marine would be so obsessed with his instrument he would try to make it part of his body. 

 

Slaanesh and Giger are like a match made in heaven the Warp.

 

 

For CSM, the Primaris-treatment would actually be very easily achieved, I think. It's so easy to justify larger CSM, either they mutated from their exposure to Chaos, their patron God gifted them (see the new Death Guard) or Fabius working his science on them. All of them being lore-friendly, unlike the Primaris.

[Panzer]

 

But would even like it more if a new design would have the weapon connected to the mouth through tubes. Basically making the noise marines some kind of new-techno Matrix style Banshee.

 

That's basically what the Doom Siren is. :D

[Commissar K.]

 

 

But would even like it more if a new design would have the weapon connected to the mouth through tubes. Basically making the noise marines some kind of new-techno Matrix style Banshee.

 

That's basically what the Doom Siren is.

 

I guess I basically want all the noise marines to look like that to some degree :P

[Panzer]

I wouldn't mind a Doom Siren unit at all! :D

2 base attacks, Doom Siren on everyone and 1-2 chainswords...sounds fantastic! :D

[Slave to Darkness]

 

 

 

I'm in for Emperor's Children with epic Saxophones too though

The most epic Doom Siren ever

 

If I face a guy like this, I will concede automatically out of pure respect

 

Only if he's playing Careless Whisper on a Bluetooth speaker during the game.

 

 

That, or the Epic Sax Guy loop for 10 hours !

Likely all of the above at the same time, volume at 11.

 

 

 

Pffft, not Slaaneshi enough, now this guy though... 

[Lord_Caerolion]

I'm just hoping we can upgrade Land Raiders to have the Noise Marine equivalent of the guitar-guy from Mad Max

[Commissar K.]

I'm just hoping we can upgrade Land Raiders

Link

 

But hey, let's party like it's 1999

[Chmur]

In the dark Imperium book is mentions that Cawl has the potential to make primaris marines from traitor primarch geneseed. I could see some split between Cawl and Guilliman, or maybe Fabius Bile leading an attack to get the technology himself. The new csm boxes could definitely be primaris sized.

 

Cawl actually has the Primaris ready, Roubote didn't really specify to "do only the good guys".

 

It seems that the new fluff is setting up for Primaris Chaos marines. They have geneseed and primaris recruits from the original traitor legions that has been kept in stasis. I have the horrible fear that GW will foist these abominations on us at some point.

 

From fluff point, there must be Primaris Chaos marines/renegades - at the speed at which Cawl is able to chuck them out, if they would be as incorruptible as Grey Knights etc and none had fallen to Chaos, then we're done here. Traitors would not be able to withstand the sheer pressure of these improved Space Marines. However, I see the fluff developing more in the way of "sure, Primaris can be renegades" but we have dedicated Chaos range that has been cooked up by Fabius Bile after following Cawl on Instagram.

[Commissar K.]

As before I think Chaos is well capable to handle Primaris in their current form in lore too. A prime reason why they have been made by GW was likely also to gain more potent design space for CSM, which we allready see.

 

I do agree that at some point Bile might allow for CSM to use Primaris too but I doubt GW would recreate them that soon before Cult Legion Troops. Afterall Cult Legion Troops is what most if not all CSM like anyway.

 

What I can see is that Primaris might appear as non-Mark of Chaos Marine options, basically to create depth to the Undivided Legions. At the same time I also think that wed need a Chaotified tech Priest to help Bile re-create the process. Lorewise it could be fitting with Primaris serving the Forge of Souls, which could be neat as something new.