Capt Laertes

@ Kizzdougs Thanks for the reply mate. The thinking behind the close combat vets is that the Recon Company has a better than usual chance of taking first turn and since they will infiltrate pretty close to the enemy in their Rhino(s), they can roll forward, disembark into some cover right in the face of enemy units and then charge T2, with their 3+ (or hopefully 2+) cover save absorbing any incoming fire during T1... at least that's the concept anyway, nothing guaranteed! Plus, as I'm trying to do a fluffy Recon-style list with no Termies or Jump Packers, there's very few options for hard-hitting assault units. And Drop Pods and Fliers don't really fit the theme either unfortunately. Glad to hear the Machine Killer Vets are a viable idea, I think I'll go with them then. Worth giving them a few power weapons as well or not bother? I did actually consider Mor Deythan, but I think the consistent firepower of the Seekers at AP2 will be more useful in this army in a fire support role than the 'one-shot' Fatal Strike since I have no Heavy Support... If I had another slot I'd definitely put them in though. ****EDIT! Scratch that, just realised they're ELITES not FAST ATTACK, so I think I'll put them in! Don't know why I thought they were Fast Attack!**** The Centurion rides with the Praetor and Command Squad in their Rhino (to give them a bit more muscle if necessary) and I was also thinking if that Rhino infiltrates forward along with the close combat vets in their Rhino, when they both roll forward and disembark on T1, the Praetor and Centurion can swap around between the Command Squad and Vets depending on the targets available to charge, which will give both of those squads the benefit of their Cameleoline as well as Shrouded for a good chance of 2+ cover save for both squads during T1... Ha, does any of that sound viable or is that too much theory that will be a disaster on the table?

Hi All I'm designing and modelling a Recon Company RoW Raven Guard list at the moment, and have got it mostly sorted: HQ: Praetor - Paragon, Fist, Digi, Halo, Camo HQ: Command Squad x 5 - 3 Swords, 2 Axes, 1 Combat Shield, Rhino w/ Dozer & Multi-Melta HQ: Praevian - Axe, Charger, AA, Refractor, Camo HQ: Vorax x 4 - Bio-Corrosive HQ: Centurion - Hammer, Camo ELITES: Veterans x10 - ***UPGRADE/TACTICS OPTIONS NEEDED!***, Rhino w/ Dozer & Multi-Melta ELITES: Veterans x10 - ***UPGRADE/TACTICS OPTIONS NEEDED!***, Rhino w/ Dozer & Multi-Melta TROOPS: Recon Squad x 10 - 1 Combi-Melta, 10 Camo TROOPS: Recon Squad x 5 - 5 Snipers, 5 Camo TROOPS: Recon Squad x 5 - 5 Snipers, 5 Camo FAST ATTACK: Outriders x 7 - 7x Plasma, Sergeant, Fist FAST ATTACK: Seekers x 10 FAST ATTACK: Seekers x 10 ....and no Heavy Support for fluff reasons. Obviously everything infiltrates or scouts (or both) and gets shrouded T1. This is 2705, leaving a maximum of 295 to upgrade the Veterans. I'm not sure whether to go with one squad of Machine Killers with Melta and one squad with Weapon Masters and Power Weapons, or to mix options between the squads, or to just go with ol' reliable Sniper Vets and spend the points elsewhere... I was thinking that Infiltrate, Shrouded in T1/Stealth & Fleet makes for a great "Rhino Rush", either for getting into assault or for vehicle popping, but in great need of criticism and other ideas if you'd be so kind! Cheers Jim

@ defl0 In every one of these games I wished the Vets on foot had more plasma pistols, Strike from the Shadows infiltration along with the Captain meant they did some decent damage with 4 of them, if they'd had 7 or 8 they could have put the serious hurt on key enemy units every game, eg. they may have been able to cripple the stormsurge in the first game before it got the chance to shoot. Being able to put down that much fire power on something and then charge and destroy another unit in the same turn would have been awesome and I reckon it would really help compensate for the risk of infiltrating/deep striking so close to the entire enemy army. In assault, the Claws and Fists were decent but the Swords and Axes were disappointing as they rely so much on the dice to wound and saves and so sometimes do almost nothing. But that's nitpicking really since they're so much cheaper I suppose. And obviously Thunder Hammers would be better than Fists for the same points but I've got Fists modelled on them. The Storm Shields were unlucky in these games rolling plenty of 2s, but I still reckon between 3-5 are a good idea for a squad that puts itself in so much danger so quickly. Last point I forgot to mention in the write ups: it's pretty annoying when you take so many storm shields and then have your squad wiped with mortal wounds - watch out for Destroyer Missiles (Stormsurge) and Serpent Shields (Bloody frustrating Eldar!), buts that situational I suppose. Ideal Squad: 10 Vets - 6-7 Plasma Pistols, 3-4 Storm Shields, 4-5 Thunder Hammers, 5-6 Lightning Claws. Strike from the Shadows along with the Captain. Pretty pricey though!

@ Extropian Thanks mate! Yeah I think you're exactly right, got to judge the situation. Another aspect that occurred to me during these games was order of deployment - do you declare you're putting units 'in the shadows' early in your deployment order to see where the enemy deploys units without putting your own on the table, or do you leave them until last to bluff the enemy into thinking you're not going to use it? Tactically very interesting!

@ Extropian Yeah it probably was too aggressive, I definitely felt that at the time. But now I think about it, I'm not sure where I could have put the Vets so that the Eldar couldn't get at them first with several units except have them cowering at the back of my deployment zone! Maybe reserve the Jump Pack Vets against Eldar and hope for a charge when they arrive using CP re-roll...

THIRD GAME - Space Wolves Space Wolves list: Wolf Lord in Terminator Armour - Combi-Plas & Claw Rune Priest - Axe? 10 Grey Hunters - 2 Combi-Plas, 2 Plasma Guns, 2 Claws, in Rhino 10 Grey Hunters - 2 Combi-Plas, 2 Plasma Guns, 2 Axes, in Rhino 10 Grey Hunters - 2 Combi-Melta, 2 Meltaguns, 2 Fists, in Drop Pod 9 Grey Hunters - 2 Combi-Melta, 1 Meltagun, 2 Fists, in Drop Pod 6 Long Fangs - 4x Lascannon 6 Long Fangs - 5 Missile Launchers, Wolf Guard Terminator w/ Cyclone Missile Launcher Very troop heavy, but troops with scary firepower! Used the cityscape board again (since the game against the Eldar was quite short!) Usual for the Ravens, Devastators and Snipers in buildings, Land Speeders and Rhinos with Tacticals and Sternguard ready to move forward. Similar for the Wolves, with the Long Fangs in their own two tall buildings, with Rhinos containing Grey Hunters rumbling forward underneath. Drop Pods and Wolf Lord waiting to drop/teleport. But this time, the Ravens saw their chance, using Strike from the Shadows to set up both squads of Vanguard, the captain and chaplain in a building right between the two buildings occupied by the wolves. But the Wolves had the first turn, so I was hoping they couldn't put as many shots into them as the Eldar... And this time (much to my relief!), it worked out ok. The wolves had a problem in that they needed to deal with the Vets, but also try to deal with the Raven Guard mech assault and supporting fire coming at them from across the table. Love it, seemed like a perfect demonstration of Raven Guard tactica! So one squad of wolves deployed from their rhino to attack the captain's vets and another came down in their drop pod to attack the chaplain's vets, with the longfangs adding their fire as well. The wolves did average, gunning down 4 from one squad and 3 from the other, but when they followed it up with charges into the Vets (far too reckless!) they were cut down by the waiting Ravens. Meanwhile the other Drop Pod containing Grey Hunters came down in support of the other squad of Grey Hunters mounted in their Rhino, and managed some success in gunning down all the Devastators. Then the Ravens struck, and that was it for the Wolves really. The Chaplain led his vets in cutting down one squad of longfangs. The other Vets and Show Captain charged into the Wolf Lord who had teleported in and the Shadow Captain smashed the Wolf with his Thunder Hammer. The Land Speeders, Snipers, Sternguard and Tacticals made short work of the packs of Grey Hunters (and Rune Priest) who were attacking them. By the end of turn 2 the Wolves only had their empty Rhinos, Drop Pods and a few long fangs left. Text book victory for the Ravens, utilising their tactics perfectly. The Wolves made a mistake in splitting their force and were too reckless, but Strike from the Shadows forced them to make that decision. All in all, really like the Raven's tactics and stratagems. I thought Strike from the Shadows would be OP only costing 1 CP, but it puts units that use it at great risk, and against some armies it can be almost useless and actually dangerous if you don't get the first turn (something which is a problem in 8th generally I think!). Didn't get much use out of Shadow Masters, but reckon it's pretty nice if a bit situational. Hope you've enjoyed these summary reports, if you've found them useful (or useless!), let me know. Cheers

SECOND GAME - ELDAR (Craftworlds) Eldar List: Farseer Autarch Skyrunner - Lance 10 Dire Avengers in Wave Serpent w/ Twin Bright Lance 10 Dire Avengers in Wave Serpent w/ Twin Bright Lance 6 Fire Dragons in Falcon w/ Pulse Laser & Starcannon 5 Shining Spears 8 Warp Spiders 8 Swooping Hawks 5 Dark Reapers Looked like a nice balanced Eldar Aspect list... This time on a ruined cityscape battlefields covered with large ruined buildings... ideal for giving sneaky Ravens cover! The Devastators and Sniper Scouts deployed in the top floors of ruined buildings while the speeders, tacticals in rhino and sternguard in Rhino advanced underneath. The Eldar deployed with their Avengers in Wave Serpents in the centre supported by the Warp Spiders and Dark Reapers in cover in ruins. The Autarch and Shining Spears on one flank, the Fire Dragons in their Falcon on the other, with the Swooping Hawks in the skies. The two Vanguard squads, Captain and Chaplain again used Strike for the Shadows and set up in ruins on the flank, ready to take out the Fire Dragons in their Falcon and then smash their way down the Eldar battle line. The small Eldar army had the first turn, but the Vanguard would easily be able to take one turn of fire with a 2+ cover save and plenty of 3++ storm shields.... Nope. 20 Vanguard Vets dead in one round of firing. The Eldar moved so quickly to bring their whole force to attack the Vets, they stood no chance. The Captain and Chaplain tried to counter attack, but were easily gunned down. Meanwhile, right down the other end of the battlefield, the Autarch and Shining Spears struck right into the Raven Guard deployment zone. They were finally taken down, but not before they had destroyed the Sternguard and the Devastators. The only good result for the Ravens were the Land Speeders taking out both Wave Serpents and the tacticals flaming some Dire Avengers, but there's no other way to say it: This was a contemptuous massacre by the Eldar :( I badly under-estimated both the firepower and speed of Eldar. Elite armies be warned, they can focus and overwhelm even exceptional units with frightening ease. But what else is new, eh? Next game...

Hi All I managed to get in a few games yesterday with Raven Guard using the new chapter tactics and stratagems and thought I'd share the experiences in case it proved useful! I played three games using this list: 2000pts Battalion Detachment - 6 CPs 10 Deployment 'Drops' Captain w/ Thunder Hammer Chaplain w/ Jump Pack Vanguard Vets x10 - 5 Swords, 3 Fists, 2 Axes, 4 Plasma Pistols, 3 Storm shields Vanguard Vets x10 - Jump Packs, 6 Twin Claws, 4 Fists, 4 Storm Shields Sternguard Vets x6 - 6x Combi-Melta, Rhino Scouts x5 - Sniper Rifles, Camo Scouts x5 - Sniper Rifles, Camo Tactical x5 - Combi-Flamer, Flamer, Rhino Land Speeders x3 - All Heavy Flamers & Multi-Meltas Devastators x5 - 4 Missile Launchers I thought this was quite a balanced and competitive list and was greatly looking forward to using Strike from the Shadows with the Vanguard Vets! FIRST GAME - TAU EMPIRE Tau List: Ethereal 10 Strike Team 10 Strike Team 10 Strike Team 6 Crisis Suits - All Twin Plasma & Fusion 10 Pahtfinders 10 Pathfinders Longstrike Hammerhead Hammerhead Stormsurge (!) The battle field was mostly open with a couple of hills in each deployment zone but with a large landing pad complex just off centre in the middle. Devastators and Scouts deployed far back to give supporting fire, land speeders, tacticals and sternguard ready to move forward as fast as possible... and of course one squad of vanguard with the chaplain and the other vanguard with the captain deployed in the complex ready for a first turn charge! The Tau deployed all their fire warriors opposite the complex with the stormsurge behind them, while longstrike and his hammerheads covered the open ground. Crisis Team in Reserve. 10 Drops to 11 meant the Ravens went first (thankfully!). The early game went ok for the Ravens, with the Landspeeders and Devastators blowing a hammerhead out of the air and the captain leading his vanguard in slaughtering one strike team and damaging the stormsurge with their plasma pistols. The chaplain and his vanguard were not so lucky taking 6 casualties from a lot of 'For the Greater Good' overwatch. They still killed a strike team though. Then things went wrong for the Vanguard Vets... the Stormsurge and some fire warriors leaving the Captain feeling very lonely and the newly arrived Crisis Suits doing the same to the Chaplain. Longstrike and his hammerhead buddy also shot down two of the land speeders. A very good counter-punch from the Tau! The stormsurge had to go, so the Devastators and last landspeeder opened up on it, reducing it to 5 wounds. Then the Captain, fully expecting to be obliterated by the overwatch charged it... and made it in with 2 wounds left. And smacked it down with two Thunder Hammer hits The Chaplain was useful in harrassing the hammerhead and some pathfinders by charging in and making them relocate, which he continued to do until the final turn when he was finally shot down. The Sternguard jumped out of their Rhino and took out 4 Crisis Suits with their meltas. Things were looking ok for the Ravens, but the Tau firepower started to show in turns 3 & 4 - The captain was shot down by Fire Warriors, who also repulsed an attack from the tacticals (the last one killed by the Ethereal in assault!) who had finally caught up. Longstrike and the last Crisis suits took out the Sternguard, Land Speeder, Chaplain and even started attacking some sniper scouts. All in all, a close and fun game, which resulted in a minor victory for the Tau, who only had Longstrike, 2 Crisis Suits, a few pathfinders, 3 Fire Warriors and the Ethereal left. The Ravens only had the Devastators, one squad of scouts and two rhinos who were merrily charging into the remaining pathfinders repeatedly! So far, Strike from the Shadows seems a decent (if very risky) tactic for Vanguard Vets, especially against an army like Tau with effective overwatch. Shadow Masters didn't really have any effect this game since most of the fire fights were within 12"... On to the next game...