The Cult of the Bolter and Chainaxe

[GuyKeefer]

Hey everybody. This will be my first real post here in the Chaos foums, as I mainly just peruse Amicus and the Modeling forums. But since being involved in the current Arena of Death, I've decided it's time to get into the Chaos side of things. First of all, I'd like to give you guys some background on what I am about to describe to you: The Cult of the Bolter and Chainaxe!

When AoD Anitoc began, I originally slotted to be on the Loyalist side of the battle, but when the concern arose that Chaos was going to be at a disadvantage because of lack of players, I volunteered to switch over to the Chaos side. After trying to promote Chaos to gain votes in the upcoming polls, I noticed that the Loyalists were always talking about the Legio of the Bolter and Chainsword: Legio this, Legio that, support the Legio in the AoD! I realized than that Chaos had no single entity to rally behind, so I created the battlecry of "Support the Cult of the Bolter and Chainaxe!" as a joke. But after thinking for a little bit, I realized that Chaos players had no board organized group, such as the Legio for the Loyalists. I also realized that after the first few polls of the AoD, the was very little support for the Chaos side of the board. So I began thinking...

I thought, "Why doesn't Chaos have a board supported group like the Legio? The Loyalists' already have a lot of support period, why shouldn't we have a group to band together with?" So I thought about it a little bit, and began to read up on the Legio and what they were all about. I discovered that part of the Legio had actually been taken into Chaos by a Radical Inquisitor early in their history. So I took that plot hook and ran with it. I decided that I would create some sort of Chaotic arch-nemesis to the Legio, and the Cult of the Bolter and Chainaxe (CBC) was the solution.

While the CBC is Chaos related, I have left it opened ended enough to provide unlimited modeling and gamplaying ideas. I've tried to make it simple enough for anyone to participate in created a model, because I'm not a good painter, and I know that making a color scheme that was hard to paint would turn off a lot of people. But, I also wanted the CBC to be easily distinguishable from the Legio, so choosing colors was very hard as you will see later on in this post.

So without further adu, I present to you the groundwork for Codex: Cult of the Bolter and Chainaxe!

Background of the CBC

The Cult of the Bolter and Chainaxe is a group of disenfranchised renegade Space Marines made up of mainly two groups:

A. Renegade Space Marines such as Red Corsairs, Soul Drinkers, and other Marines who have been disenchanted by the way the Imperium is run and the idiotic, backward things they are forced to do. IE: Destroying half of their Chapter just for some =I= interest that has nothing to do with anything, the constant put-down of the ordinary man of the Imperium, and the insult of being governed by the Highlords of Terra and not the true Emperor, etc.

B. Chaos Space Marines how have realized that Chaos is not the true way and have given up their life as complete worshippers of the Chaos Gods and have been thrown out of Chaos. They realize that Chaos must be used against Chaos to truely save the Imperium. But, while they are not full-fledged cultists of the Gods anymore, some still do worship their Gods, but more in the sense of how modern day religions work. They may still retain their gifts of their old masters and perhaps keep some of the same attributes of their former life (such as Berzerkers), they are much more "normal" now.

Shortly after the 13th Black Crusade, where the Legio B&C destroyed the majority of the "traitor" Legionaires, there was a great feeling of dissent within the Chaos ranks. This was the 13th crusade into the Imperium, and yet they still had not truely won anything. They may have buckled the gate into the Imperium, but at what cost? Many of the former members of the Chaos crusade began doubting their allegiance to Chaos for many different reasons: why should they die for masters that did not truely care if they lived or died? Why should they fight for a cause that will probably kill them all before it is realized? A small contingent of these dissenters, including several of the remaining traitor Legio B&C marines, met at a remote planet named Gorgene, located just outside of the Eye of Terror.

There, these "traitor" Marines had a meeting betwen them, discussing their doubts and beliefs. A general consensus was reached, with an agreement that they must leave the folds of Chaos or be destroyed in it's futile and worthless quest. But what would they do? Not only would they be traitors to Chaos, they were already traitors in the Imperium's eyes, with no way to be accepted back into that society. A slow realization surfaced in the small group, they were leaving Chaos for the very same reasons they had left the Imperium. They realized that the Gods of Chaos and the true rulers of the Imperium, the Highlords of Terra, did not care what happened to them and used their lives as currency to purchase worthless items to further their greed for the Universe.

Some of this group of collaborators mentioned that they had come from groups such as the Red Corsairs, groups of Space Marines who had realized the follys of following the demented rule of both the Imperium and Chaos, and had forged their own destinys, living by their own rules. It was slowly agreed that these rogue groups were the only ones that would except them as brothers, having the commanility of being disenfranchised by both of their old masters.

So it was decided that this ad-hoc group of ex-Chaos Marines would set out in search of these groups of renegade Astartes, hopefully being able to forge a bound with them, to create their own "Chapter" for their own purposes. They took what few ships they had and set off into Imperial controlled space to find these renegade Marines. At this point in time, this hodge-podge group consisted of around 500 Chaos Astartes from all beliefs: violent Khorne Berzerkers stood beside pleasure-seeking Slanneshi Marines, Plague Bearers of Nurgle called Sorcerers of Tzeentch brothers. They had all discovered a common bond that linked them together beyond their differences in worship and had once again found the will to call their fellow traitor Astartes "brother."

The search for the renegade Marines lead the traitors into the early part of M42. Along the way they had been harried by both Imperial and Chaos forces, thinning their numbers, but never defeating the determined group. Finally, in 21M42, the traitors finally discovered an outpost of renegade Astartes near El'Phanor in the Segmentum Obscuris. The traitor Astartes convened together aboard the strike cruiser Encirclement. There, the remaining leaders of the band debated the best way to contact the renegades without inciting a battle. After lengthy talks, it was decided that there would be one representative from each of the "companies" that had formed during there long quest. With only 346 marines split into 3 companies, 3 commanders would teleport to the surface and present their request for asylum: Captain Rogan, a former Blood Angel who had worshipped Khorne, Captain Lukan, formerly of the Alpha Legion, and Captain Emanuel, one of the surviving traitors of the Legio Bolter and Chainsword, were the ones chosen.

Upon teleporting to the surface, the trio of Captains began their search for the renegade base. While they had tracked one of their ships to the planet, their renegade's base was cleverly hidden somewhere on the surface. After scouring the main continent of the planet for several days, they were finally ambushed by several of the renegade Astartes. During the ensuing battle, the Captains managed to incapacitate their attackers, only knocking them unconscious when they could have easily killed them. But the leader of this attack had remained hidden during the attack, watching how the traitor Marines reacted. After all his men had been defeated, this man decided to reveal himself to the trio. This was Brother Hemadri, formerly of the Ultramarines. Declaring himself to the traitors, he asked why they had not killed his men. Captain Emanuel responded by telling him that they were only looking for asylum with the renegades on this planet and had no reason to kill them. This stunned the former Ultramarine. Why would these worshippers of Chaos, one of whom looked to be a berzerker, act as they did? Knowing he was out numbered and would never win the fight, Hemadri considered his options. His conclusion was to take these traitors to his leader, both to find out why they were really here and to put to give his band of renegades the advantage in numbers.

The renegade's base was cleverly concealed underground around a group of active volcanoes. This allowed them to easily coneal their base of operations from prying eyes and to easily power their base with the thermal energies of the planet. As Brother Hemadri led the three traitor Captains through the base to the meeting room, curious eyes glared out of doorways, posing the question of why the taint of Chaos was being brought into their home. They may have been renegades, but they wanted nothing to do with Chaos. The unease caused by the blasphemed armor of the Captains of Chaos was easily felt in the air. At long last, the representatives of the traitor Chaos Marines arrived at the meeting room. There they were met by the leader of the band of renegades, Ulgoth, former Brother Sergeant of the Space Wolves.

Tensions were high as the fomer Space Wolf demanded to know why these traitors had decided to "grace" his home with their tainted bodies. Captain Rogan, his Khornate temper flaring, stepped towards Ulgoth, threatening to kill the renegade for the insult that he had thrown. Lukan also stepped forward, agreeing that the insult was uncalled for. Seeing the tensions rising and the outcome of a successful alliance slipping from their hands, Captian Emanuel quickly stepped between the two groups and called for them to be quiet. Having extinguished the hate that hate been quickly brewing, Emanuel simply explained why they were there and what they were seeking. The story of the journey, they hardships they had faced, and the battle they had faced when first arriving on the planet gave Ulgoth a lot to think about. Could these men be trusted? They were not only traitors, but doubly so; they had betrayed all of their former masters.

Ulgoth decided that he would need sometime to think over the request of the trio of Captains, but offered them the chance to offload their troops to the planet to give them a chance to free themselves from their ships, even if that time might be short. Over the next three days, the traitor Marines were transported down to the planet's surface where they spent their time mingling with the rengegade Marines of the planet. There were even some long-lost battle brothers who were reunited on the planet. Bonds were created between traitor and renegade, fostering an atmosphere of brotherhood and peace between the two groups.

At the end of these three days, a decision was reached. The leader of the renegades, Ulgoth, and the three Captains of the traitors, each shook hands to cement the new bond between them. From that day forward, the two outcast groups would be bonded together not as a band of warriors as the renegades were, nor as a group of outcasts as the traitors were, but as a new Chapter of marines.

Even as the celebrations at the birth of the this "bastard" Chapter, reformations were happening. With the combined forces of the the renegades and the traitors, the Chapter numbered over 800 marines. While feuds over who would become the Captains of the 10 companies were expected to create schisms within the new group, barely an argument ensued. Captains Rogan, Lukan, and Emanuel, as well as Ulgoth and Brother Emanuel, were elected as Captains of 5 of the new companies, with Captain Rogan leading the traditional veteran 1st Company.

But as the two groups worked together to form one, numerous questions arouse. What would they do? How the ideals of Chaos interact with those of the renegades? And what would this new Chapter be called? These questions were not answered until 50M42. During those 29 years, the Chapter expanded it's numbers, increasing from roughly 800 Marines to nearly 1400, incorperating other renegades and traitors who had the same ideals. The Chapter had also had great discussions of what they would, as being mere pirates was not what any Astartes was created to do. As the time past, the commanalities between the groups revealed the same reason for leaving the Imperium: the unjust rule of the Highlords of Terra, the idiocy of wasting their lives for nothing, and the destruction of what truely made up the Imperium, the ordinary men and women that they were created to defend.

These common ideas were taken together and used to create an ethos, titled the Ethos Adeptus. The Etho Adpetus stated that the protection of the common citizen was the most important objective of the chapter. No longer would they aid either Chaos nor the Imperium in opressing the citizens of the Imperium into believing in some assanine religion, nor would they aid the forces of either side in the oppression of the common man. Their new objective was to eliminate the corrupt forces of the universe that oppressed man and allow them to live life as they saw fit: worship whoever they want, how they want, and live their lives how they want, not how the government wants.

But how could the former Chaos Marines and former Loyalist Marines hope to complete this goal? It was already self evident that Chaos could not defeat the Imperium, nor vice versa. Once again, Captain Emanuel stepped forward, offering a solution. He spoke of how the Inquisitor who lead them to Chaos told him of how they could use Chaos to defeat itself. But while he suggested this course of action, Emanuel also stated that giving yourself to Chaos would only lead to the corruption and perversion of what they hoped to attain. He suggested an alternative. While allowing the worship of whatever God a Marine chose, whilst that maybe any of the Chaos Gods or even the God Emperor, they must remain objective and only give their faith to the Gods, not their whole selves. For if anyone gave their whole soul to any God, they would be overwhelmed and enveloped by their beliefs.

This revolation led to the creation of distinct religions within the Chapter. While a marine may worship the God Emperor, Khorne, Tzeentch, or any other God, they would not fully devot their body and souls. This allowed religious freedom between the Marines and also prevented major mutations within the Chapter. While minor mutations such as heightened agression from worshipping Khorne, increased toughness from believing in Nurgle, or the lack of fear brought from worshipping the God Emperor, there is no history of the major mutation or daemonic possession related to the full devotion to one God. It also allowed the peaceful co-existence of historically opposed groups such as the worshippers of Tzeentch and the worshippers of Nurgle.

But the Chapter did not have name or symbol. How would it represent itself within history and to it's enemies without a name? Once again, Captain Emanuel stepped forward and offered his advice. His former Chapter, the Legio Bolter and Chainsword, was created to keep the Adpetus Astartes loyal to the Imperium. If they could sway the Space Marines loyal to the Emperor, show them the error of their ways, they could free the Imperium from the yoke of oppresion the Highlords of Terra currently used to abuse their loyal citizens. And once the people of the Imperium were united, Chaos could finally be put to an end. So why not begin the war by creating a rival chapter to the Legio? For the Legio was the only thing holding the Imperium together by keeping the Adeptus Astartes loyal to itself and to the Imperium. Captain Emanuel suggested a name combined the beliefs of both the renegades and the traitors. He agreed that they could no longer be recognized as "Legion," and were actually a new cult, albeit a non-Chaos one. Therefore, Emanuel came to the conlusion that they should be called the Cult of the Bolter and Chainaxe. This would not only represent their begininnings and beliefs, but also show their contempt for the corrupt Imperial machine. Their new objective? First, free the Imperium from the corrupt Highlords of Terra and return the rule of the Imperium to the Emperor and his citizens. Second, to remove Chaos from the Universe, thereby allowing the Imperium live without the constant fear of being destroyed from the inside out. And lastly, to rid the Universe of the xenos whose only purpose is to corrupt and destory. No alien could be allowed to live, lest they begin to corrupt the citizens of the Imperium and use them to further their evil ways.

The Colors of the CBC

The Cult of the Bolter and Chainaxe faced a huge problem when trying to organize itself into a coherent unit. It had Marines of innumberable Chapters and numerous faiths; how could they possibly create an organized uniform while allowing the freedom of the individual Marine to show what he belived in and wher he had come from? Captain Rogan of the 1st Company standardized the Chapter's uniform in early 51M42. Here is an excerpt from the regulation that he passd.

Every marine's armor will be painted a dark blue. This is to include the leggings, chest piece, arms, and gauntlets of the power armor. The helmet will painted gray to symbolize the mixing of all of our beliefs. The backpack power plant will be painted dark blue, with the exhaust vents painted gray.

The right pauldron's color will correspond with the Marine's Chapter of origin. If he does not desire to show the heraldry of his original Chapter, he may display his God's symbol on the right pauldron. If the Marine declines to show either, the right pauldron will painted the same dark blue as the rest of the armor.

The left pauldron will show the Marine's allegiance to the Cult. The symbol of the Cult of the Bolter and Chainaxe is a black line bisecting an X, with a black circle on both sides of the line. While this may present a problem to those Marine's who elect to show both their Chapter of origin on their right pauldron and their God of worship on the left pauldron, do not be discouraged. If this problem arises, the symbol of the Cult will be painted over whatever is on the left pauldron.

All weapon casings will be painted a deep red to represent the blood of the Imperium that has been spilt for the whims of the Gods and the Highlords of Terra. This will always remind us of our objective: freeing the citizens of the Imperium from the yoke of oppression, both from the forces of the Imperium and those of Chaos.

Homeworld

While the CBC was created and primarily based on a planet near El'Phanor, no one has been able to determine where exactly the Cult's home base is. Numerous Inquisitors and detatchments of Adpetus Astartes have been sent to locate where the Cult's headquarters is, none have been heard back from. There have been numerous reports of uprisings on planets near El'Phanor and Cadian System, there has been no extablished pattern to the revolts.

Combat Doctrine

The Cult is made up of all types of Marines, from the ultra-violent followers of Khorne to the doctrine-followers of the Ultramarines. Therefore, while small assault groups of 5 to 15 Marines may be made up of Marines with the same beliefs, the Companies of the CBC combine Marines of all Faiths. Normally, a Marine is placed in a squad depending on what his beliefs and specialities are. For example, believers of Khorne are normally assigned to assault squads, former Blood Ravens used as forward scouts, and Tzeetchian Sorcerers being used as company Librarians. The focus of the Cult is not on making every Marine a "jack-of-all-trades," but to help him find the niche in the squad he could best server. For example, this avoids the trouble of forcing a Khornate beliver into working within a heavy-weapons squad.

Also of importance, the Cult avoids the wanton culling of the enemy. While it is normally unavoidable to destroy most adversaries, the Cult makes a concerted effort to help other Astartes, Imperial Guard soldiers, those held by Chaos, and even the ordinary citizens of the Imperium realize that the Cult is not evil, that they are only trying to bring the Imperium back to what is what meant to be: a haven for all those human, of any belief, to give them a good life without the worry of the corruption of Chaos or the false ideals of the Highlords of Terra. Therefore, the Cult does not kill it's enemies even if they surrender. Taking prisorners of war is common within the Cult, and re-education is common within the POW camps maintained by the CBC. While this does cause many prisoners to realize the error of their ways, some captives never convert. None-the-less, the culling of helpless prisoners is never condoned within the Cult. A person may believe what they want, even if it is the wrong belief. But if they do not realize that they are wrong and correct their ways, their are only condemning themselves to a life of hardship.

Recruitment and Service Within the Cult

While the majority of Marines are recruited through the merging of newfound renegade or traitor groups and converted POWs, there is also the recruitment of new Marines from the local populace of liberated planets. While it is true that the CBC does not have a standard geneseed to use in new recruits, this does not prevent the creation of new Marines for the Cult. While the recrtuiting practice is much the same as the disillusioned Loyalist Chapters, the age requirement is much broader within the Cult. This is due to the fact that several Apothecarians within the Cult are knowledgeable in the ways that traitor Chapters use in creating new Astartes. Potential recruits for the CBC can range anywhere between 8 to 30 Standard Years of age. This allows the Cult the ability to easily make up for it's casualties in battle, though the maxumum number of Marines has never reached more than around 1800 at any one time.

The majority of Marines within the Cult are armed with the standard bolter and chainaxe, with training primarily focusing on the use of these weapons in both long range combat and close range hand-to-hand fighting. What other weaponry the Cult utilizes has been acquired thourgh either theft or taken from the dead of their enemies. While the First Company does have several squads fully suited in Tactical Dreadnought Armor, the remainder of the companies reserve the precious suits of armor for squad leaders and other officers.

While the Codex Astartes reserves several of the companies to be specifically filled with reserved assault, scout, and heavy weapon squads, the Cult has never followed this practice. What heavy weapons, jump packs, and rare scout troops are distributed between the ten main companies. This allows each company to operate indepently, allowing it to operate indepently. This gives the CBC to operate in several theatres of war without having to support each main battle company with reserve companies. Each company is expected to maintain it's Table of Organization and Equipment (TO&E) through independent recruiting.

This indepent recruiting is realized by each Company selecting new recruits through a pool of "newbies". This pool is the sum of the groups incorporated into the Cult and those new recruits created through the use of geneseed. Each Company takes a turn "drafting" it's new members, much like we do in modern sports. Depending on what the Company needs at that time, they choose who would be the most valuable addition by comparing their skills, age, and abilities. This allows each Company to maintain their tailor their troops to what they need at the time.

Organization

The Cult of the Bolter and Chainaxe follows the basic organization put forth by the Codex Astartes, but allows each Company to tailor itself to it's own strengths. Therfore, some Companies stirctly follow the Codex, allowing only around 100 Marines in the Company and organizing it into 10 man squads. Still, other companie diverge from this standard, allowing it's squads to be anywhere between 3 and 20 Marines strong. This organization boils down to the Company Commander's preference, as the Cult allows itself to be flexible enough to meet any situation as it arises.

Battlecry

While the Cult of the Bolter and Chainaxe does not have a standard battlecry, it is not unexpected to hear Marines scream "For our Gods and the people!" as the charge into battle.

-----------------------------------------

Well, I hope that I have picqued everybody's interest with this quick write up... well, it took me over 4 and half hours to write up, but you know what I mean. Criticism, responses, questions, etc. are gladly encouraged. And I do hope that at least everyone enjoys reading what I've spawned here.

Also, any grammatical and spelling errors pointed out would be great. A daemonette known only as "St. Pauli Girl" has been keeping me company all night. :P

-GuyKeefer

EDIT

31 January 2007

Fixed the spelling error that Yogi found and fixed some other grammatical errors.

Inserted the color scheme example Yogi created, with just a slight modification.

1 February 2007

Inserted an example picture of the use of the CBC's symbol.

20 February 2007

Inserted the IA illustration that Scally created for the CBC.

[Renik]

i like it you did well with it does mean my guys gota repaint his bolter but oh well was some gd work i think.

[Yogi]

In the last line of Combat doctrine, you've spelt hardship hardhip.

 

Thats the only mistake that I noticed.

 

This is very cool, I like what you've done with the simple idea, this has really grown into a monster!

 

I'll come back and comment on this more later. Nice work!

 

xXEditXx

 

Ok so I went to the interactive painter and this is the best I could do.. we should try and get that Scally guy onside, he does awesome IA marines.. Keefer maybe you could pu thte request inot him, cause I've already put one i previously.. heres the thread http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.p...101409&st=0

 

Anyways here's what I did.. it's not pretty but it gives the general idea..

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v690/kilianjay/bc.jpg

[GuyKeefer]

In the last line of Combat doctrine, you've spelt hardship hardhip.

 

Thats the only mistake that I noticed.

 

This is very cool, I like what you've done with the simple idea, this has really grown into a monster!

 

I'll come back and comment on this more later. Nice work!

 

xXEditXx

 

Ok so I went to the interactive painter and this is the best I could do.. we should try and get that Scally guy onside, he does awesome IA marines.. Keefer maybe you could pu thte request inot him, cause I've already put one i previously.. heres the thread http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.p...101409&st=0

 

Yogi-

Thanks for the reply. I put your example in my first post. I changed the location of the dots on the chapter symbol to correspond to what was written in the IA.

 

As far as contacting Scally, I'm glad you brought that up. I had not even noticed that thread. I will definately ask him very nicely (revs chainaxe) to do one up for us.

 

Thanks again for the comments.

 

Renik-

Thank you very much for kind comment. I appreciate that you took the time to read that huge article (it's around 9 pages in Word). I'm sorry about the bolter mishap, and hopefully it won't be too much work to fix. You can also just slather the red on there like it was painted on in a hurry.

 

-GuyKeefer

[Renik]

its fine still has been nice break from painting masses of red for my blood angels

[GuyKeefer]

Hey guys. Kind of surprised there isn't more enthuism about my idea... so therefore I took some of the fluff that I created earlier, fixed some grammatical errors, and have put it here for people to read. Hopefully this will inspire some people to take up the idea.

 

Now, before I explain what this short story is about, I just wanted to take a moment to speak. I would really love to see enough people to become interested in this idea and contribute to it, whether through building a model, making fluff to be added into the ever growing history of this Cult, or even just to leave criticism, good or bad, about the ideas here. My ultimate goal and initial vision for the creation of the Cult was to make a "sister" group to the Legio B&C so that the Chaos lovers here on the board could have something that would draw us all together. The Legio has numerous tie-ins in what goes on at the B&C: they are specifically featured in the AoDs, they have sponsored painting competitions, and every on the board is encouraged to participate in the Legio's doings. But what if you don't enjoy making Loyalist models? What if you prefer writing stories or drawing pictures of Chaos related things? There is no niche for that here, leading to a less cohesive bond between the Chaos members of this board. So, in my crazy mind, I figured that this would be a great idea and that hopefully it would be seen that way by the members of the board. And without support from you guys, the CBC is nothing more than a DIY chapter that is going to dissapear somewhere on my harddrive. I would love ultimately to bring up the question of the B&C "sponsoring" the Cult, but I will not waste the time and energy of the board admins without knowing that it is a well thought of idea and some people actually think so. But, I would be happy enough to just see it stickied here in the Chaos forums and used as a theme to inspire wrting, drawing, and modeling competitions here... anyway, that's enough ranting from me.

 

This short story was originally going to be the history of the CBC, but once I finished these two excerpts, I ran into a dead end. Nevertheless, I do believe that it is a great way of explaining how it is tied into the Legio. This is something like a first draft, so there will be errors in there, so please forgive me. I did enjoy writing about how the schism of the Legio B&C began. I purposefully left the Inquisitor unnamed, as there is no record of one in the Legio's history. And you also may notice that a certain someone in this story plays a pivotal role in the Cult later on.

 

And now, witout furth ado, here is:

 

The Beginnings of the Cult of the Bolter and Chainaxe

 

Mid M44

 

As Chaplain Augustus marched into the meeting hall, all the men inside quickly stood at attention. A tense silence rang within the hall as Augustus

[Kaewt]

Guy..great posts, and good reads =p I'm currently knee deep in modeling a squad for my BL, but when I get them together I'll throw a marine or 5 together. As for lack of enthusiasim, all I can say is keep it up! If you need anything feel free to shoot me a pm, and I'll see if I can help.

[Mr. Harlequin Crow]

Any of you guys got a badge 'n banner for Dawn of War? That would rawk! :rolleyes:

[the_unforgiven]

Love the idea thank the ruinous powers i own night lords . also a huge amount of spare marines and a force commander set unopened :wub: . Ill will contribute loads of squads but I have a question what do we paint the trim ? grey ? and can the grey be substituted for silver ? I love the fluff i was actually thinking along those lines but inquistors instead of the marines. good job either way.

 

"Fear the night"

-The unforgiven

[GuyKeefer]

Love the idea thank the ruinous powers i own night lords . also a huge amount of spare marines and a force commander set unopened :P . Ill will contribute loads of squads but I have a question what do we paint the trim ? grey ? and can the grey be substituted for silver ? I love the fluff i was actually thinking along those lines but inquistors instead of the marines. good job either way.

 

"Fear the night"

-The unforgiven

 

the_unforgiven,

 

First off, thanks for the compliments. I really appreciate it.

 

Now, regarding your question about the shoulder pads, let me give you a link to my test mini.

Test Mini

 

There are three different ways the shoulderpads could work. The only consistency between them will be that the CBC's symbol will be located on the left shoulder.

 

1. Marine shows no other allegiances. This means that his right shouldpad will be bare and left will have the CBC's symbol painted onto it. Both shoulders will be painted in the colors of the Cult, which consist of the trim being grey and the main pad being blue.

 

2. Marine is a renegade from either a chapter or a Chaos worshipping marine. In this case, the marine will still have the left pad painted in the Cult's colors with it's symbol, but the right will be painted in the original colors of whatever chapter or God he used to belong to. For example, an ex-Blood Angel would have his right shoulderpad painted red and black with the blood drop symbol and have his left pad painted like in example 1. The same thing would go for an ex-traitor.

 

3. Marine is both a renegade/traitor and worships a Chaos God. In this case, the Marines chapter affiliation and God's symbol will go on the right and left shoulders. It doesn't matter which goes where. In my example, even though you cannot see his right side, there is a Blood Angel's symbol there, painted red and gold for that chapter, and his left side has the symbol of his God, Khorne, painted in the colors of that God, which happen to also be red and gold. This left the question of where the CBC's symbol would go. I decided to pull an idea from the Red Corsairs. If the Marine falls under this option, the Cult's symbol will be painted over whatever is on the left shoulderpad.

 

 

I hope that I've helped answer your question. As for the question about substituting silver for the grey, I would prefer to try and stay inside one standard color scheme for right now. I've tried to provide a little space for creative minds with the shoulderpads, but just like the Legio has all it's members the same standard scheme, that is how I would like the Cult to be. That way, you could take two minis from anyone, stand them together, and have someone realize they are from the same group.

 

-GuyKeefer

[Tubal]

I'd like to make it clear that I'm positive about the overall concept, and if this post sounds negative it's because I think it could be done differently ;)

 

I think the idea has a lot of potential, and the board needs something to support the chaos players as well as the loyalists, but there are a few problems as I see it:

The biggest problem for me is the rigid colour-scheme. Many players choose chaos primarily because of it's endless possibilities. Everytime I talk to someone who is about to start a new chaos army they inevitably mention something they want to do to make it their chaos army. You don't get that as much with loyalists, I mean there's only so much you can do with the Ultramarines 2nd Company without straying outside the lines and, ironically, branding yourself as a heretic in the process. ;)

Forcing players into adopting a (relatively) rigid look goes against that IMO important point and makes the concept less interesting for me, especially considering I might make a model eventually. At the same time I understand the importance of a group identity.

In the earlier topic I suggested using cloth items, such as tabards and robes, and it's something I still think is a good idea. It could be combined with the apparent freedom of the organisation itself and be dependant on the individual's tastes as well as the commanders. It could also depend on the nature of their mission, eg. no robes when on a search-and-destroy mission against Eldar, but covered up when dealing with allied loyalist guard troops. A squad led by a former Ultramarine might choose to paint their armour completely to "cult code" and look as uniform as any loyalist unit, but one led by a Word Bearer sorcerer and consisting of ex-legionaires could, and should IMO, look very different. They would still share the blue and grey, just on different parts.

Marines raised directly by the cult would obviously be more inclined to wear the uniform as well, so would likely paint their armour to code.

 

Secondly: the symbol.

It's not terrible, but it's kind of cryptic. What does it mean? Could it be improved?

It also doesn't have to be the only symbol they use; just as the loyalists have the aquila and a chapter symbol the cult could have a few different symbols and variants, more complicated versions for banners etc. Maybe the above symbol is the symbol of their conviction, that there is more to faith than extremism. I'll ponder it some more tomorrow...

At least it's easy to paint ;)

 

The fluff is ok, but could use some work. Firstly I think they are too nice! This is the grim and dark future! Rogue Trader says it better than me so I'll just borrow a quote:

Don’t claim your marines are “nice”.

They aren’t. Marines are bio-engineered killing machines. Fair enough, chapters like the Salamanders may have a humanitarian streak, but they doesn’t make them cuddly and nice. They still chant Catechisms of Hate as they go into battle, and they will still kill anyone or anything that opposes the Emperor’s will. There is a big difference between helping out distressed refugees (for example) when there’s no fighting to be done and choosing to ignore the approaching tide of Greenskins in favour of picking up a little girl’s teddy bear out of the mud. The Imperium is a harsh place, and nice people don’t live long.

 

On the same note, a Chapter of 1000 Marines doesn’t become ambassadors or negotiate, they don’t form alliances with Xenos species. They kill them. End of story.

My point is that the marines in the story are depicted as much to tolerant, understanding and enlightened, and it doesn't quite mesh with the 40k I have in my head. How do you subdue a marine without killing him anyway?... ;)

 

Also, the cult is too big! A force of 1400 marines would be a very significant threat, it would be too hard to stay hidden (as they'd have to) and as rare as marines are where did they find them all? I suggest that the core force is no larger than a couple of companies, maybe half a chapter, but there could be other groups of renegades (and even loyalists) that sympathise with them.

 

 

Any other whines I have is mostly minor so I'll leave that for later ;)

 

Kudos to GuyKeefer for putting in the work :tu:

[Tabor]

The Problems i currently have with the cult are these

 

1) i agree with tubal, the colour scheme is too rigid and is preventing me from painting up some minis, because

 

-i don't have all the colours

-i don't (no offence) particularly like the colourscheme

 

i like the idea that the chapter will keep its main uniform put have on a shoulder guard/knee pad/tabard something wich marks it as part of the CBC. maybe the above colour scheme could represent the 'inner circle' (or HQ) of the CBC, who try to organise everything, who maintain connections between the various armies, who command from afar, and who tie togethor the disparate forces who are the fighting arms of the CBC

 

2) At the start of this thread you mentioned that chaos needed it's own banner to rally behind in the AOD, yet this, to me, doesn't feel like chaos. i play chaos because i like the idea of burning down the holy palace and drowning the false emperor in the blood of the astartes. stuff like that. i appreciate the effort you've put in, the fluff is good for the most part and i can see that you really want to make this happen. but.

 

You've mentioned that the cult is free from major daemonic mutations and possession, i get the impression daemons aren't common either, and those who worship chaos do it in such a way as to remain unmarked. in fact (this may be harsh) you seem to suggest that everything that makes chaos... well, chaos, is gone.

 

I respect that you've attempted to do possibly the most difficult thing in the Wh40k universe - bring order to chaos. but i think you're trying to do this the wrong way, in effect you're pushing the square peg into the round hole. chaos is a very broad church, and to get everyone to cooperate would be impossible.

 

sorry for being such a pain in the @$$, but thats just my opinion

[Iron Faction]

Ok dude i like the direction that you are going with because my army is based on the chaos gods sucking and have decided to leave the Iron Warriors and create their own chapter known as the Children of Suffering who are pretty much outcasts. but what you did could never happen #1 anyone who pledges alligance to Khorne wouldnt take an insult from a living being without someone dying let alone sitting down and declaring peace between him and a space marine. im telling you someone in that room would die!!! #2 there is no way all the chaos powers would join together in brotherhood unless an unbelievable power was leading them in to battle such as Abbadon( in the codex it even states that he is the only one who can join the ruinious powers together except for mabye Horus). Plus i dont believe they could just give up their colors that easily especially Plague Marines, most chaos marines armor is warped and mutated. now how the hell do you paint over that. also im going to have to agree with everyone else the paint scheme being meh. now what you should do is make the colors a light grey, close to a winter scheme and have blood smered across the armor to represent the pointless blood shed between the brothers for all those years of fighting for corupt leaders and blood thirsty Gods :tu: . but i do agree with the marks of their gods and history. HEY AND DIDNT U SAY THAT SOME LONG LOST BROTHERS REUNITED ON THAT PLANET, NOW HOW THE HELL DOES THAT WORK, CHAOS MARINES HAVE BEEN AROUND FOR THOUSANDS OF YEARS, LOYALTISTS ARE LUCKY TO LIVE TO THE AGE OF 250. but getting back to the point i like what you are doing and i hope u keep it up. and i hope u took no offense to what i said. and may your enemys flesh be torn from their screaming loyaltists bodies!!!

[Yogi]

This is the problem with chaos.. they don't like authority.. People who play them dont like authority. All chiefs and no indians.. :tu: -- (I am Gulity too)

 

I really dislike the cloth thing.. I dont really know why.

 

I can think up a bunch of stuff that sounds cool, and is chaosy.. but its been done before. You have the Corsairs, The original traitors and you have renegades. All of them are megalomaniacs with psychotic tendencies. None of them tolerate anything, thats why they are all commanding small numbers of minions.

 

Anyone who commands alot of Chaos warriors created them or they all have a similar narrow background. (Abadabbadoon has legion politics)

 

This cult has evolved from not being Imperium and to not being chaos -- so it has no allegiance, it behaves like neither..

 

If you want really chaos you have one leader and his slaves.. Yes slaves.

 

Have an example:

 

- The Cult of EVERKILL

 

Led by Angry - BnC marine - lets call him Draccus Khaine EverKill

 

Angry leader has a fleet of warships. Plus a home base in a warp anomaly (pick you fav here)

 

Angry leader recruits anyone to increase his power. Angry leader has enforcers to ensure his word is law.. Offenders are slain - plus some system of keeping the mob with you like = the law breakers squad leader is killed as well as the offending marine..

 

All members have sworn an oath to Everkill (and are desercrated in the process). EverKill makes them paint a big K on their armor to represent this oath to Him and Killing.

 

Angry leader hates Bnc and makes effort to go to war with them .. (He is a classic villain unforgiving and unsuccessful)

 

Angry leader fails often.. Cause you will never defeat the BnC.. it just wont happen.

 

Now you have a chaosy organization. The leader is Everkill you are his slave.. do what he says.

 

If you like this I will be Everkill and you will be my slave.

 

Pledge your allegiance in my thread Minion!

[GuyKeefer]

Wow, a lot of stuff to read through. And just so you guys know, you're not bastards for posting up you're opinions. :D I'm happy just seeing some people finally throw in their two cents. I don't have time to address all the stuff that's come up in the most recent posts, but I would like to address one issue, namely the color scheme/rigidity issue.

 

1. Yes, the scheme might seem blah or meh and very simple to paint. Well, I think it looks very nice, especially if you incorporate different colored shoulderpads on the model. The deep red of the weapon's casings and the grey of the helmet and backpack works pretty well at breaking up the blue, IMHO. But, I chose the scheme more because it's simple and easy to paint. I'm a horrible painter, as you can see in the CBC WIP thread. And since my idea was to "mainstream" the whole thing, why should the paint scheme require you to be a moderate to great painter? Just be thankful it's not ultramarine blue. ;)

 

2. The whole idea of Chaos players not liking having a "rigid" moseling scheme. If you're going to make a Khorne army, what are you going to paint them? There's not a whole lot else to use except red and gold. And what kind of weapons are you going to give them? Probably bolt pistols and chainaxes. And what about those darn traitor legions? Oh my, they're all painted the same colors too. Hopefully Martha Stewart will convert to Chaos so that everyone can have a different painting scheme on their armor.

I understand everyone's point about rigidity not being Chaosy, but I've incorporated numerous ways to modify the model to be different. You can combine any number of bitz from Chaos and Loyalist boxed sets to create an almost infinite number of models. And while, yes, people who worship the Chaos Gods only do so in a very limited capacity, they might have been transformed already, so perfect loophole there to make slightly mutated models with perhaps a tentacle or horns?

 

3. Rigidity in the fluff... yes, I understand that the idea is far fetched, but most ideas in 40k are. Trying to create something individual and new is very hard. You've already got Pirate Marines with the Corsairs, and making up a Chaos God just didn't make a lot of sense to me. And I sat around and thought for a couple days about how to go about the originality problem. The best I came up with was what you've read in the IA. I'm sure there are a few continuity problems, but I believe that I've at least made the idea plausible sounding, no?

Other had problems cropped up to, mainly how to allow people to play with the Cult on the table and how to try and please the majority of Chaos players. With 5 Gods, Pirates, and with being able to use the Loyalist or Chaos Codex to represent anything in between, how could I possibly make the group open to everyone and still have a working army. Once again, both problems got solved in the IA with the combining of the Traitor-Traitors and the Renegades.

 

4. Almost forgot one thing... the robes issue. It's a good idea, but I don't like the robes. I've just never really liked the whole monk/crusades look on Marines, and that idea has already been taken by the Dark Angels.

 

Now, forgive my post, because I'm sure there was a little malice and ranting in it, but I'm honestly just trying to keep this idea afloat for right now. Obviously I'm probably going to need to go back to the drawing board and shelve this IA and create a new one soon, as the current one I've written doesn't really seem to be working for anyone. The only problem that I really see is the evidently, my idea is not Chaosy enough. I don't know I can make it more Chaosy beyond making it a strictly Chaos Codex using army and saying that they are just a renegade group running around blowing everything up. That's kind of boring and is the basic background of every Chaos army.

 

Anyway, I'll try and come back later to respond to the other issues raised recently. Once again, thanks for the critiques and most of all for just reading the thread.

 

-GuyKeefer

[Renik]

thought crossed my mind which might make people who are not happy with colour scheme more happy. Simply have that colour scheme for orginal members of the bolter and chainaxe. Then allow it so as members joing they adopt the colour scheme. So for example you have an iron warrior disatisfied with the grand company hes in join the bolter and chainaxe and to signify him joining he paints one of his shoulder pads in volter and chainaxe xolours and adopts the symbol on it as well. Then either have it the more your armour is in the colours of the bolter and chainaxe shows how long someone has been in the bolter and chainaxe.

[GuyKeefer]

Hey guys. Kind of took a brake from getting the CBC going, as it was getting a little too involved for me at the present time. But, I'm back and am ready once again to get back into the saddle.

I asked Scally a few weeks ago if he could make me one of his amazing IA illustrations for the CBC. It's come out very well. So, without further ado, here it is.

He also requested to see some pictures of some minis, so I'm going to put together a few more for him and to show some more examples of how easy it is to make whatever you want with this Chapter.

Thanks again for all the feedback everyone has been giving. Please keep giving suggestions.

-GuyKeefer

[brother heckengar]

Well brothers I say leave your armour the same colors as before, and place the cult making on the right side. W e need to know one another from the Legio, as we are killing them. I have a World Eaters to give to the cause, Brother Lithen, mark of Khorne, bolt pistol, Khornate chain axe, feel no pain, frag and some undivded if we need them. Are we going to have renegade guard with us?

[Ceres]

I personally think you are doing a great job! Keep up the good work!

 

 

(even if I'm a loyalist...)

[Excarnificator]

Great idea!

I’m a bit partial to Tubals reasoning though. Giving some room for individualism and anarchy is sort of in the nature of Chaos. So, in order to promote this and also to also follow the official B’n’C colour scheme of black, red and white, how about this suggestion:

The right arm is painted black with the fist crimson red. Then use the Chaos arrow shoulder pad with a black painted rim, white inset and red arrow symbol. Pretty easy to accomplish and if one wish one can extend this colour scheme to the whole figure. Or you could keep your legion/renegade colours and just paint the right arm in the colours of the bolter and the chainaxe! Of course minor conversion work using bolters and chainaxes is highly recommended.

/Cheers