Widowmaker Posted September 17, 2007 Author Share Posted September 17, 2007 @Storm Dragon - Hmmm.... interesting idea. Might have to run with that when painting. @Capt. Engelhardt - Definitely constructive, and I appreciate it cos it was kind of echoing the worries I had. I think also prefer the old - although I like this as a stand alone model. Who knows maybe I'll redo a DP, and use this as the base for an Inquisitor scale DW team? Anyway, this model looked to me like it was turning into just a big marine. My problem was, I think a lot of the chaos look of the old came from the fact the GW DP is so hunched over - the icons etc help, but I shaved that off on my DP - so I reckon the pose makes him look more menacing. Course, Artemis is much more upright (both figuratively and literally :) ) so it's harder to bring the same feel to it. I've added the trim arrows on one shoulder. The other I'm gonna turn the DA icon into a chaos star. I might also remove the DA icon from his leg (since I'm not happy with it) and add another arrow on there. Thanks for the comments - exactly what I was looking for. So I got a little more work done over the weekend - Not as much as I'd hoped, but it was just too nice out to stay in, so... See how this grabs you... http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010081.jpg Face http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010080.jpg Right side - you can just see the arrows on the shoulders http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010082.jpg With Detail - trying for bullet holes. Is it me or are they more like pustules? - I might add spikes into the gaps to make it less nurgle and more chaos. http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010084.jpg Legs http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010085.jpg Thats all for now. As always comments and criticisms are always welcome. As are suggestions as to how to improve him. Cheers Widowmaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artemis the hunter Posted September 18, 2007 Share Posted September 18, 2007 Great work so far, wish I could GS like that... My advice: The plastic looking DA icon on the leg isn't needed. You have an icon on the other leg (one which looks better than the other, IMO), so use that space for a chaos arrow like you mentioned. Spikes would definitely add a bit of chaos look coming out of those holes on the leg. Those lines of text on the arm scream "Inquisition" to me, so you might want to cover those up with more spikes or something. For the cape, add a little more texture to the bottom. Weathering on that can be added during painting in the form of dust and whatnot. Just my 2 credits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widowmaker Posted September 18, 2007 Author Share Posted September 18, 2007 @Artemis the Hunter - thanks for the comments - especially the compliment about the GS work. It's kind of a work in progress for me, and I'm amazed at how it's turning out. I've never done anything on this scale before (well, I have - but the results were the first version of the DP, and we know how well that turned out :D ). It turns out that patience, a thin layer of oil and some sculpting tools really ARE the key ;-) I like your suggestions about the modifications to make - i think I am going to remove that symbol - as you say, it's not nearly as good as the other. An arrow will be a good replacement I think. I will have to look at removing the text - I was thinking of covering them with Chain, but I'm not sure. Maybe a studded gauntlet? Thanks for the thoughts though. So todays questions.... 1. What the heck am I going to put in his second hand? I was thinking a crozius (which would fit well with his helm) but maybe some talons (I have lots of nid bitz floating about) 2. Should I give him a hood? I like the menacing feel it gave to the first guy, but i like the new helmet.... AAAAAHHHHHH!!!!!! Help me fraters, What should I do? :) Suggestions, comments, criticism, as always, will be appreciated Cheers Widowmaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StormDragon Posted September 18, 2007 Share Posted September 18, 2007 I think a studded gauntlet would be a good way of covering the text. It would also tie in with the chaos marine minis since they all seem to have full gauntlets. I'd like to see a mock up of the talons, I like the sound of them, but I can't envisage what they'd look like. :) Definitely no to the hood, I love the way the helmet is turning out, I think it would be a shame to cover it up. And I think the bullet holes on his leg could look quite good if they were painted up as if his daemonic essence were starting to corrupt his armour and burst out. If you paint it to look like a dark red light (or some other daemonic colour :blink:) was shining through the armour from the inside. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widowmaker Posted September 20, 2007 Author Share Posted September 20, 2007 Alrighty folks, A little update for you. I managed to get some work done last night. Not sure I'm 100% happy with it, but I can also see in my minds eye that it will look much better when I paint it. I got Azazel's wings on, and his weapons attached. His weapons are, as you see below, a sword and a power scythe. I know folks were suggesting earlier that I shouldn't give him a scythe, but i couldn't figure out what else to put in his hand. I guess I could have used a crozius, but it didn't seem to spark any interest. I couldn't recall how Typhus's scythe was done, so the cable here run all the way to the wrist - not attached yet though, and I'm not sure that the guard on the sword isn't too big now. Not sure about either so if you have suggestions about how I should alter them, let me know. Still thinking about that hood :pinch: , but at the moment, StormDragon has persuaded me to leave it off. We'll see. Maybe I'll do a mock up of it tonight and see what folks think.... Anyways..... on to the pics http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010086.jpg http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010087.jpg http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010088.jpg Close ups of the wrappings... (not my best) http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010090.jpg Of the Sword http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010092.jpg Of the Scythe http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010091.jpg And his legs now with spikes.... http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010093.jpg Well, that's it. I still need to add the arrows on his legs (should maybe have done that first) and remove the litanies from the armour... but I'll get to it. Let me know what you think. Let me know what I should do about the weapons... I ran out of ideas. Comments, criticism, suggestions - everything is appreciated. <_< Cheers Widowmaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoyalSpaceMarine Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 Great work! I'm envious of your GS skills... My only tiny tiny tiny criticism is the wings. I feel like they should be bigger and a bit more over the top... not over the top of the model... you know... exaggerated a bit. I'm not sure where you'd find wings the size I'm talking about, but if you could make them bigger, I'd go from giving you a 9.5 to 9.999 on the awesome scale. Good luck! LoyalSpaceMarine Keep your bolters firing!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widowmaker Posted September 20, 2007 Author Share Posted September 20, 2007 Thanks LSM, I know what you mean about the size of the wings. If he tried to fly on them he'd probably look like a humming bird. :) I'd really like them to be almost twice the size they are, but have no idea where to get such a thing. I wanted them folded like this, rather than outstretched like the Changer of Ways...... cos they give more of the angelic feel I was looking for. I'd sculpt them, but I'm pushing my skills with the GS I have - cetainly not going to attempt full wings (At least not yet - maybe in 3 years when I try the MK III version :sweat: ) Thanks for looking. I appreciate it. Cheers Widowmaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goththing Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 Very nice Widowmaker, very nice indeed :) the helmet. Only problem is the sycthe handle maybe make a bit "fatter" GT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widowmaker Posted September 20, 2007 Author Share Posted September 20, 2007 Thanks Goththing... By "the scythe handle" I assume you mean the entire shaft? I guess it probably does need to be thicker - do you think it would be better with GS or a bigger rod? The current shaft is a one piece rod, and I'm a little afraid that going bigger might destroy the hand. Saying that, I had some brass rod at one point which might fit over the plastic and act as a sleeve. Appreciate the comments.... Anyone got any thoughts on how I can improve the scythe head? I like the 'nid piece, but the Angel wing is poor.... seemed fine when I was doing it at 3 a.m. this morning, but now... not so much :) Cheers Widowmaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squiggoth Posted September 20, 2007 Share Posted September 20, 2007 This is starting to look great, good greenstuff skills for somebody who's never done it before - the skull face and robes in particular are excellent. :o I'd really like them to be almost twice the size they are, but have no idea where to get such a thing. I wanted them folded like this, rather than outstretched like the Changer of Ways I think these very wings would look more impressive if they were perched slightly higher on his shoulders. Right now they seem to be sprouting from his rib cage, which (to me) feels more wrong than their size. Remember - it's not the size of the thing, but what you do with it. ;) I couldn't recall how Typhus's scythe was done, so the cable here run all the way to the wrist Anyone got any thoughts on how I can improve the scythe head? I like the 'nid piece, but the Angel wing is poor.... seemed fine when I was doing it at 3 a.m. this morning, but now... not so much The Manreaper has only a small part of exposed power cabling, running from the scythe blade to a small generator on the back of the scythe, like so: http://s13.photobucket.com/albums/a285/squ...utenant007a.jpg I quite like the angel wing, maybe you can make it look like a power generator by adding some rivets and exhaust pipes and letting the cables run from the wing to the blade. The shaft looks a bit flimsy to be honest. It might look better if you covered in in greenstuff and sculpted leering faces all over it, kind of like Wurrzag's Bonewood Staff, or the WHFB Nurgle Lord's scythe: http://www.games-workshop.pt/warhammer/raz...o/wurrzag_p.jpg http://www.innerspin1.com/11a.jpg Makes it look very sturdy and demonic, and it's easy and fun to do. :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rizara Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 first off..awesome work so far, he looks great. As far as the hood, i say give him a hood, however make it where the hood is down, not up over his helm. Just to say he has the option for a hood. As far as my only critics/complaints, the scythe as mentioned does look a little to top heavy for the size of the pole. It just doesn't seem to fit the proportions considering how long the scythe is, and the size of its blade. Also..one last thing, the wings look to small. Have you thought about using the Greater Demon of Tzneetchs feathery wings. They are much larger than the pegasus wings you used, and they will be stretched outwards to give him some more movement and motion, right now the wings are just there, all folded up and since he's in a running stance, the wings would be outstretched a little. also i think the studded gauntlets would look good as they would match his collar of his armor. if you give them the same type of spikes, it would hide the writing on the armor. Also, the cables running the length of the scythe look really out of place. An idea would be to have the cables running out of the box on his gauntlet, into the a box say just above where his hand would be, then maybe have some exterior cables running from that box, along the edge of the scythe into a larger power box just under the scythe's blade, which would probably look a bit better, instead of such long power cables running from his arm. It would seem the way they are now, that the weapon would give him a handicap using it as he would get caught up in the cables. Also..it might just be better that the scythe, being as large as it is, has its own power source, as it is a two handed weapon and to have it connected directly to the marine would make it hard to wield as well. Just some ideas for ya. Good luck and i look forward to seeing this awesome demon prince finished and painted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widowmaker Posted September 21, 2007 Author Share Posted September 21, 2007 Wow!!! Thanks for the comments guys, I appreciate them - lots of stuff to think about. Squiggoth, thanks for all the comments and the links - very helpful. I've added more GS. It's still a little thin - especially compared the the size of the blade - but certainly better. I think I might go for the gnarled wood approach instead of the leering faces. However, I have at least one more night of GSing to do though (some daemon faces on the armour) so it might get me in the mood.... I've also changed up the top a little - added the back of a thunder hammer instead of the wings and added some power cabling. Still need to find a little more hardware to go up there, but it's starting to come together. Might find a way to add the wings back in. We'll see. I know what you mean about the wings looking a little low, but they're actually positioned at the top of the block one would normally add a backpack. Not sure if I could get them higher without serious dremelling etc. :P Manreaper - Great minds obviously think alike - as you'll see a little later, I've added a hood on his back. It's not brilliant, but i think when painted, it should do the trick nicely. (as an aside to squiggoth, I think that might go some way to alleviating the positional prob of the wings). I got the hands GS'ed a little - covered the litanies. have to get the studs on tonight. Not sure about changing the wings - I'm not really a big fan of the ones you mentioned. I like the way these ones are folded, but you make a good point about how they'd be positioned if he was running. I'll see if I can lay my hands on the daemon wings and see what they think - but it may happen after its painted - It has to be done by next weekend (nothin like leaving a project till the last minute, right? :D ) Anyways - got some cosmetic work done last night. See what you think.... http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010100.jpg http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010101.jpg Front shot with hood http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010107.jpg Rear shot of the hood http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010102.jpg Scythe power supply - still needs work http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010103.jpg Banding and arrow on the shin http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010104.jpg More spikes - perhaps too many? What do you think? http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010106.jpg Thanks for looking folks - as always comments, criticism and suggestions are always welcome. Thew GSing will be finished by the weekend. I want to enter him into a comp at the end of next week, so I need to get my arse in gear and paint. (Note to self - remember to wash the model otherwise the paint won't stick... Oil great for GS - lousy for paint :D ) Cheers Widowmaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StormDragon Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 I like the hood. You've got the hood on there but you're not covering that wonderful helmet. :D I think the power pack on the scythe is a little on the small side. I think it would look better if it extended further down the shaft, I'd say it should be at least double the length it is now. edit: must learn to spell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widowmaker Posted September 21, 2007 Author Share Posted September 21, 2007 Thanks StormDragon yeah, I tried a mock up of the hood, but it wasn't as good as the previous incarnation. Not sure if it's cos the neck/helmet/shoulders are so different, but it was not good. And as you say, it covers up that helmet. The effect wasn't as good just with the face sticking out. I think the whole head needed to be seen. Thanks for the tip about the powerpack. I'll try an add another genny (man I hope I don't need any more than 3 thunderhammers any time soon ;) Also got to find an L - shaped piece to add on the other side. I was thinking the bit from the tau pulse carbine, but I seem to have mislaid them oh well. Time to tear my house apart again. Cheers again Widowmaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarbonBased Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 These are the wings I got from Hasslefree mini's They might be more what you were looking for... http://i180.photobucket.com/albums/x120/Carbonbased_photo/PICT0216.jpg http://hasslefreeminiatures.co.uk/range.ph...4dc027151f3c137 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widowmaker Posted September 21, 2007 Author Share Posted September 21, 2007 Cool, Thanks CarbonBased.... First off, nice mini. Do you happen to know how big those are compared to the pegasus wings I'm using? I like the fact that they are more spread out, but am interested to know if they're bigger. The site says 20mm by 48 mm..... not sure what the pegasus ones are like Damn my impatience - I want to know :sweat: Thanks for the info Cheers Widowmaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squiggoth Posted September 21, 2007 Share Posted September 21, 2007 I've added a hood on his back. It's not brilliant, but i think when painted, it should do the trick nicely. (as an aside to squiggoth, I think that might go some way to alleviating the positional prob of the wings). Yup, that hood did the trick by filling in that big empty area at the shoulders. The wings look perfectly posed now. B) The scythe also looks a LOT better now, the finished version should be sweet. And that concludes my forum browsing for today, as I'm almost falling over from lack of sleep whilst typing this. Nighty-night! :tu: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widowmaker Posted September 26, 2007 Author Share Posted September 26, 2007 Alrighty then... after a pretty unproductive weekend, I finally knuckled down and got some work done. I added some detail to his left leg, and I think I got the scythe fixed - well, for all intents and purposes, I have cos it goes under the brush tonight, after which, it's a little more difficult to fix :) So, what does it look like now? Are you sitting comfortably? Good, then let us begin... http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010108.jpg http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010110.jpg http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010111.jpg Scythe Detail - it's mirrored on the other side http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010109.jpg Leg detail - by the way - it's a little difficult to tell, but all that uneven greenstuff was meant to be daemon faces in the armour. Hopefully it'll show better when it's painted. http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s106/widowmakerphotos/Games%20Workshop/Warhammer%2040K/Chaos/Marines/Fallen/In%20Progress/P1010112.jpg So. Anyone have any comments? Criticism? Suggestions? I have one question - He is going to be in the Fallen's traditional Black armour, but I have a question about robes and symbols. At the moment I am leaning toward black and white respectively. I know there is a suggestion that it should be red, but I was going to leave that for my termies (when I get to them) Anyone want to argue that the DP symbol should be red? If so, why should it be red? Thanks for the help thus far folks, almost done. Cheers Widowmaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HellChyld Posted September 26, 2007 Share Posted September 26, 2007 fix the detail on the leg pic it shows the scythe otherwise looks good and Look forward to paint rt dark angels wore black armor with red and white markings and such. for that fact I would go with red and white markings robes whatever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widowmaker Posted September 26, 2007 Author Share Posted September 26, 2007 Bugger, sorry about that. - Fixed Thanks for the heads up Neph. Cheers Widowmaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StormDragon Posted September 26, 2007 Share Posted September 26, 2007 Looking good. Now I can't wait to see him with some paint on. I agree with Neph about the red markings. If he's a fallen angel then he's going to be pretty old and you don't get older then RT Dark Angels and they were definitely black with red markings. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarbonBased Posted September 26, 2007 Share Posted September 26, 2007 Cool, Thanks CarbonBased.... First off, nice mini. Do you happen to know how big those are compared to the pegasus wings I'm using? I like the fact that they are more spread out, but am interested to know if they're bigger. The site says 20mm by 48 mm..... not sure what the pegasus ones are like Damn my impatience - I want to know ;) Thanks for the info Cheers Widowmaker Sorry, I don't know how big the Pegasus wings are. I can post the measurements on these when I get home tonight, if that helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beef5570 Posted September 26, 2007 Share Posted September 26, 2007 Really good very creative just one tiny critiscism the wings are too small, I suggest the Lord of Change really big. Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squiggoth Posted September 26, 2007 Share Posted September 26, 2007 Job's a good one! :) If you haven't basecaoted him yet you might want to make the edges of the arrows and armour trims a bit sharper by carefully dragging a knive along the edge. Soft-edged trims might be a pain to highlight sharply (altough on such a large model it might not be an issue, I never tried that :P ). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Widowmaker Posted September 26, 2007 Author Share Posted September 26, 2007 Thanks for the comments folks, I appreciate you continuing to look. @Carbonbased - thanks, but I found the Hasslefree mini dimensions on the site (20mm by 48mm), I was wondering what size the pegasus ones were. Still ain't checked.... :) :P But since i have to get this painted by the weekend for a comp., I have a little time since mail order won't get me bitz in time to add them. I like them though, so I may add them at a later date. @Beef5570 - Thank you sir. Yeah, I've seen the wings of the Keeper, but while the size is good, I'm not sure that I like the shape. Actually, I've never seen the keeper's wings in person - maybe I'll change my mind if that happens. perhaps it's just the angle of the pics I see causing me not to like em so much. I do like the Warhawk rider wings, but I think they may suffer from the same size problems that the Pegasus ones do.... Right now I just have to go with the story that he's running and the wings fold in REALLY tight :lol: @Squiggoth - thanks for the tip. I knew I'd have to go and wash off all the oil I've used, but I forgot i might have to go sharpen up the edges. Nice one :) alrighty. Stay tuned everyone. Should have some progress shortly. Cheers Widowmaker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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