Gaming Table Planning

[frostclaw222]

Alright, long term project here, but before I start getting too detailed, I wanted to ask around to see if some folks with more (read: any) experience had some pointers.

 

I'm planning on cooking up a gaming table finally, since I got sick of using the carpet, and this new cat might just qualify as a fleeted bio-titan otherwise. And since I have a fairly large force, I want it to be Apocalypse friendly, as well as being large enough to accommodate both a terrestrial (happy trees and hills) and urban (cityfight) setting.

 

My initial idea was to take an 8x12 table and basically split it in half, with the north half being terrestrial and the south side being cityfight style, including several access points along the periphery for some serious chokepoint defenses. This is a long term project (I estimate it'll take about a year in time and budgeted expenditures), so I really want to get it right out of the gates.

 

I have a basic sketch of what I just outlined above, but wanted to ask the following questions:

 

1) Should I be considering a more asymmetrical division? Meaning, a diagonal division?

 

2) For the cityfight portion of the table, just how much in the way of ruined/intact structures should I be looking at (assuming a 6x8 cityscape)? I'd prefer over-doing it to having things too sparse, as if it's going to be cityfight style, I figure as long as there's a little room for vehicle movement (especially along thoroughfares), I'd be better than having the place look like it's got nothing but empty lots. From what I'm getting from the Forge World site, most of their pieces measure 8 in by 12 in...does GW's City of Death pieces generally mirror that when assembled?

 

3) How much terrain should be on the terrestrial side, hills and forest-wise? I want the table to be friendly to all forces, without setting my wolves up to get pounded should someone come over to visit with their Tau.

 

4) Where is the best place to get foam to build up the board? I want to possibly include a trench and/or river system, and am uncertain just what sort of surface I should be looking for, and where to look for it at.

 

In terms of outlay, I'm not too concerned, especially since I'll be stretching it out over a long period. But the goal here is something that isn't completely immobile, as I'm in the military and may have to relocate in a few years. So, the board itself will likely be cut up in sections, somehow, and the actual structures within the cityscape will not be fixed in place (which might help in terms of keeping the cityfight area from getting too static).

 

As I said, zero experience here. The most I've done with terrain is put a sprue of the CoD stuff together at the last ATL GD. But I wanted suggestions, horror stories, and success stories, so that I can use them to avoid some common pitfalls.

 

Thanks.

[aretziel]

Hi.

 

Me and a friend are in the starters to make our own board as well so this is a interesting topic for me/us as well.

 

We will, as you do, make a large table for apocalypse games and/or even regular games on a larger board.

 

 

1) I seen a board somewhere where they made a City/Landscape table. One part City and one part Landscape with hills and trees.

They set it up with a 'ravine' outside the city walls. A broad bridge connected the two parts and in the wall there were a bottleneck hole that could fit a Rhino I guess. So you could get in/past over the bridge and over a small natural bridge and through the crack in the wall.

 

That could be one option. And to anwser you question, I think a regular square split may be best.

You can make the board in to natural parts. And it may be easier to set up on a regular square board.

 

2) I would go with a 'main road' that can fit a LRC plus some space around it. Maybe going in a curve over the whole City piece or a S shaped road with some smaller shortcut roads that only a Rhino sized vehicle can use. That would make it hard for larger vehicles to manouver. Maybe a larger plaza somewhere for open space.

 

Broken buildings closer to the road and larger/taller ones further away? Maybe try to do a destruction pattern in some way. Like a bombcarpet been dropped in one line so all structures in a line are blown down to first floor etc.

 

3) My suggestion is to make it rather neutral. And make additional pieces to place out. This would go for the City part as well, so you can change the setting from time to time.

 

Smaller hills and ups and downs in the terrain do not effect that much as a forest may do.

 

4) Here in sweden we got isolation foam (don't know the techincal name for it, polystyrene or something?). It's either pink or blue. Think the different colors show the thickness of it. It's the best pick I think. Like the white one you get your TV in it dies not chip as easily and break.

It's rather expensive though. But you should be able to get it in bulk at any store that provied stuff for building a house =)

 

 

I have zero experience on building these myself and take my advice as what I myself been thinking on =)

[LoneSniperSG]

Hm. I'm also considering a table. I saw one up for purchase a while back at my store, and I had the inclination to buy it. Wouldn't have been a problem to cut out the tyranid bio pools.

 

The theme I go for with my bases is a snowscaped city. Though there are few enough bits to negate the city part if needed, but I'd like to blend my two favorite scenery types. I don't mean to jack the thread for my own purposes, but the original poster and I are in the same boat with the same stale mead. My biggest standing problem though is storage, but that can wait to be addressed.

[Blue303]

You can get the insulation foam (pink or blue) at Lowes or Home Depot. It comes in several thinknesses.

 

Are you going to do the city part modular? I would think that it would be nice to have where you can rearrange the buildings or swap them out for rubble.

[Playa]

Hey,

 

I want it to be Apocalypse friendly, as well as being large enough to accommodate both a terrestrial (happy trees and hills) and urban (cityfight) setting

 

The materials used come in 4x8ft sheeets. The simplest method would be to use this as the board dimension.

 

My initial idea was to take an 8x12 table and basically split it in half

 

If you need this much area, just make four 4x6ft boards. For large battles, the 40kA book suggests:

 

3kpt = 4x8ft

5kpt = 6x8ft

10kpt = 12x8ft (ie, two 6x8s)

20kpt = 24x8ft (four 6x8s)

 

The only issues with modular boards are the seams. G weapons become problematical.

 

, with the north half being terrestrial and the south side being cityfight style

 

The 4x8s I did were 3/8in plywood sandwiched between two sheets of 1in foam.

Paint one side Urban Grey, the other Rural Green - done.

Effectively, you get two tables occupying the same volume as one.

 

Dow Sheathing foam can be cut with a knife:

 

http://www.dow.com/styrofoam/na/res-us/install-studs.htm

 

Glue the foam to the wood with aliphatic resin glue (Titebond, etc).

Left-over foam can make hills and rock outcroppings pretty easily.

 

how much in the way of ruined/intact structures should I be looking at

 

Eight 16x14in pieces will *completely* cover a 4x8 leaving only 6in 'roadways' between bases.

16x14 is just the size of the bases you'd use, what and how much you put on them is up to you.

A sheet of cheap 3/16in panelling would be more than enough material for all the bases.

The Citadel Imperial Sector I bought yielded enough material to cover these pretty well.

 

does GW's City of Death pieces generally mirror that when assembled?

 

The basic 'L' shaped corner ruin is a classic for a reason. The Imperial Sector made seven Ls:

A 14insq, 12in, 10, 8, 6, 4 and 2. I built them to be stackable for a single 7 storey ruin.

There were also enough bits to make 6 internal Ls to support the structure.

 

AFAIK, the only issue with the GW kit is the relatively low 3in "ceiling" height.

Consider making the 'ground floors' out of foamcore with the CoD bits above.

 

How much terrain should be on the terrestrial side

 

Once you get started making terrain, you'll soon have too much. ;- )

Just agree upon the amount with your opponent before the match.

Take turns 'deploying' the terrain, and *then* roll for first turn.

Winner goes first, loser chooses his board edge.

 

I want to possibly include a trench and/or river system

 

Your call, but that's always a mistake, imo. Don't confuse a game board with a diorama.

A green 14x16 in base with a tree on each corner is a Forest through which models can still move.

Basic Ls and four-tree Forests may not look like Beirut or Agincourt, but they play well.

 

the board itself will likely be cut up in sections

 

Have the lumber yard rip the 4x8s down to 3x8, then halve them into 3x4s.

Four of these will make up an Apocalypse-worthy 6x8ft table.

Later, you can just make further pairs of 3x4s as you go.

Eight will net you the 8x12ft board you mentioned above.

 

Or, you could just say "drokk it" and take the easy way out:

 

http://www.war-zone.com/shop/tabletops.html

 

HTH

 

 

Playa

[Tvayumat]

Making it in pieces is the best idea you could have. The one I made is very cool (pics coming soon) but we made it on a 4' x 4' base.... and now simply getting it anywhere is a giant pain in the rear.

[frostclaw222]

LoneSniper: Actually, jack away. That's part of why I'm putting this up here. We see threads in this forum all the time about figs and vehicles, but when you've got enough figs and maybe enough vehicles, the last thing you want to do is play on your buddy's rug. Insofar as the mods permit, consider this an open thread for ideas on modular table construction, quite possibly with a bias towards snowy cityscape terrain that makes my Space Wolves feel more at home. :P

 

Playa: Appreciate the comparison between table size and the Imperial Sector kit; in some ways, you seriously read my mind. And, for the record, Agincourt is definitely not what I'm going for...that fight ended positively for the shooty folks B)

 

A couple or even several folks here have mentioned getting foam and cutting it to suit my tastes for elevation detail. Cool, cool. Playa even suggested doing two sides on the same piece of wood, which is economical and clever to boot. However, was wondering if someone could give me a basic how-to in a paragraph or two on the cutting. In particular, what I'm looking for is: 1) what cutting implement to have in hand, 2) what density of foam to have, and 3) what particular advice you'd give to a first-timer so that he knows whether he's doing it right or not. I mean, I know what I'm after, but with the wrong tool and the wrong material, coupled with uncertain technique, I'd bet against me.....

 

aretziel, i like what you're suggesting about a method to the ruined madness in the cityscape, by having the majority of the chopped down buildings displaying a 'path of damage' or something similar.

 

one thing i wanted input on: playa says a trench system is a bad idea. anyone have input on that? i was thinking a partial trench system on the outer edge of the river, sort of a buffer zone before they hit the moat, as it were. this would put it more into the no-man's-land, while still making a useful fortification. right?

[aretziel]

regarding the foam.

 

the regular white one, the one yo uget with TV packages etc. is rather brithle and break easy.

the foam that's pink/blue is denser, heavier and better in my mind.

 

foam can be cut with a knife but the edges will be rather bad looking then. some people even it out with putty/filler to make it look better.

 

otherwise there are 'foam cutters'. basicly a thin wire that gets hot and you slice your way through like hot knife through butter.

(ventilate for the fumes, as they are toxic as most burnt plastic).

 

if you want nice and smooth edges that's the best tip.

 

 

regarding the trenches it could make trouble if you do a 'put together' board that you want to be able to make different each time.

also it may prevent regular small game 'on open field' kinda play.

 

my suggestion would be that you do a regular flat (or somewhatt slightly hilled) field and make separate tankblockers/concretewalls kinda cover instead.

you can always make some stuff that they launch them out of orbit into the ground before a siege =)

trenches would be a hell to build right outside a city with guns, as well as they would do little or no cover if the city got a city wall ... =)

[Crayoneater]

Have a look at the Black Gobbo online magazine or Games Workshop general army info:

 

Apocalypse Terrain

 

 

Gobbo is up to like 107 and they usually show tables and terrain construction.

 

Gobbo Terrain way back in issue 17!

 

perhaps simpler to cut/paste this link and simply change the issue 01-107

 

http://us.games-workshop.com/e-zine/issues...104/default.htm

 

 

 

We were limited on space at our house, so rather then have coffee on my wargaming table we attempted to create the "modular" table.

Cut your 1/2" MDF into 2' x 2' sections and then glue them to the back of you're 1"+ styrofoam. We hot knifed ours but I presume you can cut this on a band saw or score it and snap it cleanly.

 

By using this technique you can create extra with trenches, roads and rivers. Or perhaps a series of ruined building tiles, alien texture or scorched out craters. Leave your terrain features in the middle of the tile or the roads and rivers ending in the middle so you can twist tiles to match up.

 

Leave your mountains, trees and debris as seperate structures. This way you can littler them about the table to make sure no two are alike.

 

We've always wanted to create a terrain generator, three dice one red one green one blue etc. One die column would be world type, the second die would determine amount of debris and trees, etc etc.

 

This ensures randomness and fairness in games when close combat and ranged armies collide.

[Dragontigre]

You may want to have a look at those links :

http://del.icio.us/Dragontigre/board

[Xinua]

Hi everyone, bring this old thread back to life,

 

As I'm about to embark on a ruined city board.. to play regular 40k rules and city of death expansion...

 

any of the people that started this thread still around, if so, how did it go?

 

I will go for a modular board.. well I actually already got 4x6 fold up board that I made a while ago and have been playing on by rolling out he battle mat on top and sticking "normal" terrain on it, hills trees etc.

 

Now I've decided to get the Imperial Sector buildings box as a start, and try to come up with a game board that can change between games, preferable in a semi random fashion.

 

I will probably got for a "abandoned/ruined industrial sector" as the theme, So will have the buildings in different states of "ruin" some pipe work, some silos and possible some craters, and/or bio-hazard spills/pits. some main 6" wide road going through, and smaller roads that prevent larger armor from taking short cuts will have some dead ends. But still one larger open court yard, some easily extended/shortened gang ways between buildings, using magnets to attach and extend to different variations. They make really good strong small magnets now days!

 

So the pieces I'm thinking:

 

 

 

1. open court, a 18x18"

2. main road, 6x100" split in 10" sections

3. 3x building 12x12

4. 2x building 16x12

5. 4x building 6x6, 6x8 (silo types)

6. small roads 3x200 split in 10" sections

7. pipelines different sizes and angles, different pieces.. at a total of like 6x100"

8. craters

9. some low hills of different base sizes to be able to give different buildings a raise..

10. barricades

11. gangways for connecting buildings above ground floor

 

This would make it possible to build some unique cityscapes more or less every time, but there would be a lot of edges between the pieces... which is not nice..

 

If you make the pieces all around 12x12 or bigger the possible modularity will become less.. I guess its a trade off.. I'm just one of those that likes to play each game on a new terrain i guess.. so its never the same..

 

its a bit of a huge project.. but will give it ago..

[Playa]

Hey,

 

what I'm looking for is: 1) what cutting implement to have in hand, 2) what density of foam to have, and 3) what particular advice you'd give to a first-timer so that he knows whether he's doing it right or not

 

Structural insulating foam is the stuff you want. I cut all mine with a cheap retractable - and disposable - knife.

It's the sort with the bits you 'snap off' as they dull. Just use a metal straight edge as a guide - simplicity itself.

For my board, I put the plywood on some saw horses, and squirted a zig-zag pattern of wood glue over the surface.

Using an ordinary paint roller - its tray half-full of warm water - I quickly and evenly spread the glue with the moistened roller.

 

I had a friendly opponent help me with the next step:

 

Align the first sheet of foam before the glue has a chance to set-up - within 1-2min.

Then, turn the thing over onto the saw horses again - foam down, now - and repeat the foam procedure for the 'flip' side.

Once the second sheet of foam is glued in place, lay the whole 3pc assembly flat on the floor, and check the edge alignments.

I then used an assortment of weighty objects - mostly tool boxes - to ensure the foam was completely flat at edge and center.

 

Place the first weight in the center, and work your way outwards to the edges.

Wipe any oozing glue edges with a wet cloth, and let the glue set overnight.

 

playa says a trench system is a bad idea

 

To expand on my reservations regarding permanent board features - a flat 2-sided board has limitless potential.

You - and your opponents - can put virtually any cover or concealment upon this 'blank slate' that you desire.

Every match can be played in a diffferent environment only so long as no feature is *permanently* attached.

 

Trenches can be simulated with a narrow roll of brown felt - models on the felt gain the cover/ concealment of a trench, etc.

 

i was thinking a partial trench system on the outer edge of the river, sort of a buffer zone before they hit the moat

 

Similarly, streams, ditches and moats may be represented with blue felt.

When "area" terrain existed, shapes cut from green felt often represented wooded areas of the battlefield.

These common practices all evolved from decades of gamers balancing realism against playability and portabilty.

 

In the end though, your board only has to please yourself, and possibly the odd opponent. ;- )

I've just seen too many players come to regret the zeal with which they pursued "realism" to let it go unsaid.

 

FWIW, I went with the 2-sided board so my opponents could bring their own - sometimes FB - terrain if they wished.

Most of my cover/ concealment bits are City Fight/ Apocalypse/ Ash Waste, or I'd otherwise never use the green side.

 

 

Playa

[Chaoswolf]

If you're still interested in having a trench, how about making one in a low hill made from foam that can be removed/moved as desired?