what would you like to see in the next codex

[CelestialSon]

You kinda contridicted yourself toward the end there...You said that the daemonic essence of chaos bridged the gap of the glitz and glamour between CSM's and SM's...Then at the end you mention that you are glad they made them less daemonic....Not sure what you mean by all this. Anyhow not to turn this into another one of the million "ZOMG i hate my C:CSM" rants here is what i would want to see.

 

I dunno, i think there's nothing wrong with saying i'm not 100% against daemons. My point, maybe i didn't elaborate well enough is that i like when the daemonic element in CSM is more like an occult element. I like possessed and grater daemons, daemon weapon and vehicle possession because it's like they don't actually have daemons walking around as part of their army. That's why i was glad they nerfed the daemonic element, having generic stat upgrades and calling them daemon ___ wasn't doing it for me.

 

And i agree, defiler is nice. The only problem i have with it is a personal failing: i hated defilers firing indirect in 3.5 so much i have a hard time fielding them without hating myself.

[Lay]

My point, maybe i didn't elaborate well enough is that i like when the daemonic element in CSM is more like an occult element. I like possessed and grater daemons, daemon weapon and vehicle possession because it's like they don't actually have daemons walking around as part of their army.

Eh, that kind of stuff was also available in last Codex. The whole direction you prefer for Chaos Marines was feasible as an option. Now it's the only style left.

[CelestialSon]

Good point. I will say i'm disappointed at how they drilled the "legions no more" thing into the new codex so often. It would be nice if the legions really were different from renegade chapters. 2nd ed chaos codex dealt with that in the form of Huron Blackheart, now he's just an effective chaos lord for his points... somewhere between sorc and chaos lord with a bevvy of weapons.

 

I actually like fighting CSMs vs chaos daemons, am i the only one? There's something so satisfying about khorne bezerkers beating the snot out of bloodletters, or daemonettes being gunned down by noise marines.

 

I do miss chaos hounds and other undivided mutant goodness that was the hallmark of LatD.

[Dammeron]

- A definite seperation between Renegades and Traitor Marines. To my mind, there should be seperate stats and options for Renegades and Traitors, Renegades being the more recently "turned" marines who lack the experience and blessings afforded to their more ancient allies, but having access to a very limited number of equipment and weapons options more commonly associated with loyalist marines. Traitors, on the other hand, should have less equipment options, a much higher points cost, an augmented stat line (Ld 10, +1 WS), and be fearless as standard. They should technically be an elites option unless the leader of your army is also a Traitor Warlord, in which instance they may be taken as troops, or something like that.

- A lesser lieutenant option who could quite handily represent a Renegade commander, or simply a newly risen champion amongst the legions of chaos who hasn't quite aspired to the state of warlord yet. This would also be a very handy built in mechanism for determining whether or not your army counts as a Traitor Force or Renegade one too.

- God-specific vehicle upgrades that have been properly thought out.

- Cultists and Mutants that can be taken in the same manner that Chaos Spawn are now (perhaps counting as compulsory troops choices if your army functions under a particular special rule or whatever for those who want an army largely comprised of such units).

- Just some genuine thought, time and inspiration, rather than the desire to fill a gap in the product line. For all its failings ( and there were quite a few), one got the impression from the 3.5 dex that it was a labour of love that had a great deal of time and passion lavished upon it. All I personally get from the 4.) codex is mechanical coldness, and a sense of hurried carelessness that frankly makes my blood boil after almost twenty years of customer loyalty.

[Askari]

I don't think we need seperate stats. I think we need to redo the price of some icon then bring back veteran skills: unmarked units can buy 2, units with icons can buy 1, cult units can't have any. The current stat line and standard wargear are great and your changes would increase the cost of traitor marines and make it harder to make a competitive legion force which is the main complaint. Instead of special rules and characters just allow a bit more customization.

 

I like the idea of a lieutenant but I don't like your idea of him determining your army type. i think he'd be a good choice for low points games. I'd like o see the return of gifts with them being limited to a max of two per lord and 1 for a lieutenant instead of by a points cost like 3.5.

 

I 'm fine with the current vehicle options they just need to be changed to the same price as loyalist vehicles, predators aren't rare at all.

 

I would love the introduction of mutants and cultists with cultists having more weapon options ala traitor guard but mutants being able to take larger squads and take icons. Maybe they can also have the option of being lead by an aspiring champ too. Bring back some good old Lost and the damned flavor. But I would expect them to make them not count as compulsory troops choices.

 

I don't really care about love as long as they make a dex that allows us to make an army of renegades, red corsairs, and any legion that can be competitive and isn't full of errors or stupid rules I'll be fine. I just wanta quality product that I can enjoy.

[Smurfalypse]

You kinda contridicted yourself toward the end there...You said that the daemonic essence of chaos bridged the gap of the glitz and glamour between CSM's and SM's...Then at the end you mention that you are glad they made them less daemonic....Not sure what you mean by all this. Anyhow not to turn this into another one of the million "ZOMG i hate my C:CSM" rants here is what i would want to see.

 

I dunno, i think there's nothing wrong with saying i'm not 100% against daemons. My point, maybe i didn't elaborate well enough is that i like when the daemonic element in CSM is more like an occult element. I like possessed and grater daemons, daemon weapon and vehicle possession because it's like they don't actually have daemons walking around as part of their army. That's why i was glad they nerfed the daemonic element, having generic stat upgrades and calling them daemon ___ wasn't doing it for me.

 

And i agree, defiler is nice. The only problem i have with it is a personal failing: i hated defilers firing indirect in 3.5 so much i have a hard time fielding them without hating myself.

 

Yeah, everyone used to laugh at me cause i would never field them as indirect fire support...Always slowly walked up the board and hopped into melee when possible. The indirect thing was sooooo un-hateful that it didnt feel like something chaos would do unless they were seiging a city or something.

[Zeller]

Dreadclaws.

 

Demonic fire control in LR.

 

The ability to combine both cult specific Greater Demons and Lesser Demons with CSM legally outside apoc and opponents permission.

 

Venerable Dreadnoughts. Those of us that play first founding legions anyway.

 

Legion specific rules via special characters or something of the like.

[Utsujin]

I miss the old 3rd edition codex.

:) please tell me your joking here , you really miss the 3ed codex ? I think your the first person i seen in 10 years who said something good about the 3ed dex .

 

 

I miss the themed armies. Where you can have berzerker terminators or plague terminators, and not just Icons... A vindicare picks him off, they're regular termies again, and what not.. omg.

[Fury_of_Fenris]

+1 ws for champs as their ancient guys whove been fighting for melina possibly power wepaon as standard for champs seeming that they usually have spwecialised wepaons. um cheaper bikes and possibly what id like to see would be a better dreadnought that isnt insane. and possibly a new type of fast attack like a chaos land speeder lookin thing

[Brother Nihm]

Specifics:

 

Landraiders /w Infernal Device

Unique Daemons (e.g. bloodletters, furies etc.)

Useful Dreadnoughts (e.g. D.Possession = no insanity checks).

An Icon system for Renegades and a Mark system for Legions.

Dreadclaws.

0-1 Lash.

Rivalry between the Gods.

Daemonic Visage on select units or as an upgrade.

For the Chaos Lord to be better in CC than your run of the mill SM HQ.. (scale those back to WS 5 ;) )

Remove the random abilities from Possessed and make them upgradeable.

Give spawn an invulnerable save and/or lower their cost.

 

 

The vague:

For Havocs to be useful again so I don't have to always rely on Oblits.

Interesting and worthwhile Special Characters.

 

 

and last but not least,

some variety when making strong list builds.

[Deciple of Lorgar]

Cheaper bikes, and able to change thier twin-linked bolter for a combi bolter instead of changing the riders weapons.

 

Rules for playing the origional 9 legions, so that I can play themed Word Bearers again. Also at least one or maybe 2 special charachters for them, I would like to see a black legion charachter that isn't abaddon introduced (a sorcerer or a daemon prince maybe?)

 

Standard Chaos Space Marines who don't run away from taking casualties, I mean for chaos sake, they live in a place filled with daemons and unspeakable nightmares, but get scared when they loose combat, or take to many casualties from shooting? it just doesn't make sence.

 

Possessed that start like normal marines, but based on kills (inflicted or recieved) start to become more daemonic, (I don't know if that could work or not, just a thought)

 

A reason to take a power armoured Chaos Lord/Sorcerer.

 

A Chaos Landraider which is not a space marine landraider with out machine spirit.

 

A new type of fast attack that is a marine with 2 wounds that must infiltrate or deepstike, and carries a chaos sniper rifle, that wounds on a 5+ that turns enemy models into spawn (for the laughs!)

 

Chosen that can purchase veteran skills.

 

The front cover to be of Word Bearers slaughtering ultra marines.

 

Traitor gaurd units, mutants other chaos beings that arn't daemons or marines.

 

These are some of the things I would like to see. I could go on and on about what needs to be added, removed, changed or what ever. But then again I think ever serious Chaos Marine player could.

[Night Stalker]

Cheaper bikes, and able to change thier twin-linked bolter for a combi bolter instead of changing the riders weapons.

 

true. it should be this way.

 

Rules for playing the origional 9 legions, so that I can play themed Word Bearers again. Also at least one or maybe 2 special charachters for them, I would like to see a black legion charachter that isn't abaddon introduced (a sorcerer or a daemon prince maybe?)

 

I dont feel like it's good idea. Non Abby as BL character is also not good idea - first, they better make other legion special characters!

 

Standard Chaos Space Marines who don't run away from taking casualties, I mean for chaos sake, they live in a place filled with daemons and unspeakable nightmares, but get scared when they loose combat, or take to many casualties from shooting? it just doesn't make sence.

 

Well, i find it dumb that SM do not run away. And chaos have small chance with 11 LD [10 + re-roll]. Maybe give chaos marines re-roll as some sort of combat tactic ?

 

Possessed that start like normal marines, but based on kills (inflicted or recieved) start to become more daemonic, (I don't know if that could work or not, just a thought)

 

Lame. This concept is first bad, second contraditcs fluff - they are possessed with lesser daemons - they need to be stronger, more resillient and mad!

 

A reason to take a power armoured Chaos Lord/Sorcerer.

 

Agree, i find it lame, that only DP is worth its point :/

 

A Chaos Landraider which is not a space marine landraider with out machine spirit.

 

I like current cheap land rider ...

 

A new type of fast attack that is a marine with 2 wounds that must infiltrate or deepstike, and carries a chaos sniper rifle, that wounds on a 5+ that turns enemy models into spawn (for the laughs!)

 

I'd rather want chaos jetbikes. 2 wound non-champion character sound lame. champions would not use sniper rifle.

 

Chosen that can purchase veteran skills.

 

It's bad. Chosen should have 2A, i mean - thousand years of constant warfare, and elite close combatt unit have 1A ? :cuss

 

 

The front cover to be of Word Bearers slaughtering ultra marines.

 

I couldnt care less :>

 

 

Traitor gaurd units, mutants other chaos beings that arn't daemons or marines.

 

In your dreams :drool: On a serious note, i'd want it too, but better to made our wish list at least quite probable.

 

These are some of the things I would like to see. I could go on and on about what needs to be added, removed, changed or what ever. But then again I think ever serious Chaos Marine player could.

 

True

[Askari]

I think it would be better to introduce traitor guard and mutants than to bring back all the different types of daemons. We should keep the current generic daemons but allow them to purchase fleet or wings.

 

I'm fine with the slightly random nature of possessed but I think they should roll for heir power before deployment so they can get to outflank if they get scout and that taking an icon will allow them to re-roll their power.

[the jeske]

I miss the themed armies. Where you can have berzerker terminators or plague terminators, and not just Icons... A vindicare picks him off, they're regular termies again, and what not.. omg.

thats not the 3 ed dex , thats the 4th or 3.5 ed dex. the 3ed dex was the one made by JJ with stuff like khorn sorc etc .

[Speshtard]

Q: WHat would you like to see in the new codex?

 

A: A printing of the 3.5 codex.

 

Seconded, 4th killed my Night Lords, all the character drained from my army overnight.

 

Well done GW.

 

I would like the old style points limit, armoury and chaos marks system as well as the legion specific rules.

 

Maybe not the same rules, but something for those that want their army to have some character rather than being a band of evil vanilla marines.

[Smurfalypse]

Q: WHat would you like to see in the new codex?

 

A: A printing of the 3.5 codex.

 

Seconded, 4th killed my Night Lords, all the character drained from my army overnight.

 

Well done GW.

 

I would like the old style points limit, armoury and chaos marks system as well as the legion specific rules.

 

Maybe not the same rules, but something for those that want their army to have some character rather than being a band of evil vanilla marines.

 

 

They are getting rid of armoury's so dont even hope for that...To be honest im a fan of the last couple of codexs, orks and marines. They do not really have a choosing of wargear via old style armory but they have piles of options and different ways to accomplish things. The HQ adding army wide things to an army is a great idea, the bombardment for the chapter master is great, bikes as troops for the captain also good, all the specials are great, even their other HQs have alot of flavor. Libbys are infinetly fun and can do a different "thing" every game you play, the chaplains arnt the best HQs but are still good, but have PILES of flavor to them and add something to almost every list, master of the forge is another fun one as well, put him on a bike with the conversion beamer and hes a pain in the butt :rolleyes: Orks are just as customizable and fun all around, this is what im hoping for in the next printing of the chaos dex...Whenever that is (years from now probably).

[djkest]

Let's see now:

 

1) Buff or change possessed

 

2) More options for specializing HQ options

 

3) Cheaper plasma pistols

 

4) Better summoned demons

 

5) Cheaper or More predicable/better demon weapons

 

6) Bring character back to Chaos!

 

7) Make chaos stuff on par with Loyalist powers in new loyalist codex

 

8) New dreadnaught model and change the rules around.

 

9) Army-specific themes, or special rules for different legions (word bearers, night lords, iron warriors, etc)

 

10) Buff chaos lord, he's supposed to be the baddest marine in CC out there! All he got was +1 WS....

[Penmarch']

Let's see...

 

Veteran skills so I can customize my troops

 

Legion specific troops

 

NO ICONS!!! Marks!!!!

 

Gifts of Chaos again to customize my army

 

+1 WS for champions

 

 

 

 

 

Know what? Just give us back the old 3.5 codex....

[Fury_of_Fenris]

i honestly think games workshop enjoy ruining each army and the game each time they redo something maybe they want to drive themsleves broke but who knows

[Deciple of Lorgar]

Lol mitchell_marine, drive them selves broke?

 

It's more like they give us a really bad codex, then after we stop complaining, they unleash a vastly superior one to send us into a frenzy of buying it and new models.

[the jeske]

i honestly think games workshop enjoy ruining each army and the game each time they redo something maybe they want to drive themsleves broke but who knows

 

not true . the ork codex was really good . the new sm codex , if your a ultra player is good too . chaos dex for a BL player ? again good . But it does suck, if you play/played anything else .

[Vodunius]

Beastman slave squads. A CSM army isn't a proper CSM army without Beastman slave squads (with or without explosive collars).

[Fury_of_Fenris]

im not just refetring to codexs im refering to everything i mean seriously 50 aus bux for 10 guys. and 85 dollars for a landraider then after they promise no more price rises KAAAAAAABBOOOOOOOOOOM up they go... again. the new marine codex is good for marine players but i mean takin away th korn axes so marines get there saves. and then they take away all chapters and make them plain and boring( alot like they guy who wrote it) i honestly think games workshop has lost it.

[CelestialSon]

[sing] you're never getting god specific daemons back, never![/sing]

 

It would be nicer to see a special character for each legion. Also, some more mark specific powers, i feel cheated by Bolt of Change being so expensive/crap. I use unaffiliated powers, they sync better with MoT.

 

Princes should be 0-1, but that is becoming rarer and rarer anymore. I would like a difference between wings and jump packs, outside of the fact that jump packs make you jump infantry, wins don't. OH and a reason other than daemon weapons to take a chaos lord.

[Utsujin]

I miss the themed armies. Where you can have berzerker terminators or plague terminators, and not just Icons... A vindicare picks him off, they're regular termies again, and what not.. omg.

thats not the 3 ed dex , thats the 4th or 3.5 ed dex. the 3ed dex was the one made by JJ with stuff like khorn sorc etc .

 

 

Well, then the 3.5 codex again. I used to play pure death guard and now well, it doesn't feel complete with only plague marines as troops and others with marks of nurgle.. I'm sure there are definately some terminators out there yet..