Raulmichile Posted December 5, 2008 Share Posted December 5, 2008 It is a general concensus that Daemon Primarchs are the most powerful daemon princes out there, but I'm not sure of that. Maybe they are the most (in)famous to humanity but not necessarily the most powerful (maybe Horus but who knows?) For instance, who is more exhalted to the eyes of Khorne: Doombreed or Angron? We all know about Angron, but Doombreed is regarded as the first daemon prince ever ascended by Khorne, a former human who made horrendous acts of carnage and destruction, who pleased young (then) Khorne. Same can be with N'Kari and Fulgrim. And, sincerily what would be Lorgar's rank in this? I think he should be one of the weakest as he doesn't fulfill any more important function to the Gods of Chaos than Angron or Magnus. In fact it's difficult for me to fathom how the "undedicated" primarchs got the favour, which god(s) gave it to them? Now who they serve? Nobody in particular? Meh, I find then difficult to earn daemonhood if not to serve the gods forever... and Chaos gods are noted for being extremely zealous and demanding with their minions and their devotion. I do believe daemon primarchs are amongst the most powerful daemon princes but I'm not sure they are the most powerful of them all. Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDarkApostle Posted December 5, 2008 Share Posted December 5, 2008 Lorgar not doing anything? Perhaps it would enlighten you to know that Lorgar was the one who managed to corrupt Horus? ;) And thus initiate the whole Heresy. Now THAT's what I call one heck of an offering. :P TDA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raulmichile Posted December 6, 2008 Author Share Posted December 6, 2008 Don't take me wrong, I'm not underestimate Lorgar's role. (In fact I'm a Word Beares' player) But it is this aloof attitude he has what drives me to think that he was merely used as a tool (well, all traitors) but his role was more of a facilitator and not as a protagonist. I think he got rewarded for his services but is not high in the list of regards. I think Angron is more estimed by Khorne than Lorgar for instance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redbaron997 Posted December 6, 2008 Share Posted December 6, 2008 Well of course Khorne holds Angron in higher esteme than Logar...Angron is devouted completely to Khorne. And as for Logar doing nothing? What are you nuts? He written like 534,634,643 books of Logar...each a best seller....amongst the Word Bearers legion anyways haha. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperialis_Dominatus Posted December 6, 2008 Share Posted December 6, 2008 Doombreed, probably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Askari Posted December 6, 2008 Share Posted December 6, 2008 The first daemon princes are the most powerful. So Doombreed and whatever others were created before the emperor even began his plans to unite the stars. Amnd undedicated daemon princes can still earn alot of favor and strength because of their horrednous acts. they may not earn the favor of individual gods, but they can earn the favor of all of them. Abbadon's the most powerful living marine and he's stronger than most daemon princes. that's because although he may only rank as a 2 out of ten to khorne on scal of dedication he also ranks as a 2 to slaanesh, and another 2 to nurgle and another 2 to tzeentch, which when combined makes him an 8 out of 10 and gives him a lot of prestige since a full 10 would be a an extremely ancient greater daemon. undivided lords make up for quality with quantity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDarkApostle Posted December 6, 2008 Share Posted December 6, 2008 Don't take me wrong, I'm not underestimate Lorgar's role. (In fact I'm a Word Beares' player) But it is this aloof attitude he has what drives me to think that he was merely used as a tool (well, all traitors) but his role was more of a facilitator and not as a protagonist. I think he got rewarded for his services but is not high in the list of regards. I think Angron is more estimed by Khorne than Lorgar for instance. Well, since he's the one organizing the whole Legion then he's doing quite alot since instead of all the other Legions which just kill everyone or take them as slaves, the Word Bearers turn them into full fledged Chaos Cultists, remember? Thus increasing the power going to the Gods surely dozens upon dozens of times compared to everyone else since they are slaving/turning surely millions of common people every day. TDA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richter Kless Posted December 6, 2008 Share Posted December 6, 2008 Doombreed is the most powerfull, now question about it. hell it even says so in the Chaos Space marine codex. So I guess this means this discussion is over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Nihm Posted December 8, 2008 Share Posted December 8, 2008 That depends on your definition of powerful. I'd think it's something like this: Physically powerful? Doombreed and/or Skarbrand, they are both top contenders. Mentally/Psychically? Amon Chakai, no contest. With regards to fame/deeds done? Lorgar. Most corruptive? N’kari. Toughest? Foulspawn. With the exception of Horus, I don't see the Daemon Primarchs as being anywhere near any of the Gods' first princes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silent Shadow Posted December 8, 2008 Share Posted December 8, 2008 Also remember that the first daemon princes were mortals and so didn't have the high 'base level' power of primarchs. So Doombreed may be the strongest in terms of daemonic powers mutating a mortal but Angron was the pinnacle of humanity and was elevated to a daemon prince from a higher basic power level. For all we know they could be as strong as each other because Angron started as a primarch while Doombreed had more daemonic gifts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Primarch Naogedd Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 Just one thing: Skarry is a fallen Bloodthirster, not a Daemon Prince. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Of Malfeasance X Posted December 9, 2008 Share Posted December 9, 2008 1) There are more than 4 chaos gods, those are simply the most infamous (Malal, others) 2) There are unaligned powers in the warp that can gran daemon princehood to a Chaos Lord who just couldn't fit in with the others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brew city envoy Posted December 14, 2008 Share Posted December 14, 2008 If you include their retinues than angron for sure. he can have up to 12 bloodthirsters! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sons of Horus Posted December 14, 2008 Share Posted December 14, 2008 but it doesn't say the other DPs can't have more as a retinue does it :devil: I see the Daemon Primarchs as being equal to the first DPs (except Horus even though he never had the chance to ascend). i think when you say more powerful than primarchs you mean greater daemons such as An'ggrath. now those are the true bad @$$es Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperialis_Dominatus Posted December 14, 2008 Share Posted December 14, 2008 It seems fairly clear to me. The page where Doombreed is mentioned also mentions Daemon Princes older and more powerful than the Primarchs. Doombreed is the most powerful champion of the most powerful Warp God. Result...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDarkApostle Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 It seems fairly clear to me. The page where Doombreed is mentioned also mentions Daemon Princes older and more powerful than the Primarchs. Doombreed is the most powerful champion of the most powerful Warp God. Result...? "than the Primarchs" Does that mean base Primarchs or Daemon Primarchs as well? It's an interesting point for this debate. TDA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperialis_Dominatus Posted December 15, 2008 Share Posted December 15, 2008 Although the Daemon Primarchs are perhaps the most infamous and abhorred Daemon Princes, there are a few who are older and more powerful. There are Daemon Princes who bartered their souls to the Chaos Gods long before humankind left Earth, brutal dictators and bloodthirsty warriors who gained power as mighty civilizations rose and fell throughout Humanity's war-torn, tortured history... Doombreed Khorne was the first of the Great Gods of Chaos to awake fully, and Doombreed was one of the first of his servants. This is my basis for saying Doombreed is more powerful. It's not directly stated, but hey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sons of Horus Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 maybe they are stronger than the Primarchs but then again that source of yours is the 4th ed C:CSM. it has been outdated by the 5th ed C:CSM (im just saying). anyway even if they are stronger than the Daemon Primarchs, Horus was still stronger than them and he wasn't even a Daemon Prince. ^_^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperialis_Dominatus Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 Eh... my source is the latest Codex. The most recent Chaos Codex has most often been termed the 4th ed. Codex, with the monster preceding it the 3.5th and the pamphlet before that as the 3rd. Sorry for the misunderstanding. ;) And yeah, Horus might have been stronger (part of being possessed by the four Gods of Chaos), but you said it yourself... he's not a Daemon Prince. :P *looks at thread title* ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheDarkApostle Posted December 16, 2008 Share Posted December 16, 2008 maybe they are stronger than the Primarchs but then again that source of yours is the 4th ed C:CSM. it has been outdated by the 5th ed C:CSM (im just saying). anyway even if they are stronger than the Daemon Primarchs, Horus was still stronger than them and he wasn't even a Daemon Prince. :) The current codex we have was released while we were still playing 4'th edition. So there is no 5'th ed' codex ;) TDA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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