Equipping tactical squad sergeants

[Giga]

The question is simple; when taking a close combat weapon (such as a power sword, power fist etc.) do you replace the bolt gun or the bolt pistol with it?

 

That extra attack is nice, but I'm not sure about having only 1 shot at 12" range.

[Castus Xanthis]

Replace the boltgun. If he was a shooting sergeant you wouldn't give him a CCW anyway.

[Koremu]

It depends what you are wanting the Sgt. to do. If he's there with a power fist as MC/Dread deterent, then keeping the Boltgun makes sense - the kind of things you're wanting to use the Power Fist on aren't susceptible to your Bolt Pistol fire anyway, so you don't miss that Bolt Pistol shot on the assault, and maintain the range advantage of the Boltgun for general use.

 

On the other hand, if you are expecting the Tactical Squad to be providing supporting assault bodies vs. enemy Infantry, then the supporting Bolt Pistol shot might be more useful than a Boltgun you'll rarely use due to its inability to be fired on the assault.

 

In addition, don't forget that certain squad setups of Special and Heavy Weapon mandate or encourage specific tactics, so match your Sergeant carefully with the Squad.

[Brother Veritas]

My favorite Tac Sgt replaces both. If you're going to give him a Power Fist, you may as well add a Storm Bolter to improve his ranged envelope.

[bystrom]

I usually take a power fist with a bolter, as said, I have more use for another bolter shot against lighter infantry than shooting once before charging (I don't want them fleeing as well) and the power fist doesn't benefit from a normal close combat weapon. With a power weapon, I sometimes take a bolter and sometimes a bolt pistol, depending on which model I use; more in-game the difference is usually whether the squad prefers assaulting or shooting enemy squads.

 

I think I would have more use for a bolt pistol when it comes to mixing with a power weapon as a power weapon usually would have more effect than a single bolt pistol (2 PW attacks in a single game turn as compared to one bolter shot. When it comes to a power fist, the only difference is a single shooting shot).

[CompanyOfTheFallen]

I see no point in taking a Bolt Pistol with a Power Fist, you won't get that extra attack anyway. On the other hand the far better ranged combat capability may be important sometimes.

 

As far as power weapons, there is no point in taking a bolter. You want that extra attack because it is the only reason to take a power weapon. In all other cases you are better with a claw or fist.

[Koremu]

I see no point in taking a Bolt Pistol with a Power Fist, you won't get that extra attack anyway. On the other hand the far better ranged combat capability may be important sometimes.

 

As far as power weapons, there is no point in taking a bolter. You want that extra attack because it is the only reason to take a power weapon. In all other cases you are better with a claw or fist.

Tactical Squad Sergeants can't take L Claws, sadly :rolleyes:

[Marlow]

The question is simple; when taking a close combat weapon (such as a power sword, power fist etc.) do you replace the bolt gun or the bolt pistol with it?

 

I replace the pistol with a Power Fist, or I replace the Boltgun with a Power Weapon.

The plan is to either hit very hard or as much as possible.

[ItsPug]

Hi

I play 13th Company SW and all the sergeants have bolter and powerfist because they used to be able to use the bolter and true grit to get an extra attack. they don't get it anymore but i'm still likely to use them as I play pretty defensively with them and just let the enemy charge me. fire bolters in my turn and wait for the enemy to charge before each guy gets 3 attacks. I can outfight assault marines lol!

[Sternguard sergeant McColl]

My favorite Tac Sgt replaces both. If you're going to give him a Power Fist, you may as well add a Storm Bolter to improve his ranged envelope.

 

My sentiments exactly, it can really help fire power against hordes.

[Koremu]

I prefer Combi-Weapons, especially those that are Assault. Combi-Melta and Power Fist, plus a meltagun Marine in the Squad is a handy little vehicle hunting squad.

[Giga]

Thanks for the input guys. ;)

 

Since I do my best to respect WYSIWYG whenever I can, I have made myself a bunch of sergeants with various options and still somehow I managed to not make any of them with a powerfist and a boltgun. All the powerfist ones have bolt pistols. ><

[Hymirl]

Its not too hard to swap a pistol for a bolter! Chop'n'change?

[Giga]

Its not too hard to swap a pistol for a bolter! Chop'n'change?

Yeah, but it's still a pain in the ass, because I've already been swapping some plasma pistols for bolt pistols.

 

What can I say, my sergeants tend to die from "too hot!" way too much. :/

[Reinholt]

My thoughts:

 

As others have stated, the combos I like from basic gear are power fist + bolter and power weapon + bolt pistol.

 

When I'm tinkering with combi-weapons, since they are only a one-time use thing, I tend to match them to the other gear in the unit. So if I have a tactical squad with flamer, missile launcher as the weapon choices, I'll take a sergeant with a power fist and a combi-flamer to match them. I put combi-meltas with my meltaguns when I use them.

 

I can say I never take combi-plasma, just out of personal preference, as I don't like to give plasma weapons to sergeants (combi-plasma or pistols). The chance to overheat is small, but I don't like blowing up guys with power fists or power weapons in the name of a plasma shot or two. In the long run, I'd rather have the close combat weapon, so I'll just give plasma guns to my rank and file guys and let them blow themselves up.

 

I'm not a stormbolter fan because my guys tend to be in rhinos and hop out to dish out shots within 12", so there is pretty much no added utility for me, and I think the points can be better spent elsewhere.

[fwf_cypher]

with a power fist i usually sport a storm bolter for the two shots and assault quality. On the other hand, i have a multimelta/melta gun squad that gets a combi weapon on the sergeant who is packing a power fist. If im carrying a power sword its almost always with a bolt pistol, rarely a plasma pistol.

[Doc Faolan]

Then again, there's always (for your PF sgt) the much overlooked Plasma pistol, giving him more killy goodness vs the things you'd want the PF for anyway.

[Koremu]

Then again, there's always (for your PF sgt) the much overlooked Plasma pistol, giving him more killy goodness vs the things you'd want the PF for anyway.

'Gets Hot' is not a popular special rule to have on an expensive Sgt.

[white radish]

However, you're required to take the upgraded Sergeant now, so it's no longer a matter of expense. The expense is already there, and the question is whether or not the utility of a S7 AP2 shot is worth it.

 

If I still had to pay "extra" for the Sergeant with Armory access, I might think twice about the Plasma Pistol, even if the points expense is approximately the same... but they've neatly cleaned up that issue for me.

 

In the appropriate squad (a Plasma Gun-bearing Combat Squad, for instance), then why not? If the squad is tasked to deal with TEq & TEq HQs, Transports & Light Vehicles, high T & MC-type creatures, and annoying FnP Nobz, then it can be more effective than bringing a PFist... you're effectively getting S7 & AP2 at Initiative 11, versus S8 at I1 with a PFist.

 

Of course, Gets Hot! is still a bother... but IMO, you have to break some eggs now and again to make yourself a cake.

 

EDIT: Also, if you're Drop Podding, the Plasma Pistol can be brought to bear quicker than putting the PFist into action, although the PFist is a deterrent to absorbing a charge... and the Plasma Pistol is far more inviting of a charge.

[Koremu]

The expense is not already there; Power Fists are not cheap, and using a Gets Hot weapon on a model with a Power Fist raises the risk/reward level to the point where it's not worth it IMO.

 

I don't say Plasma Pistols are bad, just that I wouldn't risk the costly Power Fist for a single Plasma shot.

[Marlow]

I don't say Plasma Pistols are bad, just that I wouldn't risk the costly Power Fist for a single Plasma shot.

I agree. I would take the risk with a Power Weapon but not if I have the Fist. Too many points down the drain if you fail Gets Hot.

[theredcorsair]

I'd like a Power fist with a storm bolter, best of both worlds kinda

[General Retreat]

Another overlooked option is to just replace the bolt-pistol with just a Plasma Pistol. As previously said, put him with a Plasmagun toting squad and consistently get 3 plasma shots at 12". Or stick him with a Meltagun squad, and you have two MEQ/TEQ killing shots plus the option to assault. And you still have the boltgun if you need a single shot at 24".

[white radish]

The expense is not already there; Power Fists are not cheap, and using a Gets Hot weapon on a model with a Power Fist raises the risk/reward level to the point where it's not worth it IMO.

 

I don't say Plasma Pistols are bad, just that I wouldn't risk the costly Power Fist for a single Plasma shot.

 

Sorry, I thought the point had gone around to discussing general armament rather than the Pfist specifically.

 

I try to avoid the Pfist on tactical squads, and if I take an assault-type squad, I'd try not to give them too much dakka. XX pts for a Storm Bolter is usually points I can get better kill value elsewhere.

[Blitzkrieg861]

I take a bolt pistol with either a power weapon or power fist. It's a better combo with the PW as you get your 1 shot plus an additional attack in close combat. With the PF you don't get the additional attack in hand to hand, but you get 1 shot still... so I think that works better if you're expecting to get into combat. Although, Storm Bolter and Power Fist is nice too, 2 shots before assaulting is solid.