Traitor Aranos Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 Are the generic Chaos Space Marine troops a good choice, or is it better to specialize? Thanks guys, and by the way I'm new here, so Hello! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 Hi there, welcome to Chaos. Short answer to your question: Basic CSMs are awesome. Longer answer to your question: Basic CSMs are awesome because ^_^ they are incredibly flexible. BP/CCW/Bolter plus Frag/Krak Grenades means that a naked CSM has the ability to shoot @ 24", engage in close combat and take out light armor. Thats rather impressive. They're made even better when you start adding in some of the goodies. Special weapons, specifically the Meltagun and Flamer, give them additional anti-tank and anti-horde capabilities for a modest price. A Champion with a Power Fist/Weapon gives them much more close combat punch (pun intended) and a Rhino supplies them with the mobility thats necessary for a scoring unit to get up close and personal, because CSMs are most powerful within 24" of their opponent. Some rules of thumb though to make life easier 1) Don't take a heavy weapon, 10 guys standing still to fire 1 gun isn't worth it 95% of the time. 2) Don't mix rapid fire and assault specials. This means Plasma Guns work by themselves whereas you can mix/match Meltaguns and Flamers. 3) 99% of the time, you want to take a 10 man squad, as this gives you 2 specials and lets you fit in a Rhino. One of my favorite builds is this: Flamer, Meltagun, Power Fist Champion, Icon of Chaos Glory, Rhino = 250 points Kinda expensive, but this unit can do anything, which I really like Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traitor Aranos Posted March 23, 2009 Author Share Posted March 23, 2009 That actually sounds pretty awesome... Do you then commit to any Chaos god, or do you just stay with the CSM guys? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 That actually sounds pretty awesome... Do you then commit to any Chaos god, or do you just stay with the CSM guys? Either or really. I used to run Undivided, so only Icon of Chaos Glory for the cheap reroll. Of the other marks, Khorne is probably the best (competitively), followed by Slaanesh. Tzeentch and Nurgle are thought of as a waste because 1) you typically have a cover save better than a 5++ save and 2) point for point Plague Marines are better then Nurgle marked CSMs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traitor Aranos Posted March 23, 2009 Author Share Posted March 23, 2009 Okay great, and with troops is it acceptable to mix CSM with another troop choice? (i.e. Khorne Berzerkers) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 Okay great, and with troops is it acceptable to mix CSM with another troop choice? (i.e. Khorne Berzerkers) Its perfectly acceptable. Some of the times its probably the best thing to do, with Berserkers for example. They excel at killing infantry but are somewhat lacking against heavy armor, like a Dreadnought. By supporting your Berserkers with Khorne marked CSMs with dual Meltaguns, you're able to take out tanks easily and leave your Berserkers to kill the fleshy stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornelias Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 Some rules of thumb though to make life easier1) Don't take a heavy weapon, 10 guys standing still to fire 1 gun isn't worth it 95% of the time. i used to agree with this but lately i've started including 1 squad with a heavy weapon, the reason why? normally i run with 3+ csm squads depending on the points size of the game, when it involves objectives i would have a 2x plasmagun squad sitting in an objective that's in my deployment zone, i often found that my opponent overlooked it alot or focused on other parts of the board and the squad wouldn't really do much for the first 2-3 turns. so i've started using a lascannon in it for a few long range pot shots and the results have been pretty good. this won't work for everyone but it's worth bearing in mind if your using basic csm as a holding unit ( i'm sure most people use plaguemarines etc) ^_^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted March 23, 2009 Share Posted March 23, 2009 Some rules of thumb though to make life easier1) Don't take a heavy weapon, 10 guys standing still to fire 1 gun isn't worth it 95% of the time. i used to agree with this but lately i've started including 1 squad with a heavy weapon, the reason why? normally i run with 3+ csm squads depending on the points size of the game, when it involves objectives i would have a 2x plasmagun squad sitting in an objective that's in my deployment zone, i often found that overlook it alot and focus on other parts of the board and the squad wouldn't really do much for the first 2-3 turns. so i've started using a lascannon in it for a few long range pot shots and the results have been pretty good. this won't work for everyone but it's worth bearing in mind if your using basic csm as a holding unit ( i'm sure most people use plaguemarines etc) ^_^ A dedicated objective camper is the 5% of the time that I'd say its ok to use a heavy weapon, for the exact reasons you've outlined. However I wouldn't think about putting an objective camper in a list unless I had 3 other mobile objective taker squads first. Basically do what Cornelias is doing if you want a heavy weapon. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mutt-Man! Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 If you throw more bodies into something the scale rises for certain strengths. 10 zerks are 210, while you can easily fit 14 marines for the same duty. 4 more power armor wounds to be ridden into and out of the game, another 4 krak grenades to make use of, and the option to use fabius bile's enhancements+icon of khorne to arguably similar to khorne forces also comes into mind if you want versitility. 10 noise marines with sonic weapons mock at 250, while an easy 16 regular marines can make due the same. thats 32 bolter rounds at 12" while noise marines have 30 shots at 24" standing still. Its give and take, specialists are when you have strategies in mind. Regular marines fill the gap between specialisations. The more marines you get in a unit for a single icon, namely nurgle and tzeentch - the better off you are. Having to buy fewer icons, realizing that the humble krak grenade and the 3 attacks per marine on the charge can take care of most foes, most notibly with a powerfist champ and a pair of meltaguns for all-rounded fighting. (instant kill, high AP for Feel no pain, tank munching, big critter*wraithlord*wounding) Other then that, just make sure when a melee unit gets near you, dont use bolters unless you know you can finish the unit off. You have to get the charge on melee specialists, dont let them get the bonus, make it your favor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traitor Aranos Posted March 24, 2009 Author Share Posted March 24, 2009 Great to know. Its good to know that even with 32,000 members, you guys are still quite considerate and helpful. Not anything like the WoW players I had to deal with. :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cornelias Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 Great to know. Its good to know that even with 32,000 members, you guys are still quite considerate and helpful. Not anything like the WoW players I had to deal with. :P these are probably the friendlist, most informative and welcoming boards i've came into contact with and a great credit to the community here, a huge golf clap must go out to kurgan the lurker and all the other people that put so much time and effort (and cash) into making this place for us. welcome aboard btw ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traitor Aranos Posted March 24, 2009 Author Share Posted March 24, 2009 Yeah, it is pretty nice here. I think its just Warhammer players in general. Shoutout to Da-Warpath for Fantasy Orcs and Goblins for another great forum! :P But now, I will apply your information to my game as soon as my codex gets in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chillin Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 I sure the others have already answered your Q. But yes regular csm's are some of the best and most versitile TROOPS in the game. Welcome to B&C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Night Stalker Posted March 24, 2009 Share Posted March 24, 2009 Okay great, and with troops is it acceptable to mix CSM with another troop choice? (i.e. Khorne Berzerkers) Its perfectly acceptable. Some of the times its probably the best thing to do, with Berserkers for example. They excel at killing infantry but are somewhat lacking against heavy armor, like a Dreadnought. By supporting your Berserkers with Khorne marked CSMs with dual Meltaguns, you're able to take out tanks easily and leave your Berserkers to kill the fleshy stuff. Well, berzerker skull champion with power fist and 4 S9 attacks on charge kill most vechicles dead. If they managed to do it of course. I use 10 man squad with two special weapons (melta/melta, flamer/melta, plasma/plasma seems to be most successful) and icon of chaos glory/khorne/slaanesh. With very cheap rhino. It's good scoring unit, just remember supporting it and be aware of the enemy threat, and everything should be ok. If you must, it's only 200 or so points, so you can sacrafice squad or two. not big deal. You need a bit of experience for that, but without playing it's impossible to achive. Overall solid buy. Not game-breaking unit, but scoring :> Not everyone like their playstyle ofc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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