Theories about the Empoer?

[lee265]

Well i have this theory that one of the missing primarchs is what was actually wounded by Horus and that is what is now on the golden throne I was just wondering what theories you have about the Emperor?

[Lansirill]

Heh, I just posted a thread with one in another section.

 

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/index.p...howtopic=167304

[Sons of Horus]

That he is already dead :P

 

*warms up assault cannon and waits for loyalists to chase him*

[Rindaris]

Well i have this theory that one of the missing primarchs is what was actually wounded by Horus and that is what is now on the golden throne I was just wondering what theories you have about the Emperor?

 

Ok, lets assume this is true (it is an interesting theory). What do you think happened to that Primarchs Legion? What became of the Emperor? I mean if he was still around even behind the scene wouldn't the backslide with technology not have occured? And the whole worshipping the Emperor as a god (unless he really did want it and was using reverse logic with the Wordbearers).

[Sons of Horus]

Well i have this theory that one of the missing primarchs is what was actually wounded by Horus and that is what is now on the golden throne I was just wondering what theories you have about the Emperor?

 

Ok, lets assume this is true (it is an interesting theory). What do you think happened to that Primarchs Legion? What became of the Emperor? I mean if he was still around even behind the scene wouldn't the backslide with technology not have occured? And the whole worshipping the Emperor as a god (unless he really did want it and was using reverse logic with the Wordbearers).

 

 

check out my theory ;) :P if a missing primarch is on the throne that means Horus isn't dead and the emperor is ^_^

[lee265]

The theory works like this at some point the Emperor found that particular primarch and either they looked incredibly similar or he just found him first, either is a possibility, and when he gazed upon the future he saw at least some of the possibilites that could come about and decide that a stagnate Imyrium wasn't the worst outcome and then directed events for this to occure so chaos wouldn't wipe out humanity.

The Primarchs legion was then put in storage either by geneseed storage and the marines slowly died or were put into actual stasis field I dont know could go either way.

As far as tech backslide he has let that happen before that why there is Standard Template Construction.

Also Horus is still dead sorry.

The Emperor is alive somewhere in the Palace working on his secret projects like the webway or who knows what else.

[Magua]

Here's the thing, right? You can make whatever theories you like, but it doesn't change how the galaxy is *now*. So it goes with the recurring theory that the Emperor died, and it's Horus on the Golden Throne -- so what? Other than perhaps a little amusing irony, you still end up with the Imperium in the same state that it is today. So if the Emperor is actually alive and kicking somewhere, what has he been doing for the last ten thousand years? Apparently, not much. =P

 

(But most of the "Who is on the Golden Throne" stories end up with other flaws, though, like handling the idea that for awhile after being placed on the GT the Emperor was still conversing and meeting with people, etc.)

[Chaplain Kharn]

well its pretty much his psychic might keeping massive holes from warp space from opening and he is to preocupied with that if he were to be miraculously resurrected from his death like state in that time warp space would open and millions of daemons would escape if he dies then the warp itself would open and the dark gods themselves could come out in physical form

[Astalon]

well its pretty much his psychic might keeping massive holes from warp space from opening and he is to preocupied with that if he were to be miraculously resurrected from his death like state in that time warp space would open and millions of daemons would escape if he dies then the warp itself would open and the dark gods themselves could come out in physical form

 

He was doing all that before he was interred in the golden throne, so it wouldn't make any difference.

[dustermaker]

How about this.....The Emperor isn't dead, he just left humanity to whatever fate it takes. He did this many times in the years before he united humanity. Who is to say that he didn't just go back into the shadows and watch the galaxy play out. He may come back at some point when we "need" him.

 

I don't really believe this theory, but I am just throwing it out there based on what has happened in the past, and by something that was said on one of the HH novels.

[gil galed]

i think that theories really need some basis before we start throwing them around, its all well and good saying an invisible primarch pitched up, killed horus and then cause the Emperor was dead pretended to be him but there is no reason for this to be so and no fluff to back it up, i see this thread descending into insanity

[Angelwinged]

Has anyone else read about the Star Child? The Emperor was apparently the person created after thousands of the psychic shamans of ancient earth saw how man would eventually fall and allow Chaos into the universe and destroy everything. So they all killed themselves so their pure energies could be dumped into the warp/whatever at once, and those energies were put into one man who was born, the immortal Emperor.

 

Basically the Emperor's mind is becoming fragmented and overwhelmed slowly by Chaos and the 10 thousand year battle of wills. So the best thing to do would be to allow for the Emperor to die, so his spirit could go to a new body and be born again. But the Imperium will keep him on the Golden Throne for as long as possible.

 

I forgot where I read this, but I know it was real games workshop fluff somewhere.

[Sons of Horus]

yes that is real GW fluff from either rogue trader or realms of chaos.

[Erlend90]

I do not know who wrote this, but I know it is fan fluff. Still, I think it is cool!

 

Horus the Emperor

 

"Hold your tongue, heretic!"

 

 

The empty room shook with the impact of a ragged figure's body into a

sturdy and ancient rockrete wall. A burly man wrapped in a thick

leather coat and bearing the mark of the Inquisition easily hefted and

tossed the smaller person. Dust from centuries past were rocked from their

resting place and fell over the man-handled heretic. He gave out a series of

coughs before pleading, "Please! Please hear me! I know the truth!"

 

 

The squirming man tugged helplessly at the Inquisitor's arms, but

could not get even the slightest bit of relief from the hold. The

Inquisitor drew his face closer to the heretic; his long angled face becoming

feintly clearer to the helpless man as once hidden scars and blemishes

revealed themselves.

 

 

"What 'truth' could you possibly know that the Inquisition does not

have access to?"

 

 

"I know the truth about the Emperor!" The words barely escaped the

heretics lips before his body was flung some twenty feet into yet

another sturdy wall. His body smacked into it with a sickening thud before

falling to the ground in a broken heap. The Inquisitor walked towards the

battered figure on the ground; a highly noticable look of disgust etched

across his face.

 

 

"For a heretic to speak His name to an Inquisitor of the Ordos

Hereticus is to welcome an execution!" He reached for his holster, "By the

authority of the Holy Adepts of Terra and the Inquisition of the immortal

Emperor of..."

 

 

"Hereticus Preservitae, Inquisitor Lexington." the heretic rasped,

interrupting the Inquisitor's sentence. Lexington halted his words

and his hand remained poised over his holster. For a brief moment, Inquisitor

Lexington experienced surprise for the first time in many long years.

 

 

"How do you know of Ordos Hereticus methods and of my name? Neither

parcel of knowledge was granted to you!"

 

 

"I know many things, Inquisitor," the man replied, dragging himself

to his feet, "and I request that you perform the Hereticus Preservitae."

"I do not intend to interrogate you, heretic. What makes you think

that I would soil my vox recorder with your vile speakings?" Lexington's

tone dropped slightly from aggressive to curious. This shift gave the

heretic a bit more confidence.

 

 

"Because you are an Inquisitor. Curiosity is in your nature as well

as your duties. Besides, what harm could the frail words of a battered

heretic do to a devoted Inquisitor of the Ordos Hereticus?"

 

 

Lexington stared at the man; his gaze piercing deep into the ragged

figure's soul and contemplating its worth. He slowly reached for his

Bolt Pistol, but instead grabbed for one of many belt pouches hanging

from his waist. His hand searched briefly and found the desired rectangular

box. He spoke the necessary information for catalouging a heretic

interrogation and finally placed the vox on a small piece of debris next to him.

 

 

"Tell me what you know."

 

 

"Do you know of the Horus Heresy, Inquisitor Lexington?"

 

 

"Of course I know of the most famous moment of Imperial history. The

Primarch, Horus, was swayed by the Dark Gods and turned Space Marines

against the Immortal Emperor of Mankind. Do not insult me, heretic!"

 

 

"I mean no insult, Inquisitor Lexington. I only wish to elaborate on

this event. You see, Horus was the first Primarch discovered by the

Emperor and so was his closest 'son'. In truth, Horus was more akin to a clone

than an offspring" The last statement clearly disgusted Lexington, but he

held his tongue. "After more and more of the other Primarchs were discovered,

the Emperor's attention was split amongst His 'sons' and His empire.

Horus felt jealousy and contempt for his 'father' and so was easily swayed

by the Ruinous Powers. With their gifts under his control, it was easy

to bring other Primarchs to his cause; even if they didn't want to."

 

 

"'Even if they didn't want to'? What are you implying?" Lexington's

curiosity was too much to remain silent.

 

 

"Not all of the Primarchs, nor their legions, wanted to rebel. But

with the influences of the Dark Gods instilled in him and the vast

experience he had among them, it was easy to manipulate them by means of a

spell."

 

 

"A spell?! Nonsense! Those legions were impure, defected! They chose

to rebel!"

 

 

"Yes, but not entirely under their own will. Daemonic possession only

furthered the control of some of the more pious warriors amongst the

legions. And with this great army at his beck and call, Horus began

that long civil war known as the Horus Heresy."

 

 

"You have yet to speak anything of value." Lexington reminded. The

heretic shook off the statement and continued.

 

 

"When things looked the most grim, Horus inexplicably dropped the

shields on his battle barge. The Emperor took this opportunity and made a

grand assault with the assistance of the Primarchs Rogal Dorn and

Sanguinius.

Sanguinius was the first to reach Horus and confronted him. Horus

attempted to turn the winged Primarch to his side, but Sanguinius

was too stubborn and head strong. He listened not to Horus's words and

attacked.

The battle was fierce, but Horus ultimately slew Sanguinius and

tossed his lifeless body to the ground. It was at this point that the Emperor

entered the bridge and engaged Horus in the most spectacular duel this

existance has ever known."

"Yes. Yes. The Emperor won the duel, slaying Horus. He payed the

ultimate price; however, and was carried off to the Golden Throne by Rogal

Dorn himself. That story is legendary. Your worth thus far, heretic,

is...."

Lexington was interrupted as the heretic held up his hand for

silence.

 

 

"No."

 

 

"No?"

 

 

"Yes. No. That ending is rumor at best."

 

 

"What are you getting at?"

 

 

"It is true that one was slain and one was near demise. Horus's dark

abilities were still quite strong, even near death. Before he fell

upon the deck, he set about implanting a single fog into the minds of all

in the room. Although Rogal Dorn was a Primarch, his prowess was on the

battlefield and not of daemonic spell warding. When he knelt down to

collect his Emperor, he grabbed the wrong corpse."

 

 

"What are you getting at, heretic?" Lexington looked tense and

extremely enraged at the predicted answer.

 

 

"What I'm saying, Inquisitor Lexington of the Ordos Hereticus, is

that the corpse sitting atop the Golden Throne is not the Emperor. It is and

always was Horus."

 

 

Faster than any eye could blink, Lexington drew his Bolt Pistol with

it's barrel centimeters away from the heretic's face. The heretic, half

expecting this, froze in place and attempted not to make any sudden

movements. Lexington breathed heavily and yelled at the man, "HOW

DARE YOU! You DARE to insult the Emperor in front of me?! I should kill

you where you stand!"

 

 

"You can try, Inquisitor, but it will take more than blessed Bolts

to kill me. I am cursed with immortality by the Dark Gods themselves. I

exist only to tell the truth; and I have."

 

 

"How could you possibly know what had transpired aboard that barge?!

How could you come to this despicable conclusion?!"

 

 

The heretic reached extremely slowly into his robes. Lexington

threatened to shoot, but the heretic ignored the warning and pulled out a small

canister. He offered it to the Inquisitor, but noticed he was in no

mood to accept it. He instead placed it upon the ground.

 

 

"What is this?"

 

 

"Proof."

 

 

Lexington slowly knelt down to collect the canister and gently

screwed the top off of it. A feint glow emmanated from the interior as Lexington

withdrew the contents. It was a single, long feather. It's edges were

speckled a dark crimson and the mark of the Imperial eagle displayed

proudly across it's face. The Inquisitor stared at it in shock, "This

cannot be!"

 

 

"But it is, Inquisitor. A feather from the fallen body of Sanguinius,

Primarch of the Blood Angels."

 

 

"How did you...."

 

 

"I told you, I was there. I was servant to the Sons of Horus when the

battles occurred. I was there to observe and live. I speak truly,

Inquisitor, The Emperor is....."

 

 

The heretic had no time to finish before a rune encrusted Bolt round

exited Lexington's sidearm and entered the head of the heretic. The

Inquisitor spat upon the fallen corpse and carefully sealed the

precious artifact back into its container. Lexington knelt down to retrieve

his vox as well, when the ragged figure of the heretic slowly rose to his

feet.

Startled, Lexington instinctivley drew his weapon and aimed it at the

heretic once more. A hail of exploded shrapnel rained down from the

heretic's face as his wound began to heal.

 

 

"Golden Throne! What heresy is this?"

 

 

"I told you, Inquisitor, I cannot die. I cannot be terminated so

easily as I've tried many times before."

 

 

"I swear by the Immortal Emperor of Mankind I shall see you dead!"

 

 

"Weren't you listening, it's not...." Lexington's loose finger upon

the trigger silenced the heretic. Realizing the predicted results of

this next execution attempt, He put down his weapon.

 

 

"But it doesn't make sense. If Horus is seated upon the Golden

Throne, then why has not the Imperium fallen to Chaos?"

 

 

"Because Horus is selfish and desires nothing more than power. Do you

think he would share it with anyone, even the Dark Gods?"

 

 

"How could no one know of this? Surely the traitor legions would

realize that their leader is behind the Imperium."

 

 

"Oh but they do, Inquisitor. After his return to Terra, his

influence upon the traitor legions was lifted. After they realized what had

ocurred, it was too late. Their own battle-brothers chased them off into the Eye

of Terror without caring for a single plea of salvation by the marked

'traitors'. There they were fed upon by daemons and the Ruinous

Powers until the last vestiges of their sanity was gone. The Gods fed them

the truth about Horus and the last remnants of their sanity remembers

only that the Imperium worships a False Emperor. Horus planned this power

all along. He didn't want to crush the Emperor and assume the throne

since he would no doubt share it with Chaos. That is why he dropped the

shields on his battle barge. He staged his death and had his own enemies carry

him to his seat of power where they would protect him until the end of

time."

 

 

"But what of the Adeptus Custodes? They must know it is Horus."

 

 

"You are correct, Inquisitor. They discovered it was Horus, but much

too late. If they had revealed his ascension, the Imperium would tear

itself apart before it could rebuild. The safety of the Imperium was more

important of a consideration to think about. Also, Horus's psychic

energy made possible the Astronomicon. However, they vowed that no one else

would discover this and so protected the area against any who would

intrude."

 

 

Lexington had a wave of shock roll over him and was about to speak

when the heretic interrupted him, "Do you know of what a Daemon feeds

from?

 

 

"Yes. They feed from souls. Souls of psykers." Lexington sounded

weary.

 

 

"Just like the hundreds of souls sacrificed to the 'Emperor' every

day just to sustain him."

 

 

Lexington dropped to his knees and stared out into the distance. The

recent knowledge sweeping across his brain and unlocking questions.

Questions that he never thought he would ask himself as an

Inquisitor of the Imperium of Man. The heretic was relishing the Inquisitor's

state of being and knelt down beside him.

 

 

"Face it, Lexington, your Imperium is a farse. The one you worship

is the same creature you've been raised to hate. You seek out to eliminate

the Emperor's enemies when His greatest rival is idolized by His own

servants. What do you think of that, Inquisitor?"

 

 

The heretic had no time to revel in the questioning as a large

silvered stake pierced his chest and impaled his heart. Lexington released

his grip and kicked the ragged defiler to the floor. The heretic had a look

of extreme agony on his face as the area surrounding the wound

incinerated and spread d to consume his entire anatomy to ash. As the

dust and ash blew across the floor, Inquisitor Lexington collected his vox. He

stared at it for what seemed to be an eternity until he smashed it

into a wall, destroying it utterly. He then collected the heretic's canister

containing its sacred cargo and left. He entered a loyal Inquisitor

of the Ordos Hereticus and exited an unsure man filled with confusion and

doubt about his god-like Emperor; the very tools of a heretic to the

Imperium of Man.

 

 

The ashes swirled and merged at the center of the room until the

full-bodied figure of the heretic became whole once more. He patted

his chest to check the wound, only to find a completely healthy (albeit

poorly groomed) chest. A small silhouetted vapor cloud appeared in the air

in front of him.

 

"Yes, my master?"

 

 

"You have failed yet again, slave! Your soul shall be consumed if you

cannot maintain a simple riot among the loyalists!"

 

 

"But the message of truth was spread to yet another Inquisitor, my

lord.

That makes a good number of their ranks aware of exactly whom they

serve."

 

 

"That traitor, Horus! He shall regret his actions once the Dark Gods

claim him again. Until then, slave, you have a cult to reform!”

[Sons of Horus]

that theory has a lot of holes in it though.

 

the Astronomican was around since the Great Crusade.

[Theidi0t266]

Ooh i like that story, very nice

[Sons of Lion]

that theory has a lot of holes in it though.

 

the Astronomican was around since the Great Crusade.

 

i agree. if only the people in the room were affected by the 'fog' then what about when abbadon rescued Horus body? he wasnt in the room and would have instantly known is was the emperor lying on the floor. this would have spread like wildfire amongst the traitors and loyalists alike. Also, Horus would not have had the psyker power to hold the forces of chaos at bay on the golden throne, the emperor was already doing this before his death, horus didnt even know anything about that.

 

nice bit of fluff, but fatally flawed. you cant go reinventing history...

[Lucifer216]

Check out this thread.

 

http://forum.blpublishing.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=11519

 

Brother Lucan's musings on this subject are by far the best I've ever read. I hope GW take note and make his line of reasoning semi-official...

[Grand Master Tyrak]

In truth, Horus was more akin to a clone

than an offspring" The last statement clearly disgusted Lexington,

 

Sorry to disappoint you, but all the Primarchs were the clone sons of the Emperor. That's nothing new.

[Sons of Horus]

I think he meant to say he resembled the emperor much more than the other primarchs.

[lee265]

Scince when was it stated the Primarchs were clones of the Emperor I don't remeber that? true he used his DNA if I remember right but then tweeked it. a bit like saying the herse is a cadalac its true for some models of herses thats where they came from but they just aren't anymore.

 

Oh and because i fell like causing some camotion I hate the Godfather. :wallbash:

[CernunnosX]

I pose a question to you in response to your question: Since when have the primarchs NOT been stated as the clone sons of the Emperor? Seriously, when I read fluff, at least 3/4 of the time the primarchs are referred to as the clone sons of the Emperor.

[lee265]

Look i know he used his dna but calling them a clone after the other modifications were made is like calling a howlere monkey your cousine :) . I do read the fluff he did heavy genetic enginerring to them thats why i don't think clone is the most accurate term we could use thats all i was trying to point out. Also Akin to saying the custodias are marines.

[Astalon]

You're right to say they're not clones. I think when they use the word clone-sons, its meant to represent some of the DNA used was his, along with a variety of other modifications meaning they weren't simply copies.

[Grand Master Tyrak]

I think when they use the word clone-sons, its meant to represent some of the DNA used was his, along with a variety of other modifications meaning they weren't simply copies.

 

Some? All. Although they have been genetically engineered, they didn't start of as humans like the Space Marines.