[Daemon review] Sample lists

[Captain Malachi]

Sorry for the wait, been working on my own site and I'm also writing a new codex and assembling the contents of a tau battleforce, as well as trying to read the second omnibus of the Gaunts Ghosts series, so I've been a little busy.

 

Mono- Khorne:

Continuing with the theme of mono-god lists, here’s a list for Khorne that Infidel wrote up, and I must say it’s unashamedly direct.

 

2x bloodthirster with unholy might and blessing of the blood god.

 

3x 2 man squads of bloodcrushers.

 

2x 12 man squads of bloodletters. One has an instrument.

 

2x soulgrinder with phlegm.

 

The bloodthirsters are your main anti-tank, being fast enough and strong enough to threaten anything reliably. The bloodcrushers are rather small units, but it has the advantage of letting you assault multiple units at once. The bloodletters are your line troops, again, they just kill stuff. The soulgrinders are your support, with phlegm they can provide cover fire to your more fragile bloodletters or high profile bloodcrushers.

 

Sadly, mono-Khorne doesn’t have much in the way of tactics beyond ‘run up and hit’. Careful use of flesh hounds can let you tie up fire support units, princes can provide additional anti-tank, and heralds make excellent troops killers, but with little or no ranged support, you really are looking at being combat as much as possible.

 

There isn't really a lot to say on mono-Khorne unfortunately, but if there's anything you think I should add please say.

[Rahveel]

Yeah, khorne tactics usually boil down to "hit him with the pointy end of the stick" in 40k.

 

I would actually really like to fight that list, as I really am not sure how it would do.

 

personally, what with the smaller crusher units and most of the points being tied up in the BT's and SG's, I think I could shoot it up pretty well, so long as your entire 2nd wave didn’t show up at once. but there again, khorne does not need much to survive in order to wreak havoc in CC, so i could easily misjudge the effects of my shooting, and end up with a face full of hellblade!

 

my big question for this list would be, "how do you win objective based games?" I usually see BL's pulled further into their foes (if not shot down after their first slaughter), and they are certainly not a speedy unit, so would have trouble hoofing it to an objective. PB's might also have this problem, but they are so durable, that you can just camp them on an objective for a number of turns. with only T4 and a 5++ (or cover), bloodletters wont be camping very effectively, and may well be bemoaning the fact that they aren’t swinging those nasty PW's at anyone.

[Infidel]

It's actually quite interesting how a game like this would turn out.

 

You're essencially fighting 5 MCs + 2 AV13 walkers with battle cannons. What you'd want is to drop the thirsters and grinders in ASAP and quickly secure a territory of sorts. Use phlegm to target exposed heavy weapon to at least reduce some return fire.

 

Thirsters take quite a bit of small arms fire to kill and since big guns are going to be pointing at the grinders, that's ok. The purpose of the grinders is for the initial shock and to draw away heavy weapon to ensure thirsters get a 2nd turn assault. If they live through the first turn of dakka, then bonus.

 

A lot of the time, blood letters dont so much "hold" objectives, but rather "take" objectives. Throw them at enemy objective holders and see them disappear in a carnage of hellblade and S5 attacks.

[Rahveel]

it would defanatly be frigtining to face!

[Ju'kosian]

This is my mono Nurgle list, I've used it with succes and you can easily change it into an epilist.

well actually it's half mono-Nurgle and Half daemonzilla.

 

 

* Great Unclean one @ 165pts

Cloud of flies

 

 

* Plaguebearers @ 165pts

9 plaguebearers, 1 with Icon, 1 with instrument

 

* Plaguebearers @ 165pts

9 plaguebearers, 1 with Icon, 1 with instrument

 

* Plaguebearers @ 135pts

9 plaguebearers

 

* Plaguebearers @ 135pts

9 plaguebearers

 

 

* Daemon prince @ 245pts

MoN, Iron hide, Flight, Noxious touch, Breath of chaos and "cloud of flies"

 

* Daemon prince @ 245pts

MoN, Iron hide, Flight, Noxious touch and "cloud of flies", Breath of chaos

 

* Daemon prince @ 245pts

MoN, Iron hide, Flight, Noxious touch and "cloud of flies", Breath of chaos

 

 

Current total : 1500pts

[Rahveel]

I really like this list as a deviation from epi, but still has nasty teeth. At first I thought "wait, were are the nurglings or beasts?", but realize those really have no purpose w/o epi.

 

Interestingly, this is defiantly the heaviest troops list we have seen yet, and still manages to take a lot of big nasties. its surprising how many points one has to play with when they are not taking almost mandatory elite/HQ choices. My Tz and Infidel's Khorne have almost a 3rd of our armies tied up in HQ choices alone.

 

Do you usualy feel that the strength of your army is in its troops choices, or are you just under-impressed with nurgle choices in other force org sections?

[Captain Malachi]

Since the mono-Nurgle list is going to be combined with the Epi list in our review, how would you edit it to include Epi? I don't mean to be a pain, it's just that we agreed on that and it really has to be done.

[Infidel]

My Mono-Nurgle:

 

HQ: 110pt

Eipdemius

 

Troops: 686pt

9 Plaguebearers, Icon

9 Plaguebearers, Icon

9 Plaguebearers

9 Plaguebearers

6 Nurgling

6 Nurgling

 

Heavy Support: 710

Daemon Prince, Mark of Nurgle, Ironhide, Breath of Chaos, Wings, Cloud of Flies

Daemon Prince, Mark of Nurgle, Ironhide, Breath of Chaos, Wings, Cloud of Flies

Daemon Prince, Mark of Nurgle, Ironhide, Breath of Chaos, Wings, Cloud of Flies

 

1496pt

 

I dropped the Noxious Touch on the DP because NT come free at 10 kills, and that's a easy target with 3 breath princes. Nurgling gives you speed and even greater tarpit abiliity.

 

Stick one pack of PB with Epi and one icon per wave.

 

First wave:

Epi + 9 Plaguebearer, 2x Daemon Prince, Plaguebearer w/icon

 

Interestingly, this is defiantly the heaviest troops list we have seen yet, and still manages to take a lot of big nasties. its surprising how many points one has to play with when they are not taking almost mandatory elite/HQ choices. My Tz and Infidel's Khorne have almost a 3rd of our armies tied up in HQ choices alone

 

As is my balanced list. The HQ perfectly encapsulates the essence of their patron god, BT gives you the needed speed and antitank in a khorne list, KoS gives you a stupidly fast MC that hits at I10. However, I dont think the Tzeentch/Nurgle GD have a place in their respective themed list, because Tzeentch Herald > LoC and Epi list dont need GUO.

[Ju'kosian]

I like the chaos instruments on plaguebearers because in my experience they tend to draw a lot in HTH..

at least that's what I do.. They lack the number of attacks to really hurt something..

Offcourse when Epi is in your list you don't need them, becasue you just have to be a little patience, and when that tally is up.. they go trough everything..

 

I take the first wave differntly with the epi list (mine is somewhat similair), I normally stick epi with an Icon squad, and send in the 3 DP's all in at once..

[Captain Malachi]

Mono-Nurgle/Epidemius:

 

Mono-Nurgle:

We’re going to combine the mono-Nurgle build with the Epidemius build, since they generally go hand in hand. Epidemius basically unlocks the potential of a Nurgle army. Here is Infidels Epidemius army:

 

Epidemius.

 

4x 9 man squads of plaguebearers, 2 have icons.

 

2x 6 bases of nurglings.

 

3x daemon prince with mark of Nurgle, iron hide, breath of chaos, daemonic flight and cloud of flies.

 

As you can see, the heavy slots are maxed out on daemon princes, this is for two reasons. 1) Nurgle armies are incredibly slow and have little killing power, daemons princes make up for both of thee weaknesses to some extent. 2) The tally. Epidemius can only boost the army once you have killed a few units, and plaguebearers and nurglings aren’t going to do that any time soon, but three princes can get the tally up in one or two turns, especially when given breath of chaos. You may notice that the princes are very similar to our standard ‘heavy assault’ build, but minus noxious touch. This is because at ten kills, they get it from Epidemius’ tally, so you save yourself 30 points by not buying it. However, some people buy it anyway to get the tally up even quicker.

 

There are two different views on the best unit to take advantage of the tally, beasts or nurglings, plaguebearers don’t have the number of attacks to do it effectively. Beasts have the advantage of potential, they could theoretically throw out six power weapon attacks that wound on two’s when the tally is up, but they could also only have one. Nurglings get three all the time, are cheaper and have more wounds, however, they have a lower toughness and take more damage from templates and blasts. Really it’s up to you which one you take, but you really do need to take one or the other, or else there’s not much point in taking Epidemius.

 

The problem these lists have is anti-tank. Yes, princes can bust open tanks quite quickly, but to get the tally up they should be focusing on troops. For this reason some players like to include a unit or two of screamers of Tzeentch as pure tank killers, they aren’t Nurgle units so won’t benefit from the tally, but it also means your princes can focus on the troops and get the tally up.

 

Rules note- It’s important to note that enemy Nurgle units both benefit from, and add to, the tally. However, this can lead to some complicated situations. There is some debate on whether or not Epidemius’ tally affects ranged attacks, so discuss this with your opponent before the game, or the tournament organiser before you sign up. You want to make sure you know if you’re Death Guard ally is going to be getting AP2 bolters or not in that doubles game.

 

Guess it's mono-Slaanesh next. Now where's dark_elf?

[Infidel]

Mono Slaanesh comes in 3 flavors as far as I can tell, Daemonzilla, Mass herald/fiends and mass pavane.

 

The daemonzilla list performed consistantly and I dont have the herald model to really try out the 4 herald build in a tourny situation, and mass pavane can be very nasty.

 

Also, when I say mass pavane, I don't mean something ridiculous, but generally taking 3 on the DPs and a masque. Other pavane carriers are far inferior choices, they're too expensive on the sherald and on the KoS you want to always be able to fleet.

[dark_elf]

1500pts Mono Slaanesh Daemonzilla

Keeper, Might + Musk

1 Fiend, Might

1 Fiend, Might

18 Daemonettes, Icon

18 Daemonettes, Gaze

6 Daemonettes

6 Daemonettes

DP, MoS, IronHide, Pavane, Might

DP, MoS, IronHide, Pavane, Might

DP, MoS, IronHide, Might

TOTAL: 1497

 

Wave 1: Keeper, 2 DPs, 2 x 18 Daemonette squads. Sometimes I switch 1 DP out for a Fiend to help the Keeper.

 

The 2 small squads of Daemonettes are my objective campers, hopefully coming in at the late game. The battle plan usually revolves around the Keeper tying units up for 1 combat round before

using Musk to attack another unit. By this time, usually the DPs should be in charge range to engage the Keeper's previous unit or engage a new one with the help of the 2 x 18 Daemonettes.

 

The last DP lost his Pavane to allow me pts for an Icon. Gaze was there to eat up the left over 5pts.

 

The list can be optimised further for those who dont wish to use the sacred numbers, but unfortunately for me, I like sacred numbers so this is the best I can do with my play style.

 

Alternatively, drop the 3 DPs add in 3 x SGs with Phlegm and you got 30pts to spare. These pts can go into another Icon -_-

 

I find mono-slaanesh tougher than the other mono-lists to play. They are very fragile. It takes a while to get used to the speed and to make it work for you.

 

 

 

1500pts Mono Slaanesh Heraldspam

 

Herald, Chariot, Might, Musk, T'Gaze

Herald, Chariot, Might, Musk, T'Gaze

Herald, Chariot, Might, Musk, T'Gaze

Herald, Chariot, Might, Musk, T'Gaze

 

2 Fiends, Might

2 Fiends, Might

2 Fiends, Might

 

18 Daemonettes, Icon

18 Daemonettes, Icon

6 Daemonettes

 

SG

SG

TOTAL: 1498

 

Wave 1: 2 Heralds, 2 x 18 Daemonettes, 1 SG, 1 Fiend

 

I've only proxied the HeraldSpam list twice, as I don't have any SGs or that many fiends. All my heralds died in both games but they did make a hole in my opponents battle line, which the Fiends

and Daemonettes mopped up. The naked SGs are there to draw fire away from everything else, and if they make it into combat... bonus!

 

Again, going with the sacred numbers, as such the list can be further optimised. Additionally, if you want a more rounded list give the SGs Phelgm. I would drop 1 Fiend and 1 icon to make room.

 

I have yet to try a mass Pavane list.

[Infidel]

My list (proxied a few times, using kroots as netts)

 

Slaanesh Daemonzilla

HQ: 470pt

Keeper, Might, Musk

Keeper, Might, Musk

 

Elites: 180pt

6x Fiends

 

Troops: 336

12x Daemonettes

12x Daemonettes

 

Heavy Support: 500

Daemon Prince, MoS, Hide, Pavane, Musk

Daemon Prince, MoS, Hide, Pavane, Musk

Daemon Prince, MoS, Hide, Pavane, Musk

 

Wave 1: Kos, KoS, 2x DP

Wave 2: Netts, Netts, Fiends, DP

 

Again, another list that doesnt take much explaination., I dont take icons because slaanesh dont have good icon bearers and the speed more than makes up for it. No anti-tank but has the speed of a turbo-charged photon. Every unit out side of Netts comes with Hit'N'Run and 3 Pavanes. Troops is a bit on the light side, but I only use them to assist things that are already tied in combat, and most of the other time they sit in cover.

 

Herald Spam:

HQ: 300pt

Herald of Slaanesh, Chariot, Might, Musk

Herald of Slaanesh, Chariot, Might, Musk

Herald of Slaanesh, Chariot, Might, Musk

Herald of Slaanesh, Chariot, Might, Musk

 

Elite: 570pt

6x Fiends, Might

6x Fiends, Might

6x Fiends. Might

 

Troops: 435

12x Daemonettes, Instrument

12x Daemonettes, Instrument

6x Daemonettes, Instrument

 

Fast-Attack: 192

6x Seekers

6x Seekers

 

Wave 1: All Heralds, Fiends x2

Wave 2: Fiend x1, Netts and Seekers

 

So this is a heavy-less list, basically rendering all of his tank-busting weapons to one wound savable on a 5+. Wow, look at that Lascannon go. 18 Fiends all come with might to eat up those armor. Speed, Speed, Speed is the word. This list also comes with a gloriously huge amount of attacks which always result in some truely EPIC number of dice being rolled.

[dark_elf]

Interesting list Infidel.

 

How do you find the Slaanesh DP without Might?

 

2 Keepers in a 1500pt list ought to be somewhat intense for the opponent hehe.

 

I'll have to proxy your version of the HeraldSpam. Ive never tried a game without my DPs as I find I rely on them and the Keeper to keep me in the running.

[Infidel]

How do you find the Slaanesh DP without Might?

Fine really, they munch any infantry without trouble. What I do is that I throw them at enemy troops and send my KoS at armour. With the pavane it ensures that the majority of your force will get a turn 2 assault and also help you shuffle enemy around. They fit a niche' and if I have the points might is the first thing i'd put on them.

 

2 Keepers in a 1500pt list ought to be somewhat intense for the opponent hehe.

They're not as tough as you may think....

 

I'll have to proxy your version of the HeraldSpam. Ive never tried a game without my DPs as I find I rely on them and the Keeper to keep me in the running.

Fiends will be the substitute for your MCs, faster too. Avoid immolators. In the current metagame where everyone is running mech, they also come with lots of anti-tank weapon. Combi-melta, multimelta attack bikes, power fists etc etc.....now laugh as they all translate to ONE dead nett 2/3 of the time.

[Infidel]

Since it's been a little while since anyone posted anything, I'd assume we're jsut waiting for Capt'n to write up the Slaanesh lists.

 

Here's my balanced list:

HQ: 475pt

Herald of Tzeentch, We Are Legion, Master of Sorcery, Bolt of Tzeentch, Chariot, Icon

Herald of Tzeentch, We Are Legion, Master of Sorcery, Bolt of Tzeentch, Chariot

Keeper of Secret, Unholy Might, Soporific Musk

 

Elite: 180

6x Fiends of Slaanesh

 

Troops: 364

9x Pink Horror, Changeling, Bolt of Tzeentch, Icon

9x Pink Horror, Bolt of Tzeentch

 

Heavy Support: 480

Soul Grinder, Phlegm

Soul Grinder, Phlegm

Soul Grinder, Phlegm

 

1499pt

 

Wave 1: Soul Grinder x 3, Herald x 2.

 

This division is so that I can drop in as many of my big guy as possible. The heralds will attempt to reduce as much return fire from the likes of Land Speeder as possible while the phlegm and gaze will focus on exposed heavy weapons, this maximises the surviviblity of my Grinders. The KoS and Fiends will drop into position using Icons, ensuring that they'll arrive without mishap and they can hit whatever they need to hit next turn without any "what-ifs". The icon on the horror squad is bit of an insurance so that even if the wrong wave arrives, the Grinders at least have somewhere to land.

 

The force will flank the enemy and the Grinders will be the vanguard of the assault, firing phlegm as it marches and fleet into CC ASAP. The horrors will sit on objectives and provide fire support where needed but they are best kept a long long way away from any CC threat. Fiends and KoS will be like a supercharged scalpel, taking our dreads and the likes to ensure that Grinders can safely smash things in CC without having to worry about a dread up his arse. The Heralds will be entrusted with the duty of taking out any last-turn objective contesters before they die.

[aberrant_unc]

Fiends are so good, I can't imagine playing a mono-slaanesh build that didn't have 3 6 fiend squads.

[dark_elf]

Fiends : one of the best choices in the Dex :P

 

For me, I don't field many because I dont have the models.

[Captain Malachi]

Yeah, sorry guys, real life has hit, and it's hit hard. I'll have something up sooner or later, shouldn't be more than a couple days.

 

Again, I'm really sorry guys.

[Spaakl Daakli]

I think I can safely (if somewhat arrogantly) say for all of us who have followed this series, that you have no need at all to apologise for r/l popping up and tapping your shoulder occasionally.

 

I haven't contributed to this series (as my depth of knowledge & experience is miniscule by comparison to those who have), but I am but one of a very considerable silent host who consider themselves fortunate to have been able to imbibe so freely and so often at this font of knowledge. Which has only become available because of your vision in initiating these threads, and your balanced & generous stewardship of them as the work has progressed.

 

I have derived the blueprint (very Tzeentch, that) of my mono-Tzeentch force very largely from what has been suggested by this meeting of minds (even more Tzeentchian :rolleyes: :lol: ;) .

 

I trust that your Real Life distractions are not of any regrettable nature, and I look forward to your return to this thread when you are well & truly able.

[Infidel]

I think I can safely (if somewhat arrogantly) say for all of us who have followed this series, that you have no need at all to apologise for r/l popping up and tapping your shoulder occasionally.

 

I haven't contributed to this series (as my depth of knowledge & experience is miniscule by comparison to those who have), but I am but one of a very considerable silent host who consider themselves fortunate to have been able to imbibe so freely and so often at this font of knowledge. Which has only become available because of your vision in initiating these threads, and your balanced & generous stewardship of them as the work has progressed.

 

I have derived the blueprint (very Tzeentch, that) of my mono-Tzeentch force very largely from what has been suggested by this meeting of minds (even more Tzeentchian B) ;) ;) .

 

I trust that your Real Life distractions are not of any regrettable nature, and I look forward to your return to this thread when you are well & truly able.

 

/salute

[antique_nova]

I guess you won't mind me popping in my list? :)

It's my original list which a few people inclidng captain Malachi helped me to tweak

 

1500 points

2x Herald of Tzeenech

2x chariot

2x breath of chaos or Bolt Of Tzeentch

2x mastery of sorcery

2x we are legion

220

 

2x Herald of Tzeenech

2x chariot

2x breath of chaos or Bolt Of Tzeentch

2x mastery of sorcery

2x we are legion

220

 

10x bloodletter

160

 

10x bloodletter

160

 

10x bloodletter

1x Chaos icon

1x Instrument of chaos

190

 

1x deamon prince

1x Mark Of Tzeentch

1x Bolt Of Tzeentch

1x deamonic gaze

1x breath of chaos

190

 

1x deamon prince

1x Mark Of Tzeentch

1x Bolt Of Tzeentch

1x deamonic gaze

1x breath of chaos

190

 

1x deamon prince

1x Mark Of Tzeentch

1x Bolt Of Tzeentch

1x deamonic gaze

1x breath of chaos

190

 

I am not really bothered which ever wave i get to be honest. If i get my waves of bl then i will just pull it hopefully within 13 inches, just outside charge range and forcing them to come to me if they are in cover to able to rapid fire me. This also comes with luck on the die roles. If i get my princes and herlads etc i will place them either far out or very close to use boc.

 

I also saw a competitive player use beasts of nurlge in a competitive 1500 point game. he thinks they are awesome. he also had 3 princes and 3 squads of plaguebearers of 8 guys each. a herald, kurgath and epidermus.

thanks

antique_nova

[Infidel]

I also saw a competitive player use beasts of nurlge in a competitive 1500 point game. he thinks they are awesome. he also had 3 princes and 3 squads of plaguebearers of 8 guys each. a herald, kurgath and epidermus.

Kulgath and Epi and a herald for HQ? That's a bit point hungry for very little. I understand that Kulgath can get the tally up using the poison blast but I can't see how that is any better than the prince list we discussed earlier.

 

Beasts CAN be awesome when the squad pumps out 6 poisoned attack each, but when you roll poorly then it's quite bad. Those points are genuinely better spent on something else.

[minigun762]

I think we can do:

Mono Nurgle

Mono Khorne

Mono Tzeentch

Skarbrand

Balanced

Daemonzilla

 

Mono Slaanesh is a bit meh, but I guess we can do it if we want.

 

Then we'll probably start at the 1500 pt mark. I feel a 1500pt list scales up and down quite nicely. Also, I personally feel that Daemon dont really scale beyond 2500 pt....

 

I've been away for awhile, got myself back into WoW...

Having said that, is there anything I can help with? I'll gladly take up one of these lists and run with it.

[Captain Malachi]

I'm back! For a few days at least, and I bring goodies.

 

Mono-Slaanesh:

Another of Infidels lists for you, this is his herald spam list.

 

4x herald on chariot with unholy might and soporific musk.

 

3x 6 man units of fiends with unholy might.

 

2x 12 man daemonette units with instruments.

1x 6 man daemonette squad with instrument.

 

2x 6 man seeker squads.

 

 

As you can see, there is no heavy support in this list, meaning all the anti-tank is in the fiends, for this reason many of us would recommend including soulgrinders or princes/keepers in a mono-Slaanesh list. However, fiends are surprisingly good at killing tanks, with their speed and decent strength + rending, and with their sheer number of attacks, you’d be surprised how much damage they can do. The problem is, once your opponent realises this, it won’t take him long to wipe them out, so make sure you pick your targets carefully.

 

Each chariot is also capable of tank busting, but is more suited to light infantry killing, much like the daemonettes. With only strength three (four on the heralds) they will have trouble killing toughness fou enemies, but toughness three enemies tend to die quickly, making infantry heavy guard armies a favourite target for these lists.

 

The daemonettes and seekers are there to add numbers more than anything else, although the seekers do have some pretty impressive speed on them, making them good at tying up units. The instruments are there as points filler for than anything else, but you never know it might come in handy.

 

Another way to do mono-Slaanesh is pavane spam. These lists generally have the Masque and couple other heralds with pavane in HQ (maybe a keeper for anti-tank), and then they often have three soulgrinders. With pavane you can bunch enemies up to get hit by the soulgrinders phlegm attacks, very nasty.

 

I decided to go with Infidels herald spam list, just for something different really, but I tried to adress alternative options where it was applicable.

 

Oh, and thank you Spaakl Daakli. No it was nothing bad, just a case of leaving everything to the last minute, and then really not being ready when the last minute came around. It's good to hear they've been of some use as well. As I said, I'm back for a few days, but hopefully I'll have time to keep up with this from now on.

 

Daemonzilla next? We could always use my list for that. It's always been focussed very heavily on the MCs, obviously I'd make notes on bloodcrushers though in the actual write up.

 

HQ:

Bloodthirster w/ blessing of the Blood God and unholy might.

Keeper of secrets w/ unholy might and soporific musk.

 

Troops:

7x plaguebearers.

7x plaguebearers.

7x plaguebearers.

 

Heavy support:

Daemon prince w/ mark of Nurgle, noxious touch, daemonic flight, iron hide, breath of chaos and cloud of flies.

Daemon prince w/ mark of Nurgle, noxious touch, daemonic flight, iron hide and cloud of flies.

Daemon prince w/ mark of Nurgle, noxious touch, daemonic flight, iron hide and cloud of flies.

 

Of course if anyone would rather we used a different list that's fine.