Little Advice

[Jaxx]

Hey, the names jack im 17 and looking to start collecting and learning the gameplay of Warhammer 40k.

 

Im after a little advice, i've looked through the armies and im keen on Chaos however i really don't know how to work this, im thinking of going with the simple Black Legion colour scheme because im not the best of painters however its still quiet a cool look and im sure i can paint them ok.

 

But what does this mean if i commit to the black legion?

 

I understand i can use all the Beserkers, 1k sons, PM or Noise Marines as elites but im rather confused. Personally i prefer the look of Nurgle but theres no way in hell ill be able to paint them to a standard that they deserve so im looking to stick to black legion, however are the tactical squads pants? I've had a gander at all these army lists and none of them involve just basic tactical marines, its all a mix of the God soldiers. What should i do? Im rather confused, like the next guy im not made of money and can't really afford to go and buy a tactical squad to find out 3 weeks later there pants and were a waste of money i should go and get myself some plauge marines or noise marines etc. So first runs the question what would be a good army to go with, please add the note i really am not a confident painter, hense black legion, spray black, then touch up the trims.

 

Then the question arrises what weponary should i give the infantry because i see all these posts all saying i wouldn't of gone with the melta gun should of gone with the flamer etc but im just curious what to do, as if i say i give one of my marines a melta gun and i want him to have a flamer, do i have to take it all off and resculpt him etc? i was thinking of giving a plain tactical squad a heavy bolter, but once again i really don't know.

 

Its all a confusing world when you first start so any advice would be hugely appreciated. Please be gentle as when i say im just starting to learn the game i mean im taking a little coarse down the games workshop learning the game, so i really am new to this and just looking to get myself my first box of men and some paints and just make my first unit all together.

 

So once again the questions:

What colour scheme/type of chaos should i paint/buy?

What wepons should i arm them with?

What are the perks of having a god driven army or an undivded army?

 

Thanks for any advice given. Please keep it simple and easy for a noob to understand laugh.gif

 

-

 

This is the route i entend to take

 

Going to purchase myself a codex tommorow have a read up then get myself a tactical squad, paint them up, once done purchase another tactical squad and a chaos lord in terminator armour so i have 2 Troop Units and 1 HQ unit, the paint theme was going to be Black Legion.

 

After which i was going to get myself some Khorne Bezerkers as an Elite Choice with a rhino to transport them in, from there on move on to possibly some Havocs for heavy support or some Plauge Marines or Noise Marines, i don't wish to get tanks too fast (apart from a rhino) and just build up my core army.

 

Would this be a good way for me to go or not?

 

And also i was curious whats Abadon like? Good unit to have or bad?

 

Also can i have Khorne Bezerkers + Plauge Marines or Noise Marines on the field as elite choices? or can i only choose one god faction as elites?

 

And do the Black Legion follow one of the 4 gods? or are they undivided?

 

(this is two of my posts merged into one, split by the "-" mark, i posted into the wrong forum and was re-directed by a member)

 

- Jaxx

[Drudge Dreadnought]

Welcome to 40k, and welcome to Chaos!

 

Im after a little advice, i've looked through the armies and im keen on Chaos however i really don't know how to work this, im thinking of going with the simple Black Legion colour scheme because im not the best of painters however its still quiet a cool look and im sure i can paint them ok.

 

Black Legion is an excellent color scheme overall. Its easy to do at a decent tabletop quality, and also can be used with much more advanced techniques. You can't really go wrong with it.

 

I understand i can use all the Beserkers, 1k sons, PM or Noise Marines as elites but im rather confused. Personally i prefer the look of Nurgle but theres no way in hell ill be able to paint them to a standard that they deserve so im looking to stick to black legion, however are the tactical squads pants? I've had a gander at all these army lists and none of them involve just basic tactical marines, its all a mix of the God soldiers. What should i do? Im rather confused, like the next guy im not made of money and can't really afford to go and buy a tactical squad to find out 3 weeks later there pants and were a waste of money i should go and get myself some plauge marines or noise marines etc. So first runs the question what would be a good army to go with, please add the note i really am not a confident painter, hense black legion, spray black, then touch up the trims.

 

Actually, using Cult Marines (berserkers etc) as elites was an old codex thing. In the current codex they are all troops. It is also fairly simple to do very effective, good looking nurgle marines as many nurgle color schemes are just layered washes. They can somtimes be easier than other schemes due to needing less precise highlights to still look good. I wouldn't worry about the skill required for them if they are what you like.

 

Chaos has some of the best standard troops in the game. Our regular old vanilla marines are a very solid unit. Plagues and Berserkers are used in the top tournament lists though. My advice would be to get the Codex and read it.

 

Then the question arrises what weponary should i give the infantry because i see all these posts all saying i wouldn't of gone with the melta gun should of gone with the flamer etc but im just curious what to do, as if i say i give one of my marines a melta gun and i want him to have a flamer, do i have to take it all off and resculpt him etc? i was thinking of giving a plain tactical squad a heavy bolter, but once again i really don't know.

 

Get the codex, read it back to back, then come back and start asking questions. There are also lots of tactica threads on this board to read.

 

Its all a confusing world when you first start so any advice would be hugely appreciated. Please be gentle as when i say im just starting to learn the game i mean im taking a little coarse down the games workshop learning the game, so i really am new to this and just looking to get myself my first box of men and some paints and just make my first unit all together.

 

You've come to the right place, ask lots of questions. Sorry i don't have time to answer all your questions atm but i'm sure somone else will.

[LuNCHBiZZLe]

Welcome to the fun of chaos,I've played alot of armies over the years and chaos is by yfar my favorite to play for fun/fluff.As far as what to take sounds like you're lookin at the older codex grab yourself the newer version and flip threw it a bit before you start buyin things.Also get some practice games in even if that meens watchin people at your local store play and askin questions(look for chaos players),most will be happy to help a new gamer out.

[chillin]

Wow, you ask alot of Q's. As a big black legion fanboy I'll try to answer as many as I can and put them in some kinda order.

 

1- yes BL paint scheme is ez, but as you get better painter, you can use more advanced techniques and make them really standout.

so they good for begainers and more advanced painters. I get complaments on my army all the time.

2- Yes, you can use PM's, T'sons, brzrkrs, NM's, and csm's all as troops (so can every other chaos army now, sounds like you have codex 3 or codex 3.5), You can use PM models but paint them in BL colors or alot of people (including myself use reg csm models with shield and other things to use as "PM's". You can not go wrong with reg csm's (tacticals) they are one of the best, most cost efficent troops in the game. As to how to equip. meltas, flamers, plaz, are all good. You don't give a guy a flamer then decide you want a melt then break it off and resculpt him. you give some guys meltas, some flamers, some plaz. You'll often want some of each in each army list anyway. Do not put hvy bolters in reg csm (tac) squads, but hvy bolters in havocs I like.

3- I use mostly undivided csm's with maybe 1 cult (god) troop in 1500 or 1600, some people use more cult troops, you can do whatever you want, undivided csm's, brzrkrs, and PM's are probably best for newer players. Having a totally god driven army tends to be more specialized and smaller (b/c they cost more pts), an undivided (or mostly undivided) army tends to be more versitle and larger (b/c each guy is cheaper).

You really can't say 1 is better then other, just depends on what you like and how you want to play.

4- can't go wrong with buying csm squads, but don't get a termii lord, use a winged lord, can make one up out of the reg csm squad box and get the winged back back for him (I assume you can buy this as a "bit" now for a few dollars). Don't let the GW guy talk you into buying the termi lord model (or anything else you don't want). Going to need some rinos for those troops too.

5- After that some brzrkrs or PM's would be good (but like I said they r troops now not elites. Gotta get some oblits at some point too.

Abbadon is a powerhouse but needs a LR to be effective and is expensive (points).

7- different members of the BL worship different gods and other BL members worship as undivided (this used to be unique amongst the chaos legions), so they can have cult troops as well as undivid troops.

 

I suggest reading the "chaos lords handbook" and "asp champs handbook" in the GRAVIS section of this sub-forum alot of you Q's will be answered in more detail and better explained there.

From your post it sounds like you got you hands on an old codex (3.0 or 3.5) read the fluff (fiction) of the BL in there, it will give you a better understanding of the legion, to make sure that's the one you want to do. I love the fluff and paint scheme of the BL B) so for me it was definately the right choice.

Welcome to B&C and the BL (maybe ;) )

[Jaxx]

Ok. Thanks for the replies and im beggining to understand, got myself a new codex today and i still run the question, why not go for a lord in terminator armour? As a first resort i think i would like one just so i can go to the GW and play with 2 tactical squads and a Lord in T Armour, then im sure i can rebuy another lord in future, was thinking Abaddon/Deamon Price or just a regular lord in power armour. I don't really understand what difference these wings would do?

 

Also when i read through the codex today, im looking at posessed marines, would they be a better choice than Bezerkers?

 

Other than that i think im sorted except for the lord, i like the terminator armour but i don't see the downfall of it, could somebody tell me?

 

 

- Jaxx

[daemon*hunter]

Termie lord

pros:

excellent save

looks awesome

cons:

Expensive

mobility (or lack of)

doesn't fit in a rhino

 

wings

Pros:

relatively cheap

very mobile

fits in a rhino

Cons:

can be hard to find suitable wings

 

Daemon Prince

pros:

looks awesome

can (should) take wings

tougher than lord

Eternal warrior

psychic

Fire magnet

cons:

expensive

big

cant use transports

fire magnet

 

Daemon Prince Win.

[Jaxx]

so would you recomend a normal lord or termi lord? can't termi lords be deepstruck?

[daemon*hunter]

so would you recomend a normal lord or termi lord? can't termi lords be deepstruck?

I'd recommend non-termie, more mobile and can also deepstrike with jump pack or, iirc wings.

But you don't want to deepstrike something that expensive, too risky.

[Jaxx]

but the thing is i won't be putting wings on it for a long time due to im only new and want to play it simple, whats the movement of a termi lord oposed to a normal man? and would it be a good idea to team a normal chaos lord into a squad of 9 bezerkers to make up 10, then put them in a rhino? or would the lord be better off on his todd?

[daemon*hunter]

I put my winged lord in a rhino, to stop him gettin sniped, he jumps out, flies away from what evers in there with him, then generaly dies ;)

 

Termie lords walk at normal speed, but (i think, dont quote me on this) cant run.

[chillin]

why not go for a lord in terminator armour?

I don't really understand what difference these wings would do?

Also when i read through the codex today, im looking at posessed marines, would they be a better choice than Bezerkers?

 

1- too slow, can't ride in rino, you already get 5+ invul.

2- wings move 12", over terrian, troops, walls etc.

3- possessed not as goood as brzrkrs but cost more pts.

[chillin]

I put my winged lord in a rhino, to stop him gettin sniped, he jumps out, flies away from what evers in there with him, then generaly dies :)

 

Then you're doing something wrong, you can't put him in a situation where he can be shot with hvy weops or plaz or overwhelmed in CC.

[Jaxx]

so if i get a normal lord with wings, should i accompany him with some raptors? just to take flak and support him in CC?

 

 

The choices i was going to go for and the reasons:

 

Termi Lord - Deep strike with squad of terminators causing high casulties fingers crossed, if hes killed, his death is in vain and still can cause alot of kills using the terminators

Normal Lord - Either accompany with 9 Bezerks in a rhino or have 10 bezerks in a rhino then keep him on foot accompanied by 5 odd Chosen space marines with CC wepons

Normal Lord w/ Wings - Accompany with Raptors for defence and CC numbers

 

Are any of these options a good idea?

 

Personally i prefer the Termi lord idea but i really don't know, i don't like the idea of him running around on his todd but if i got bezerks i entend to get Khârn The Betrayer to accompany them at some point, which laeds me to one last question, Can i play Khârn in a BL army?

 

Edit - Or should i keep a normal lord on his own w/ wings and then fly him in assisting any cc battles etc? is that a better way to play?

[LuNCHBiZZLe]

I use jump lords(wings) and jump them up behind my rhinos as they advance then after I deploy I give a good round of shootin(with the lord joined) and most likly loose 1 or 2 marines then they get back in the tank and move to the next threat(wings will let you do this).

[Jaxx]

What about a chaos lord with a jump pack? The model is armed with twin lightning claws, is that a good way to go? no guns but good in CC, can jump him in to assist other squads or even pair him with a group of raptors.

 

I don't like the idea of putting my own wings on him, i won't be able to do a good job.

 

Would this be a good idea? Twin lightning claws and a squad of raptor support? or no raptor support?

[Night Stalker]

What about a chaos lord with a jump pack? The model is armed with twin lightning claws, is that a good way to go? no guns but good in CC, can jump him in to assist other squads or even pair him with a group of raptors.

 

I don't like the idea of putting my own wings on him, i won't be able to do a good job.

 

Would this be a good idea? Twin lightning claws and a squad of raptor support? or no raptor support?

It sucks. But if you want to go this route, try Mark of Khorne + Jump Packs (or wings, they cost the same and allow you to board rhinos/lrs - stupidity, but morons wrote this codex) + Lighting Claws, or Mark of Tzeentch + Steed + Lighting Claws.

 

Former is cheaper, latter is more expensive and cost few points more. both give you that important 6 attack when charging.

[Jaxx]

i don't want to go down the wing route because putting wings on the unit would be a little too hard for me (im only new) and i think the model would look stupid, i doubt ild put my lord in a rhino anyway because i would use it for other purposes, but do you think the jump pack lord with lightning claws is a good unit?

 

Is it worth sacrificing the gun for both claws? and should he be accompanied by some raptors for extra support?

[Drudge Dreadnought]

Get a box of possessed. Comes with 2 winged backpacks.

[Night Stalker]

i don't want to go down the wing route because putting wings on the unit would be a little too hard for me (im only new) and i think the model would look stupid, i doubt ild put my lord in a rhino anyway because i would use it for other purposes, but do you think the jump pack lord with lightning claws is a good unit?

 

Is it worth sacrificing the gun for both claws? and should he be accompanied by some raptors for extra support?

So Lord with Pack then, only a bit worse (for the same points :/). I said it before- it sucks, so it's not good unit in comparition with say daemon prince with wings.

 

you can buy gun after you buy claws, so the point is moot. Raptors generaly speaking sucks too. it's not the strongesyt choice - but you could play and win with them, and with lord - as long as you dont want optimal build they are both perfectly acceptable.

[LuNCHBiZZLe]

I would use the lord with lightnin claws but figure out a way to do wings that way you can get in a transport still.

[Jaxx]

i don't want to go down the wing route because putting wings on the unit would be a little too hard for me (im only new) and i think the model would look stupid, i doubt ild put my lord in a rhino anyway because i would use it for other purposes, but do you think the jump pack lord with lightning claws is a good unit?

 

Is it worth sacrificing the gun for both claws? and should he be accompanied by some raptors for extra support?

So Lord with Pack then, only a bit worse (for the same points :/). I said it before- it sucks, so it's not good unit in comparition with say daemon prince with wings.

 

you can buy gun after you buy claws, so the point is moot. Raptors generaly speaking sucks too. it's not the strongesyt choice - but you could play and win with them, and with lord - as long as you dont want optimal build they are both perfectly acceptable.

 

well i do entend to get a deamon prince in the long run, but this is just for a small army so i can play with my friends, you can also field 2 hq units so i could field a deamon prince with my jump pack unit.

 

But a 5 man jump pack unit 1 aspring champion with lighting claws aswell, all with mark of khorne, thats alot of attacks for a 6 man unit.

 

Also im only playing for fun, not tourny. Remember im only new, i haven't even got my first squad of men yet :lol:

 

Im only here looking for a little advice. Thats all

[Teal]

I would buy the battle force. Good value, a crap load of models, and a rhino! After that, grab a second rhino. Although possessed are a tad on the weak side, I find that between their general awesome appearance and the "oh-crap-demons!" effect on some opponents, they can be a lot of fun in a casual game. As mentioned previously, with a bit of work/extra bits you can use the spare parts from the CSM to make a chaos lord on the cheap. Like others said, give him some wings. The possessed come with a winged backpack. Use it, it's easy. The model will look good (I think, at least. I used some eagle wings that I had laying about from my wood elf days)

[incinerator950]

I managed to get ahold of the wing sprue for possessed. I'm giving 1 to my Sorc of Nurgle. It's not as complicated as it looks actually, but since my guys jetpack is supposed to be attached to something that's sticking out of his back, and not something else, I might improvise some greenstuff to make it look more attached.

[Jaxx]

don't get me wrong, wings are probably better than a jet pack, but with the jet pack i can then get a unit of raptors to come with him, they won't be able to get in a rhino if i give him wings. And i want him to have twin lightning claws, but i think the jump pack lord is a cool figure, were as if i made my own he wouldn't look as good

[Teal]

If you give him wings, he can still join some raptors. He's still jump infantry. Wings offer a bit more versatility, and like I said before, you can just glue on the possessed winged backpack. It looks good, and there's no work involved. No converserions, just swap backpacks.