Iron Warrior w/ Servo Arm Posted July 26, 2009 Share Posted July 26, 2009 Which is, of course, a profound mistake. hobbies such as Warhammer/40K are never going to be mainstream; they are cult by nature, especially when one considers they compete with much more immediately gratifying fair such as computer games. By dumbing down the game, what they are effectively doing is alienating those who would be more consistent customers, i.e. the dedicated "cult" fan base who have allowed the game(s) to survive and progress to their current state. IMO, rather than attempting to artificially expand its market, GW would be better off consolidating the one it already has and doing its damndest to ensure that it maintains their enthusiasm. Speaking personally, I've been playing FB and 40K since the late '80s, and have spent not only a great deal of money but invested a significant amount of creative energy in the hobby. This is the first instance in all that time where I have said: forget it, what I am expending on the hobby isn't being returned anymore. Even with the drear 3rd edition codex there was at least some suggestion that they were willing to fix the mistakes made (with errata and Index Astartes articles). This time around, it seems the company is being far more intransigent, and I for one am getting to the point where I will be leaving it behind entirely very, very shortly if we do not see some meaningful sign that the situation has been acknowledged and that something is being done to rectify it. Actually, you should quit immediately as I really doubt GW will change anytime soon. Even if they do, this edition is already out so you have to do what I do and wait for the next one. A company is not your friend, and you should not treat it like one. If they screw up, stop supporting them and let them know where they went wrong (which is the point of the letters). If they do things right, then give them money. The thing is, if you read the GW annual reports, they state how they are "dedicated to the niche market", but their policies say otherwise. Do you really think you should keep on buying their products? You can just what I do, and focus on the fluff and painting (use Vallejo!) rather than playing the game. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2060872 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grand Master Tyrak Posted July 26, 2009 Share Posted July 26, 2009 Which is, of course, a profound mistake. hobbies such as Warhammer/40K are never going to be mainstream; they are cult by nature, especially when one considers they compete with much more immediately gratifying fair such as computer games. By dumbing down the game, what they are effectively doing is alienating those who would be more consistent customers, i.e. the dedicated "cult" fan base who have allowed the game(s) to survive and progress to their current state. This is the problem - once Warhammer stops being the latest cool thing, GW are going to turn around and discover that in the process, they've alienated all their existing supporters. The policy of "ignore your supporters, they'll remain your supporters always, instead cater to those who aren't your supporters" is all well and good when it was first invented, but it's in general circulation now - we've got wise to it, and we're not going to put up with it. It's not that GW shouldn't expand, it's that they shouldn't expand at the expense of their supporters - it'll drive them (us) away, and there's no guarantee there'll be new ones to replace them. You can just what I do, and focus on the fluff and painting (use Vallejo!) rather than playing the game. Already there. :lol: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2060893 Share on other sites More sharing options...
incinerator950 Posted July 26, 2009 Share Posted July 26, 2009 I still have the vassal software that GW has so horribly tried to shutdown, so after I figure out how they work, I'll start playing with it :lol:. I love free gaming. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2060970 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Hadafix Posted July 29, 2009 Author Share Posted July 29, 2009 Almost forgot.... Letter Sent! And if the warp gets it, then may it be damned! Now the waiting game, has anyone got a Tarot stack or Regicide board and pieces while we wait? :blink: Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2064581 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Evar Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Yeah I am also dissapointed with the 4.0 chaos dex. My BL don't feel special anymore because of the lack of other choices from the absence of rules/builds in the 3.5 dex. For example in the old dex my friends AL were vastly diffrent to my BL. Now its the same comp- DP, oblits, rhino CSM's- PF and dual melta/flamer ect. I know I should not complain about my BL since other CSM armies got screwed hard (EC,AL and NL), but the BL are now in the same leauge as the corsairs or random DIY warbands. I can't bring myself to finish the new BL mini's I put together. I now play WH Hordes of chaos and am having a ball with fantasy. 40K wise I am just painting up some Sable Swords SM squads. The goal is to slowly make a battle company. I will always like the BL for their fluff and look, but I don't think I can play with them again until the edition changes or the dex gets better. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2065236 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kinzel Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 heh I think I'm alot like some of you guys who don't play with the army anymore. Although in my case it's because the last hobby store that sold GW stuff in my city closed down a while back and I don't know anyone who still plays. I think the stores might have stayed open longer if GW had managed to keep the players attention as they all seemed to start with 1 army then like all good magpie gamers everywhere moved to the next shiny 1 to be released. Problem being they had no real attachment to any of them and nothing to call them back :D Quite funny cos a couple hours drive away is a smallish town that has a toy store that happens to sell GW and has a thriving gaming community. Duno what to make of that then. My army used to be almost fully undivided(loyalists at heart) and that was great as any Chaos army I played against was vastly different to mine in style and feel and yet now with me being Loyalists who were betrayed but still loyal and them being a 10 000 year old First Founding Traitor Legion we could be twins. I have over a company of marines who I now just cycle through rebuilding and repainting :huh: Is it sad that I might enjoy that more than the actual battles? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2065358 Share on other sites More sharing options...
incinerator950 Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Try local stores that stock. GW's shop locater is helpful for once. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2065386 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kinzel Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 Not so much. The store finder doesn't cover South Africa so the closest way for me to search is the stores page in White Dwarf. It was through that that I found the little toy shop couple hours from me :o The other 2 major cities covered that actually have proper stores are 1000+kms away each so.. ;> Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2065693 Share on other sites More sharing options...
incinerator950 Posted July 30, 2009 Share Posted July 30, 2009 0_o jesus christ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2065705 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Hadafix Posted July 31, 2009 Author Share Posted July 31, 2009 Not so much. The store finder doesn't cover South Africa so the closest way for me to search is the stores page in White Dwarf. It was through that that I found the little toy shop couple hours from me :D The other 2 major cities covered that actually have proper stores are 1000+kms away each so.. ;> Thats what happens when you live in a big country, things seem to be further apart. I suppose going by plane to these places is a bit extreme, but if it makes you feel better, though I am only a few miles from my nearest store, it takes about an hour to get there via bus. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2066800 Share on other sites More sharing options...
daboarder Posted August 1, 2009 Share Posted August 1, 2009 big country HA! try it in oz now sydney is ok but god forbid if you live in another state Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2067204 Share on other sites More sharing options...
minigun762 Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 Has anyone heard a response yet? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2075629 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Hadafix Posted August 10, 2009 Author Share Posted August 10, 2009 I am hoping for the end of this week, that is if the postal strikes dont slow things down further. If everyone who said they were going to send a letter sent one, then surely they have to send at least one letter back. You did all remember to put a return address on your letters? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2075751 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuskRaider Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 I highly doubt they'll respond. GW won't admit a mistake or that they are alienating a lot of players and fans. Seriously, don't hold your breath I don't want to see you guys disappointed. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2075785 Share on other sites More sharing options...
the jeske Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 I am hoping for the end of this week, that is if the postal strikes dont slow things down further. If everyone who said they were going to send a letter sent one, then surely they have to send at least one letter back. You did all remember to put a return address on your letters? not really normally GW anwsers only to mails and sometimes [aka a few years ago ] in a general post to the public , but they havent done that since the fast errata to nids immunity to instant death. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2076053 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Angel Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 lets give it a bit more time shall we. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2076639 Share on other sites More sharing options...
incinerator950 Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 I'm sorry op, I never sent out the letter :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2076644 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Hadafix Posted August 11, 2009 Author Share Posted August 11, 2009 I'm sorry op, I never sent out the letter :( Then send one, it doesnt matter that most have been sent by now, just that as many as possible are sent. I agree that they may choose to ignore the letters, but then they really are ignoring the fan base. In that case, if it seems that is what they are doing (giving fair amount of time) then maybe posting up threads every where stating that GW doesnt listen will get some kind of answer from them. Anyone up for starting a letter campaign to the share holders trustee if this fails? The Post Office cant eat all the letters sent to them, or those sent out. And I have some faith that GW will at least answer, just maybe not in the way that many hope for. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2076759 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron_Chaos_Brute Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 A 3 month break from B&C, and this is the first thread I see in Chaos Ascendant. Good to see everything is still the same. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2076875 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Angel Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 I'm woking up a flow up letter Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2078793 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magnus Thane Posted August 14, 2009 Share Posted August 14, 2009 Well overall i am no advocate of adding hordes of options and rules in it for Legions etc. But i do think the codex faild hugely in some regards. Above all the fact that some potentially very cool and useful units are crippled. Like the Possessed or the Dreads for instance. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2079694 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spreader Posted August 14, 2009 Share Posted August 14, 2009 Has anyone heard a response yet? Dear. Michael, I just wanted to drop you a quick line to thank you for your recent letter. Unfortunately the number of letters I receive means taht I can't reply personally to all of them, but I did want to let you know that I had received and read yours, and really appreciated the fact that you took the time write. Please don't hesitate o get in touch again; I read all of the mail I receive and find it really helps to keep me in touch with the grass roots of the hobby. Sincerely, Jervis Johnson Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2079933 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drudge Dreadnought Posted August 15, 2009 Share Posted August 15, 2009 Splendid sir! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2080052 Share on other sites More sharing options...
SquirrelKing Posted August 15, 2009 Share Posted August 15, 2009 Dear. Michael, I just wanted to drop you a quick line to thank you for your recent letter. Unfortunately the number of letters I receive means taht I can't reply personally to all of them, but I did want to let you know that I had received and read yours, and really appreciated the fact that you took the time write. Please don't hesitate o get in touch again; I read all of the mail I receive and find it really helps to keep me in touch with the grass roots of the hobby. Sincerely, Jervis Johnson Not to sound too pessimistic, but that reads like a cookie cutter answer... :) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2080099 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DuskRaider Posted August 15, 2009 Share Posted August 15, 2009 Yup. Definitely just a secretary slappin the Jervis seal on a generic letter and sending it out. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/172566-complaining-about-the-ccsm/page/8/#findComment-2080262 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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