Mephiston

[Ultramarcos]

That's one general question that I have as well for the Wings of Sanguinius power...do the Librarian have to take same Dangerous Terrain test as Jump Pack unities does?

[Morticon]

yup.

[Ultramarcos]

yup.

 

 

shoot.. :P

 

Here goes another on Mephiston (to not risk divert from the original thread subject)

 

Mephy vs Sanguinor, Exemplar of the Daemonhost...errrr...Host.

 

what about comparing the Lord of Death against our Demon, I mean angel ? what are your thoughts about it ?

 

Generally speaking I believe Mephy is more usable in games ,as it's Stats are more...say....robust..and honestly I'm not sure how to use Sanguinor either...

[JamesI]

You can avoid the dangerous terrain test if what is providing Mephiston cover is another unit. Have some tac marines or assault marines in front of Mephi, so if someone wants to shoot him he has cover, but no drawback when he moves (as the cover just gets out of his way).

[Morticon]

Im keen to hear what other people think on the matter..but here are my findings ->

 

Statistically -

 

Mephy is twice as survivable as the Sanguinor for everything S5 AP3 and lower.

While everything AP2 and S7+, the Sang is twice as survivable as Mephiston.

 

The Sang is by far more reliable - no tests needed for his powers.

 

But Mephiston is able to kill much more, yet the Sang is solid and stable.

The Sangs benefits to boost your own army is also undeniable and something we should really take advantage of if we use him.

 

 

I'll be using the Sang pretty soon too - I've jsut been reluctant to because of the need for anti psyker ability!

[Crynn]

Not exactly correct in all circumstances mort because unless your talking pure combat meph should have a cover save which would actually make him less vulnerable to str 7+ ap 2 weapons than the sanguinor at range. I also found the Sangs buffs are very medioca for the lack of combat prowess he has over meph. Also Meph actually beats a few things that the sang doesnt in 1v1 combat. The swarmlord and Nightbringer for example, the sang gets annihilated by both.

[Morticon]

Not exactly correct in all circumstances mort because unless your talking pure combat meph should have a cover save which would actually make him less vulnerable to str 7+ ap 2 weapons than the sanguinor at range. I also found the Sangs buffs are very medioca for the lack of combat prowess he has over meph. Also Meph actually beats a few things that the sang doesnt in 1v1 combat. The swarmlord and Nightbringer for example, the sang gets annihilated by both.

 

 

Yup yup. Thats not factoring in cover.

With cover obviously much better.

[rodgambit]

Does Skulltaker from the demon army get his 2+ invul against all of Meph's attacks?

[Morticon]

Does Skulltaker from the demon army get his 2+ invul against all of Meph's attacks?

 

Def. not.

Mephs psychic abilities (except the Force Weapon) all effect Mephiston.

The S10 sword is not an ability being used on the Skulltaker (or Kharne) its being used on Mephy.

 

(All of this is working on the assumption that its a 2+ save vs. psychic powers, not a regular 2+ inv.)

[Whitefireinferno]

Mort I think he means the whole "Blah blah 2++ against force weapons and Psy powers" since it doesnot say whether the force weapons are just the ID effect or all attacks made since mephy is using a force weapon. I say he only gets the 2++ against the ID effect of the Force weapon since its only Psyker like when he is doing his your gonna die power.

[Requiem of the Wolf]

Mort I think he means the whole "Blah blah 2++ against force weapons and Psy powers" since it doesnot say whether the force weapons are just the ID effect or all attacks made since mephy is using a force weapon. I say he only gets the 2++ against the ID effect of the Force weapon since its only Psyker like when he is doing his your gonna die power.

Hate to interrupt,but does anyone know if Tempest's wrath would affect Sanguinius when he is using the Blood Wing power or whatever its called? I was told it wouldn't and I haven't found anything to contradict that yet,was just curious.

[Whitefireinferno]

I would say yes he does have to make the Tests But that May not be correct so I will wait for somebody else to answer.

[Morticon]

Mort I think he means the whole "Blah blah 2++ against force weapons and Psy powers" since it doesnot say whether the force weapons are just the ID effect or all attacks made since mephy is using a force weapon. I say he only gets the 2++ against the ID effect of the Force weapon since its only Psyker like when he is doing his your gonna die power.

 

WI - totally matey. Just the psychic power part of the force weapon- not the attacks itself. Thats not a psychic power. However, we may have both forgotten that Daemons are immune to instant death ><;

 

 

What is tempests wrath?

[Hazard]

Tempest's Wrath - SW Codex Libby power that makes jump troops, skimmers etc. take dangerous terrain tests. And RAW Libby with wings won't need to take tests unless he is deep striking since his type remains Infantry.

[liberate_tutame]

Can I ask very obvious question, how many attacks does Mephy get on the charge? Does his force sword count as a close combat weapon? Meaning he gets six on the charge, five normally?

[rodgambit]

Meph's plasma pistol+force weapon does grant him another attack in CC.

[liberate_tutame]

Thanks rodgambit. About to use him for only the second time and wanted to make sure. :)

[rodgambit]

Cool. I've used him in several games ranging from 1250-1500. He's my favorite character and just a monster on the table.

[kollar]

That's one general question that I have as well for the Wings of Sanguinius power...do the Librarian have to take same Dangerous Terrain test as Jump Pack unities does?

 

 

yup.

 

Is that really so Morticon? Under the Wings of Sanguinus power, it states that he "move as if he had a jump pack", it doesn't change his unit type to Jump Infantry.

[JamesI]

Mort I think he means the whole "Blah blah 2++ against force weapons and Psy powers" since it doesnot say whether the force weapons are just the ID effect or all attacks made since mephy is using a force weapon. I say he only gets the 2++ against the ID effect of the Force weapon since its only Psyker like when he is doing his your gonna die power.

The problem with this is Skulltaker is immune to the instant kill as a demon. The 2++ against force weapons is useless unless it applies to wounds caused by forceweapons.

[Morticon]

yup.

 

Is that really so Morticon? Under the Wings of Sanguinus power, it states that he "move as if he had a jump pack", it doesn't change his unit type to Jump Infantry.

 

Matey, you're quite right, I shouldnt have been so quick on that one cause it is a bit grayer than a lot of other issues.

 

 

My initial take on the matter was as follows:

 

Take a look at the rule for jump packs on page 62.

 

 

"Models equipped with jump packs are jump infantry."

 

Thats what I used to justify my thinking.

 

However,strict RAW applied, you may be right as I think there are grounds for arguing that moving as if he had a pack is not him actually having a pack.

 

I used to play him as counting him as having a jump pack. But, that doesnt seem to be the case.

 

><; feel a bit dirty about that..but seems to be the way the RAW is. Other thoughts?

[kollar]

><; feel a bit dirty about that..but seems to be the way the RAW is. Other thoughts?

 

Well, I would use the same ruling for Chaos models with wings. They aren't jump infantry either, they have the same wording. That is; "moves as jump infantry". And they can even enter vehicles, unless I'm mistaken?

[igotsmeakabob!!]

There's no need to feel guilty.

Tempest's Wrath affects units by their type (jumpI, skimmers, etc).

Mephiston isn't affected by it because his movement power doesn't change his unit type.

However, Jump Infantry (assault squads) can't NOT be affected by it because moving 6" doesn't change their unit type, they just "move like infantry."

[Morticon]

Damn- that also means ive been playing jump infantry wrong for years now.

 

If you walk into DT, youre still liable for dangerous tests. Kinda sucky.

[igotsmeakabob!!]

Very much so!

My hatred for the Wolves is great in this respect.