The Rift Lords - Ace's idea for traitors

[Ace Debonair]

I can't fight it anymore... It's time to increase my workload yet again! :D

 

After working on some really cool ideas for a traitor warband for months and months, I've managed to lose my first draft of the ideas. :lol:

Common sense dictates starting over, but I've sat on this project too long - I'm wondering how well this idea will float, and I can't take the waiting any more.

So, I'll be building these guys piece by piece like I am with the Infinity Knights, but first I'll hit you guys with some bullet point ideas I have for this chapter.

 

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*Lead by two distinct figures - Lord Maluk and Keja the Sorceror. Maluk is a brooding, dangerous leader who leads through might. Keja is a shrewd tactician and his ability to think several moves ahead makes him valuable to the warband. Think of him as sort of an evil Grand Vizier type - whilst Maluk is the obvious leader, (and therefore the obvious target), Keja is often the one who makes the less obvious decisions and plants ideas in Maluk's head.

 

* Operating behind the scenes for much of their early life, out of the view of the Imperium. With hindsight, reports of some Imperial bear similarities to the atrocities performed by the Rift Lords, and in this fashion their actions can be traced back to the years after the Heresy.

 

* Thier favoured methods are those of lightning-fast attacks, hitting unexpecting enemies from multiple sides at once if possible. They prefer to take prisoners where possible, especially when attacking undefended settlements. After victories prisoners are offered to the Chaos Gods in mass sacrifices, and the desecrated corpses of the slain are piled up to form a star of chaos on the floor.

 

* Strongly against overt worship of individual Chaos Gods. Instead, they dedicate their worship to the entire pantheon, like the Word Bearers. The Rift Lords also worship the Chaos Primarchs, seeing them as demigods who emobdy the potential of man under Chaos. As a side note, they'd dislike the Black Legion for turning their back on Horus' legacy.

 

* Rather than mindless, slavering pawns of Chaos, however, the Rift Lords are highly disciplined and cold. They see themselves as saviours, vying to liberate Mankind from the suppressive influence of the Emperor and his lackeys, and to embrace the power and potential of Chaos.

 

* The Rift Lords have covered a great deal of Imperial space in their time, travelling from system to system until they reached the Shroud Stars, in the galactic North, near the Infinity Knights.

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And this is where I reach the parts I'm unsure about. I honestly don't know if these are even plausible ideas.

 

My very, very first idea for these guys was to have them be a large warband that operates over an enormously long range, meaning Rift Lords could be sighted in almost any part of the galaxy at any given time.

I don't have a clue how I could do that, realistically.

 

My second risky idea runs as follows.

Maluk and Keja are both aware that the loyal Astartes are the biggest obstacle in the way of liberating the Imperium. Logically, they are prioity targets, especially when weakened. When a founding rolls around, and more chapters come into existence, they are often largely made up of inexperienced marines. Part of their favoured tactics would be to seek out newly-founded chapters and eliminate them before they get chance to get that experience.

Obviously, this would require either huge foresight on the part of Keja or a good spy network. The former is a wee bit unlikely, so the latter is the only real option. ^_^

 

Unknown origins is the third potential idea. As you can see the Rift Lords borrow ideas to one extent or another from many different existing legions - the diverse worship of the Word Bearers, the surprise-attack penchant of the Night Lords, and possibly even a spy network like the Alpha Legion. There will be other, less obvious nods to other legions, too. I wanted it to be a case where hardly any of the original warband is left, most of their numbers now being the remnants of other, conquered warbands, and nobody in the command structure actually caring whose geneseed they carry. Plus, I really don't think where they came from is important, and I've never done uncertainty before in the geneseed section. :P

 

Darn, it's getting late and I'm rambling. I'd better wrap this up.

 

 

EDIT: Put up my chosen colour scheme, very similar to Heru Talon's suggested scheme... but with a bit more turquiose. :P

 

Thanks to everyone who's read my meandering ramblings this far.

I eagerly await criticism and the total annihilation of my roughly-hewn ideas. Any comments or opinions will be hugely appreciated, no matter how harsh they are!

 

 

 

 

...Except for suggestions to make the armour more black. -_-

Edited July 7, 2010 by Ace Debonair

[Grand Master Tyrak]

My very, very first idea for these guys was to have them be a large warband that operates over an enormously long range, meaning Rift Lords could be sighted in almost any part of the galaxy at any given time.

I don't have a clue how I could do that, realistically.

 

It would be very tricky to do that. The forces of Chaos need hide-outs for a reason - the original Legion fleets may be able to go toe-to-toe with the Imperial Navy, but the IN has the weight of numbers. You have to deal with that (since you're waltzing through Imperial territory), but you're presumably going to be equipped with a standard Astartes fleet plus whatever else you've scavenged. I can't think of any plausible ways to do that myself, but just to keep it in play that's what the reason will have to explain.

 

Obviously, this would require either huge foresight on the part of Keja or a good spy network. The former is a wee bit unlikely, so the latter is the only real option. :lol:

 

If you change to pure Tzeentchian the former would be very plausible, and even if you stayed Undivided it would still be easier than the latter option. You don't have to deal with Inquisitorial counter-espionage for a start, at the expense of risking the foresight being incorrect.

[Lord_Reven]

* Thier favoured methods are those of lightning-fast attacks, hitting unexpecting enemies from multiple sides at once if possible. They prefer to take prisoners where possible, especially when attacking undefended settlements. After victories prisoners are offered to the Chaos Gods in mass sacrifices, and the desecrated corpses of the slain are piled up to form a star of chaos on the floor.

 

* Rather than mindless, slavering pawns of Chaos, however, the Rift Lords are highly disciplined and cold. They see themselves as saviours, vying to liberate Mankind from the suppressive influence of the Emperor and his lackeys, and to embrace the power and potential of Chaos.

 

Just wanted to point out that if they want to liberate the IoM wouldent it make more sence to try and convert the captured civilians, instead of butchering them all? :) Mabey this could be how they build up a spy network, they take civilians, convert them to chaos, then travel discreatly and drop there spies off in a hive world or something somewhere to start a cult.. and so on and so forth.

 

Oh and i like the 1st paint job the best.. the purpule one with white shoulder guards.

Edited May 20, 2010 by Lord_Reven

[RagingGriffon]

I concur with Lord Even. Butchering does not equal "liberating." You mentioned that they are like Word Bearers, so that implies a leaning towards being "preachers." I think you can take the angle of them having cultists, a network all over, and they preach to unsuspecting citizens that the Imperium is falling, and the only way to save themselves is to convert to the Rift Lords form of "religion."

 

Are they an offshoot of a Traitor Legion or are they turned Loyalists?

 

Also, the color choices you have don't do anything for me. Sorry.

[Lord_Reven]

I concur with Lord Even.

 

You concur with who now?

:)

[Heru]

My very, very first idea for these guys was to have them be a large warband that operates over an enormously long range, meaning Rift Lords could be sighted in almost any part of the galaxy at any given time.

That bit doesn't work with your chosen leadership structure. Two individuals wouldn't be able to control all their forces over such distances, especially when we are dealing with backstabbing independent Chaos renegades.

 

 

Edit: In reference to colourscheme, here is my suggestions:

(CSM image seeing as they are Chaos Renegades).

Edited May 20, 2010 by Heru Talon

[Lord_Reven]

*Keja the Sorceror walks to Lord Maluk and whisperes something in his ear*

*Lord Maluk charges at you screaming "I DEMAND TO BE PAINTED PURPULE AND WHITE" while shooting at you with his... bolt/plasma/combi pistol!*

[Brother Argent]

So Ace, the Rift Lords start to see the light of day, eh? Good. Inspires me to start with my Iron Dragons, actually. I read over the (brief) points given above and here is my thoughts:

 

You say that your Chapter is lead by t wo figures, a sorcerer and a lord. Without sounding too harsh this is a trite overdone (I shoiuld know, I was thinking of doing a similar thing). The whole two leaders with one being a killing machine who thinks he is in charge and the other being a sorceror whom is really the man in charge has ben repeated in many ITs. Can I make a suggestion that you reverse this or eliminate it entirely. My suggestion would be have an over smart Sorceror in charge of the Chapter with a smart sneaky lord behind the scenes, pulling the strings. Just makes hem that little bit different.

 

If they have operated behind the scenes for much of their time and believe that they must convert the Imperium I would suggest going for a kind of terrorist sleeper cell set up. That t hey have small coven on many Imperial worlds, converting groups of Imperials and, of course, disupting Imperial forces. This works well to the hunting of new founding Chapters too, as they would have a massive spread out network. The cells would have to be small, however, and fluid as to avoid Inquisitorial scrutiny and killiness.

 

Whilst most people think massacres are a no-no for this Chapter I think they work. After all groups like Al-Quaeda and other fanatical militants believe that the only way to save the world and humanity is by killing the infidels or corrupt non beleivers, ala 9/11, Madrid train bombings etc. So your Chapter could basically go" Oh wel, these are staunch Imperials, no way to convert themn. Lets chop them up and make pretty pictures instead"

 

The not liking the Black Legion is an interesting point. Dont focus on it, however, as it will end up being Chaos Ultra-hate, or at least feel like it.

 

As I've lost what I was thinking I'll sumarise with one point/suggestion:

 

I know it may seem a little contreversial but I would suggest basing these guys of extremist Islamic militants, or other similar forces. They have got the whole religious conviction, stealthyness and appropriate demeanour for your guys in my mind. Throw in the 'miracle worker' sorceror leader and the hard line sneaky git Chaos Lord behind the scenes (or visa versa) and you have got one cleaver group of traitors.

 

Oh and colourschemes- go Heru Talons Option A. Of course in my mind the Rift Lords sound as though they should have a dark blue scheme, similar in colour to the Alpha Legion, only darker.

[RagingGriffon]

Sorry, Lord Reven :lol:

 

I see what Silver Phoenix is saying, and I agree. Kill all the people that don't convert and make their bodies art work.

[Ace Debonair]

Wow, that's some food for thought. :D

 

If you change to pure Tzeentchian the former would be very plausible, and even if you stayed Undivided it would still be easier than the latter option. You don't have to deal with Inquisitorial counter-espionage for a start, at the expense of risking the foresight being incorrect.

Thanks, Tyrak. I'm sticking to undivided for these guys. Big T might be my favourite Chaos God, but I think the chaos-primarch worship works better under an undivided banner.

That might be quite good, actually. Even in the event of being wrong (and therefore failing in his duty) Keja would just put words around it and use it as a further example of Imperial deviousness.

 

It would be very tricky to do that. The forces of Chaos need hide-outs for a reason - the original Legion fleets may be able to go toe-to-toe with the Imperial Navy, but the IN has the weight of numbers. You have to deal with that (since you're waltzing through Imperial territory), but you're presumably going to be equipped with a standard Astartes fleet plus whatever else you've scavenged. I can't think of any plausible ways to do that myself, but just to keep it in play that's what the reason will have to explain.

True. This would again be easier with a Tzeentch warband, as they could be guided safely (for the most part) by their sorcerors. I'll have a go at working this in anyway, but I won't be afraid to drop it.

 

Just wanted to point out that if they want to liberate the IoM wouldent it make more sence to try and convert the captured civilians, instead of butchering them all? Mabey this could be how they build up a spy network, they take civilians, convert them to chaos, then travel discreatly and drop there spies off in a hive world or something somewhere to start a cult.. and so on and so forth.

Must... Stop... Writing... Late... At... Night... :)

Yes, they'll be big on preaching liberation and salvation under Chaos. It'll be a reasonably successful approach, using the most skilled orators of the chapter. If an attempted conversion goes awry, however, that's when the surprise attack happens.

 

Your idea is spot on, Lord Even Reven. :P Good thinking!

 

I concur with Lord Even. Butchering does not equal "liberating." You mentioned that they are like Word Bearers, so that implies a leaning towards being "preachers." I think you can take the angle of them having cultists, a network all over, and they preach to unsuspecting citizens that the Imperium is falling, and the only way to save themselves is to convert to the Rift Lords form of "religion."

 

Are they an offshoot of a Traitor Legion or are they turned Loyalists?

 

Also, the color choices you have don't do anything for me. Sorry.

 

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense.

Oh, they're an offshoot of an original legion, although precisely which one is uncertain.

Colour-wise, well fair enough. It's a work in progress.

 

That bit doesn't work with your chosen leadership structure. Two individuals wouldn't be able to control all their forces over such distances, especially when we are dealing with backstabbing independent Chaos renegades.

 

True. Thanks for chaos-ifying those colour schemes! I somehow forgot we had a Chaos marine painter. :wub:

Of the two, the white one does look better. I'll have a little play with that and see what sort of results I get.

 

You say that your Chapter is lead by t wo figures, a sorcerer and a lord. Without sounding too harsh this is a trite overdone (I shoiuld know, I was thinking of doing a similar thing). The whole two leaders with one being a killing machine who thinks he is in charge and the other being a sorceror whom is really the man in charge has ben repeated in many ITs. Can I make a suggestion that you reverse this or eliminate it entirely. My suggestion would be have an over smart Sorceror in charge of the Chapter with a smart sneaky lord behind the scenes, pulling the strings. Just makes hem that little bit different.

 

I'll make it individual somehow. Maluk's not an idiot, he knows exactly what Keja's doing, and he allows it simply because the Sorceror is useful. I'm undecided if Keja should be aware of that or not, but I think he should certainly suspect it, making him paranoid and cautious. Maluk won't be without 'sneaky', in any case.

 

I know it may seem a little contreversial but I would suggest basing these guys of extremist Islamic militants, or other similar forces. They have got the whole religious conviction, stealthyness and appropriate demeanour for your guys in my mind. Throw in the 'miracle worker' sorceror leader and the hard line sneaky git Chaos Lord behind the scenes (or visa versa) and you have got one cleaver group of traitors

 

Don't take my blunt response the wrong way, SP, but that's not going to happen. Some ideas are too controversial even for me, and that's one of them.

I can see why you'd make the comparison, but I'm drawing inspiration from other sources (you wouldn't believe me if I told you where some of these ideas have come from)

 

If they have operated behind the scenes for much of their time and believe that they must convert the Imperium I would suggest going for a kind of terrorist sleeper cell set up. That t hey have small coven on many Imperial worlds, converting groups of Imperials and, of course, disupting Imperial forces. This works well to the hunting of new founding Chapters too, as they would have a massive spread out network. The cells would have to be small, however, and fluid as to avoid Inquisitorial scrutiny and killiness.

 

I like it. Obviously the cells won't be told any information that might prove useful to an Inquisitor... meaning that the Rift Lords are entrusting willing converts with nothing more than a pack of lies. How delightfully Chaos-y. B)

 

The not liking the Black Legion is an interesting point. Dont focus on it, however, as it will end up being Chaos Ultra-hate, or at least feel like it.

Agreed. It was just a minor point, but one I thought I should mention in case it turned out to be a problem.

 

I see what Silver Phoenix is saying, and I agree. Kill all the people that don't convert and make their bodies art work.

By today's standards, corpses-as-a-chaos-star probably counts as art, but that's a discussion for another time. :(

 

Thanks guys, it's nice to see my ideas generating some interest.

Any more views or opinions? Let me hear 'em! :D

[Wildfire]

Is anyone else getting a very wide page on Ace's first post? I'm guessing it's due to formatting on the pictures. I haven't read more than the first couple lines because it's too annoying to scroll back and forth.

[Ace Debonair]

Is anyone else getting a very wide page on Ace's first post? I'm guessing it's due to formatting on the pictures. I haven't read more than the first couple lines because it's too annoying to scroll back and forth.

 

Oops, my apologies.

It looked alright on my screen.

 

Hopefully my edits have fixed the issue?

[Captain Juan Juarez]

RE: The Foresight.

 

Maybe include some slowly growing factions in the warband who wish to worship a particular God; none of them have the power to influence the entire band and so their Undivided worship wins by stalemate - would explain the Sorcerers sight if he is one affiliated with the Big T.

[Lord_Reven]

Your idea is spot on, Lord Even Reven. :P Good thinking!

 

Your quite welcome :P

 

I got an idea for the whole leadership thing, instead of a mad dude and a magicy dude, how about having one of them possessed by a deamon? Like Fulgrim, where the deamon will actually be smart, in 100% contol, and having it interested in leading your chapter? Cant say for sure how well this would work, or if others have taken the idea already, but it seems kinda cool to me.

[Chaos Terminator Nero]

My very, very first idea for these guys was to have them be a large warband that operates over an enormously long range, meaning Rift Lords could be sighted in almost any part of the galaxy at any given time.

I don't have a clue how I could do that, realistically.

 

maybe some sort of captured necron tech or craft world ability or sorcery similar to the fallen dark angels allowing them to phase in and out all over the galaxy.

[Lord_Reven]

maybe some sort of captured necron tech or craft world ability or sorcery similar to the fallen dark angels allowing them to phase in and out all over the galaxy.

 

Dont think that would work as the 'Crons would just "Phase Out" not really leaving anything behind.. Note: Not leave anything useful behind, they would leave nothing behind.

[Ace Debonair]

RE: The Foresight.

 

Maybe include some slowly growing factions in the warband who wish to worship a particular God; none of them have the power to influence the entire band and so their Undivided worship wins by stalemate - would explain the Sorcerers sight if he is one affiliated with the Big T.

 

A very good idea, but overt worship of a particular God in the Rift Lords will mean death for failing to properly venerate the other Gods. To this end, the Rift Lords almost never summon demons, as they draw the focus to only one of the glorious Chaos Gods.

I'm settled on the Undivided aspect. If they have any bias at all, it's towards Horus, the blessed and honoured warrior of all the Gods. Both Maluk and Keja seek to emulate him by recieving blessings from all four, however unlikely that might be.

 

I got an idea for the whole leadership thing, instead of a mad dude and a magicy dude, how about having one of them possessed by a deamon? Like Fulgrim, where the deamon will actually be smart, in 100% contol, and having it interested in leading your chapter? Cant say for sure how well this would work, or if others have taken the idea already, but it seems kinda cool to me.

 

Also a good idea, but not one I want for the Rift Lords. Maluk's not going to be insane, just powerful. He's clever enough to lead a warband in and of himself, it's just Keja is awesome at planning several moves ahead, and his presence is tolerated because he's useful. Keja knows he's too useful to kill, so he occasionally delights in seeing how far he can push Maluk.

 

maybe some sort of captured necron tech or craft world ability or sorcery similar to the fallen dark angels allowing them to phase in and out all over the galaxy.

See, I was originally thinking capture Eldar technology that Maluk also allows brother DIY chaos types to use, meaning a greater scope for DIY chapters to operate in multiple areas. Then common sense kicked in and reminded me how dumb/overpowered that was. :lol:

 

This proto-chapter is becoming a real ideas magnet! I'll have a good think over the weekend and see if I get any brainwaves to help define these guys better.

I could possibly indulge in a short tale detailling Maluk and Keja interacting to give a better idea of what I'm aiming for.

[Captain Juan Juarez]

Or to take my previous idea to a different level:

 

You don't have to worship the Gods for them to take an interest, more likely it operates the other way round and that they take an interest and a turning occurs at some later date.

 

So lets expand that.. Sorcerer Bob* is becoming quite powerful and drawing the eye of the Great Changer, despite venerating all four Gods equally. So why not say that the Changer grants Bob* the foresight in an attempt to sway him without being overt about - plus this gives the opportunity for a bit of inter-Chapter riftage later on in their history (but not that you would document now).

 

So Bob* has this Gift, which he doesn' quite realise what it is and simply thinks his powers are growing.. While Chapter Master Jim* doesn't question it because it furthers the aims of the band.

 

 

*No sniggering at the back.

[Ace Debonair]

Or to take my previous idea to a different level:

 

You don't have to worship the Gods for them to take an interest, more likely it operates the other way round and that they take an interest and a turning occurs at some later date.

 

So lets expand that.. Sorcerer Bob is becoming quite powerful and drawing the eye of the Great Changer, despite venerating all four Gods equally. So why not say that the Changer grants Bob the foresight in an attempt to sway him without being overt about - plus this gives the opportunity for a bit of inter-Chapter riftage later on in their history (but not that you would document now).

 

So Bob has this Gift, which he doesn' quite realise what it is and simply thinks his powers are growing.. While Chapter Master Jim doesn't question it because it furthers the aims of the band.

That's extremely plausible, but I'll give up the attacking-new-chapters gimmick before I give up the chaos undivided one. I might instead just drop a hint or two that something along those lines is happening and let people decide the Rift Lords' future for themselves.

 

And it's Lord Jim, not chapter master Jim. :blush:

 

Quick question: Are posessed marines associated with any of the Chaos Gods in particular, or is that something an undivided warband can exploit?

(Don't give me that look - I've never even seen a Chaos Codex before.)

[Captain Juan Juarez]

Plague Marines are Nurgle, Bezerkers - techically not possessed but.. - are Khorne, Noise Marines are Slan... sp?... And thats all I've got!

 

On my note - The band would still be Undivided, but the insidious grasp of Big T would be tunneling under the surface, with the Lord and Sorceror unaware, with plenty of strife ahead :blush:

[Ace Debonair]

On my note - The band would still be Undivided, but the insidious grasp of Big T would be tunneling under the surface, with the Lord and Sorceror unaware, with plenty of strife ahead :P

 

Oh, that I can play ball with. You'll have to excuse me if I try to take the softly-softly approach with it, though.

 

EDIT: Posted half a response again. :blush:

 

So... general, tentacle-armed, spikey-faced possessed marines are ok for the Undivided bunch to use?

Or do they not exist anymore? I'll admit I'm well out of the loop in terms of chaos stuff.

Edited May 21, 2010 by Ace Debonair

[Captain Juan Juarez]

On my note - The band would still be Undivided, but the insidious grasp of Big T would be tunneling under the surface, with the Lord and Sorceror unaware, with plenty of strife ahead :)

 

Oh, that I can play ball with. You'll have to excuse me if I try to take the softly-softly approach with it, though.

 

EDIT: Posted half a response again. ;)

 

So... general, tentacle-armed, spikey-faced possessed marines are ok for the Undivided bunch to use?

Or do they not exist anymore? I'll admit I'm well out of the loop in terms of chaos stuff.

 

Ah but you wouldn't want to make the T influence very over, otherwise it means the Marines themselves should have noticed.

 

Also, chances are that the basic tentacly variety are for Big T as the Great Changer is the Lord of Mutations and such.

[Heru]

Possessed still exist, but from a tabletop standpoint no-one likes them.... :rolleyes:

[Lord_Reven]

Quick question: Are posessed marines associated with any of the Chaos Gods in particular, or is that something an undivided warband can exploit?

(Don't give me that look - I've never even seen a Chaos Codex before.)

 

Posessed marines can indeed be undivided, as Chaos Undivided does have there own deamons ^^ So if you like deamon marines, or marines with horns / spikes / wierd growths go ahead.

 

Also "normal" mutations for all chaos marines are common, not only the ones who serve the big T.

Edited May 21, 2010 by Lord_Reven

[Brother Argent]

I think you may have taken my idea the wrong way there Ace (its okay, I dont make sense at the best of times). I didn't mean draw them exactly from said militant groups. I dont want to see a Chapter Master Osama. If I do I'll post myself to you and beat you to death with your own keyboard). What I meant was perhaps draw inspiration from said crazies. That is a fanatical force, devoted to your death or theirs if needs be. A force that seems omnipresent because there is little fractured groups of them everywhere. A group that everyone is paranoid about. And no matter how well you prepare they will always get you in the place you didn't expect. A group that thinks nothing of killing "infidels" if it will help achieve their goal. Thats the idea I meant, not islamic militants in SPACE!!!.

 

Uh, hope that makes it clearer. And again by draw inspiration I meant for your Chapter, not your self. If self thn the same mail and keyboard incident shall happen. ;)