Original Rank Structures...

[Titan87]

So I am looking to do an original rank structure, but I am having difficulty coming up with one other that the "Chapter Master>Captain>Sgt" or the "High Marshall>Marshall>Castellan" rank structure.

 

I have been working with a medieval crusader focus for the chapter, focusing on the crusaders from the UK and Germany.

 

Any Advice or links to help come up with a rank scheme?

[Octavulg]

If you have a different structure, that might be interesting. Funny names really aren't that exciting.

 

Look at the rank structure of various knightly orders and monastic orders, maybe? Especially the Templars and the Knights of the Garter etc.

[voi shet magir]

What do you mean by "rank structure?" Do you just want new names for "guy in charge of chapter," "guy in charge of company," or do you want to change their powers and selection processes?

 

Fex, in chapters whose Master is also first company captain, the other captains have to do things he agrees with, or they won't get Terminator and veteran support. The Master might also influence the chapter by directly appointing or nominating the Captains, but some Chapters' companies sort of elect their leader, like Space Wolf Great Companies. Allegedly, The White Scars' Librarians are responsible for mystically selecting the predestined or most appropriate Master, but once they find a Great Khan, it is unclear what his actual job is. Perhaps the company/brotherhood Khans are somewhat divided and independent, so he might have to mediate them somehow, perhaps just by being so excellent they are all in awe of him. Some officers probably win duels with other candidates, and that is a more direct way, if less effective, to assert dominance.

 

"Master" is a suitable title for knightly chapters, and gw players will be familiar with it from whfb. If the chapter master is actually a Grand Master and his subordinates are Masters of companies called Orders, that would imply the companies are more separate from each other. If the entire chapter is called an order, which would be a good chapter name, it would appear more unified. Since crusaders had diverse origins and existed in a feudal period without national armies, you might want to have individual company-orders with distinct heraldry, and then a unifying chapter badge.

[Wildfire]

Marines appear to have a unified pyramid command scheme. Are you thinking of doing something more feudal, democratic, modern military, or what?

[NightrawenII]

Use Wikipedia, like this for example.

[Titan87]

I have been looking at both a different structure and a different rank organization. As the chapter stands the current organization is more democratic. The chapter is broken into 3 individual fleets. Each fleet is headed by a "Fleet Master" for lack of a better term. Each fleet is composed of 2 "Battle Companies" (100 initiates), 1 "Training Company" (50 Initiates/50 Neophytes), and a Veteran Company (50 Marines in 2 of the fleets, and 100 Veterans in 1 Fleet). The each company is headed by a captain figure, except the Veteran Company, which is headed by an Emperor's Champion type figure who is the best individual combatant in the fleet.

 

P.S.

Each Battle Company is assigned its own Strike Cruiser, while the Veteran and Training companies are assigned to the fleet's Battle Barge.

[Ace Debonair]

I have been looking at both a different structure and a different rank organization. As the chapter stands the current organization is more democratic. The chapter is broken into 3 individual fleets. Each fleet is headed by a "Fleet Master" for lack of a better term. Each fleet is composed of 2 "Battle Companies" (100 initiates), 1 "Training Company" (50 Initiates/50 Neophytes), and a Veteran Company (50 Marines in 2 of the fleets, and 100 Veterans in 1 Fleet). The each company is headed by a captain figure, except the Veteran Company, which is headed by an Emperor's Champion type figure who is the best individual combatant in the fleet.

 

P.S.

Each Battle Company is assigned its own Strike Cruiser, while the Veteran and Training companies are assigned to the fleet's Battle Barge.

So... who is the top-ranking officer of the chapter? Is there one?

 

What sort of rank system do you want, if not a straightforward Fleet Master>Captain/equivalent>Sergeant/equivalent?

[Lord_Ikka]

So it looks like your structure is a Crusading Fleet based Chapter. Most of those either follow normal codex ranks, or Black Templar ranks and practices. But you are trying to basically make three equal strength units, one which has slightly more veterans than the other two.

 

You could go with Roman military terms. Chapter Master would be a Legate, Tribunes would command the separate fleets, and Centurions would command the different companies, and Decanus as Sergeants.

[A_POINTED_STICK]

There are also several Greek Organizational systems you could adapt to astartes:

 

Athenian Method:

 

Stoechis (Squad) Say 20 Marines with 2 Sergeants and 2 Corporals (AKA 2 Tactical Squads)

Decadarchos (Sergeant)

 

Lochos (Company) Say 300 Marines

Lochagos (Captain)

 

Phyle Taxis (Clan) (Battalion) Say 600 Marines

Strategos (Master)

 

Phalanx (Brigade) Say 1200 Marines

Polemarch (Chapter Master)

 

Archons (Chaplains?) 3 per Lochos?

 

Spartan Method:

 

Enomotia (Squad) 30 Marines (3 Tactical Squads so 3 Sergeants and 3 Corporals)

Decadarchos (Sergeant)

 

Pentekostys (Platoon)75 Marines (2 Enomotia, 10 Specialists, 5 Command Squad)

pentekonter (Veteran Sergeant)

 

Lochos (Company) 300 Marines (4 Pentekostys)

Lochagos (Captain)

 

Mora (Battalion) 600 Marines (2 Lochos)

Polemarch (Master)

 

Phalanx (Brigade) 1200 Marines

King (Chapter Master)

-Hippeis (Honor Guard) 30 Honor Guard and 2 Ephors?

 

Strategos (Captain)

Navarch (Admiral)

 

Ephors (Chaplains?) 5 Per Mora?

 

Macedonian Method:

 

Lochos (Squad) 20 Marines (2 Tactical Squads)

Lochagos (Sergeant)

 

Taxis (Company) 125 Marines (6 Lochos +Command)

Taxiarch (Captain)

 

Syntagma (Battalion) 250 Marines

Syntagmarch (Veteran Captain)

 

Chiliarchia (Battalion) 1000 Marines

Chiliarch (First Captain)

 

Phalangiarch (Chapter Master) All Marines

Hypasists (Shield Bearers) 125 Veterans

Agema (Honor Guards) 25 Honor Guard

Somatophylakes (Command Squad) 5 Honor Guard

 

Etc.

[PorridgeMeister]

There are also several Greek Organizational systems you could adapt to astartes:

 

I would recommend using this; it is a good method that I have tried - I am currently using an adaptation of the Macedonian System in my DIY Chapter, the Myrmidons who obviously have a Greek-Macedonian backgroud, being the Sons of Achilles....

.....check out the thread if you want an example - it's around here somewhere..... :)

[Hemal]

You could use something where say 5 man squads are under the command of a Corporal say...normal marines being the equivalents of Privates...

 

Or else use something like the RAF command structure -

(Lord) Marshal of the XYZ chapter, - supreme head of the chapter like Helbrecht

Chief Marshal (you could have different Chief Marshals for different Crusades perhaps),

Marshal (both Captain equivs and also a maximum equiv rank for specialists, say for example senior non-line officers like Chief Librarians could be Marshals..),

Vice Marshal ( Or second in command of the Crusade?),

Commodore - could be a reserved or ceremonial rank for junior commanders assigned as commanders of ships - maybe even techmarines,

Group Captain/Commander could be a "detachment" commander - equiv to a leading say 3 units of marines, depending on seniority, maybe also the Honor Guard leader, other ceremonial ranks or Company Champions?

Lieutenant - other members of the command squad, Veteran serges

Officer - Jnr Sergeants, battle squad leaders - you could have a Lt and an Officer in the same squad of Marines

[Wildfire]

Been thinking about it, and it might be very interesting to have a feudal system of command for a SM chapter.

[PorridgeMeister]

Been thinking about it, and it might be very interesting to have a feudal system of command for a SM chapter.

 

Go with what seems instinctively right for your Chapter and for you...

[Grey Hunter Ydalir]

Depends what ties in best with the theme, efficiency or tradition.

 

In essence, you're choosing between what technically could be more streamlined for ease of use and what may well be unwieldy but is an entwined part of the chapter.

 

The difference between modern military structure and the structure of a knightly order like the Knights Teutonic, for example.

[Titan87]

Depends what ties in best with the theme, efficiency or tradition.

 

In essence, you're choosing between what technically could be more streamlined for ease of use and what may well be unwieldy but is an entwined part of the chapter.

 

Very true, the chapter division and reorganization resulted from massive casualties in the chapter history, which resulted in the distribution of the power away from the chapter master.

 

What I was envisioning is a system where each fleet is a relatively autonomous entity, and will operate independantly, however when the entire chapter is involved in an action one of the fleet commanders (The one with the largest veteran company/in command of the chapter fortress monastery Celestial Warrior) is the defacto chapter master, but a vote of no by the two other fleet commanders can override the "chapter master's" decision.

[Hemal]

Issue with having such a structure is that generally, in fighting forces, such "democratic" practice will lead to more indecision. By all means argue, offer opinion, but the High commander's word should be final..

 

If you are more Naval than most, use Commodore as the rank below Marshall...

[Aqui]

You could use something where say 5 man squads are under the command of a Corporal say...normal marines being the equivalents of Privates...

 

Or else use something like the RAF command structure -

(Lord) Marshal of the XYZ chapter, - supreme head of the chapter like Helbrecht

Chief Marshal (you could have different Chief Marshals for different Crusades perhaps),

Marshal (both Captain equivs and also a maximum equiv rank for specialists, say for example senior non-line officers like Chief Librarians could be Marshals..),

Vice Marshal ( Or second in command of the Crusade?),

Commodore - could be a reserved or ceremonial rank for junior commanders assigned as commanders of ships - maybe even techmarines,

Group Captain/Commander could be a "detachment" commander - equiv to a leading say 3 units of marines, depending on seniority, maybe also the Honor Guard leader, other ceremonial ranks or Company Champions?

Lieutenant - other members of the command squad, Veteran serges

Officer - Jnr Sergeants, battle squad leaders - you could have a Lt and an Officer in the same squad of Marines

 

I'm not one hundred per cent certain, but I think the highlighted ranks used to be in Rogue trader.....

[Guest Mordray]

The Void Reavers are currently using the following system... which is undergoing constant tweaking and modifications

 

Each 'type' of squad is broken down into their respective reserves... Warriors (tactical/ground assault), Devastators (possibly renamed bombardiers to differentiate them from their codex cousins), Slayers (scouts/assassins), RAA Troupers (for lack of a better name... Rapid Anti-Armor Troupers...) Operators (drives/pilots... possibly broken down into differing concept formations such as the fast moving viper and the slower Land Warrior MBT and the transport...), Maji (squad deployed psykers), Guides (leaders, all are veterans drawn from other reserves/formations.)

 

Within each infantry (but not Maji and Guides) formation the pattern is: T1 Grunt<T2 Grunt<T1 Vet<T2 Vet

 

T1 Grunt: Fresh from training and not all that impressive.

T2 Grunt: Fresh from training but he caught someones eye as having potential. leads five man squads (4 t1's + 1 t2)

T1 Veteran: Has several campaigns and serious combat to draw upon. rarely put in command but is sometimes seen leading 5 man squads of (t2 grunts) sharing his experiences and

T2 Veteran: Has shown promise not only in combat but also in leadership potential

 

I haven't locked down the vehicle formation and command structure yet... likely it'll be the same.

 

Maji currently have three ranks in my notes but I don't have them with me and can't remember the spellings... likely they'll have more ranks, given their nature...

 

Guides have five ranks, currently (closer to six-plus if you count the chapter master but then we're talking galactic scale orders), and recruit exclusively from the t2 veterans taking only those most talented in leading their brothers... I'm thinking of adding another rank to the vets to represent those skilled in the martial aspects of war rather then mainly leadership such as what the Guides would seek out...

 

Each rank in the guides represents not only their skill in leadership but also generally the distance they lead from. The Guides of Void Reavers are not trained to both lead and fight but to devote themselves to leading. The reasons they are even on the battlefield is two fold. No Void Reaver wishes to abandon their brothers to battle alone and to ensure that the enemy can not easily disrupt communications by utilizing the more potent localized bands over their more easily disrupted long range counterparts. This also gives a closer to first person experience ensuring minimal distortion of facts and reality.

 

T1 represents a guide attached directly to a squad formation and he would be best skilled at boosting the effectiveness of a particular formation such as a warrior or devastator(bombardier) formation would have a t1 guide recruited from within their ranks attached so as to ensure proper application of force.

 

T5 Guides are battalion commanders and are answerable only to the chapter master. They are generally given command of a hundred plus marines (Jahkob Drakiel the current 1st battalion commander last deployed with 240 Astartes and several thousand combat servitors).

 

The Ranks in between t1 and t5 are still being figured out. A T5 Guide is responsible for an entire campaign from start to finish and as such can't be everywhere so t4's will likely represent their more mobile agents. Most of the time a Void Reaver Guide won't need to concern himself with logistics directly as the chapter's serfs will handle this but an adviser council is present to ensure that the T5 doesn't overstretch his resources.

 

 

Well I hope this helps you in your own efforts though you will notice I don't have any names for the ranks this is because I'm currently more concerned with creating a working skeleton before I start strapping pretty colors and decorations on to it.