To our Flesh Tearer players

[Malus the Destroyer]

I'm doing as much research as I can and trying to solidify/unify information about our chapter. I've already added how our Company/squad markings are arranged to The Lexicanum.

 

Now, I did not add this part, because I don't have concrete info on it yet but.....

I think that any given squad, regardless of how it is equipped, may have a diversity of squad type markings. My theory behind this, is every battle brother is trained and required to serve in every squad type dependant upon neccessity in an engagement. I don't think they'd take the time to "repaint' the Devastator marking into a "Tactical" marking, or whatever the case may be.

Now, the squad number marking would be more important to a Sgt, or commander, and that may be addressed dependant upon which brothers are organised into squads.

 

As for the Company Marking,.....this one is tough. We are down to 4 Companies. Would this be reflected in updating the company marking of all the brothers from 5th-9th companies being filed into the remaining 1st 4 companies? Normally I would say yes, as fitting a promotion, but this really isn't the case with us. I'm thinking, it is another case of "can't be bothered" with repainting something, as our forces organize themselves right before a campaign. Would the rapid squad assignment also lend itself to the company assignment for a conflict? IE "no time to update the paint on this shoulderpad, I've got war to wage"?

 

Anyways, any CONCRETE information is more than welcome. I want to diagram, chronicle, and build our entire chapter, as well as supply this collection of information for any and all other members of the Flesh Tearers.

[Whitefireinferno]

Nope we are down to 300ish MArines now We had 400 at armageddon but since then yeah. But yeah no repainting because we are too busy killing things to do so.

[Malus the Destroyer]

Ok, got my editing done on the link I provided. I made a mistake in posting, and jumped the gun putting the link here before verifying it was posted.

 

Whitefireinferno, got the source book/info on us being down to 300+, so I can post it?

[Whitefireinferno]

HMM I cant find it at the moment I checked Chapter approved and Codex:armageddon and I was wrong since armageddon we lost a company worth of marines at armageddon we had 5 companys*on the inside of the back cover* and In chapter approved we are down to 400 according to Carnarvon's wee bit on page 50.

 

So yeah 400ish Opps my bad But Im guessing we would be nearing that number tho due to the time between armageddon and such.

[Malus the Destroyer]

Keep in mind, we do still recruit. It's just attrition through warfare and Black Rage that is degenerating our chapter.

 

Anyways brother, if you have any other material we can add to the Lexicanum with a source, please speak your peace. I want to build a fully detailed list and explanation of our chapter for everyone.

[SamaNagol]

Does the Space Wolf altercation predate Armageddon?

[Firedrake28]

Does the Space Wolf altercation predate Armageddon?

 

I think so, otherwise the Flesh Tearers would be pretty much wiped out since "Hundreds died on both sides,".

[Malus the Destroyer]

What was the "Space Wolf Altercation"? This sounds like info I'm looking for. Anything to do with the Chapter period.

[WarpWalker]

Malus, what you are doing is quite the Noble cause! I too, as many other Sanguine brothers would like to see a full chronicle of our chapter.

[Fracture]

The space wolf incident is known as honours end. We and the wolves were removing chaos from a world and during a counter attack by ourselves that pretty much won the war for the imperium we got a little over excited again and might have butchered a few hundred civilians again. Seth tried to explain to Logan that it was only those who had been corrupted but the wolves weren't having any of it and attacked the flesh tearers. Hundreds were lost each side apparently. I say it would be a hundred tops per side as GW seem to have started a trend where it gets a bit over the top with casualty figures.

 

It's all in the blood angels codex time line.

[Legatus]

Codex Space Wolves, actually, on page 19. It is dated at 837.M41, so about one and a half century before the last war for Armageddon.

[CainTheHunter]

Codex Space Wolves, actually, on page 19. It is dated at 837.M41, so about one and a half century before the last war for Armageddon.

 

Yes, and it gives the SW perspective there :P

[All-Things-Power-Armoured]

I like the things you have found out about the chapter.

 

Though surely they would still observe battle rites on their armour and so forth, you might be busy killing things on one planet, but to travel the warp to some planets takes weeks, there'd be plenty of time to re organise your force and paint their armour. I think its more likely that it would set off on a campaign and the squads would be selected for the first mission, then when they change units they keep their original livery until the end of the campaign when they will again be re-organised.

 

So your army would be representing a campaign, early on it would have normal markings and gradually get more extreme as time goes on.

 

Very interesting ideas, Do you think some units would still have their old company markings? or would they have removed them during their time between battlefields.

[Carnus Caedes]

I understand the motivation behind the thread but I was initially a proponent for actual squad markings... that is my personal preference in regard to ease identification as a modeller/painter/wargamer. Nothing definate has been forthcoming in all my travels through the interwebs to this point that confirms either.

 

The only evidence I can offer is the FT tactical marine example in the painted miniatures section of the current codex...

 

When in swallows fluff the whirlwinds of the chapter seem beaten and poorly kept that the iconoraphy is clean and well presented showing their deferential regard to the battle spirit of the technology in their keeping [poor justification I know...]

 

Without any presumptions or personal opinions nothing yet suggests squads change their iconography or otherwise... it would make sense to me prior to this current codex that squads would signify their company coloured blood drop only giving credence to the fact they are continually re-organised... why then do they show the painted example of a tactical marine with the tactical arrow and company blood drop?

 

[frustrated Grunt]

 

I hope to add something more solid in the very near future... the questions and statements of the OP has definately got me wondering now... thanks for starting this thread :P

 

I'm always open to new thoughts on this issue... I'm so glad to know finally the lack of information bothered a few more people :) [sorry]

[All-Things-Power-Armoured]

Maybe the point is that the squad that they are assigned to represents their particular specialty, after all Tactical Marine are masters of all aspects of war as it says in the BA codex. So you could have an assault marine with a tactical symbol to represent that they are able to be swapped between many units, whereas a devastator or assault marine may not be able to swap with many other roles, ie, an assault marine would only join a devastator squad in dire circumstances but may join a tactical squad if the mission needed him to.

[Droofus]

I don't paint any squad specialty markings on my Flesh Tearers. I think the Index Astartes pic is mistake on the part of the artist (who's probably some poor slob who was told "paint this guy in wine-dark red armor with black shoulder pads and helmets - other than that, make him look like this guy" *gives him picture of Ultramarine tactical marine*).

 

Squad markings (the symbol delineating what numerical squad they are part of) get put on the kneecap.

[Darkchild130]

Agreed, as squad specialties change as per the mission dictates, i think we would be more interested in killing the enemies than painting our armour.

I would put squad markings on the knee, as squad composition is much less likely to change than their deployment designation.

 

Darkchild

[Vodunius]

I'm actually pretty certain that buried deep in either the Armageddon3 or Eye of Terror campaign websites was a blurb saying that after Armageddon one company - 2nd or 3rd I believe - was sent on a penitent crusade and is missing in action after it disobeyed an order not to engage an ork fleet. This fits with the IA article art whose example marine was identified as being 5th company. Note the marine in question had a white blood drop, for years I assumed this was a screw-up until someone pointed out that the Blood Angel battle companies match up with the codex battle company colours except for the 3rd which uses white (which is spare since the 1st company has a skull) instead of red due to the red armour. The Flesh Tearers however have black pads so can freely use red drops for the 3rd company, but would need to use something else for the 5th (black) company - hence the white for 5th.

[Malus the Destroyer]

I'm all for speculation in this thread to "flesh" out the Flesh Tearers. But if you have hard printed cannon, ie... Black Library or various Codecii, please specify the name of the book and page number for the Lexicanum update. Inquisitor S over there is pretty harsh on what is updated, as it has to be concrete with specific pg numbers.

[Carnus Caedes]

The topic of organisation in the Lexicanumv FT article is speculative. Loosely based on the few nuggets of truth available. 1: Armageddon Website, Codex: Armageddon, Index Astartes I Flesh Tearers, Imperial Armour Volume Two - Space Marines and Forces of the Inquisition, Games Workshop Website, Codex: Blood Angels (5th Edition). A few of these extracts are no longer accessible on the web.

Regardless of company blood drop colour it doesn't discount that squad type signifiers are employed or state how the squad type is signified

 

 

It also doesn't put forward the heraldry of the example supplied on page 80 of the current codex wich is pretty solid evidence (a shame so long coming) in regards of FT chapter heraldry.

[chaplain belisarius]

read the article-good job sir! :)

[Malus the Destroyer]

I didn't write the whole article. I actually only added some to it. But I plan to expand that page as much as humanly possible!

[Bat33.1]

Does anybody have any thoughts on colour schemes for FT Honour Guards? I just don't see FT of any sort running around in a 'bling' gold suit of power armour.

 

I kind of imagine FT being like the young Mike Tyson when he came into the ring with plain black shorts, an old towel with a hole cut into it over his shoulders and a big bad attitude that was going to get the opponent out of the ring in as short a times as possible :)

 

I can't decide if I should use the new sang guard figures as the basis for some honour guard but painted in a more or less stock FT red/black, I think they need some way of standing out but not 'bling' ^_^

[Darkchild130]

Individualise their wargear, its a way more suitable way of making them standout than 'bling'. Honour guard are veterans of hundreds of battles, so reflect that with their weapons and armour ie: damage, trophies, older MKs of armour, lots of ammo and weapon mods (my personal favourites), kill markings etc.

Its more subtle than blinging up your dudes and imo more effective than just putting them in fancy armour.

 

Darkchild

[chaplain belisarius]

flesh tearers have a battledamaged, functional tough look which is ace...(i hate bling)