VV question

[Mudpuppet]

Hello brothers,

 

I have been wondering alot about how people say that VV are really reliable on the arrival etc for gettign the charge. But from what i understand there is a large risk of them either scattering out of charge range or ontop of enemy units...

 

The only thing i can think of why people think they are so good is that you could place them outside the minimum range for scattering onto enemy units and use running in the shooting phase to get within charge range again. However i was of the understanding that if you ran you couldnt then charge, and that you had to declare a charge with heroic intervention before you land?

 

Can someone explain to me why everyone seems to think there is little chance of accidents happening? Cos i cant seem to figure it out...

 

Thanks,

 

Mudpuppet

[mlund]

I have been wondering alot about how people say that VV are really reliable on the arrival etc for gettign the charge. But from what i understand there is a large risk of them either scattering out of charge range or ontop of enemy units...

 

There isn't a large chance for Blood Angels Vanguard Veterans due to Descent of Angels.

 

The only thing i can think of why people think they are so good is that you could place them outside the minimum range for scattering onto enemy units and use running in the shooting phase to get within charge range again. However i was of the understanding that if you ran you couldnt then charge, and that you had to declare a charge with heroic intervention before you land?

 

Nope, you can't run if you declare Heroic Intervention.

 

Can someone explain to me why everyone seems to think there is little chance of accidents happening? Cos i cant seem to figure it out...

 

OK, run a 5-man squad and place your center model 3" away from the most advantageous edge of the enemy's unit. (That's the edge with the most narrow profile for scattering into)

 

Roll the scatter die. 33% of the time you land on target.

 

In the other 2/3 of the time you scatter.

 

Considering the angles you can land in, very few of those angles can carry you out of charge range, even with a full 6 inch scatter. Very few of those angles can carry you into the enemy unit either. I'd estimate that when you scatter from such a position you'll mishap into the enemy around 10% of the time. That's around 6% of actual landings being a mishap with such a placement.

 

Now, consider that placement of models around the initial landing model is up to you. You can make sure to put a model as close to the target unit as possible when it helps you and not to do so when it hurts you. That's a little under 1 inch of play for your landing reach. Only a 5+ on the distance die has any significant chance of landing you out of charge range (that 1" of play makes any 4 inch result that isn't perfectly away still a valid charge). Of that 33% of scatters that go high-distance, less than 50% of directions are away from the enemy unit at an angle that can make a 6 inch scatter miss (anything on or near a 180 degree arc still keeps you within 6 inches + model base even on a 6 inch scatter). So only about 17% of your scatter rolls carry even the possibility of landing out of range. Then out of all the "away" angles, only a small arc carries you far enough at a 5 inch scatter. So you're looking at maybe 6% of landings carrying you away.

 

So, around 12% of your outcomes are misses, and only about 2% result in your unit being killed outright.

 

I think your actual biggest problems stem from needing to attempt landings in areas crowded by additional units / impassible terrain or landings against units in difficult terrain. Landing within 6 inches is still a problem if you need to roll difficult terrain to get into grips with the enemy.

 

- Marty Lund

[Mudpuppet]

Wow,

 

Theres clearly more thought involved than i imagined. Thanks for clearing it up for me, i think i understood most of what you said.

 

Mudpuppet