Mentors?

[chaplain belisarius]

Hi,

 

does anyone play mentors? Any information on them (apart from in lexicanium)?

 

thanks guys..

[Octavulg]

They lost an entire Terminator Company once trying to clear a Space Hulk, and had to be bailed out by the Guard.

 

Of course, that was in Citadel Journal.

 

Their fluff's changed a lot over the years. They make good Sternguard.

[chaplain belisarius]

Really? just realised i know nothing about them thats all...thanks for that mate! :)

[Octavulg]

Not a problem. Lexicanium's pretty helpful, honestly.

 

They had a WD article way back in the early hundreds. A lot of it seems to have changed, though.

[chaplain belisarius]

when doesnt it change?:)

[Octavulg]

True enough. :)

[chaplain belisarius]

its a lot like being a historian or archeaologist sometimes (or a librarian?)

 

:)

[chaplain belisarius]

ive checked lexicanium...any other sources of info and fluff? any mentors players? thanks..

[chaplain belisarius]

no one knows anything about or plays mentors? I feel sorry for them now...might get them as my next army now..:jaw:

[Terminatorinhell]

Didnt they replace the astral scorpions and were a really high tech chapter?

[chaplain belisarius]

all i know is what ive read on lexicanium and in the SM dex...was hoping one of you gents could point me in the direction of more info? :jaw:

[Brother Tyler]

The Lexicanum article is based on the older Rogue Trader era fluff, which is highly inconsistent with the material presented in the current Codex: Space Marines. Where the earlier incarnation had the Chapter being the research and development Chapter, dispatching cadres to study and train other fighting units of the Imperium, the new incarnation has them being highly isolationist and doesn't seem to support any advanced tech.

 

My opinion is that the Mentors have been ret-conned, the Deathwatch now filling the role that the Mentors used to fill.

 

All that said, the basic information about the Chapter number and its founding hasn't been explicitly contradicted, so it's possible that they're still the replacement for the Star Scorpions (with all of the background material on that Chapter).

 

The only official material that we currently have on the Chapter is the information that is presented in the current codex. Everything else is questionable (though mentions of battles/campaigns in any Imperial Armour books, if there are any, are probably in the current fluff).

 

Bottom line - I wouldn't take the majority of the information that currently appears on the Lexicanum site as official or useful.

[augustmanifesto]

well, they were (barely) mentioned a few times in the Badab War I book by forgeworld. They took part in the Badab War on the side of the loyalists, took pleasure from engaging with the Executioners at length, and specialize in siege (that's what the book says, we don't need to argue about this one, guys ) . The new siege land raider variant is painted in these colors. They are likely a successory Chapter of the Imperial Fists, which would explain why they took a pleasure in engaging the Executioners (themselves IF successors) and why their colors were used on the forgeworld land raider variant.

 

But they will be one of the main Chapters in the next forgeworld book, Badab War II. So if you can hold out another two months or so there should be some great stuff on these guys!

[NuclearMessiah]

page 135 IA 9

 

The Mentors are not one of the chapters that conducted actions during the Badab conflict. Its possible you got them mixed up with the minotaurs chapter perhaps?

[augustmanifesto]

oh you're right. my bad! myyyyyyyyyyyyy bad :P Edited December 5, 2010 by bannus
Unnecessary reaction removed

[chaplain belisarius]

thanks for that guys! Are they appearing in the next IA book then? All the fluff on lexicanium is completely different to what is said about them in the current marine dex...any info would be great, i feel like my search has hit a bit of a brick wall! :(

 

A few questions-

 

1-Are they a codex chapter?(i imagine the answer is yes, but its the best place to start my line of enquiry)

 

2-Who is their primarch?(any ideas?)

 

3-do they have any particular character quirk or combat doctrine that makes them stand out?

 

I hope you guys can help with this...:P

Edited December 5, 2010 by chaplain belisarius

[NightrawenII]

Bottom line - I wouldn't take the majority of the information that currently appears on the Lexicanum site as official or useful.

I have to disagree on this one.

- Lexicanum is very useful, when you want to find out something, you can barely remember and can't be bothered to look throught 10+ books.

- The fanmade contents was removed and any submited information is now under vigorous control.

 

That being said, there are often outdated or retconned informations, but the site is far from useless. I can't see, where this distrust comes from. :P

Edited December 5, 2010 by NightrawenII

[lostsoul]

Found this online.

 

White Dwarf 98 - February 1988

 

Index Astartes: The Mentor Legion (by Bryan Ansell, Alan Merrett & Paul Cockburn, excerpted from WD 98)

 

INTRODUCTION

 

Commander Isiah studied the group of Marines at the far end of the great hall, their garish armour oddly fitting the gaily coloured light which poured through the stained glass arch of the chapel windows. They were deep in conversation and oblivious to his entrance.

 

Isiah walked forward and one of the five looked up.

 

'Ah, Commander Isiah, we were expecting you.' The five closed their conversation and faced the Commander, two of them grinning broadly, the others stern-faced and tight-lipped. Isiah tried hard not to be irritated by the lack of manners the five displayed, and the rather incourteous greeting he had received.

 

'You arrived early and I've been . . .detained,' he hissed.

 

'Well we're here now and would like to get started immediately, unless you've other plans?' The question was rhetorical. They all knew that Isiah wanted to get them onto Golance quickly.

 

'A shuttle has been fuelled and is awaiting you at port 6A.'

 

'That won't be needed Commander. We have our own transport. Just tell us where you want us to fight, we can handle the rest.'

 

Isiah was more than sure that they could. He'd been sure that they could handle the problem on Golance ever since he received news of the thought transmit. His Chapter was at its lowest ebb, unable after countless attacks, to rid the planet below of the pestilent Eldar scum who had gained control of the planet's secret arsenal. Already 350 men and officers of the Flesheaters Chapter of Space Marines had died at the hands of those vile, outlawed aliens. The arrival of these five warriors could soon change the course of the war, for they had been sent to him by the Mentor Legion in a deal that was eminently fair and honourable; Isiah receiving five soldiers of unparalleled skill for the course of this war, in return for simply giving them the experience of a real fight.

 

'I'd like you to join 8th Company on the Ashenplain of Rox and co-ordinate a full-scale assault on the arsenal's northern entrance. You'll have full air support and 115 fresh men. The aliens have concentrated their defences south of the plain and I'll be personally directing diversionary attacks against these.'

 

'Thank you Commander. Shall we be started?'

 

THE MENTOR LEGION

 

The Mentors are a relatively new Chapter. Formed in the Twenty-Sixth Founding, during the middle part of the current millennium, they received the number 888. This previously belonged to the Star Scorpions Chapter. The latter were a Chapter of the Twenty Fifth Founding and had the dual misfortune of producing redundant gene-seed and being utterly devastated by Warp entities when the Chapter's Fleet became trapped in Warp-space. The exact fate of the Scorpions is not known. However, the Emperor decreed that the chapter be considered dead.

 

The redundant gene-seed hampered Imperial efforts to rebuild the Scorpions Legion and eventually the Bio-engineers and Chem-architects of the Adeptus Mechanicus were forced to concede defeat. For a time it seemed that the number 888 would never be raised again, but some years later, a new Founding in the offing persuaded the Priesthood to revisit the chapter regalia. Thus the Mentors were born. They received the uniforms and number of the extinct chapter but instead of the redundant seed, they were given an entirely new generation of genetic material collated from the storage banks of the Earth laboratories.

 

The new chapter is highly unusual and their modus operandi is quite different from that of the bulk of the Legiones Astartes. The Mentors have an extraordinary capacity for learning, particularly of matters military. The chapter's main pursuit is therefore one of perfecting the fusion between science and art of war, and military technology. They do not engage in campaigns or wars as other chapters do, but instead 'loan' squads of Marines to other Imperial military bodies. Squads of Mentors may be found fighting alongside the Imperial Army or even other chapters throughout the galaxy.

 

The Chapter is roughly organised in much the same fashion as the Ultra-Marines. However the bulk of the chapter are never seen, the location of their headquarters and Monastery-Retreat being an absolute secret. Only the very highest strata of the Priesthood are aware of its exact location. Here the Mentors perform their rigorous training and disciplining. The massed ranks of the chapter are exhaustively trained in the art of war and in the use of Imperial military hardware, both old and new - the Chapter acting as a test bed for the latest Imperial technology. While a large proportion of the chapter is permanently based at their secret HQ, the balance of the chapter are sent out on missions, including the elite Brethren.

 

The basic rationale behind squad loaning is that the Mentors are able to extract the maximum amount of information regarding the fighting prowess and techniques of just about any Imperial military organisation. 'Loaned' squads returning to chapter HQ bring with them an invaluable record which is without parallel in the galaxy. The chapters and armies to whom these squads are sent benefit from having these superior warriors join them for a campaign or battle. An extra benefit to the Mentors is that they are also able to claim and maintain an honourable record of real combat experience. Even in the short period of the Chapter's existence, they have amassed an enviable Roll of Honour.

 

Another facet of the Mentors is the development and training of the chapter's Elite Cadre. It was originally envisaged that this would perform a number of important semi-military roles, from counter-terror operations to complex undercover missions. They would be the Imperium's ultimate human warriors, capable of dealing with any threat outside a normal chapter's area of expertise. This aim has not been fully realised as yet, but the Mentor Elite Cadre are even now amongst the very best that the Imperium can offer. They too are sent out to aid other Imperial military units in the pursuit of galactic security. The Elite Cadre are also frequently called upon by the Inquisition who recognise their superior skill at arms.

 

At any given time, the Mentors are likely to have as many as 25 Tactical squads out on-loan to other commands, and there are usually at least 10 squads of the Mentor Elite Cadre on missions. The rest of the chapter remains hidden, forever engrossed in the training and experimentation program.

 

Any army unit or chapter may include a single squad of the Mentor Chapter in their battle orders. This squad can be either one of the rank and file Mentor Tactical squads or may be a group of Mentor Elite Cadre.

 

MENTOR CHAPTER SQUAD COMPOSITION

 

The following units are all typical examples of squads sent out to other armies by the Mentors. The chapter itself will never put into battle. These units will only ever be found serving under other commands.

 

RANK AND FILE SQUADS

 

These are organised around the archetypal Imperial system of the ten man squad. In addition, they uphold the tradition of splitting into two groups of five men each when in battle. There is no Sergeant in the Mentor squad, as each man holds the same rank and any of the ten may be nominated the leader (or two leaders, if the squad splits into battle units of five).

 

ELITE CADRE

 

The Elite Cadre of the Mentor Chapter are the most advanced warriors of their kind in the galaxy. There are two ways Marine or Army commanders can employ them on the battlefield. First the cadre element may simply be used as a powerful squad, gaining the benefits of the Targeting-Web facility and other special equipment; alternatively, the models may become leaders for other units. The latter is preferred by Army Commanders as the Elite Cadre make especially good leaders for units of normal warriors.

 

Each member of the Elite Cadre has the profile of a Marine Minor Hero. This represents the adaptability of the chapter's advanced training techniques. The models also have the powerful Targetting-Web, Timewarper, and Shift Field (see below) available to them, and all models are armed with Mentor Bolt guns. The Timewarper and Shift Field are individually carried items and must be assigned to particular models. These items can be used to enhance any unit joined by the Mentor carrying them.

[Brother Tyler]

Bottom line - I wouldn't take the majority of the information that currently appears on the Lexicanum site as official or useful.

I have to disagree on this one.

- Lexicanum is very useful, when you want to find out something, you can barely remember and can't be bothered to look throught 10+ books.

- The fanmade contents was removed and any submited information is now under vigorous control.

 

That being said, there are often outdated or retconned informations, but the site is far from useless. I can't see, where this distrust comes from. :lol:

I should have been more specific. I was talking solely about the Mentors article when I said that "I wouldn't take the majority of the information that currently appears on the Lexicanum site as official or useful.

 

The stuff from the Index Astartes article quoted above is some of that really outdated information that appears to have been retconned.

[chaplain belisarius]

@lostsoul-wow! thanks for that mate! maybe i should take sternguard as troops to represent their elite status? :)

[lostsoul]

That would be expensive but they'd look very cool, you wouldnt have a large force so thats a bonus.

Bonus #2, GW do the revised shoulder pad design in the mail order bitz section.

 

If you find white dwarf 98 let me know what you think of the full article and the elite cadre, pretty sure there were rules. Shame its outdated material, probably nolonger 'chapter approved' (bad joke, couldnt resist) but still makes for great fluff and doesnt mean you cant have house rules to see how they play. If nothing else, they are quite eyecatching in the green and white.. just dont fight Biel Tan, the armies will bleed into one visual puddle.

[Vodunius]

I'm with Brother Tyler on this one, the old stuff has clearly been retconned out of the water with extreme assertiveness:

However the bulk of the chapter are never seen, the location of their headquarters and Monastery-Retreat being an absolute secret. Only the very highest strata of the Priesthood are aware of its exact location. / The rest of the chapter remains hidden, forever engrossed in the training and experimentation program.

vs

Shrouded in mystery, the Mentors are untrusting of other Chapters, and prefer to work alone and unobserved by all save their foes.

[Bannus]

The Mentors had to be retconned to some degree to line up with existing fluff. Since the fluff surrounding technology has changed (i.e. it is ritualized and static), it would be hard to justify a chapter field-testing new gear when no one is allowed to develop any.

 

Still, I think it would have been cool to retain the rest of the fluff to a degree.

 

Rules-wise, the Sternguard Squad would make a great "counts as" Mentor Elite Cadre - just don't give the Sergeant any upgrades.

[chaplain belisarius]

I was thinking that would be good? take sternguard as my troops choices and have a small elite army?

 

@lostsoul-biel tan and mentors on the same table would be interesting to say the least! thank you again for posting the info...

 

Another question-they are more likely to be led by a captain? or would it be ok to have a librarian or chaplain? (im guessing they operate in small elite groups led by a commander, rather than at company strength? good idea?)

[Bannus]

I was thinking that would be good? take sternguard as my troops choices and have a small elite army?

You can't have Sternguard as Troops - and that wouldn't be accurate anyway. The Sternguard would represent the Elite Cadre. As the previous posts attest, the rest of the chapter follows the Codex norm.