Gaeus Marius Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Hello All, I am in the process of finishing up my battle company, and have quite a few models without the pre-made shoulder pads. I can't stand transfers in any shape or form, so am left with free hand painting. Are there any tutorials on this thread, or any tips to make a uniform looking chapter badge? Thanks for all your help.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gillyfish Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 I'm not aware of any, but that doesn't mean they don't exist. I free-hand mine and find that the best way to do it is to paint a line for the sword first and then a line across that for the hilt. That will help you define the length of the icon. I then paint a line leading up to just below what will be the hilt and then curve it round until it is alongside the edge of the hilt. I'll do the same on the other side and then paint three linbes which will form the wings on each side. I will then thicken them out until each side looks roughly equal. I'm not sure if that makes much sense - next time I paint one, I will try to do a tutorial for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isiah Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 There's one here by Emilio if that helps. It's quite basic - but simple is often better ;). Cheers I Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ancient god Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Have you looked into decal softeners? Vallejo produces them, but you can get them from a couple of other providers too. They basically slowly dissolve the plastic film the decal is printed on and make it lie flat against what ever curved surface you want. Some patience is required but it's a very nice and easy way to use decals. I use them for my DA decals and they work a treat. You can see some of the results in my DA thread, just look it up in my user profile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EPK Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Have you looked into decal softeners? Vallejo produces them, but you can get them from a couple of other providers too. They basically slowly dissolve the plastic film the decal is printed on and make it lie flat against what ever curved surface you want. Some patience is required but it's a very nice and easy way to use decals. I use them for my DA decals and they work a treat. You can see some of the results in my DA thread, just look it up in my user profile. I know this is somewhat off topic, but it is slightly on topic as well. Not trying to hijack... I actually ordered a bottle of Micro Sol (and Micro Set) today. I see many tutorials that swear you should have a gloss coat to apply the decal to. Now, if Micro Sol can dissolve the film couldn't I skip this gloss clear coat step? I have a handful of models of which I simply applied the decal directly to the painted shoulder - I suppose that's a matte finish. They look decent, but of course when you turn them certain ways in the light, you get glare. I can't say what I'm seeing is really "silvering" as I can't see the clear parts really at all and the glare shows on all parts of the decal. My hope was I could still apply some Micro Sol to them to help with that as well as do some weathering (yours is stunning by the way) to make them look overall less uniform. Will the Micro Sol help? If it matters, I'm now using the Forge World decal sheet - not sure if they are of a higher quality than the GW ones (mostly bought it just to get Deathwing ones). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ron Posted February 23, 2011 Share Posted February 23, 2011 Does this help any? Sometimes breaking the symbol down into simple shapes is the best way to go instead of trying to paint a complex design in one pass. http://lh6.ggpht.com/_-HZLorI1B0w/SIUURNXcDQI/AAAAAAAADBA/iCaEXgBqjpc/s400/Deathwing%20shouder%20icon%20steps.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xyon Posted February 24, 2011 Share Posted February 24, 2011 I dont know if that helps him, but it sure as heck helps me! Inspiration! Thanks for the tip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanhausen Posted February 24, 2011 Share Posted February 24, 2011 Looks neat ^_^ But covering the red with white must be nightmare... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ancient god Posted February 24, 2011 Share Posted February 24, 2011 I know this is somewhat off topic, but it is slightly on topic as well. Not trying to hijack... I actually ordered a bottle of Micro Sol (and Micro Set) today. I see many tutorials that swear you should have a gloss coat to apply the decal to. Now, if Micro Sol can dissolve the film couldn't I skip this gloss clear coat step? I have a handful of models of which I simply applied the decal directly to the painted shoulder - I suppose that's a matte finish. They look decent, but of course when you turn them certain ways in the light, you get glare. I can't say what I'm seeing is really "silvering" as I can't see the clear parts really at all and the glare shows on all parts of the decal. My hope was I could still apply some Micro Sol to them to help with that as well as do some weathering (yours is stunning by the way) to make them look overall less uniform. Will the Micro Sol help? If it matters, I'm now using the Forge World decal sheet - not sure if they are of a higher quality than the GW ones (mostly bought it just to get Deathwing ones). I still use gloss varnish both under and over my decals to make the film become invisible and to protect the decal. The gloss varnish does two things: 1. It provides a smooth surface for the decal to cling to. You can normally see decals very clearly because the surface beneath is uneven. For comparison, look at a smooth piece of plastic or glass, maybe a model plane's canopy. If you take a file to it or use matt varnish ontop of it, it will become milky because the surface is no longer smooth. The same effect takes place when you apply a decal over an uneven surface. 2. It protects the paint under it from the Micro Sol. I use Micro Sol too and once in a while, it will dissolve the upper layers of the paint underneath (or around) your decal. Not a nice thing to have happen. The gloss varnish is much sturdier, and even if some of it dissolves, it won't matter much. So what I do for squad markings for example is, apply gloss, then apply solvent with the decal right after and more solvent on top, to make it soak. Then let the decal set a little and reapply the solvent. Use a cotton swab or a clean, stiff brush side to carefully bend the decal into place. This will take some time and I will usually reapply solvent three or four times until I am satisfied. I then touch up the decal with regular paint, if necessary (I touch up the red arrows because I want them to pop). After this, seal the decal off with gloss varnish. In the case of the squad markings, I now apply the number ontop of the unit patch, and seal that with gloos varnish too when I'm done. I paint some matt varnish over the whole pad when I'm done. This usually results in smooth, traceless decals. Using Microsol on old decals: I haven't tried it myself, but you won't harm the models by trying. The paint beneath will be old and well dry, so it shouldn't dissolve too easily. Try softening them up with 1-2 layers of Microsol and mold them onto the models with a small drybrush or similar. Apply a good measure of sightly thinned gloss varnish afterwards and seal with matt varnish. Might improve the result! You can use weathering techniques after all this, you'd do that after applying decals anyway. Try scratching the decal with your base colour first, and then the whole area with a generic "wear and tear" tone like a dark brown/grey. It makes the decal look like part of the model and shows how it would be painted on the armour's base paint. I don't know if the Forgeworld decals are any different than GW's, haven't used any of those yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EPK Posted February 24, 2011 Share Posted February 24, 2011 Thanks for the insight ancient god. That seems to be the gist of what I gathered online as well. I'm all for taking my time on models, like a lot of you, I spend hours on each and unfortunately don't have enough time to work on them consistently (it took me months to finish 5 Vets, and I still need to do the basing and details on one! lol) . The layers of varnishes just seem like a lot more added time. But I guess if you want to do something right, it makes sense. When the Micro Sol comes in, I'm going to test it out and see what I wind up with on one of those models already with decals. Even if it helps blend the decal just a tad, I'd call that useful - I'll let you know of the outcome. I'm no master painter/modeler, so something that is just "good" is still passable in my book. Honestly I though they looked good already, but with the right application, I'm sure they could look great. More on topic - That freehand tutorial above is spot on. The best way to do it is break it into shapes. Slightly different technique - when I use the upgrade sprue's shoulder pad with just a sword on it, I paint the wings on separate to make it into a chapter badge, building up from gray. I do a quick "sketch" of the rough proportions first, than fill in from there. As noted, I will than go back and clean it up with the color of the actual pad to square off edges and such. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaeus Marius Posted February 24, 2011 Author Share Posted February 24, 2011 Thanks guys, I truly appreciate all the help. AG, your method for applying decals sounds good, and the pics on your DA thread were awesome. Ron, your method for painting the free hand deathwing symbols is simple, but very clean looking. I think I will give both a try. I have about 40 power armored marines, and 20 more deathwing to paint, so I have a pretty big job ahead. I paint the squad markings the same bone white as the chapter badge, so I figured that decals were out for them, but I might try apllying, then painting over them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krewl Posted March 1, 2011 Share Posted March 1, 2011 I also use Ron's basic idea. Paint up the total shapes as large simple blobs and paint away what you do not need. You can also start by painting with a pencil and covering it later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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