Jarl Kjaran Coldheart Posted May 9, 2011 Share Posted May 9, 2011 Nope, you're confusing the confrontation with what happened after. Curze told Fulgrim, Fulgrim told Dorn, Dorn 'confronted' Curze, Dorn got beaten up, and Curze was isolated in his chambers, where he killed the honour guard and fled to Nostramo. fair enough, i never claimed to be a expert at this :cuss luckily, all it took was me checking my index astartes collection to remember the proper flow of events. (and you correcting me of course!) WLK Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/227687-primarch-v-primarch-round-1-fight/page/5/#findComment-2751711 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walter Payton Posted May 10, 2011 Share Posted May 10, 2011 The only three primarchs actually to have faced one another in a single combat with a decisive outcome are thus: Fulgrim: 2 (Roboute Guilliman and Ferrus Manus) Guilliman: 2 possibles (possibly killing Alpharius or Omegon and possibly banishing Fulgrim) Horus: 1 (Sanguinius) Does the fight between Russ and Magnus not count? Magnus might have used his sorcery to escape into the warp, but that doesnt nullify the fact he had lost in hand to hand combat against Russ. and are we also discounting the Lion-Wolf brawl? WLK By decisive I meant with the death of one of the participant. Russ fighting the Lion to a standstill and then being surprise-punched whilst he was trying to make peace doesn't really prove anything, except that the Lion has poor people skills. I don't know about the Russ/Magnus fight, not having read A Thousand Sons or Prospero Burns, but I don't really see it as decisive; Magnus survived, managed to turn up at Terra, then Fenris and Garm, and is still kicking back in the Eye. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/227687-primarch-v-primarch-round-1-fight/page/5/#findComment-2753555 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MagicMan Posted May 10, 2011 Share Posted May 10, 2011 Russ broke Magnus' back over his knee. Seems pretty decisive. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/227687-primarch-v-primarch-round-1-fight/page/5/#findComment-2753626 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walter Payton Posted May 10, 2011 Share Posted May 10, 2011 Russ broke Magnus' back over his knee. Seems pretty decisive. Why? Magnus survived, didn't he? Universe pre the fight between Fulgrim and Guilliman: Guilliman is alive Universe after: Guilliman is dead. Plenty's changed. Universe pre the fight between Russ and Magnus: Magnus is alive. Universe after: Magnus is still alive. Nothing's changed. Breaking Magnus's bones (and having one's back broken does not necessarily affect a primarch in the way it affects a human) makes little difference to the nature of the universe or war. Killing Roboute Guilliman makes a huge difference. In that regard, Russ Vs Magnus was not decisive, whilst Guilliman vs Fulgrim was. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/227687-primarch-v-primarch-round-1-fight/page/5/#findComment-2753655 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epistolary Exander Posted May 10, 2011 Share Posted May 10, 2011 Guilliman was influential in forging the Imperium we have today & giving us the options to write our own lovely IAs for our own chapters. Only the Emperor knows what Guilliman would have done & subsequently what fandom would have been able to write if Fulgrim had not been so mean to this prodigy. May Guilliman forever rest in peace :P On a more serious note isnt Guilliman meant to be alive in stasis & healing slowly from the wound he suffered from Fulgrim? Seeing as how most of the loyalist Primarchs are missing or know one really knows what they are doing, it wouldnt surprise me if Guilliman is healing from this wound. Let alone if Manus turned back up with his head back on Frankenstein style, actually that would be quite fitting (pun not intended). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/227687-primarch-v-primarch-round-1-fight/page/5/#findComment-2753674 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walter Payton Posted May 10, 2011 Share Posted May 10, 2011 Guilliman was influential in forging the Imperium we have today & giving us the options to write our own lovely IAs for our own chapters. Only the Emperor knows what Guilliman would have done & subsequently what fandom would have been able to write if Fulgrim had not been so mean to this prodigy. May Guilliman forever rest in peace :P On a more serious note isnt Guilliman meant to be alive in stasis & healing slowly from the wound he suffered from Fulgrim? Seeing as how most of the loyalist Primarchs are missing or know one really knows what they are doing, it wouldnt surprise me if Guilliman is healing from this wound. Let alone if Manus turned back up with his head back on Frankenstein style, actually that would be quite fitting (pun not intended). I was careful not to say that Guilliman is dead; he isn't. The stasis field preserves his body exactly as it was after his wound. He should not be able to either die or heal. However, he isn't still running around and taking names. The rumour that Guilliman healing is slowly is conspicuously described as just that: a rumour. Many, including Uriel Ventris, consider it to be wishful thinking. I would love it to be true, but in a universe as certainly uncertain as 40k, when something is a rumour, it is certainly a rumour and therefore incontrovertibly certainly uncertain. Fulgrim and Collected Visions make it very clear that Ferrus Mannus is dead. Bummer, innit? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/227687-primarch-v-primarch-round-1-fight/page/5/#findComment-2753686 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarl Kjaran Coldheart Posted May 10, 2011 Share Posted May 10, 2011 Russ broke Magnus' back over his knee. Seems pretty decisive. Why? Magnus survived, didn't he? Universe pre the fight between Fulgrim and Guilliman: Guilliman is alive Universe after: Guilliman is dead. Plenty's changed. Universe pre the fight between Russ and Magnus: Magnus is alive. Universe after: Magnus is still alive. Nothing's changed. Breaking Magnus's bones (and having one's back broken does not necessarily affect a primarch in the way it affects a human) makes little difference to the nature of the universe or war. Killing Roboute Guilliman makes a huge difference. In that regard, Russ Vs Magnus was not decisive, whilst Guilliman vs Fulgrim was. Magnus: His planet didnt survive. His legion was shattered. not decisive enough? WLK Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/227687-primarch-v-primarch-round-1-fight/page/5/#findComment-2753761 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epistolary Exander Posted May 10, 2011 Share Posted May 10, 2011 Ive nothing against Manus being killed off, but its a bit annoying with how little material there is on the rest of Iron Hands legion. Manus died along with veteran companies on Istvaan 5, we havent really been told what vast bulk of the Iron Hands have done after the drop site massacre. They were supposedly in route to Istvaan to link up with the rest of the legion at some point during the battle, but they never materialised. I mean it wouldnt have been hard to have the entire Iron Hands legion wiped out in the battle, all it would take is to allow the Iron Hands to spear head the 2nd wave & then gun them down when they linked up with the rest of their legion. The 2 decisive things about the battle between Russ & Magnus was that Magnus was able to puppy train Freki & Geri, while Russ tried to show Magnus how smart he actually was by turning Magnus into his own personal olympic bar Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/227687-primarch-v-primarch-round-1-fight/page/5/#findComment-2753837 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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