Dealing with Eldar / Dark Eldar

[Colonel Kurtz]

Hi all,

 

Having recently joined my local gaming club, and having played a grand total of two games now (1 draw, one humiliating defeat), one of the member has offered to play me Friday week, with either Eldar or Dark Eldar, he wasn't sure which. Points limit of 1000.

Having only recently begun, I have bugger all built, but have pretty much access to everything, Having a free weekend coming before hand, I can go into a building frenzy to make a list.

So, what I am asking you, oh veterans of countless battles, how should I equip myself and why (ie suggested army lists).

Thanks in advance, I eagerly await your responses.

[Colonel Kurtz]

Initial list being tossed around here in the office with my mate Smaug

(Please excuse me if I stuff up the shorthand)

 

HQ

Captain in TDA with SS & TH

 

Troops

Full Tactical Squad with ML, Flamer and Sgt with Bolt Pistol, Combi Flamer and MBs, Razorback w/ TLAC

Full Tactical Squad with ML, Flamer and Sgt with Bolt Pistol, Combi Flamer and MBs, Razorback w/ TLAC

 

Fast Attack

Baal Pred with TLAC and HF

 

Heavy Support

Pred with Autocannon and LC sponsons

[ianj253]

I can't speak on eldar as I've only played them once. However, I do have a lot of experience against their evil brethren! 

 

Your list would be tough for a DE player to handle due to the pure amount of mech, which gives DE some trouble. There are some DE list that just don't care about mech though. If he's taking true born with blasters ( DE melta gun with 18 inch range) he'll love facing your list.

 

DE love their dedicated transports, which pack a good amount of fire power. Each venom can put out 12 poisoned 4+ shots. This may not sound like much but the venoms come in at only 55 points, so DE can bring them out in force. Now venoms, and all DE vehicles for that matter, are easily brought down. Most have 10 av. Multimelta attack bikes are a good option as they can easily pop open a transport and have great maneuverability.

 

DE are pretty weak in combat, as they are your typical T3 S3 space elf. Just steer clear of incubi if he takes any, as they'll slaughter space marines whole sale. 

[Theredknight]

Those flying pirate ships are a pig en masse! They can be in your face end of turn one if they play it right, along with the de jetbikes, and that is hassle even with rapid firing bolters.

 

I play against a de player occasionally, he takes the flyer, 2 boats, 6 jetbikes 11 witches, 2 talos, 5 scourges and whatever other men (or trannys) he can fit in there.

 

I was a little taken aback my first game, but id taken 2 Tac squads, plasma guns, both sgts with combi plas, one with ml, one with hb.

 

One assault squad, 2 flamers, sgt hand flamer,

 

Base libby, storm bolter (prescience)

J pack sang priest

Foot sang priest.

10x sternguard

 

Raven for aa purposes.

 

Razor ass cannon

 

He annihilated half a Tac squad with his bikes, left my plas and sarge, I rapid fired plas at his boat and blew it up, all but one died in the crash.

 

I could give a full report but don't want to bore you.

 

My sternguard with libby and sang priest in, pretty much annihilated his witches and leader, his jetbikes and a talos with special issue munitions, no creeping in cover for those.. and wounding 2+ on the talos was a godsend as hed kiled my heavy weps off by then.

Flamers on ass squads ruined (wounding on 3s) and plas in Tac squads great for those light vehicles.

And hurricanes, ass can and h.bolter on the raven..yes...yes...

[Colonel Kurtz]

Assault cannons, muchos bolters, plasma, sternguard. Got it.

[Theredknight]

That's just me personally, others will come up with things im sure.

they are just puny space elves in the end with t3 and some crappy saves (5+ I think mostly) so bolts do damage once youv cracked the shell of av10 armour, you can even glance them to death with bolters..

 

If your playing lots of bikes,hmm well a dev squad with 4hvy bolters should bring down most things if your defending :-)

 

Eldar will probably take dark reapers, doa 2 separate combat squads near them, flame them to heck with your 2 flamers, and 2 hand flamers (sarge and priest) and finish them up close and personal..again thats me personally.

[Xenith]

Bolters are enough.

 

Regular marines will beat eldar non CC specialists in combat. Assault marines/other will lose to Eldar CC specialists.

 

As said, assault cannons/S7 are the bane of Eldar/DE. Enough to take down any transport they put down.

 

Id swap the flamers on the Baal for heavy bolters - you need the range. Up close youll just get Fragon'd or haywired.

 

Id say the only weak choice in the army is the captain. Swap him for a base librarian (to prescience something, or to protect against Doom) with a force staff (S6 instadeaths eldar, AP4 should be enough).

 

Use the freed up 60pt for something like a speeder or an attack bike.

[ASSASSINAWOKEN]

I believe the majority of DE vehicles can be brought down with Str 4 weapons being glanced to death. Bodies do help as they have poisoned weapons so 3+ and 2+ save galore will be simply overwhelmed by dice rolling.

[Colonel Kurtz]

Hmmmmm, I need to start building a lot of stuff this weekend it seems

[Theredknight]

@ xenith with a s6 ass cannon, it'd be hard to bring down a talos pain engine. The person I play takes 2 of them, hence why I use sterns either pod or in reserves. Can even chuck in a plas or 2 for good measure points are cheap at 5 each! :-)

 

I didn't really bother with mech as they just got haywired and glanced up. Once you get in combat, that t3 really begins to tell agains power armoured a astartes!!

[Colonel Kurtz]

Okay, so Smaug and I have come up with this. Comments and tweaks appreciated

 

HQ

Libby in Terminator armour and storm shield Force Stave

 

Elites

8 Sternguard w/ 1 x combi melta, 2 x combi plasma, 2 hvy flamers + SGT w/ bolter and lightning claw

 

Troops

Full Tac squad w/ ML, flamer, SGT w/ Bolter and BoltPistol, Razorback w/ TLAC

Full Tac squad w/ ML, flamer, SGT w/ Bolter and BoltPistol, Razorback w/ TLAC

 

Heavy Support

Preadtor w/ Autocannon and HB

[IK Viper]

How are the sternguard getting there? If they walk they will get shot down/avoided.  Also I like the Twl Las Cannons alot in most cases, in this particular match up I would favor the Twl Assault Cannon because of the higher rate of fire and less need for high strength and AP2 but that can be considered list tailoring.  Depends on if he is doing it to and is accepted or if you both are going for an all commers list. 

 

If you are planning on walking the sternguard with the Libby up front to tank wounds I would reconsider,  Eldar and DE are both so fast and out range you so badly that Sternguard on foot will not threaten them enough.  I personnaly would either take off the TDA on the libby and put them all in a rhino, or if you are feeling aggressive put them all in a Drop Pod.  Walking that unit will just get them shot up before being able to engage much of anything though.  If you play the Sternguard right however they can use their special ammo to really rip chunks out of DE or Eldar infantry very effectively.  

 

Prioritize popping his anti-tank first then stay in your vehicles until you close to rapid-fire range,  most of the DE weapons shread infantry but bounce off armor.  Anything with a bright lance / dark lance/ or void lance can ruin your day so kill it fast.  Also prioritize anything with the "Haywire" special rule.   

[Grey Mage]

Why would the Sternguard "get" anywhere? Against eldar you should be sitting back unloading kraken rounds into those T3 4+ bodies....

 

Anything with a 3+ save is likely to be moving towards you, save Dark Reapers. Dark Reapers are nasty.... and I dont see a single answer to them in your list to be honest.

 

Consider a Drop Podding Dreadnaught of any flavor you like- as long as it has a heavy flamer- as a solid addition against Eldar, and not a slouch vs DE.

 

The libby though is going to be only of limited use as psychic defense, and may very well die outright to Runes of Warding- 3d6 leadership tests, with perils on 12+ kills alot of libbies fast.

 

To be honest, I liked your first list better and I think itll fare better against most Eldar lists overall.

[Dafoo]

Glad to see none of your Eldar players are running wraith lists lol. Those things can be nasty if you get in too close. I have seen Eldar lists with nothing but T6 and T8 with Eldrad... It was not a fun match. At 1000 points you should be safe from that though.

[Grey Mage]

Glad to see none of your Eldar players are running wraith lists lol. Those things can be nasty if you get in too close. I have seen Eldar lists with nothing but T6 and T8 with Eldrad... It was not a fun match. At 1000 points you should be safe from that though.

Yeah... seeing as a scoring unit of Wraithguard is 396 points *wince*

But it is so much fun to watch an entire deathwing army bounce off one of your troops units

Other units with 3+ saves to watch out for though... Warp Spiders- who can drown you in 2+ to wound shots... and Dark Reapers- who can drown you in S5 AP 3 shots. Neither were popular in the mech age, but both should be making a swift comeback.