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Angels and Knights


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And it is a great day. My Khorne worshipping girlfriend has finally repented her vile heresy and has found a Chapter of the Imperium to believe in and has discovered her faith in the Emperor is strong. She has chosen Sanguinius as her Primarch and the Blood Angels as her chapter (which is also good for my Space Wolves.) So I am after some advice from my Grey Knight brethren as to whether we work well with the Angels and if so what are the good parts of the alliance.


She has already decided the Sanguinor and Sanguinary guard are 2 things she is going to run on a regular basis and she is quite liking the idea of an almost entirely Assault Marine centered list. Which i think is pretty cool.


I am quite looking forward to alliance of Knights and Angels.

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I wish I could get my girl into playing 40k with me. She painted most of a minotaur once, which inspired her to take full-on painting (on canvas) classes. She plays Dominion, which is good enough for me.


Ironically, my two armies use those two codecies there: Blood Angels and GK, but I have yet to ally them together. (Well, I haven't allied GK to my marines since prior to the 5th Ed. drop.) Seems to me it'd still work out brilliantly, but you'll see before I will. :)

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I could see it working quite well actually as two separate forces working together - as in two separate armies and players. A doubles tournament/game for example.

As 'Allies' within one FOC I don't think BA are all that great. They bring more specialised, expensive units to the table as a rule (Going off Sanguinary Guard/Sanguinor as you mentioned) which is something we already have plenty of. And we're no slouches in CC anyway. GK allying in units, in my opinion, need bulk, cheap units (Guard blobs for example) or at least a few specialised units which still don't break the bank (Vendettas and the like). 


Again though - as tow forces working together with their own FOCs etc - I think us and BA would work very well together.


I consider myself very lucky in that my fiance is very supportive of my 40K addiction and is actually a decent painter. She loves painting larger models like Land Raiders/Stormravens etc and is fantastic at doing intricate freehand artwork on them. She once painted a Grey Knight hero impaling a daemon swooping down on it on the side of my Land Raider Crusader and it was incredible. You however, having your GF play - are especially lucky :D

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Yeah I am definitely lucky in that respect, well for the most part she tends to kick my ass :-).


I was thinking with the Blood Angels I would take a heavy fire support role. Running lots of Psycannons possibly using a couple of purgation squads :-)

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BA, for the most part, aren't actually all that great in CC anymore. Losing the initiative bonus from Furious Charge really hurt, as did becoming unable to charge out of a rhino. Aside from Death Company and Mephiston (the original marine MC tongue.png), point-for-point BA are at best average in terms of CC ability.

One thing BA do excel at is mobility. Every one of our rhino chassis vehicles are fast, and we're the only marines with scoring jump troops by default. We've got the best anti-tank stormraven (TLAC/TLMM with 4x S8 AP1 missiles). Descent of Angels means not only do our jump marines arrive on time, they also arrive on target.

If you've got a fairly static GK army, BA make a good complement. They're also pretty good at deepstriking melta behind enemy lines, and vapourising tanks without warning. If you're already mobile (PT-DKs, Interceptors), BA probably won't add much if anything that a GKGM with grand strategy wouldn't.

Just a side note, Sanguinor and SangGuard are both fantastic models to build/paint and fun to play, but neither are great on their own in gameplay terms. I personally wouldn't run SangGuard without Dante to make them scoring and a banner to give them punch, otherwise they're 40pts/model for a 5-man unit with 2 attacks/each that has no invulnerable save. Sanguinor is similarly situational: while great for tanking a challenge (WS8 2+/3++ EW), he can't be part of a unit and only has 3W, so he often gets torrented off the board. He's also really expensive for what benefits he brings. If he were 50-75pts cheaper, I'd consider him. As it is, I haven't used mine in almost a year of regular weekly play.

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My doubles partner plays BA while I field my Ghostwing in local doubles tournaments (1500pts per player). What we've found is that while BA and GK do not really suppliment each other (we both fill the same role), both armies compliment each other nicely in our mobility and assaulty nature.



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Check out the GK Army List Sub Forum.  I have posted numerous lists recently utilising GKT as the core element of my lists. I love them and my lists are built around them. Several of these ideas are still on the front page of the Army List forum. As I understand it, a few people round here are the same. I know Vash uses - or at least used to - use a solid core of 20 GKT in his list.


GKT are an amazing Troops choice that I don't see often enough. Most prefer more boots on the ground which means Coteaz/Henchman spam unfortunately, but as you point out they are a good match for BA - and indeed many armies. By themselves they are a stand out choice in my opinion :)

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As a primarily BA player, who also plays alot of GK, I think that the GK do most everything that BA can do.  There are a few things that BA have that are really nice though.


BA Stromraven => better then the GK version at killing the hated Helldrake, and its missiles will always have a viable target in every match-up


Baal Predator, Predator, Vindicator => Fast tanks that can shoot out past the 24 inch range and can relocate 24 inches a turn if needed.  Psyfulman dreads are great but these tanks are better at changing the angle of fire and moving around in order to prevent the enemy from using terrain to hide behind, making them one of the few fire base options that thrive in terrain rich boards.   


Assault Marines are great a DS Melta Guns on ppl


Mephiston => can kill enything without a 2+ save... 


Attack Bikes => the ability to project a MM forward very quickly. 


Sternguard => great at killing basically anything, you just have to get these guys in position


Death Co. => an easy way to fill your Allied troop unit requirement with something very killy (standard load out puts out 5 Attacks at WS 5 and S5 on the charge, and for 15 points those attacks can turn into Power Weapon attacks, not as good as DCA but alot tougher too.


GK lack alot of low AP shooting (can't count on rends all the time), and long range low AP shooting is basically unheard of (sans the Monkeys) this is something BA can give them.  Some example BA allied detatchments:


Detetchemnt 1: (770 pts)

Vindicator=> Demoolisher Cannon that can move 12 and then fire due to fast rule

Baal Predator => TLAC Hvy. Bolter Sponsons (great for outflanking onto side armor)

Assault Marines (10) => 2 MG, P. Sword / MB  (drops Melta on ppl, and can combat squad to cover 2 objectives)

Mephiston (more killy then a Dreadknight so long as its doesn't have a 2+ save)


Detatchemnt 2: (665 pts)

BA Stormraven => TLMM TLLC HB's

2 MM Attack bikes => fest MM's

Scout Squad (5) => 4 Sniper Rifles and a ML to hold a back objective (they have Infiltrate which is great for Relic games)



Detetchament 3: (505 pts)

BA Stormraven

5 Death Co. w/ 3 Power Axes (10 regular and 15 Power Axe Attacks with Furious Charge, with attached Reclusiare your getting rerolls to hit and to wound) 



just some ideas

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Thanks for all the repsonses guys. Some really good advice.


She has decided upon Commander Dante as her commnader which is great as Sanguinary Guard then become troops.


@IK Viper thanks for the suggestions the likely outcome will be closer to the third suggestion more than anything. Due to the Death Company which she is also a big fan of. She is not a massive fan of vehicles, a friend of ours runs alot of tank spam and put her off tanks generally.

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