Urauloth Posted August 28, 2013 Share Posted August 28, 2013 This is probably a stupid question, but is there a reason space wolves don't use ironclads? I'm not aware of anything restricting ironclads to specific chapters, so it just seems a little odd. Is there a fluff reason for it? Is it game balance? Is it so Bjorn stands out as the only av13 dread in the codex? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander S. Caesare Posted August 28, 2013 Share Posted August 28, 2013 In my belief of the SWs, I don't think siege-and-breach is their playstyle. The technological card wasn't really their way, I guess. Also, many a Great Company aren't exactly up-to-date with the latest tech. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3437604 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squark Posted August 28, 2013 Share Posted August 28, 2013 Because people need a mechanical reason to play codex marines, so every release gives them a few unique toys to play with. Now, as the most divergent codex, this is less apparent to us, but compare the 5th edition codex to say... Blood Angels, and you'll see why the ironclad, thunderfire cannon, and land speeder storm are exclusive to Codex Marines. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3438023 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted August 28, 2013 Share Posted August 28, 2013 What Squark said.We had them for a brief period- about a year- between the release of the new C:SM and the new C:SW. Along with the landspeeder storm.... amazing unit, I still pine after it sometimes. No reason we shouldnt have a decent CC dread option like the Ironclad, it just doesnt show up in game. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3438031 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squark Posted August 28, 2013 Share Posted August 28, 2013 For those confused by Grey Mage's statement, the old 3rd edition Space Wolves codex was sort of like the new mini-dexes; It had the army list and all our unique units in it, but it also required the Vanilla marines codex. So, as Codex: Space Marines got updated, our old 3rd edition codex picked up some updates in the progress, mostly with regards to vehicles. Actually, a new dreadnaught kit is probably the most sensible addition to the rumored 6th edition codex after some air support. Now, I say that with no other information beyond my own thoughts, but it does make some sense; Every other codex now has their own variant (Blood Angels have Death Company and Furioso Dreadnaughts, Dark Angels have Mortis Dreadnaughts, Codex Marines have the ironclad, and Grey Knights have the psychic dreadnaughts), so it's not that unreasonable to think we might have made our own model at some point. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3438057 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moongob Posted August 28, 2013 Share Posted August 28, 2013 Our own model was the venerable dreadnought. I don't see now how to make it unique for us (except remove it from vanila dex) again. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3438194 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dswanick Posted August 28, 2013 Share Posted August 28, 2013 Our own model was the venerable dreadnought. I don't see now how to make it unique for us (except remove it from vanila dex) again.Sagas... This is probably a stupid question, but is there a reason space wolves don't use ironclads? I'm not aware of anything restricting ironclads to specific chapters, so it just seems a little odd. Is there a fluff reason for it? Is it game balance? Is it so Bjorn stands out as the only av13 dread in the codex?You can have an allied Ironclad in a HS slot by taking a C:SM Master of the Forge as your Allied HQ. And then you can field that Iron Priest model collecting dust on the shelf, with the added bonus of taking a Conversion Beamer. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3438198 Share on other sites More sharing options...
viddar Posted August 28, 2013 Share Posted August 28, 2013 For those confused by Grey Mage's statement, the old 3rd edition Space Wolves codex was sort of like the new mini-dexes; It had the army list and all our unique units in it, but it also required the Vanilla marines codex. So, as Codex: Space Marines got updated, our old 3rd edition codex picked up some updates in the progress, mostly with regards to vehicles. Actually, a new dreadnaught kit is probably the most sensible addition to the rumored 6th edition codex after some air support. Now, I say that with no other information beyond my own thoughts, but it does make some sense; Every other codex now has their own variant (Blood Angels have Death Company and Furioso Dreadnaughts, Dark Angels have Mortis Dreadnaughts, Codex Marines have the ironclad, and Grey Knights have the psychic dreadnaughts), so it's not that unreasonable to think we might have made our own model at some point. I doubt we'd see our own variant, mostly because I don't see what new options they'd bring to the table with it. That said a Sky Hunter saga that allowed them to be anti-air would be a really cool addition. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3438207 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squark Posted August 28, 2013 Share Posted August 28, 2013 Our own model was the venerable dreadnought. I don't see now how to make it unique for us (except remove it from vanila dex) again. Oh, Venerable Dreadnaughts used to be Space Wolf exclusives? Well, the more you know. All I knew was they used to be an HQ choice. Moving it back into the HQ slot might help, though. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3438229 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Urauloth Posted August 29, 2013 Author Share Posted August 29, 2013 Yeah they did, way back when. Weird how they didn't include a scrap of space wolf iconography in the vendread kit, but pfff. Anyway what I really want for my wolves is an elite, tough, hard-hitting close combat dread with huge claws, so I guess what I actually want is a furioso and I'm monumentally out of luck. ;) Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3438919 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dswanick Posted August 29, 2013 Share Posted August 29, 2013 Yeah they did, way back when. Weird how they didn't include a scrap of space wolf iconography in the vendread kit, but pfff. Anyway what I really want for my wolves is an elite, tough, hard-hitting close combat dread with huge claws, so I guess what I actually want is a furioso and I'm monumentally out of luck. Allies are your friends ... http://i1127.photobucket.com/albums/l634/dswanick/Warhammer%2040000/Armies/Space%20Wolves/SpaceWolvesDreadnought.jpg Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3438957 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted August 29, 2013 Share Posted August 29, 2013 Our own model was the venerable dreadnought. I don't see now how to make it unique for us (except remove it from vanila dex) again. Oh, Venerable Dreadnaughts used to be Space Wolf exclusives? Well, the more you know. All I knew was they used to be an HQ choice. Moving it back into the HQ slot might help, though. It was very brief, and by the time the new Vendread kit came out that time was over. It was also an HQ option for us, wich was absolutely beyond awesome given how survivable they were. Saga of the beastslayer.... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3439054 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Urauloth Posted August 29, 2013 Author Share Posted August 29, 2013 Allies are your friends ... This is a pretty great plan. What do you run as your compulsory BA HQ/troop choices and how have you wolfed them up? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3439058 Share on other sites More sharing options...
dswanick Posted August 29, 2013 Share Posted August 29, 2013 A Kvlt Ghost, on 29 Aug 2013 - 06:21, said: Quote Allies are your friends ... This is a pretty great plan. What do you run as your compulsory BA HQ/troop choices and how have you wolfed them up? C:BA Captain w/ Power Maul (and sometimes Infernus Pistol or Plasma Pistol) - using one of my Wolf Priest models.C:BA Death Company - using Blood Claws models, all bearing Marks of the Wulfen. The rules equate pretty well: Fearless, Rage, WS5 vs WS3 w/reroll, while others give it an amped-up Wulfen fell (FNP, Furious Charge) The Character comes across as an amped-up Wolf Priest tasked with leading a suicidal charge of Wolf-marked Claws who are on the verge of losing control. It's also nice that I can then field that Dread as a DC Furioso, and still have my 1@ Troop, Elite, Fast Attack, and Heavy Support slots available. Total unit cost: 375+ pts. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3439096 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squark Posted August 29, 2013 Share Posted August 29, 2013 I've also heard of using Death Company to represent the 13th company. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3439128 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted August 29, 2013 Share Posted August 29, 2013 I havent done this yet, but if I were using BA allies itd be:Reculisiarch.9 Death Company-2 Powerfists, shown as wulfen, with a drop pod. As a basis for the 13nth company. With the elites slot likely taken up by sternguard in a drop pod, and perhaps an honor guard with similar.The drop pods are something Ive been working on for... to long. Sculpting them to look like portals opening out of the warp made by rune priests, with the lightning crackles for the stormbolter. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3439130 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squark Posted August 29, 2013 Share Posted August 29, 2013 I havent done this yet, but if I were using BA allies itd be: Reculisiarch. 9 Death Company-2 Powerfists, shown as wulfen, with a drop pod. As a basis for the 13nth company. With the elites slot likely taken up by sternguard in a drop pod, and perhaps an honor guard with similar. The drop pods are something Ive been working on for... to long. Sculpting them to look like portals opening out of the warp made by rune priests, with the lightning crackles for the stormbolter. ... That sounds awesome. Can we get a WIP pic? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3439141 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grey Mage Posted August 29, 2013 Share Posted August 29, 2013 Sure the next time I have a digital camera in the house. I dont own one myself, but I can ask around- its been a fun project so far. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3439157 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sohail187 Posted August 29, 2013 Share Posted August 29, 2013 I havent done this yet, but if I were using BA allies itd be: Reculisiarch. 9 Death Company-2 Powerfists, shown as wulfen, with a drop pod. As a basis for the 13nth company. With the elites slot likely taken up by sternguard in a drop pod, and perhaps an honor guard with similar. The drop pods are something Ive been working on for... to long. Sculpting them to look like portals opening out of the warp made by rune priests, with the lightning crackles for the stormbolter. I would also love to see pics of this :D Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3439170 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rift Blade Posted August 29, 2013 Share Posted August 29, 2013 Gotta agree with the others here Gray Mage, really would be cool to see some pics. The idea sounds great. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3439402 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valerian Posted August 29, 2013 Share Posted August 29, 2013 Given that the Space Wolves have the most dreadnoughts of any other Chapter (on the order of 200) it would be fitting for a special Dreadnought to be created in a 6e to give us back something "special" in this unit. As stated, the Venerable Dread was originally a Space Wolves-only unit, that soon proliferated to the other Chapters (similar to the StormRaven, etc.). We had the "generic" Venerable Dread in the 3e mini-dex to replace the Special Character Bjorn the Fell-Handed, who had been in the 2e Dex, but was dropped in 3e in favor of the generic. By 5th, the generic Venerable was no longer unique to the Wolves, so Bjorn was reincarnated (woo hoo!). Anyway, my hope for 6e is a unique Dread platform for the Wolves, and another HQ Dread option other than just Bjorn (would be nice to get to take advantage of the 4x HQ choices we get with a Dread option that wouldn't compete against our Elites or Heavy Support choices). V Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3439403 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russ Brother 92 Posted August 29, 2013 Share Posted August 29, 2013 Given that the Space Wolves have the most dreadnoughts of any other Chapter (on the order of 200) it would be fitting for a special Dreadnought to be created in a 6e to give us back something "special" in this unit. As stated, the Venerable Dread was originally a Space Wolves-only unit, that soon proliferated to the other Chapters (similar to the StormRaven, etc.). We had the "generic" Venerable Dread in the 3e mini-dex to replace the Special Character Bjorn the Fell-Handed, who had been in the 2e Dex, but was dropped in 3e in favor of the generic. By 5th, the generic Venerable was no longer unique to the Wolves, so Bjorn was reincarnated (woo hoo!). Anyway, my hope for 6e is a unique Dread platform for the Wolves, and another HQ Dread option other than just Bjorn (would be nice to get to take advantage of the 4x HQ choices we get with a Dread option that wouldn't compete against our Elites or Heavy Support choices). V If we got Dreads as HQ again I would be so happy... two forces of Wolves (one Heresy style and one 40k), first would be Bjorn + 3 Dread friends as my HQs with more Dreads as Elites, then Hunters, backed up by Speeders and LRs as my other choices - second would be Logan, Njal, a (hopefully beefed up) Ulrik and another RP/WP, Lone Wolves as Elites, TDAWG as Troops, TWC as my fast and Fangs as my Heavies... ahh the beautiful idea of having 7 dreads and 60 hunters turn up in two turns thanks to drop pods :P Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3439491 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squark Posted August 29, 2013 Share Posted August 29, 2013 If nothing else, we're the second largest chapter in the imperium (Everyone else splits off every time they start getting over 1500 strong apart form the Black Templars, and even they seem to have spawned a few successor chapters. well, that's our best guess as to where the Red and White Templars came from, anyway), so it makes sense we'd have more dreadnaughts since we've never had to send some of them to babysit a successor chapter. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3439547 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valerian Posted August 29, 2013 Share Posted August 29, 2013 If nothing else, we're the second largest chapter in the imperium (Everyone else splits off every time they start getting over 1500 strong apart form the Black Templars, and even they seem to have spawned a few successor chapters. well, that's our best guess as to where the Red and White Templars came from, anyway), so it makes sense we'd have more dreadnaughts since we've never had to send some of them to babysit a successor chapter.Well, we did once, but never again (re: Wolf Brothers). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3439626 Share on other sites More sharing options...
skawolf Posted August 30, 2013 Share Posted August 30, 2013 I would agree with making them an HQ choice again, that would be super rad! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/279072-ironclad-dreads/#findComment-3440666 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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