New Dex

[Ushtarador]

I think Mephiston lives or dies with his ability to move like jump infantry (as do the librarian dreadnoughts in fact), I really really hope those two units retain Wings of Sanguinius.

[Papa Lazarou]

A few things I would like would be....

- cheaper dc jumpacks

- assault marines being able to use their jp in movement and assault ala raven guard

- ap2 meph

- dante / astorath hitting at intiative

- sanguinor +1W +1T AP2 maybe a bit dearer points wise

- red thirst I kinda like but if they added something like counter attack to as well that would fit with the BA theme

- points reflecting the SM codex

- something to make sanguinary guard more appealing maybe 5+ inv would help - flying termies would rock

Apart from that everything else is great.

[gory_v]

I understand that initially our units were a bit more due to the access to possible red thirst and fast vehicles but I think they're a bit too much in comparison to 6th ed codices. I think that will probably be the most balancing thing they'll do for us but it'll probably be at the expense of losing our dex powers among other things here and there. I, like many of you, probably mostly fear the hit Mephiston will take if he's no longer as mobile and deadly as he is now.

 

As far as our version of chapter tactics go, it'll probably end up in the scrapping of red thirst as it is now since it already got a bit dulled down with the 6th rules release. They seem to have done a fine job providing army wide buffs throughout the chapters in the SM codex (poor DA) so I'm thinking there will will something along the lines of making it easier to assault or the fast tank upgrade being significantly cheaper (return of the AV13 wall of death!). I guess my intention of starting this thread wasn't necessarily to be a place for us to figure out what we like/dislike about our current dex and what we want to see in the new dex but rather a bit of hope that after analyzing the pattern of dex releases that our dex will probably drop sometime next year.

 

Nonetheless, I've enjoyed reading all of our analyses and think we'll probably be pleasantly surprised when it's finally our turn at bat. As far as models go.....they'll probably update one or two of our characters but can't really see any other models actually getting updated unless something unique is added to the dex. Outside of the furioso, DC, and Baal, we don't have units that necessarily need aesthetic updates so maybe we'll see generic SM kits being modified similar to what happened with the tac squad box this release. The assault squads are still lacking a few new bits so I'm thinking it'll be redone with our release, possibly wolves, but I find it hard to see that happening when their blood claws come with chain swords too.

[Morticon]

Wow, if they bring back 3rd ed-esque rhino dismounting for 6th....even something like being able to charge from a stationary vehicles....noms.

[JamesI]

 

I'd rather have our characters striking at initiative than ap2. Kind of hilarious that our legendary chapter master strikes last if he actually makes it into assault....same for Astorath.

 

From the codices they have been releasing so far there are one or two weapons that are AP2 but strike in initiative order. Even Farsight with his Dawn Blade is AP2 at I5. We'll get one as well when they finally redo our release. Hopefully we'll get 2 because we're supposed to be an assault army but I wouldn't hold my breath. Personally I would love to see this ability given to Mephie and/or the Sanguinor but I have a feeling it will be Dante with his Axe Mortalis.

DAnte needs AP2 at initiative.

 

Astorath I wish was also at initiative, but I'd accept him at AP3 to keep Dante Specialer.

[sockwithaticket]

HQ's

• others have covered Dante and Astaroth's fatal flaw
• Captain's with access to all wargear (art. armour, glaive encarmine, deathmask etc.)
• Sanguinary High Priest as a force multiplier character- extended FNP bubble and/or improved FNP save
• Cheaper jump packs

Elites

• Chaplains 1-3

Troops

• Assault marines - Retain Hammer of Wrath attacks regardless of jump pack use OR use jump packs in assault phase 
• Tac squads can take 2 special weapons in lieu of a heavy

 

Wargear

• Deathmasks and artificer armour for everyone! From Captain to sergeant these pieces of wargear should be universal. Our guys are artisans for goodness sake!

[Memento Of Prospero]

Chapter Tactics - Descent of Angels unchanged

Chapter Tactics - The Quick and the Dead - Once per game, at the begining of your shooting phase you can declare using The Quick and the Dead. All Models Blood Angel may fire bolters as though as they had relentless.

[Jorre]

Id like to see the return of +1 iniative on the charge or just give all blood angels rage!

[Ushtarador]

Oh yeah, I just remembered something cool that was mentioned before - jump pack marines with bolters and plasma guns! I would like that :)

[Memento Of Prospero]

I suggested bolter Assault marines, and Jump devastators with assault weapons (plasma, melta, heavy flamer) in another thread a while ago

[Jolemai]

So the tanks in C:DA and C:SM are apparently the same price. If our "fast tax" remains the same then we can probably assume that Rhinos will cost the same number of points but Razorbacks will go up by fifteen! It looks like the Redeemer will go up by five points too.

[Jolemai]

Continuing this trail of thought: Whirlwind to go down by ten, Vindicator down by five, Autolas Destructor to drop by five, Annihilator to drop by twenty and the dakka Destructor would weigh in at ten points more. It's worth adding that the base cost of a Predator in the new Codex is already five points higher than ours, so a base Predator in our new book could arguably be 90 points.

[Rottimus]

BA have been slowly but surely been made obsolete over the last year.

 

With 6th came the advent of close combat being harder, still effective but just harder to pull off.

 

As a whole BA Lost the following unique things:

Stormraven

Flamestorm predator

 

and we're are denied the following:

Mortis dreadnoughts, contemptor or otherwise

Stormtalons

Predator plasma blast gun varient

Thunderfire cannon

Centurions

land speeder storm

Legion of the Damned

Stalker/AA tank

 

Codex space marines now has cheaper characters, tacticals, sternguard, vanguard, assault squads, land speeders, librarians, chaplains, honour guard and command squad.

 

Our remaining unique units have a very similar counter part

Sanguinary guard - New honour guard

Furioso - ironclad/venerable dread

 

Thank the lord for sanguinary priests and death company because that's all we've got left. I'm hoping for a adressing of the balance because right now you can play BA vs Codex marines and have 20% less bodies on the table for little or no advantage (our heroic invervention is better but who really relied upon that anyway?)

 

Also, what will be the space marine supplement codex? Eldar and Chaos got one pretty quick. Any chance the next one will be BA?

[Jolemai]

It's going to be White Scars and no, I do not believe we will be downgraded to a supplement codex. I would also suggest you keep the faith in the Blood Angels; how are you supposed to fight the enemies of the Imperium if your resolve goes so quickly?

[Rottimus]

Is it though? I've heard white scars too but that makes little sense to me... Why include them in the regular codex, give them chapter tactics, a character AND a limited edition cover only to give them ANOTHER supplement months later...

 

That being said, GW doesn't have a track record of making sense  so :)

 

I have not lost the faith, still going to stick to the codex, but a little whining must surely be allowed! :)

 

 

[Jolemai]

It's a supplement of extra fluff, the odd special character and the odd special rule/unit. Just like the three previous ones, you need the parent Codex to field anything from the supplement. Simply put, they add the sauce to the meat and potatoes of the Codex.

 

All three supplements followed their parent codices quite quickly too.

[SnorriSnorrison]

BA have been slowly but surely been made obsolete over the last year. Wut?

 

With 6th came the advent of close combat being harder, still effective but just harder to pull off.

 

As a whole BA Lost the following unique things:

Stormraven wasn't unique to us and it was quite clear from the start that Marines were going to get access to it

Flamestorm predator I didn't know C:SM got a Flamestorm Pred? Are you talking about forgeworld?

 

and we're are denied the following:

Mortis dreadnoughts, contemptor or otherwise Yeah I think we can have Rifleman and Contemptor dreads.

Stormtalons Quite suck anyway.

Predator plasma blast gun varient Imperial Guard, isn't it?

Thunderfire cannon Meh, pretty interesting, but not the way Blood Angels should fight, too immobile. You can always ally in some C:SM toys.

Centurions I'm quite thankful we don't get those. You think the we were off pretty badly with the Sanguinor, and now GW comes up with....yeah, them.

land speeder storm Got a  point there. Although I think we will get access to it when the new dex hits. Especially as an dedicated transport, too much potential too miss.

Legion of the Damned We already have a black armoured special unit. And they're much better in close combat!

Stalker/AA tank An over-glorified autocannon and a missile on top of a rhino chassis shouldn't really concern us.

 

Codex space marines now has cheaper characters, tacticals, sternguard, vanguard, assault squads, land speeders, librarians, chaplains, honour guard and command squad. I think they will still get beaten by our specialised assault units, and our assault squads, chaplains and honour guard can actually do some damage and don't suck in general.

 

Our remaining unique units have a very similar counter part

Sanguinary guard - New honour guard

Furioso - ironclad/venerable dread Remember we still have the Death Company Dreadnought!

 

Thank the lord for sanguinary priests and death company because that's all we've got left. Let me stop you here. Nah.

I'm hoping for a adressing of the balance because right now you can play BA vs Codex marines and have 20% less bodies on the table for little or no advantage (our heroic invervention is better but who really relied upon that anyway?) More blood to spill, more glory to gain eh!

 

Also, what will be the space marine supplement codex? Eldar and Chaos got one pretty quick. Any chance the next one will be BA?

 

 

Mate, it's not all as bad as you say. Yeah, we're a bit overpriced, but we ruled in 5th, so that's still a thing to consider. I don't think we're going to get a supplement though, we'd been in the codex already. I'd rather say Templars are in for a supplement, or White Scars or something else. Right now, there's not much we can do about it, unless you like to switch codizes or spend more of your points on allies.

 

I'm just glad we got some veterans that, albeit very expensive, aren't just "better" assault marines.

 

Snorri

[Brother Xeones]

I agree that if BA go the same general direction as a lot of the new codices, we'll probably see a points reduction on certain units and a few new things here or there. I wouldn't be surprised if they did something odd like giving us a Flying Monstrous Creature exo-angel piloted by a Sanguinary Guard. It's just the sort of idiotic over-the-top thing they'd do to us...

Model release-wise I'd expect character re-sculpts for Mephi and Dante and I'd not be surprised to see a plastic Sanguinary Priest clam pack. Perhaps as others have mentioned we might get the Stormtalon or something similar. Jump Devastators would actually be awesome. Pleeeease no Centurions. Let the vanilla marines keep their termitubbies.

Beyond all that, if I could update Blood Angels, here are a few additional ideas:

• Allow a new wargear option for BA: Stasis Grenades --work like DA Ravenwing Grenade Launcher stasis shells: any unit charged by a unit with stasis grenades has it's initiative and weapon skill reduced by -1 for the remainder of the turn. The loss of +1 Initiative for assaults really hurt our assault marines. This gives a similar effect for a small additional price.

• Open up artificer armor as a wargear option for sergeants as well as captains. We're a chapter of artisans right? This would really be unique and cool as long as it was priced appropriately.

• If Seth is the warlord, treat all transports as assault vehicles Tell me you wouldn't reconsider this guy if this were the case... plus, it would seem appropriate to make this a FTs trait anyway.

[Papa Lazarou]

 

 

• Allow a new wargear option for BA: Stasis Grenades --work like DA Ravenwing Grenade Launcher stasis shells: any unit charged by a unit with stasis grenades has it's initiative and weapon skill reduced by -1 for the remainder of the turn. The loss of +1 Initiative for assaults really hurt our assault marines. This gives a similar effect for a small additional price.

 

 

 

I really like that idea.

[Kem]

useless, if your marines are blown off the board by Tau by turn 4.

[Papa Lazarou]

useless, if your marines are blown off the board by Tau by turn 4.

 and the most constructive comment goes too.......

[sockwithaticket]

useless, if your marines are blown off the board by Tau by turn 4.

If you're looking for a magic 2++ to mitigate Tau fire power you'll be waiting a long time. There's a good chance such wargear would be immensely useful against other opponents.

 

I also like the idea of Seth's Warlord Trait being  all your armour has the assault vehicle rule, it would certainly see him get some use.and go a long way to mitigating the assault nerfs that have hit us in particular.

[Gydeon]

Dante should totally get a Coup de Grâce added in the new Dex. The Bloodthirster Skarbrand was cloven in two by the Master of the Blood Angels (Supposedly, you know how those stories go when it is heard third and fourth hand!), so why not add that into his ruleset? /Wishlisting.

If Seth had the assault ramp warlord trait, I think alot of people would make him an auto include for mechanized armies. Call it Master of Mechanized Assaults if you will, perhaps something better.

I think the Angels of Death warlord trait from C:SM would suit us Red enameled warriors perfectly. What's better than an updated Captain and his command squad gaining the Fear special rule?

EDIT: Samsung keyboards are a pain with big fingers. >:{

[Hadron Ka'sel]

Also in regards to tau fire power and shooting armies in general give us the vet sergeant upgrade. I want to have cheaper sergeant meatshields for my assault squads (by that i mean naked non upgraded sergeants with a storm shield out the front, trust me when i say it works really well. At least it has for me) Infact, if we could take standard sergeants who could take artificer armour AND take a ss all of a sudden you have massively increased the survivability of that assault squad. Those two small changes would make me enormously happy, are very realistic and would also fit really well with our chapters fluff.

[Crusader Bob]

New codex sounds scary somehow. I quite like my veterans as they are, drop and charge is fun.

If we are wishlisting i'd love to have that +1I back, and maybe use jump packs in both movement and assault phases, can't kill so many marines if i'm in your face by turn 2.

 

For the rest i agree with many here, no centurions please, the Thunderfire i'm fine with or without, not going to use it anyway.

Oh, yes, make sure Dante and Astorath hit at initiative, is silly they're so slow.