[HH1.0] Word Bearer's Tactics

[Withershadow]

Summoning wasn't really in the cards, Zardu's best roll is Cursed Earth to make Gal Vorbak tougher.

[Argel Tal]

It is indeed a normal pod.  The reason I feel I can shave points there in this list is due to the number of leaderships checks and the way I can modify your leadership.   Id much prefer to attach Erebus to my Gal Vorbak, but am unable.

 

I have struggled with deciding between Mhara Gal vs the Leviathan.   I might just field Mhara proxied as a Leviathan.   The Grav-flux bombard also forces pin checks but I like that Mhara messes with Leadership better.   Admittedly, the Leviathan is better more generally, its short-ranged weapons is why I went with Mhara.  

 

To make most of your changes:

 

Erebus

Command squad 5x, 2 power weapons in a pod.

Centurion with Burning Lore - SAVES 95 points and I lose deamon summoning as a trade off.

Mhara Gal with Warpfire Plasma and Tainted Power claw

Deredeo Dreadnaught with Aiolos missiles

2 Laser Destroyer Rapiers

5x Gal Vorbak, Dark Martyr with AA and PF, upgraded to a DREADCLAW Drop Pod.

5x Meltagun Support Squad in Pod

5x Meltagun Support Squad in Pod (could be a plasma squad for variety)

10x Tact Squad, SGT with AA and MB's in a Pod

 

Feels a little too brittle - i could exchange the Command sqd for a 2nd Tact SQD

 

Yep for the levi and I think you must take a dread pod to make the best use of it and to compensate its short range but at 2K its too expensive. 

 

Concerning the list, you should put some stuff on you centurion like arti armor, maybe a refractor and a melta bomb if you intend to roll telepathy or a mele weapon if you want biomancy. 

 

And yes you number is quite low, as i said consider the seeker squad which can be a "low cost" plasma support squad with some combi plasma and still be effective against TEQ later with the AP2 ammo. Plus don't forget they can be used to cap like tac squad due to their implacable advance rule. 

 

If you run Zardu with this rite don't really consider the summoning as a main option cause you lack power dices. If you want to go for the summoning path you'd be better with daemon allies and spamm heralds and horrors. 

 

Btw maybe you should put the list on the army list section ;) 

[Kaiser_von_Hugal]

Good point - Ill move it over. 

[ronin_cse]

Trying to decide what I want to get next to expand my WB army. Right now I have a GV squad and Zardu Layak in addition to the two HH boxes from GW (B@C and BoP). I'm trying to decide between a dread claw and another GV squad, a Spartan, a Typhon, or Lorgar and something else (maybe some rapiers?). Anyone have any suggestions? I'm aiming for 2500 pts as a rough guide at the moment.

 

Edit: I could possibly swing getting a Spartan AND another squad of GV so I can fill it with death. Also guess I could get the dreadclaw and something besides GV since I already have a squad, maybe a dreadclaw and Lorgar?

Edited January 21, 2017 by ronin_cse

[ronin_cse]

Man looks like the poor Word Bearers aren't all that popular lately :(

 

Anyways decided to be responsible and save some $$$ for bills. Just went with Lorgar and a few hobby supplies.

[Jimm]

Lorgar is a must have, can't have a legion without the primarch imo.

 

What next is down to how you want to play, 10 gvb in a Spartan with Layak and Lorgar is really good and the line I went straight down. If you want to down the last of the serated sun route your want a couple of dreadclaws to deliver your gvb

 

If you want to go less power but cool a Mhara gal is a nice addition but they aren't very points efficient, it's such a shame as it's an amazing model.

 

Rapiers, leviathans, whirlwind Scorpius and deredeo dreads are always good investments and perform well outside of legion specific units.

[Confused Word Bearer]

I'm not sure if this has been asked before, but due to the Word Bearer LA rules requiring you to take a Chaplain, would a Herald be a good choice in a Word Bearers force?

[Argel Tal]

You mean it has an effect quite close to zealot ? 

 

But yes, the herald has a weird spot with WB, at lower point games you want to run a delagatus for the rite of command and the you have to take a centu/chap due to the WB rules. The herald seems a bit expensive for what it brings if you already have a chap and at higher point games you will have a praetor like to unlock the rites of war. Quite sad because I think you can convert awesome models for the WB with a pre 40K chaos marines style. 

[Caillum]

Well, Charismatic Leadership requires a 2nd Compulsory HQ, and this must be a Chaplain or generic Centurion. Given the Herald is a Support Officer, he won't fulfil the 1st Compulsory HQ slot. So you're going to need 1 of each of the following:

- a Compulsory HQ (Praetor, Centurion, Chaplain, Champion, Delegatus, Forge Lord, Vigilator, Siege Breaker, or Special Character),

- a Chaplain, Centurion or Erebus, and...

- a Herald.

That's a large cost for only a small buff.

 

I think the 1st HQ is the most important part. If you're running a Rite of War (and not taking Lorgar) then you need a Master of the Legion. If you're not running a Rite of War (or you're taking Lorgar), you have lots of options: Tank Hunter Heavy Support Squads and Phosphex quad mortars? Siege Breaker is the bomb. Want to emulate Barthusa Narek in his heyday? Vigilator it is. But the ultimate choice in almost all cases is Zardu Layak: he's a Compulsory HQ, a Master of the Legion, a Diabolist, a ML2 Psyker AND a Daemon (so he can cast Malefic Daemonology all day), he has Zealot (so he buffs a unit like a Chaplain would), his Dark Channeling is better, he buffs Word Bearers around him, and if you make him your Warlord then you can take Daemon Allies. Brilliant.

 

And if you have to take a Centurion or Chaplain for the 2nd HQ, you may as well go for the latter, as it's one of the best Consuls (and the best value).

[Confused Word Bearer]

Ah, I'd forgotten that the Chaplain/Centurion was a second compulsory. For some reason I thought you just meeded to take one, and still counted as your compulsory HQ. A shame then. Oh well!

[Kaiser_von_Hugal]

At the risk of being high maintenance, Id really like to hear about effective ways to run demons in your Word Bearer list.   I just bought Cor'bax and own an extensive Nurgle Demon host.   

 

Im thinking of running an allied detachment lead by a DUO with  a few Flying demon princes

[Jimm]

I've had mixed success with allied daemons. Be'lakor is really good but depending on how many points your group plays as this may limit his uses.

 

As for normal Daemons I've found the keeper of secrets with the soulstealer and a couple of rewards really good for the price (but hate the model).

Heralds always do well for there points particularly like a nurgle herald with the doomsday bell as - 1 ld army wide is nasty in 30k particularly when your forcing lots of fear checks or firing the mhara gals plasma canon at people.

 

With regards to flying princes I've not really used them much as I keep my allies cheap and load up with daemonetts.

[Jimm]

On a similar note, now thousand sons have taken our place as the psykers of 30k I was thinking it's a good time to start using the dark brethren row. Instant death on perils sound like it could be funny as hell, especially when you throw Samus into the fold to force them to throw more dice at powers.

Just a thought...

[Argel Tal]

It's just for blessings right ? Problem with Samus is that he has to come on deep strike making him a juicy targets for one turn :( and for a LOW, I'd rather have a juicy tank or maybe Lorgar but against TS you won't cast muh powers ^^ 

The only way you can beat TS on power dice level is by spamming horrors and heralds but you can do it by taking only Zardu or Erebus with a ROW that allows allies (not sure which ones can fit in with this, most of the good ROW don't allow allies)

[ronin_cse]

It's just for blessings right ? Problem with Samus is that he has to come on deep strike making him a juicy targets for one turn and for a LOW, I'd rather have a juicy tank or maybe Lorgar but against TS you won't cast muh powers ^^ 

The only way you can beat TS on power dice level is by spamming horrors and heralds but you can do it by taking only Zardu or Erebus with a ROW that allows allies (not sure which ones can fit in with this, most of the good ROW don't allow allies)

 

The Dark Brethern allows Daemon allies as well, of course that comes with its own problems.

[Argel Tal]

For sure the instant death perils in qutie good vs TS but I don't like to build a list knowing what your opponent will bring. The one heavy support restriction is also annoying. Most of the time it will limit you to one spartan full of gal vorbaks and Lorgar with friends. 

[Runefyre]

Seamus is a great option against sons. He doesn't hinder your summoning just the sons terribly effective blessing game. Add in that nurgle bell -1 ld and they'll start failing those perils checks

[ronin_cse]

Trying to decide how to build out my WB force here. So is there any real reason to take the Dark Brethern RoW if one will be taking Zardu Layak anyways? I suppose we might start seeing a lot more 1k Sons on the table going forward so the ID Perils might be nice as is preferred enemy. Guess I'm just wondering if those benefits are worth the restrictions, mainly the only one heavy support slot.

[Argel Tal]

As i said I wonder if there are any decent ROW that allow allied detachment. For the moment I would say that running WB without any ROW and with Zardu with some demon allies can still be effective but it really depends on you meta. Obviously vs TS the Dark Brethren is super effective but IMO it seems a bit unfair to build an army list knowing what your opponent will bring. You can also compensate the lack of HS choices with some mortars to deal with blobs and dealing with medium AV. For the hard AV you can still take the primaris lightning with krakens and screamers are also good at hunting tanks. 

[Marshal Loss]

The Dark Brethren really isn't a good rite of war, even against Thousand Sons. Sooner or later a psyker will get his head blown off to perils, which could be pretty funny, but if that doesn't happen you're getting very little (and it's quite plausible it will happen to a unit rather than an important character anyway). Thousand Sons can count as traitors if your opponent desires, meaning you don't necessarily get the preferred enemy: loyalists, daemons can be obtained as allies with characters and it heavily curtails your list building & heavy support slots. You're basically forced into taking a special character to stop yourself from needing 3 HQ"s, when if you took a special character you'd likely get daemon allies regardless.

 

On the other hand, Serrated Sun is balls to the walls amazing, but forces you to play in a very particular way and also doesn't allow allies. At least Dark Brethren allows you Mechanicum/Daemon allies if you want them.

[Argel Tal]

Downside to this is if you want to play Lorgar, it's better to use the dark brethren in order to get enough PD thanks to horrors/damons HQ to play with all his psy abilities. Belakor is also a very good choice to get some juicy invis and shrouding.

[Marshal Loss]

That's a little misleading, given that if you're using Zardu/Kor Phaeron/Erebus then you're getting Daemons as allies anyway, Dark Brethren doesn't actually give you any more power dice than you can get in any other Rite of War that allows Daemons as allies. Very little tangible benefit. I'd rather no Rite of War/a Rite of War that doesn't heavily restrict our FOC with Zardu than Dark Brethren, which is a pity because I really want to like it.

 

If it did actually give some kind of innate power dice boost - which would seem fluffy - or some other effect representing the power the warp is wreaking on the battlefield where the Word Bearers tread, it would be a really cool option.

Edited February 14, 2017 by Marshal Loss

[Jimm]

If your not using Lorgar and want a reasonable row and daemon allies then armored spearhead is a good pick (points level dependant) Outflanking vets in landraiders is expensive but effective and you can spam av14 and run a load of cheap daemons with it. I've done it with guard or daemon allies a couple of times and was pretty fun @ 4 and 5k

[Argel Tal]

That's a little misleading, given that if you're using Zardu/Kor Phaeron/Erebus then you're getting Daemons as allies anyway, Dark Brethren doesn't actually give you any more power dice than you can get in any other Rite of War that allows Daemons as allies. Very little tangible benefit. I'd rather no Rite of War/a Rite of War that doesn't heavily restrict our FOC with Zardu than Dark Brethren, which is a pity because I really want to like it.

 

If it did actually give some kind of innate power dice boost - which would seem fluffy - or some other effect representing the power the warp is wreaking on the battlefield where the Word Bearers tread, it would be a really cool option.

 

I meant that if you want to get enough PD with Lorgar you'd probably have to use a daemon alied detachment which is impossible if you don't run Dark Brethren due to Lorgar being the warlord so no Zardu or Erebus boost to get this detachement :(  So for me Lorgar = dark brethen if no Lorgar, then it's Zardu/Erebus with no ROW. 

 

 

Great idea Jimm ! But ye you have to be at a very decent ammount of points to get this done. 

[Marshal Loss]

Fair enough. I'm surprised you find your dice lacking though, at the end of the day Lorgar doesn't need a large amount of dice to get the most out of his powers. The rite is so lacking I honestly don't see it ever being worth it, unless you're using Daemons for more than just warp charge batteries.