WarriorFish Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 What do you say to the Eldar Ranger hiding in cover?Nothing, he's been blown to pieces by your artillery. It seems of late I've bumped into artillery stuff quite a bit one way or another so I ended up forging a sort of a quick summary of the rules with the help of our local big gunner Argun. So let our scholarly ways imbue you with faith and strength of knowledge with which to smite His enemies! Quote "Infantry win firefights.Tanks win battles.Artillery win wars."- Old saying amongst Imperial Guard artillery officers 6th has been pretty kind to artillery but as ever old rules can get mixed up especially if you've played across many editions like some of us! So let's see what the Emperor has giveth and taketh away - pages 34 and 100 are the places to find the barrage rules in the rules book, with page 33 containing the rules for blast weaponry.Barrage weaponry functions in exactly the same way as normal blast weaponry except in two ways: they can not target a model under their minimum range and they have the ability to fire as a "barrage weapon". Barrage weapons may target a model under the minimum range and outside of Line of Sight, which is very nice. Otherwise they work exactly the same as previous editions with regards to scatter and the blast centre being the direction of the shot as well as hitting top floors only. Against vehicles the hit always resolves against side armour and is at full strength. For multiple blasts remember that the first template is always the closest weapon to the target unit, so keep that in mind if you're using the Griffon to "spot" for bigger guns. I've only talked about the changes to the rules as I don't want to get into trouble for writing out lots of rules but it should serve as a good clarification for those who may get caught up with older rules Parting rules shot is the FAQ updates, correct as of this post: Warhammer 40,000 Rulebook FAQ 1.5 - September 2013 - Page 5 Q: In a multiple barrage, do you determine all of the hits and all of the Wounds separately for each blast, or do you resolve all of blasts in one go? (p34)A: Work out the total number of models hit by each template, then proceed to allocate Wounds and remove casualties as normal for the models hit by each seperate template. Imperial Guard Codex FAQ 1.4 - September 2013 - Page 3 Page 53– Ordnance Battery, Colossus Siege Mortar.Ignore the reference to direct fire.Page 53– Ordnance Battery, Griffon Heavy Mortar.Ignore the reference to direct fire. I hope this helps someone out as it did me, but this is all useless unless you get your artillery on to the table! So - who has some artillery tactics and tricks to share? I'll open the floor with my super secret WarriorFish artillery pro-tips:1) Mortar squads are cheap2) Takes lots of artillery to blast your opponent off the board faster [clearfloat][/clearfloat] What do you say to the Chaos Marine hiding in cover?Same thing you told the Eldar Ranger. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285986-the-imperial-infantrymans-artillery-primer/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead01 Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 I would add the specific rules for removing casualties. Which if I recall is closest to the center of the blast markers first. And anything regarding terrain ie either ruins or buildings? Those might be important as a reference with examples. Good Job so far! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285986-the-imperial-infantrymans-artillery-primer/#findComment-3577051 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kierdale Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 Very good stuff so far! You'll be covering dirty tricks like barrage sniping? I've always summarised the barrage targeting rules thus: 1. Target is within the weapon's maximum range and is beyond the weapon's minimum range and is in line of sight? - You can fire at the target and do subtract BS from the scatter roll. 2. Target is within the weapon's maximum range and is out of line of sight? - You can fire at the target but do not subtract BS from the scatter roll. 3. Target is within the weapon's minimum range regardless of line of sight? - You can fire at the target but do not subtract BS from the scatter roll. I think that makes it simple to understand (and explain to others). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285986-the-imperial-infantrymans-artillery-primer/#findComment-3577081 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beachymike123 Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 my idea of (when facing) barrage weaponry is: whisper to their subconsciousness, bring them over to Chaos and wreak havoc among their lines seriously good work gents, looking forward to what comes of this. artillery is always a good way to go with guard armies, might make me think about my next purchase regarding my mortals followers of the Dark Gods. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285986-the-imperial-infantrymans-artillery-primer/#findComment-3577090 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argun Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 Everything here explains why artillery (no matter how big) is useful to the armies of the IG. I do believe that no other army can put out the raw firepower and high-strength pie plates that the Imperial Guard's artillery can. Heck, if I ever do an Iron Warriors army, I'd start with an artillery allies attachment, then work from there. In regards to terrain; if it hits, it hits everything under the template. When it comes to ruins/buildings though, barrages hit the TOP only. Useful for clearing parapets on bastions, but does nothing against something on the ground level of a ruin. That's where the direct fire option comes in handy Barrage sniping isn't something I've heard of (the term anyway) but I have used it to good effect. Is very good against say, an orc mob with a nob all nicely placed in the center. Center some pie plates on that bad-boy, and pray to the God Emperor that you don't scatter. Sure, he'll get Look out, Sir! rolls, but if he fails them he's most likely dead. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285986-the-imperial-infantrymans-artillery-primer/#findComment-3577095 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sviar Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 Great advices. I got so inspired I ordered a Manticore. Now I can't promise I will leave it alone until ETL III Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285986-the-imperial-infantrymans-artillery-primer/#findComment-3577276 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorFish Posted January 24, 2014 Author Share Posted January 24, 2014 Thanks guys, I concentrated on the "new" changes because that's what was tripping me up and I didn't want to fall foul of forum rules by typing out too many rules. I think I was even thinking of some rules as far back as 4th Edition... To answer some questions and clarify some more: - Moving, firing and Ordnance You can move and fire barrage weapons without restriction, and for the bigger guns don't forget the Ordnance rule means you can only Snap Shot other weaponry but you get to roll 2D6 and pick the highest for armour penetration. - When to direct fire, when to indirect fire I break it down into the two firing modes: normal shooting is simple as it follows the normal rules except with a minimum range. Barrage lets you ignore the minimum range and Line of Sight restrictions. Nice and simple that way and easy to remember - Barrage weapons always count as coming from the centre of the blast This means that casualties are taken from here as well as potential cover saves, and that when calculating what floor the template lands on you use the centre of the blast marker. Remember that the enemy can always go to ground for a cover save (only the "ignores cover" rule prevents this) and may still gain cover from area terrain. This means that you can "snipe" certain models though Look Out, Sir! still applies. Tips, Tricks and Tactica This is chiefly what I was hoping the topic to be, once I'd got the rules stamped out so please add your own ideas and such. This is intended to be a community project - Ordnance Weaponry What does the hull Heavy Bolter do? Not that much, so why not take a Heavy Flamer for nothing and make closing with your batteries a bit more dangerous? Firing too close can be dangerous and it's a nice backup should you lose the main gun. - Barrage Sniping The method of placing a barrage weapon blast marker on your intended target model so the wounds target him first. For example if you successfully roll a Hit on the scatter die and place the centre on a model he will take all the generated Wounds until he dies or you run out. You can safely scatter a bit if you get enough wounds, as you only need enough to get through to your intended model - plus there's a 33% chance of rolling a Hit so it is well worth a try. - Griffon Spotting Using the Griffon's special rule that allows it to re-roll the scatter dice to be more accurate on your barrage, letting the rest of the battery target better (e.g. Basilisks!). Remember that in multiple barrages the first template must be the closest unit, so make sure the Griffon is close. You'll likely want this anyway as the Griffon will probably have a shorter range and it means it will take more flak for your expensive guns. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285986-the-imperial-infantrymans-artillery-primer/#findComment-3577328 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heimdall Skullcrusher Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Great topic. The ability to bypass the minimum range via barrage makes things like Basilisks way more useful. A couple questions: 1. Does the fact that barrage makes it so you take cover saves from the center of the template bypass the cover save granted by night fighting? I'm thinking no based on the way night fighting is worded. 2. Do ignore cover weapons (like the Collossus) bypass the cover saves granted by a) night fighting and b) jink? I'm pretty sure the answer is yes on this one, just want to confirm. Makes it pretty valuable against bikes and light skimmers. 3. Just curious how many people have had their artillery take themselves out when scattering back on themselves when using barrage inside their minimum range.. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285986-the-imperial-infantrymans-artillery-primer/#findComment-3578092 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kierdale Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 I see nothing that states that weapons which ignore cover do not ignore the cover save granted by night fighting (or Jink). Talking of night fighting it can be useful to scout forward something with a searchlight (scout sentinel, a chimera with Harker's veterans, a fast vehicle, etc.) to light up the enemy for the artillery to then drop shells on. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285986-the-imperial-infantrymans-artillery-primer/#findComment-3578101 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorFish Posted January 25, 2014 Author Share Posted January 25, 2014 1 - No, it only changes the direction the shot is coming from which is why Going to Ground saves are permitted. Also keep in mind that being able to shoot out of Line of Sight with a barrage doesn't let you target models that are greater than 36" away during Night Fighting (BRB, page 124) 2 - Yes, Ignores Cover prevents any cover saves being taken (BRB, page 38) 3 - No, if an enemy gets too close target something further away! :P Hope that helps Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285986-the-imperial-infantrymans-artillery-primer/#findComment-3578143 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhead01 Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Also keep in mind that being able to shoot out of Line of Sight with a barrage doesn't let you target models that are greater than 36" away during Night Fighting (BRB, page 124) This took me by surprise the first few times too. My friend keeps telling me spotlights! I didn't know that you could move and fire with barrage weapons. I had never even thought to look to see if I could. But then I still remember when I had to guess the distance to my targets..lol. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285986-the-imperial-infantrymans-artillery-primer/#findComment-3578205 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ammonius Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Also keep in mind that being able to shoot out of Line of Sight with a barrage doesn't let you target models that are greater than 36" away during Night Fighting (BRB, page 124) This took me by surprise the first few times too. My friend keeps telling me spotlights! I didn't know that you could move and fire with barrage weapons. I had never even thought to look to see if I could. But then I still remember when I had to guess the distance to my targets..lol. Your friend is correct, once you get a searchlight on a target, the night fighting rules don't apply. This became even more useful when Stronghold Assault came out, because some buildings can get spotlights (instead of having to use a Rhino or Chimera, which in turn loses the cover save of night fighting, and becomes first blood bait). Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285986-the-imperial-infantrymans-artillery-primer/#findComment-3578273 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarriorFish Posted January 25, 2014 Author Share Posted January 25, 2014 Yep, barrage lets you ignore Line of Sight and doesn't have any impact on Night Fighting so that works as normal. Just as well as it'd let artillery armies make a mockery of it! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/285986-the-imperial-infantrymans-artillery-primer/#findComment-3578304 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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