Pre-Heresy Death Guard 1500pts

[Enigami]

Hey all, this is my first time posting on Bolter and Chainsword, but I have been browsing threads on this forum for quite sometime now. I have been playing 30k Deathguard for sometime now and have had decent success, but would love this community's input. Any comments and criticism are welcome.

 

HQ

Master of Signal 105

-Artificer Armor

-Refractor Field

 

Elites

Apothecarian Detachment 90

-2 Apothecaries

 

Contemptor Mortis 180

-Twin Keres Pattern Assault Cannon

 

Rapier Battery 55

-Rapier with Laser Destroyers

 

Rapier Battery 55

-Rapier with Laser Destroyers

 

Troops

Tactical Squad 250

-19 Marines

-Vexilla

 

Tactical Squad 250

-19 Marines

-Vexilla

 

Heavy Support

Predator 125

- Lascannon Sponsoons

 

-Predator 135

-Heavy Bolter Sponsoons

-Executioner Cannon

 

Heavy Support Squad 255

-7 Marines

-Missile Launchers

-AA Missiles

 

Total 1500

 

If my math is correct that should be 1500 points on the mark. The apothecaries are now in with the TAC squads but I've been playing around with the idea of putting one in with the HSSquad to increase survivability. The Rapiers are separated so as to deploy them in different positions on the board. I'm wondering how important everyone thinks power weapons on the Sargent and Master of Signal are. I play almost exclusively against 40k opponents and want to welcome any comments anyone may have. Thanks all.

[Sevatar]

I like it. You seem to lack close combat punch but the endurance and firepower in this list is nice.

[Enigami]

Thanks Sevatar. I am a little worried about the lack of close combat punch you pointed out, and am a little scared of the TAC squads getting locked into combat and failing horribly. I'm not sure how to improve this without tweaking too much of my firepower, and am really unsure if I even need much of a close combat punch. If I were to field something with more close combat prowess I would choose some Deathshroud, but I feel like they are too expensive when coupled with an almost mandatory Land Raider of Spartan. 

[keeblerartillery]

I think this is a very balanced list, whoever helped you put it together must be a tactical genius.

[Enigami]

@keeblerartillery haha, yes, thank you for your contributions.

[Moonstalker]

Welcome to the B&C!  You seem to be a man after my own heart with your list, it mirrors a lot of my own thoughts and doctrines.  If I could make one suggestion for it, you might consider dropping one of those Rapiers.  Use the points saved to give your tactical sergeants artificer armor and 15 points of wargear (scythe, powerfist, or axe+meltabomb).  The remaining 5 points can be used for an upgrade to lascannons on the Contemptor-Mortis, but the Kheres is fine if you prefer that. The missile squad's range can help you deal with flyers at a distance where the Kheres won't.  Or the 5 points could be used for an augury scanner on the missile squad's sergeant to help counter deep strikers.

[Enigami]

@kitwulfen thanks for the reply. I have seen what you are suggesting in several lists and appreciate the advice. Could you explain why the Sargents need artificer armor and PF/PW/PS? I have seen this quite a bit, but have never really understood why. My lack of understanding is likely due to my limited play experience.

[Moonstalker]

Short answer, challenges and vehicles.

 

Long answer, meltabombs are very cheap, very good insurance.  Spartan causing you trouble?  Clamp a meltabomb to it.  Contemptor making problems in melee and ignoring your krak grenades?  Introduce him to your hot and fiery friend.  Yes, if you can't hurt it in melee you can try to leave.  You can also get caught in a sweeping advance and destroyed.  You aren't protected by ATSKNF, so if your attempt at fleeing from an Our Weapons Are Useless melee fails you lose the entire unit.  So for killing vehicles, meltabombs are a very good idea.

 

Challenges.  This is partly just keeping up with the proverbial Joneses.  No power weapon and the enemy sergeant (or character) has one?  He can make a real difference in the melee, tip things in his favor with a couple extra wounds per phase.  Your sergeant can jump on the challenge like a grenade and try to survive a round to protect the rest of the squad, but if he doesn't have equipment he's not gonna last long and he won't be in a position to put the hurt on enemy squads (or characters) in melee.  The artificer armor plays into this.  If the other guy brings a sword and you bring an axe, you lose.  He goes first, cuts your guy in half, and you never get to strike.  You bring an axe and AA, you're more expensive, but you laugh his attacks off (or even several bolter rounds, chainswords, etc if you need your sergeant to absorb some fire for the rest of his squad) and split his skull open at I1.  You've also got a can opener in case some terminators come calling.

 

The AA and Power Axe aren't required, I just think they're useful tools to have and will give you some advantages you can leverage.  The meltabomb... it's so cheap and there are so many things you can use it on, it's hard to say no.  I personally like to take AA and powerfist over AA/Power Axe/Meltabomb.  The powerfist is not quite as good at anti-tank as the meltabomb, but you get two swings with it.  It is also S8, and so can ignore FNP and double-tough pesky characters that are causing you problems - after all, praetors and centurions don't get EW.  Unless they're special characters or Salamanders.  As Death Guard, you have the option of taking a scythe.  You might want to pair it with a meltabomb (if you can find the points) since it doesn't give you the same kind of anti-armor coverage that a fist does, but the sweep attack could do some really, really nasty things in the middle of a tactical blob.  Or change the course of an entire melee with a squad of terminators.