[HH1.0] 30k Alpha Legion Tactics

[d@n]

that's no big deal. skorr is pretty awesome himself

[Hesh Kadesh]

Dunno,(if its worth it) i've found that +1 to pen invaluable.

 

Thst said, it is different, but still don't like the idea of a unit with that investment not being on the board for a couple of turns.

 

That said, it is a lethal combination netting -3 to reserve rolls with a Damocles there also.

Edited December 2, 2015 by Hesh Kadesh

[v6v77]

Dunno,(if its worth it) i've found that +1 to pen invaluable.

 

Thst said, it is different, but still don't like the idea of a unit with that investment not being on the board for a couple of turns.

 

That said, it is a lethal combination netting -3 to reserve rolls with a Damocles there also.

The damocles only allows you to modify your own reserve rollss by 1.

[d@n]

I'm not saying one is better then the other. They both bring different things. I like the flexibility of skorr but that's personal preference. For instance if your playing against a drop pod lists getting 1+ to pen in your enamys deployment zone is not really going to effect the game but an additional -1 to there reserve rolls is a big deal .

[Caillum]

Having run a Salamanders Drop Pod Assault army, I'm pretty used to the force taking a hiding after the alpha strike. Despite that, I'm seriously considering using my BaC box as a starter Alpha Legion force, using Orbital Assault.

 

Now, Dynat makes Orbital Assault awesome, but given Alpha Legion's "Martial Hubris" rule giving away another VP when you lose more units (like Drop Pods), how do people alleviate this issue?

[xera32]

My biggest problem with Dynat (And I agree he is really good), is he is only good in a pod list, and pod lists are notoriously bad against good opponents. The other problem I have with him is the only units that truly gain a decent benefit from it is support/seeker squads. I would much rather take more reliable AT in the form of rapiers and grav, that gain a very small benefit from it, and have a much more useful HQ. and then you run into times when the rule won't ever come into effect because your opponent isn't taking vehicles.

Skorr is perfect as he allows me to take extra combos of special rules with no risk of missing the correct warlord trait. Stealth/MTC Ruins is absolute bull:cuss if you run bike heavy. Messing with enemy reserves can cut in half a pod or flier list. Being able to infiltrate 3 units makes CotH a much more usable and less restricted RoW where I can take Tank Hunter while getting my AT into position.

[Terminus]

I am a big fan of Skorr, too, and you can find me gushing about him earlier in this thread. The flexibility between mutable tactics and his choice of trait is pretty awesome.

[march10k]

Hmmm...I'm liking the coils of the hydra.  Unfortunately, it seems to have a bit of a trap built into it.  You ~can~ take a transport for every unit, and actually gain the flexibility promised in terms of picking that special rule (tank hunters on demand against pseudo-mechanicum legions like Iron hands/warriors would be sweet), but that means fairly small and numerous squads rolling with (usually soft-skinned) transports...which just freely gives away the martial hubris penalty.  So you're pretty much shoehorned into building a list that relies on infiltration just for basic legality...and that means you don't need transports, and that in turn allows for less fragile units.  With that in mind, it also occurred to me that your infantry have to ~have~ one of the listed deployment mechanisms (infiltrate, dedicated transport, etc), but they don't have to use them.  Accordingly, it's perfectly legal for ten lernaeans to load up in a fast attack steagle in reserves...so that's precisely what I'll be doing.  

 

I'll also split the 30 tacticals in the calth box into 2x15.  2x20 would be nice from a martial hubris perspective, but impractical from a points cost perspective.  15 is a good balance, I think.  Infiltrating, of course.

 

I really wanted to do a headhunter, but I guess I'm required a third troops choice, so a legion reconnaisance squad it'll be...seems fluffy enough for XX.  Exodus goes in there, he's really cool.  Of course, he can't be my required HQ, so one of the spooks'll have to be promoted to vigilator.  Oh, and Rewards of Treason will be incorporated in a roundabout way...this squad, from Exodus on down, will be represented by two boxes of Mor Deythan ~grin~  In future lists, they might actually be turncoat raven guard!

 

That leaves just enough points in my 2k list for a drop pod dual fist dual flamer contemptor.

 

The most beautiful aspect is null deployment...sort of...XX style.  I will of course be deploying 40 power armored marines...but they're all infiltrating, so even if I'm going first, you're deploying first, and for all intents and purposes, I don't have  a deployment zone...so go ahead, let me get in your head while you look left and look right, searching for a clue to guide you in deploying against...nothing, not even a box where I have to place my models.  Oh, damn....that's so fluffy!

[Caillum]

^^ You'll still need a Praetor or Alpharius to run the Rite of War, plus Recon Squads are non-Compulsory, so another Troops choice too. This is why many Coils lists have 3x10 Tacticals in Rhinos...

[Terminus]

RAW mutable tactics does not fulfill requirement. Dual Flamer contemptor? Please don't bring your brand of crazy into this thread as well. Stick to crushing your local meta with grenade launcher spam or whatever other nonsense that strikes fear in the hearts of the citizens of lala-land. :) Edited December 5, 2015 by Terminus

[rendingon1+]

^^ You'll still need a Praetor or Alpharius to run the Rite of War, plus Recon Squads are non-Compulsory, so another Troops choice too. This is why many Coils lists have 3x10 Tacticals in Rhinos...

Praetor, Alpharius, Skorr or Delegtus Consul.

[Slips]

=][= Alright, Personal Attacks are a big No-No. Either y'all drop the subject or take it to PMs, none of this is brings anything to the discussion at hand. its that or we Start Purging. =][=

[TemujinZero]

On the Martial Hubris topic, I tend to just ignore it and build a list that can shrug off one lost VP.  Building a list such that you are very confident you won't give up this point is totally sensible, but hobbling an otherwise strong list just to half-heartedly avoid this rule seems very unwise to me.  You'll end up costing yourself multiple VPs just to marginally reduce the chance of losing one.  An infiltrating alpha strike style list in particular is a very strong list that unavoidably leaves you open to risk of giving up this point, but aggressively modifying your list to reduce this risk (removing rhinos, merging smaller squads) is just swapping one weakness for another.  I say embrace the hubris and take the chance of one lost VP in exchange for the opportunities for multiple VPs that come with aggressive mechanised infiltration.

[Resonance]

One thing that can be done in coils of the hydra is to buy all your troop squads rhino/transports and just start them disembarked. That way you can use some or all of them for different reasons

[v6v77]

One thing that can be done in coils of the hydra is to buy all your troop squads rhino/transports and just start them disembarked. That way you can use some or all of them for different reasons

That way you can get the bonus Alpha strike for first turn on foor infiltrate, Rhino block at the end of the shooting phase and then mount up turn 2. Huzzah.

Edited December 11, 2015 by v6v77

[Charlo]

I'm not Gunna lie, the Drakaina completely baffles me. Can someone break down how it exactly works and what phases it affects etc? Also, say a Moritat causes a boat load of wounds with it, how does that work?

 

Thanks! A potential future Hydra... Or am I?

[1ncarnadine]

I'm not Gunna lie, the Drakaina completely baffles me. Can someone break down how it exactly works and what phases it affects etc? Also, say a Moritat causes a boat load of wounds with it, how does that work?

 

Thanks! A potential future Hydra... Or am I?

 

You might be overthinking something? It's pretty simple. You fire the Drakaina and whatever other pistol the Moritat has until the Chain Fire stops as normal for both weapons. 

 

Then, if the unit suffered one or more casualties from the Drakaina's shooting, it has to roll one D6 at the start of your next Shooting Phase. That unit takes a number of toughness tests equal to that roll. If they pass all the toughness tests, it's over. At the start of your next Shooting Phase the unit won't make the roll again. If they failed any toughness tests, you'll roll a D6 again at the start of your next Shooting Phase, and so on.

 

The unit you fire into will only ever be taking one of these tests at the start of your next Shooting Phase. You aren't stacking multiple D6 of toughness tests. It can be easily noted by leaving a little green/blue glass bead next to the unit or something to remind everyone the unit is under the efffect of the Drakaina.

[Charlo]

Okay, awesome. So:

 

You shoot

If they take a casualty roll a D6 next shooting phase

They take those D6 tests

If any are failed they lose that many models no saves of any kind allowed and you roll another D6 next shooting phase

 

Right?

[1ncarnadine]

Okay, awesome. So:

 

You shoot

If they take a casualty roll a D6 next shooting phase

They take those D6 tests

If any are failed they lose that many models no saves of any kind allowed and you roll another D6 next shooting phase

 

Right?

 

Yep. So if a unit has taken wounds, and rolls the D6....

 

They get a 4. They take 4 toughness tests. They pass 2! Good on them, but they failed two and take two wounds, no saves. And because they failed at least one toughness test, they roll again next turn. 

 

I think you've got it, just making sure. It sounds awesome, although maybe it's just me but I'd hope the Moritat kind of... got rid of them sooner. If a unit is still rolling 2-3 turns later it means the Moritat is probably very dead :P

[Charlo]

True, but it is a lot of shots with rending, which is exactly what a Moritat could want bar plasma. Between the tests and deflag from the offhand Serpenta it's pretty great!

 

Plus AL is almost guaranteed a good turn of chain fire from mutable.

[shaun03]

Would the toughness test from the drakaina, be subject to -1 T from rad base weapons?

 

Destroyers with Rad ML would pair nicely with moritat with relic and choom pistol, downside pricy unit.

[Charlo]

Assuming they're new toughness is 3 then I don't see why not! That's a nasty idea.

 

Although isn't the -1 from missiles per model? I could well be mistaken though :)

[Slips]

-1 from Rad Phage is only if the model has suffered an unsaved wounds. = no-go on 1W models.

[Charlo]

-1 from Rad Phage is only if the model has suffered an unsaved wounds. = no-go on 1W models.

Ta for Confirmation!

 

I think on anyone other that a 'tat the pistol isn't that great. But they make it shine :) pew pew pew

[Charlo]

Apologies for double post but... Head hunters. They seem pretty cool! Power daggers and Banestrike. I've seen people bemoan them a lot and I was wondering why?