[HH1.0] 30k Alpha Legion Tactics

[Terminus]

In the context of Sergeants swinging power fists, it has the desired effect of letting you swing another time for an additional 10 points.  And I guess you could try to get lucky and stab automata to death?  But yes, the power dagger is absolutely the better weapon for being 5 points cheaper and having AP3.  The cost being 15 for independent characters is a tougher pill to swallow, but they are usually giving that mandatory centurion/chaplain a power fist anyway, and they can't get digilasers.

 

Out of curiosity, ran the numbers of 3 power fists vs 3 tainted dagger swings vs. a Castellax. The fist does 1.3 wounds on average, 3 wounds ~8% of the time. The tainted dagger has a ~11% chance to kill a Castellax, and 0.005% chance to kill 3. :D

[hivey]

So heres a question. Coils of the hydra, i know units either have to be able to deepstrike, infiltrate, or must have a dedicated transport. Do the units have to actually be deployed in the transport? If not, you can still take big tac blobs, buy them a rhino, and just field them outside of it.

[Terminus]

You can't buy a Rhino if you're more than 10. Even if you could, though, that seems like a terrible idea. Alpha Legion has nothing to gain from blobs, much less on foot.

[hivey]

Ah, ok then. Its been a while since ive looked at my books. I misplaced them.

 

 

The idea just came to me as a way to add a little more flexibility in list building. Though since you cant buy a rhino for larger than 10, that doesnt work at all.

[Charlo]

But, keeping to ten men and infiltrating a squad in a Rhino with Pintle Multi-Melta... Now that's nice!

[hivey]

Thats my plan, but i did like the idea of 1 or 2 backfield with an apothecary, holding objectives.

[Bat33.1]

Can I ask the veteran legionaries here if they were starting from scratch today which units and style of play would they use with the current book and rule updates?

Are you taking DDP and leviathans, do Spartans have any place in an AL list?

 

I can build around the following for my own army but I'm starting from scratch pretty much: 3 legion DP, 1 dreadclaw, 1 DDP, 2 leviathans with magnetised arms, 3 tac squads load out TBC, Dynat, 10 cataphracti, and I have funds to add more units but I don't know where to add punch?

 

Is a Kharabydis worth adding or do I look at a spartan? Do speeders and javelins have a role supporting DP?

 

Hopefully I can get some pointers from the vets and explore more from that point. I'm up to page 20 so far in this tactica but it's a lot to get through :)

[Terminus]

Spartans are for despoiler hordes or deathstars. Alpha Legion doesn't do either of those particularly well.

 

Thats my plan, but i did like the idea of 1 or 2 backfield with an apothecary, holding objectives.

With the ability to stack scout and infiltrate on several units, Alpha Legion's backfield can be everything outside of a 12" bubble of the enemy's deployment. Strategic Traits give you a 33% chance of getting either scout or infiltrate (on D3 or 3 units respectively), and Skorr can just pick one he wishes.

 

Our backfield is behind you!

[Baluc]

Well you have the basics of an OA army, which you can do with Skorr or Dynat.

 

Dynat has more reliable kill (+1 on vehicle damage chart), Skorr has more reliable delivery (you choose strategic genius, +1 to seize the initiative, and re-roll reserves)

 

Both lists can be good, but personally I find OA has limited replay value so to speak. Either I alpha hard enough and its a walk or I don't and its rough.

 

If I was starting from scratch? I would probably have done an All Legion Astartes rule Alpha legion army, with recon company RoW.

[Bat33.1]

Well you have the basics of an OA army, which you can do with Skorr or Dynat.

 

Dynat has more reliable kill (+1 on vehicle damage chart), Skorr has more reliable delivery (you choose strategic genius, +1 to seize the initiative, and re-roll reserves)

 

Both lists can be good, but personally I find OA has limited replay value so to speak. Either I alpha hard enough and its a walk or I don't and its rough.

 

If I was starting from scratch? I would probably have done an All Legion Astartes rule Alpha legion army, with recon company RoW.

Thanks

 

I can pickup some Rhino's for the infantry and build that way easily enough, as I understand it you can infiltrate squads in a Rhino as it's a DT? I probably shouldn't but it's allowed :)

 

It would seem that Rhino's are used as baby bunkers crossed with razorbacks now to prevent pie plates auto wiping squads and allow some top hatch shooting, but where do I go for supporting fire units? Do I use support squads in a Rhino? IW havocs with missiles in a Rhino or footslogging?

 

I've not seen many lists here with Lightning fighters are they less useful or is it meta dependant?

 

As I said this is basically a ground up build, I've got some pods which are going through painting now but I've not settled on a list as you can see by the questions :)

[matrent89]

Just curious if I run Autilon Skorr does he count as the one consul limitation from coils of the hydra?

[Terminus]

Yes. He is a Consul Delegatus. :(

[shaun03]

Is their update in the new red book that lets rhinos takes pintle MM? I know they can take combi -weapons, but unless I looked over something I haven't seen the option for pintle mounted MM.

 

In CoH the list i have been fielding more and more attack bikes with MM. Their solid cheap AT option.

[ak1508]

I'm going to try and run Master of Signal in a Damocles Rhino for the LOLz

[Caillum]

@shaun03, yes. Rhinos can take multi-meltas now. They're cheap too - multi-meltas & havoc launchers are 3 melta bombs, heavy bolters & heavy flamers are 2 and combi-bolters & combi-weapons are 1.

 

I pretty much consider Rhinos to be a 55 point transport now, with a dozer blade and MM being absolutely mandatory.

[ak1508]

@shaun03, yes. Rhinos can take multi-meltas now. They're cheap too - multi-meltas & havoc launchers are 3 melta bombs, heavy bolters & heavy flamers are 2 and combi-bolters & combi-weapons are 1.

 

I pretty much consider Rhinos to be a 55 point transport now, with a dozer blade and MM being absolutely mandatory.

 

Ourflanking or infiltrating Rhinos with MMs are absolutely hillarious. 

[shaun03]

How did I miss that was in the FAQ or something? I have  been using either combi-weapons or havoc lunchers this whole time. 

 

Yeah i get the golly gee look when i do that MM attack bikes, now adding in rhinos with MM doing that there going to be some ass hurt feelings. 

 

On non tactical questions, which would be better center piece storm-bird or mastodon? I leaning towards the storm-bris as in book 6 Skorr has his own personal one and I cant find much concerning a mastodon. 

[Caillum]

No, it is from the newest Red Book update.

 

https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-AU/The-Horus-heresy-legiones-Astartes-Age-of-Darkness-Army-List

 

Stormbird is a hell of a model. But so it the Mastodon. Choose the one that fits your army theme. :)

[shaun03]

Yeah it's it tough choice both models really standout. And either one might see the table top once or twice a year.  And the stormbird is rumored to me size of tau manta not sure how the :cuss i would transport it, and actually field it on table top. 

 

But back on tatics question looking to add more speed to my coh list, looking at seeing which one is more beneficial to add, 

 

Sky hunter benefit from MT and can be kitted out to AT or aint horde. 2+ save and not that pricey.

Land speeders don't benefit from MT choice can be kitted out to fit a selected roll around the same price. AV over 2+ 

Javelin doesn't benefit from MT and highest price of the 3, heavy guns come stander. Small bump in AV value over speeder. 

 

Anyone field any of this have some manful feedback on them? Personally i leaning towards the sky hunter as benefits from the MT i select and can pair with the other fast movers. 

[Terminus]

Sky Hunters are meh but the Sky Slayers are wicked.

[shaun03]

For support sq that going to be DS in via Dynat rule is better to give volkite charger or the caliver?

 

I going to have my AT from attack bikes and lev with cyclone melta, so looking for something to put a high volume of shots out, and be distraction.

 

The price on plasma is high and sure if its worth invesment in points, but being dam near wipe out a 5 man term sq is nice. 

 

In my Coh list with inf as MT  I can put a lot pressure up close, but i still feel DP in lone lev is running a big risk as out in front with no support or close by units to force target selection, Other than DS support unit close and maybe taking assault sq just have bodies near by to screen and support if need. What else is good way to offset the risks of DP a lone lev?

[Caillum]

A DP Leviathan is a problem that your opponent has to deal with. To balance this out, give them some other high priority targets, like a Spartan full of Rewards of Treason models, or a Vindicator squadron. If he divides his fire, then he may not actually destroy anything. If he focuses on just one target, your other units will survive and pay him for his mistake. Win / win.

 

With Dynat's DS ability, choose a unit that is effective when it arrives. Caliver Support will Snap Fire when it arrives, so not ideal. Charger Support is ok, but not going to change the world. Plasma Support is better, but I like Seekers with combi-plasma. 2+ to hit with Preferred Enemy? Gold. They also dish out hurt after the Marked For Death round.

 

The other unit to consider strongly is Machine Killer meltaVets. With Dynat, they dish out S9 shots that cause an Explodes result on a 4+. Bye-bye vehicles. :)

 

At the moment, I use his ability to Deep Strike my Tyrant Siege Terminators.

[Terminus]

^ That seems awful. Why would you take an expensive long ranged shooting unit, and take it off the board for at least one turn and then put them in a super vulnerable position, where they are easy to blast with templates and engage in melee? If it's Tyrants, it means coils, so you have infiltrate and maybe even scout with a Vigilator. Is it just to spare yourself buying a transport and you use the rule but otherwise deploy them normally? That also seems suboptimal because then you aren't infiltrating and your opponent can deploy around you.

[Caillum]

Sorry, what I meant was I use Dynat's Deep Strike ability to allow them in Coils without a DT. I start them on the board Turn 1 with Dynat in the unit.

 

I take Tank Hunters normally, which works nicely with Tyrants, Marksmen Vets (with missile launchers) and Breachers (with meltaguns). 10 Tyrants dish out 5HP a turn against AV14. )

[Terminus]

I don't like having to choose, so if Skorr isn't leading the force, I always bring a Siege Breaker HQ. A line of infiltrating tank hunting tyrants flanked by infiltrating phosphex mortars is a scary thing.