[HH1.0] Imperial Fists Tactics

[Indefragable]

I'm so used to taking a Crusade FOC that I forget others exist.

 

But essentially, as long as you satisfy all requirements for everything, there's no reason you couldn't, right?
 

On that note, you could run Stone Gauntlet (or any other RoW) in an Allied Detachment? 

[Darkwrath121]

According to pg10 of the Legiones Astartes Army List book, rites of war are not legal with alternative force org charts. Though, it's the kind of thing you can hopefully talk through with your opponent.

[Cris R]

Two questions:

 

1) I had some leftover units from another 30k project and putting together a ZM list with two squads of Breachers, one squad of Tartaros Terminators with the Storm Shields, and the new IF Tartaros Praetor with the Storm Shield when it comes out. What are the pros and cons of using ZM Assault Force versus the Stone Gauntlet?

 

2) What are fluffy options for Contemptors that work well with ZM?

 

Thanks!

Edited May 15, 2021 by Cris R

[Slips]

Two questions:

 

1) I had some leftover units from another 30k project and putting together a ZM list with two squads of Breachers, one squad of Tartaros Terminators with the Storm Shields, and the new IF Tartaros Praetor with the Storm Shield when it comes out. What are the pros and cons of using ZM Assault Force versus the Stone Gauntlet?

 

2) What are fluffy options for Contemptors that work well with ZM?

 

Thanks!

1. You get a better invuln save on your breachers getting a +1 in certain situations, you dont have to pay +15 to get your terminator squads the ability to deeptrike; those are the big ones
2. the 'can do a bit of everything' loadout oh Kheres, Chainfist + Graviton Gun will be able to perform aight; Graviton Gun with haywire makes taking doors down a bit more reliable while also dropping a difficult terrain pieplate at that location. Chainfist gets you armorbane for other dreads or to punch doors instead. Kheres gets you an S6 gun with rending. 

[The Scorpion]

Consider the humble Multi-Melta. It's two biggest disadvantages: short range & armored ceramite, are nullified in ZM.

[Slips]

Being a  heavy 1 weapon is really what lets it down since unlike the Lascannon, its not even twin-linked.

Edited May 17, 2021 by Slips

[Marshal Vespasian]

Id advocate for cc weapon + chainfist with either grav or melta in them. Grav has the added benefit of hindering your opponents movement, which is helpful in zm. 2 meltas can scratch enemy dreads before you charge them. Havoc launchers will rend in zm.

Our terminators assault cannons will rend on fives. Which is hilarious.

[Cris R]

Another question: what are the strengths of using Vets and Warders as a dread hunting unit that can double as an anti-MEQ close combat one in Zone Mortalis games? I'll be posting a 1,500 point ZM list soon and have the option of running one of these two units. The RoW I would use with the Vet list is ZM Assault Force; the Warder list has the flexibility of using ZM Assault Force or Stone Gauntlet. Thanks!

Edited May 20, 2021 by Cris R

[Slips]

Another question: what are the strengths of using Vets and Warders as a dread hunting unit that can double as an anti-MEQ close combat one in Zone Mortalis games? I'll be posting a 1,500 point ZM list soon and have the option of running one of these two units. The RoW I would use with the Vet list is ZM Assault Force; the Warder list has the flexibility of using ZM Assault Force or Stone Gauntlet. Thanks!

Melta weapons (such as Guns, Combis and Bombs) are the only reliable thing these squads have and the only one that allows the whole squad to participate is the Meltabombs.

 

Outside that, only vets can take Machine Killers for more reliability between the two units.

[Indefragable]

Just posted a set of lists to review. Any feedback appreciated:

 

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/370350-vii-legion-on-the-wall-modular-lists/?p=5701645 

[Claws and Effect]

Hey there Sons of Dorn.

 

I need to pick your brains a bit.

 

My son is turning 11 soon and plays Fists in 40k (as well as Necrons, Tyranids, and Tau. Kid has more armies than we do). So for his birthday my wife and I pulled the trigger on getting him a start at a 30k Fists army.

 

It includes Dorn, Sigismund, some Templar Brethren, some Phalanx Warders, Breachers, and a Deredeo.

 

Thing is, the kid really loves tanks and the army we sprung for doesn't include any.

 

Question I have for you is, aside from Land Raiders and Spartans, what tanks are good for the Fists as well as being thematically appropriate. My gut says to get him a Typhon Siege Tank, but I'm not sure.

 

Tips on other units to add to the force would be appreciated as well. I play Raven Guard and my wife plays Blood Angels, so our knowledge base on 30k Fists isn't great.

[Slips]

Honestly, pretty much anything from Predators to Sicaran-Chassis to, and especially, Artillery Tanks.

[Marshal Vespasian]

I love my squad of 3 vindicators. Feels pretty thenatic as well.

[Tiger9gamer]

since I am on a huge black templar kick, how viable is a templar brethren army list?

[Unknown Legionnaire]

since I am on a huge black templar kick, how viable is a templar brethren army list?

 

1.  Them zealot basterds can get expensive really quick (points wise).

 

2.  Need a method of delievery. Meaning an assault vehicle. Hello Land Raider Phobos, my old friend ( ... which brings you back to point one ... ).

 

3.  If you want them to be scoring, you will need to bring Siggy ... which is something you might want to do ... or not. I wish there was a different option to make them scoring, honestly.

 

Justy my two cents ... or three.

[LameBeard]

Zone Mortalis? No need for Land Raider and Elites are scoring too?

[Marshal Vespasian]

Siggi in a templar squad with an apithecary out of a lr is scary. But dont expect to shift anything with 2+ saves in a timeley fashion.

Love my templars though. Think I'll build a third one in predominantly black at some point.

Edited December 12, 2021 by Marshal Vespasian

[Indefragable]

Are Huscarls a straight-up improvement over 

A. Regular Termies
B. Command Squad

?

A seems like yes, other than cost (duh) and the ability to take a Spartan as dedicated Transport.
For B....you're trading out wargear options (including shooty ones)  and a 2W banner guy for a larger squad size, the Shield Wall ability of Phalanx Warders, and the ability to take Solarite Gauntlets. 

 

A regular command squad is more of a force multiplier while Huscarls are more straight-up fighty.....though given that both Shield Wall and the +1T from Stone Gauntlet don't work if you are the one doing the charging, so even as a QRF, Huscarls seem like not as straightforward good as they might be. 

 

 

 

Just planning out to do as I finish building out my VII Stone Guantlet force. I keep leaning towards A, vanilla Termies with storm shields to save some points and to get that precious FOC-less Spartan. 

[Bung]

Huscarls are a side grade to regular Terminators with Stormshields.

If you go for Tartaros Terminators with Fists / Shields and Teleport Homer there isnt much price increase.

 

Huscarls are great for conversions and can be played as an HQ choice especially in Zone Mortalis games.

 

If you want a FOC-less Spartan gonfor Phalanx Warders.

They are troops in Stone Gauntlet and can have a Spartan too.

[Scammel]

I think one thing worth noting with the Huscarls is that their solarite gauntlets are very reliable, especially when paired with shield wall - hitting the vast majority of targets on 3s with a reroll per chap is rather tasty, while their regular counterparts will be seeing half their powerfist attacks just vanish into the ether in many situations.

[Slips]

 

Here are the phase 3 Playtest rules leaks for IF there are a few pages of stuff missing such as the Phalanx Warders options (they are pretty much unchanged from what I know) and the IF armory/consul page.

 

First impressions:

• Stone Gauntlet got better
• Hammerfall Strikeforce is useable
• New Templar RoW is neat
• Stormshields can now be taken on PA ICs
• Templar flat 2W across the board and any of them can take a Plasma Pistol if you want
• Phalanx Warders have Power Axe, bolter, bolt pistol as baseline, sick, and are generally improved
• Polux got buffed to 2+/3++ from 3+/3++
• Sigismund got better - always on instant death now
• Dorn got more expensive but also got better; always swinging at S8 Ap2 but instant death isn't always on; his armor got improved to being wounded on a 4+ or worse instead of 3+ or worse his bolter is also assault instead of Salvo may have lost Aetos Dios as a unique option though, sadly. He also lost Rampage so he cant get 9 attacks anymore but retained WS8 (which can still go to WS9 with Phalanx Warders) and 6A base is still better than before.

If this is what we're getting - more or less - at launch, then I am a happy camper.

Edited March 29, 2022 by Slips

[Scammel]

Are you single, Slips? I could marry you.

 

I concur that these look like some very solid buffs across the board, and I love that the Templar RoW is practically free (no restrictions on HS is particularly notable). Sigismund probably got a little better on net - I don't think it's irrelevant that he and his unit loses the the +1 I on the charge, but that's made up for by the horrible, terrible, bowel-wrenching things he does to MCs.

 

Edit: Just noticed that all ICs - not just Terminators and including special characters - can now deep strike!

 

Edit edit: Any model with a powerfist can now upgrade it to a gauntlet - including, I assume, basic Terminators!

 

Edit edit edit: Unless the new iteration of deep strike disqualifies it, it seems possible to reaction-charge during the next movement phase? And Siggy allows an extra attempt at this via his WT?

Edited March 29, 2022 by Scammel

[Slips]

Are you single, Slips? I could marry you.

 

I concur that these look like some very solid buffs across the board, and I love that the Templar RoW is practically free (no restrictions on HS is particularly notable). Sigismund probably got a little better on net - I don't think it's irrelevant that he and his unit loses the the +1 I on the charge, but that's made up for by the horrible, terrible, bowel-wrenching things he does to MCs.

These were leaked on 4chan so arent coming from me so please no marriage proposals ty

 

But some things I missed in my initial take:

+1BS to bolt and AUTO weapons means it affects things like autocannons as well now. But, we did lose our rerolls in challenges for our characters. And if this affects our Dreads and Vehicles, well...

Polux's WLT also got slightly weaker but we dont know just what reactions can do yet so remains to be seen. Otherwise, his Power Fist was upgraded to a Sol Glove making it S10 Ap1 Master-Crafted in CC now meaning he can _really_ hurt vehicles on top of pulping anything T5 or lower if Hammerblow remains unchanged.

 

Siggy also has 3+ Precision Strikes so even if your opponent tries to challenge block him he has a chance at killing the intended target anyways.

Edited March 29, 2022 by Slips

[Bung]

Pollux already had a mastercrafted Power Fist, so he only got the Ap Bonus.

 

But Command Squads can take Stormshields.

[Scammel]

I never actually played with the original Stone Gauntlet as I was never enthused by Breachers, but I love the fact that it's now a fairly simple 'this is the Warder RoW'. The invun. reroll seems less attractive at first glance compared to T5, but without the Breacher tax I feel it likely comes out ahead in overall power.