Allies or one list

[Commander_Moustache]

In my list I use a scion platoon with 1 command squad and 2 normal squads, so I was wondering, should I have them as allies from MT? It does have better orders and I could free up a fast attack choice (and still use the valkyrie to transfer my veterans as they are BB). so I want to know, should I?

[Frater Cornelius]

I find the C:AM orders superior to C:MT. The only advantage of having MT is objective secured on the Scions. Personally, I find it not as useful as I have better things to do with them than sitting on an objective. That's what the Platoon is for. Besides, Scion score either way, so in many cases you can contest anyway.

 

I do not know you list but the decision comes down to whether you think losing the AM orders is worth having objective secured. In my eyes it is not worth it. Ignoring cover with ap3 guns, FRFSRF and shoot + run are too damn powerful to pass up. Remember, you can not use MT order on AM or the other way around, so you will also lack flexibility when giving orders.

[march10k]

I used to think that way, but I now think C:MT orders are better if you have special weapons. FRFSRF is obviously better as the number of weapons being fired goes up, and it's only really good on hellguns if you're shooting at marines. As the target's armor save gets worse, the value of bypassing it decreases. The C:MT orders seem more focused on maximizing the impact of your melta and plasma. Perfect example is the twinlinking order. I know you can get the same thing from prescience, but getting it without burning warp charges, without hovering near your psycher, and without allowing your opponent a chance to deny is really appealing. Especially in the case of a four plasma gun command squad with LD10. That's nearly automatic on the LD test, and eight twinlinked plasma shots is death incarnate.

[Commander_Moustache]

Well I suppose my next question is, if I have a preist in a unit from MT would I still be allowed to issue orders to it? Or would I be able to use both sets of orders on the unit, but only the models from the relivent codex work? (like I wouldnt be able to give him a twin linked laspistol)

[march10k]

Interesting thought. I hadn't thought of ICs as valid targets for orders...but I suspect that only the priest, not the MT stormies, would benefit from the order...

[Frater Cornelius]

You have Veterans for special weapons. They carry more and cost less. The only advantage of MT is that they can deep strike (which Vets can do as well when jumping out of a flier) but even that is only maximized when done with Meltas.

[march10k]

I agree that vets are great special weapon units. What MT bring is DSing without the valkyrie tax, the ability to take four special weapons in a command squad, and, if allied, both a separate set of orders and the two awesome formations. I have used stormtroopers as deepstriking melta teams when I didn't have the points for valks, they cost about the same as vets for 2 meltas, except they have half as many wounds (irrelevant if you're dropping them where they get one shot, then die), no option for a third melta (that's a big deal), and no need for a valkyrie that more than doubles their cost (also a big deal!)

[David Ravel]

For those of you that deepstrike MT, I personnally like to use Mystic henchmen with my Inquisitorial allies to help the deepstrike if its near my line. For 10 pts, it's a very good deal !

[march10k]

 

Not bad...skulls might be better, though, since you can put them farther from your deployment zone. I'm not sure I'd deepstrike something that I wanted close to my lines...why not just deploy it the normal way or walk it on?

[Commander_Moustache]

After some thought, I am going to attempt to try them as allies. Mostly because my normal officers are ordering the artillery or infantry squads anyway, whilst the orders for MT suit the counter charge role I plan on using said command squad for (twinlinked flamer will thin orks nicely enough to finish off, fleet will help getting into the charge and crusader will help to catch faster units) and the others should benifit my normal scions

[David Ravel]

@march10k : I don't use them as first priority deepstrike, but sometimes when you fail again and again your reserve roll, the actual target may come nearer and nearer to your stuff. Also, you can combine it with the Liber Heresius which gives scout (and therefore outflank), which can help with those DS. But yes, the skulls too are useful, and very cheap.