Brainstorming: 'Assault-based SW' or 'the Meta-Killer'

[knife&fork]

5 BC with flamer was also my choice for the SW. But now I am thinking IP + 4 servitors. 40 more points than BC but nice assault capabilities and can repair 1 hull point per rnd on the SW.

If you aren't playing CAD .... surely a better choice if u can afford points.

 

The autorepair isn't useless, but flyers often go down in a single shooting phase. The points you spend to make that flyer more durable (not the only use for the unit, I know) has almost paid for half a flyer in itself. 

[WG Vrox]

 

5 BC with flamer was also my choice for the SW. But now I am thinking IP + 4 servitors. 40 more points than BC but nice assault capabilities and can repair 1 hull point per rnd on the SW.

If you aren't playing CAD .... surely a better choice if u can afford points.

 

The autorepair isn't useless, but flyers often go down in a single shooting phase. The points you spend to make that flyer more durable (not the only use for the unit, I know) has almost paid for half a flyer in itself. 

 

 

I agree, bringing 5 BCs with flamer is a nice unit to take objectives, but nothing that hurts the over all list if they goes down with the flyer. Plus flyers are tricky and runs have to be timed and planned precisely. There will be games that regardless you end up not having the flyer on the table as much as you hoped. "Do flyers have to be on the table to get to roll for repairs?"  Regardless, that many points in a unit is too many for me.  

 

The appeal is very tempting, but the numbers just aren't there.   I would much rather put my IP+4 servitors and cw in a LRC. 

[knife&fork]

Ironhands do the self fixing flyer bit ok. You get IWND for free and then a good repair roll even with just the servo arm on an otherwise naked techmarine.

For everyone else it's more of a gimmick build. 

 

Land raiders on the other hand..... too bad you can't embark beasts in transports.

[WG Vrox]

Ironhands do the self fixing flyer bit ok. You get IWND for free and then a good repair roll even with just the servo arm on an otherwise naked techmarine.

For everyone else it's more of a gimmick build. 

 

Land raiders on the other hand..... too bad you can't embark beasts in transports.

 

Right, I hope they address the wolves as passenger issue soon.

[Jochteas]

See, I liked your third list, but I would change the Blood claw flamers to IP, and throw in 4 servitors in each, then upgrade to twinlinked multi-metas and happy hunting. I get your theme, and I really like it, and I think the Stormwolf of all vehicles can fit it, and certainly it can be tricked out to look amazing and fit the feel of the army. I mean you got little wolves, big wolves, bigger wolves, and then the biggest wolf. (Well horse versions but same principle)

[Frater Cornelius]

The only way I would ever run an Iron Priest is TWM + 4 Wolves. Those extra points have to come from somewhere. I also tend to agree with k&f that when a flyer goes down it will be one phase more often than not.

Right now the flyer is more or less a place holder anyway.

I am planning to run Harald, TWM WGBL, 3 TWM IP with 4 wolves each, and 3x 4 TWC with 2 ss and a fist. Until I can get my second WGBL and additional TWC, I will run 5 BC, flamer, melta stormwolf. If he turns out so amazing, I may keep him in for longer though.

[pedrogzc]

Well, it seems we have a list... I like the idea of pure TWC. We could discuss how we would fight against most common current meta.

How about invisible death stars? Twc list aren't just point'n kill.

 

Aditionally, not everyone knows how works LoS shanenigans, so making a little description about how deploy and form TwC unit could be useful.

 

How many people are going to try TWC extensive list?

[Jochteas]

Yeah, TWC is what sold me on Space Wolves and what got me into the whole game, so I'll be running them heavily. I'm just thankful they are actually pretty good

[Frater Cornelius]

Yeah, you need a bit more finesse than it first seems. They will eat alive those cover save based lists and skimmers due to melee. Invisible Deathstars are more tricky. It depends what kind of death star. If it is a star that takes all the points (like a 1,5k points in one unit), then you must hope that he fails invisibility early on. But other than that, you can split your TWC units into 8 different units and you have a Stormwolf with Claws. That are 10 scoring units. You just split them all up and go for objectives.

If it is a smaller star within an army (CSM crusher general with chaos spawns made invisible by Belakor) you can either go for the rest of the army, or actualy risk an all-out-assault turn 1. When all of your units attack with all of their attacks they will kill the unit through invisibility. I mean, were talking about over 100 attacks coming his way when everyone can participate. The Krakenbone WGBL will tank the Crusher Lord and has a decent chance to hit back because he rerolls all hits in melee.

 

I mean imagine that glorious cavalry charge... add this for maximum epicness:

[Frater Cornelius]

Actually, I have been thinking to playing the Stormfang. Yeah, you heard me, FANG.
I have found it's niche next to the arguably superior Stormwolf. It is when you do not have any FA slots left and no Elites to sneak it in as a dedicated. If I buy the Wolf with Claws, I will pay around 300. The fully upgraded Fang is 255. I think saving 45 points and getting a Large Blast is well worth losing twin-linked.

[toonarmy]

Update:

 

So ran 2 ML2 rune priest last night in squads with 5 WG bikers with 2 SS in each.  They supported my TWC unit which included Harald.

 

One had life leech and enfeeble, the other smite and iron arm.

 

Iron arm RP was beast.  He lasted 3 turns of shooting out in the open against eldar due to being t8 and became a vehicle killer due to being strength 7 or using smash.  He took out 2 tanks on his own.  Now I know I cannot guarantee iron arm but the anti-psycher boost was very useful and he became so annoying my opponent kind of focused on him with a large proportion of his remaining force.

 

The other RP with enfeeble made good use of his power on a Wraith Knight meaning my TWC were wounding on 4's due to FC and wolf claws.  Harald was wounding on 3's.  Needless to say it died very quickly.

 

I think keeping them cheap is the way to go.  ML2 if you think you need it but nothing else.  The WG bikes were tough wounds to remove and the times the got into combat they still did some damage as they were still WS5 with 4 attacks on the charge.  I plan on running 2 units of TWC so i may run the RP's on bikes in the unit or close enough to hand out buffs but i think they work well.

[Frater Cornelius]

Damn, don't get me started on the power of Enfeeblement. I had a very hard time against a MSU SW player with 4 ML2 RP who all rolled on Biomancy and 3 got that power. It was... hard

Anyway, update on my end. This is what I played today:

Jarl (Harald)
• 2 Hounds

WGBL

• RA, SS, MB, TWM, KBS, FCT

• 2 Hounds

Iron Priest
• TWM
• 4 Cyber Hounds
Iron Priest
• TWM
• 4 Cyber Hounds

Iron Priest
• TWM
• 3 Cyber Hounds

1 Servitor

1 Servitor

1 Servitor

4 TWC

• 2 SS, Powerfist
4 TWC
• 2 SS, Powerfist

5 TWC
• 2 SS, Pair of Wolf Claws

Stormfang

• TLLC, TLHB

I played against 2 guys who combined their Tau forces. Game was over bottom of turn 3 due them not being the best players and me tabling them. I got some turn 1 changes because they got greedy. IP usually went solo after they weathered one shooting phase as a unit and ate tanks. TWC massacred Riptides and Fire Warriors, Jarl and WGBL went after Broadsides and Crisis to eat them alive.

The Stormfang was also very valuable in that setup because he put plenty of FW into building where my Cav could not reach. His large blast and TLHB really decimated them. That thing has actually pretty decent horde control, will try it again.

My greatest weapon was me being able to weather their attacks as a unit but then going solo with all IC and doing multi-charges with the TWC. That way only the units in the building were able to shoot since the rest was stuck in combat.

The servitors just parked themselves into the closest objective they could find and stayed there. Like the owner of the store put it: "The objectives were held by a bunch of drooling idiots." That guy is awesome. But they did precisely that. They pretty much forgot them because the very nice men on horses wanted to have a chat

Overall, fairly successful. I will get me some more experienced players next time to test some more strategies.

Edit: Storm-freaking-FANG. I am used to write the word Wolf, but it is the Stormfang I used. I changed it in the army list

[SamaNagol]

You get a large blast but, it isnt Twin Linked and it only has a 45' fire arc to the front.

 

I wouldnt ever bother with the StormFang

[Frater Cornelius]

You get a large blast but, it isnt Twin Linked and it only has a 45' fire arc to the front.

 

I wouldnt ever bother with the StormFang

 

If you do not understand what the hell I have written in post 110 then you need to get your eyes checked bud. Not that I would listen to someone who spends his entire time on this forum bashing TWC units.

[CatSmasher]

I love the Stormfang. The large blast matters, and ap2 is a meaningful distinction, haven't had to use its "Lance"

[Frater Cornelius]

I love the Stormfang. The large blast matters, and ap2 is a meaningful distinction, haven't had to use its "Lance"

 

The large blast is still only s6 ap3 when fired in dispersed mode.

[pedrogzc]

We play at 1500 in our gaming group, so I have cut some things. My preliminar list is something like this

 

Harald +wolves

Wgbl kraken and rest of tw stuff

 

2 IP+4 cybereolves

3 TWCx4 units, 2 of them with fist and one with claw.

 

I still have nearly 100 to spend

 

My problem... Tyranid list. How to manage this:

 

Flyrant tl-devourer

Broodlord

30 gants x2

15 gants

Venomthrope x 2

Tervi flanker

2 or 3 carnifex

1 mawloc

 

Dificult, quite difficult for me. Bbroodlord will tear our characters apart and carnifexes with PE eat tw for breakfast.

[irwit]

Stay as one large group and try and work your way through him one piece at a time. You'll prob still lose though.

[Frater Cornelius]

Fexes get eaten by TWC. Your HQs can handle the Tervigon and Mawloc (did it before).

The only problem is those gaunts. They have plenty of attacks to get through your TWC.

[toonarmy]

I play tyranids as well so I have some good experience.

 

I would say he has very little synapse.  Flyrant will be hard to hit but it can't cover the whole board. Tervigon has to come onto the board so that is at least 2 turns without that synapse.  My advise would be to focus on units out of synapse range and they will be cut down in their prime.  All you have to do is win combat and you can then run them down as they will be not be fearless out of synapse.  An iron priest on a TW will be able to do this on his own against some of those squads.  If he takes his tyrant out of the air then go after it because his army will start to crumble.

 

As irwit says, keep together and take units on one by one.  Once in combat the tyrant can do nothing.  The mawloc can but it will also hurt his guys. and was i have said target anything that is not fearless.

[Hear da Lamentation]

He's a bit mad to have the tervigon as a flanker isn't he?

 

Also be glad he isnt taking 2 flyrants :)

 

Brood lords aren't that good anymore. My 3x. TWC (1 basic, 1ss, 1pf) killed 2 x 5 Genestealers + their brood lords (not in same round of course).

 

You neeeeeed some storm shields on this TWC.

[Hear da Lamentation]

For me, you have too many expensive units at 1500 points. You need more stuff .. and you need some way of dealing with large units of shooters.

 

(For me, gaunts .... In particular devil gaunts are scary scary scary. Especially with a venomthrope giving them marine 3+ cover saves)

[Donkalleone]

 

I love the Stormfang. The large blast matters, and ap2 is a meaningful distinction, haven't had to use its "Lance"

 

The large blast is still only s6 ap3 when fired in dispersed mode.

 

Nope. Stormfang Dispersed is AP2 ( its the HF Destructor ). Its very easy to be confused.

[Frater Cornelius]

 

 

I love the Stormfang. The large blast matters, and ap2 is a meaningful distinction, haven't had to use its "Lance"

 

The large blast is still only s6 ap3 when fired in dispersed mode.

 

Nope. Stormfang Dispersed is AP2 ( its the HF Destructor ). Its very easy to be confused.

 

 

Thanks, bud. I just looked it up. It was a pleasant surprise :)

[pedrogzc]

oh yes, i forget that each TWC carries 2 shields in the pack leader and CC specialist weapon

 

the problem with broodlord is that has an huge number of attacks with f6 ap2 at his ini with instant death... nasty

(my mistake, not the genestealer lord, but the Swarmlord... the Tyrant with 4 bone swords)

 

He deploy very compact, after the screen of 60 gants he puts carnifexes, flyrant, Swarmlord and both venonthropes, so you have to weight at least 48 TL f6 shots each turn, 36 with PE and the insane amount of little critters shots. Actually I think is best that the gants stay in synapsis, so you spend at least two rounds of HtH and crush them in his turn.

 

In the end, this TWC army at 1500 seems like just 2 big death stars units, let's see how it goes.