New ideas for a Dark Angels Legion rules

[depthcharge12]

So after pioneering some rules I had made to play with my Dark Angels legion and about 2-3 games I've been pondering about cleaning them up a bit. A house rules 2.0 if you will for them.

 

These were my ideas based upon the fluff and feel of the army:

 

"Beast-Slayers"

Dark Angels leaders, whether from the 1st legion of old fighting against the creatures that moved in during the age of darkness, or the pre imperial Calibanites, were experts at fighting monstrous beasts. Many gained renowned whilst fighting many toothed monstrosities, viscous predators, or indomitable aliens that preyed upon the home worlds of man. All Independent characters, characters, and honor guard with the Dark Angels Legion Astartes rule gain the Monster Hunter USR and always wound monstrous creatures on no worse than a 4+.

 

"Weapons From a Darker Age"

Vast and deep are the armories of the First due to their lineage and birthright. Many esoteric and archaic weapons, once lovingly hand made by individual tech-priest, now find home in the hand of the Dark Angels. These weapons were deadly in the extreme, both to the target and the user. All volkite weapons (whether carried by infantry, dreadnoughts, or tanks) may reroll failed deflagrate wounds. Additionally, all plasma weapons (same as above) may reroll 1's to hit which are successful now on a 4+. However, if a 1 is rolled again, the model instantly suffers a wound (or hull point) with no saves allowed.

 

"Oath-Sworn"

Knight-Lords are expected to lead from the front and take on the Enemy's greatest leader and threat. Whether he chooses to dispatch said leader with tactical acumen or personal bladesmanship is left to him. Dark Angels armies must contain either/both a Praetor or Champion. One of these must then elect to become the warlord, he must then accept and issue all challenges and gets rerolls to hit and wound in close combat in challenges.*

 

*Additionally, the warlord may elect an enemy independent character. The enemy player gains 2 VPs if this model is remaining at the end of the match. The Dark Angel player gains 1 VP if this model is killed or 2 VPs if the DA warlord kills him in close combat.

 

 

What are your thoughts/opinions on these rules and how should they be tweaked if needed? C and C welcome :)

[Atia]

i would allow dark angels a similuar rule as the alpha legion, but instead of steeling legion specific units, dark angels would steel legion specific wargear, as it's stated that they were (one of) the first to get new toys and from the fluff of the deathwing knights in 40k, the dark angels used stormshields on their terminators during the GC/HH ... and we need plasma-cannons for our veteran squads :P ... but we'll see how FW will handle our knight-boys

[marine7312000]

The only issue I can think of right now is with the Beast-slayers rule. I can't remember many monstrous creates in 30k. Also this ^^.

[depthcharge12]

The only issue I can think of right now is with the Beast-slayers rule. I can't remember many monstrous creates in 30k. Also this ^^.

Mostly in the AdMech side like Castellax and a few HQs. It's situational at best but still fun and fluffy :)

 

 

i would allow dark angels a similuar rule as the alpha legion, but instead of steeling legion specific units, dark angels would steel legion specific wargear, as it's stated that they were (one of) the first to get new toys :P and from the fluff of the deathwing knights in 40k, the dark angels used stormshields on their terminators during the GC/HH ... and we need plasma-cannons for our veteran squads :P ... but we'll see how FW will handle our knight-boys :P

I was considering pilfering the IF rules for the moment due to having Templar squads (very similar to DAs), close combat rerolls for leaders (again, very knight themed), and the +1 BS on bolters because the Dark Angels have been around the block a few times before the other legions were test tubes.

 

I do want storm shields and plasma cannons as well, mainly for terminators. Again, stealing some of the IF rules would be beneficial for the vigil pattern storm shields.

[Hesh Kadesh]

I'm not a fan of giving new rules without precedence, so rather than wound on a 4+, i'd rather just give Characters the Monster Hunter special rule, and leave it at that.

 

For Weapons of a Darker Age - the wording is pretty bad. Technically, all volkite wounds are deflagrate rules. Why not just Deflagrate happens on a 5+, rather than 6, or that additional wounds caused by deflagrate can generate further hits. With Plasma ,maybe just reroll failed armour saves against wounds caused by gets hot caused by plasma weapons.

 

Oath Sworn - no. Just no. You do not force the opponent to choose who his warlord is. Maybe just gain +1 VP if your Warlord kills the enemy Warlord in a challenge, but force you to challenge. Maybe a special character like Alajos or Corswain who can force an enemy to accept a Challenge.

 

I had considered a rule like at the start of assault before challenges are declared, nominate one enemy character eligible of accepting a potential challenge by Corswain/Alajos. Both nominated character and C/A add +d6 to their leadership. If C/A is equal to or higher, then enemy target must accept and no enemy may make a Heroic Intervention. If C/A rolls higher by rolling a natural 6, then gains +1 to hit for the duration of the challenge. Primarchs automatically count as rolling 6.

[Allart01]

I can't wait to have my beloved first legion. 

I don't know about their rules, but one of them MUST be called "Savage Weapons" and make them stubborn/3dices ld test and discard the highest/can't be destroyed in sweeping advances because they faced anything the galaxy had to throw against them and they don't really care anymore.

That would be so cool to make me dance.

[marine7312000]

Oath Sworn - no. Just no. You do not force the opponent to choose who his warlord is. Maybe just gain +1 VP if your Warlord kills the enemy Warlord in a challenge, but force you to challenge. Maybe a special character like Alajos or Corswain who can force an enemy to accept a Challenge.

 

Oath sworn doesn't say anything about choosing who your opponent's warlord is... It only specifies that YOU( as a DA player) MUST choose either a Praetor or Champion as warlord and that your army MUST include at least one of the two.

[depthcharge12]

I can't wait to have my beloved first legion. 

I don't know about their rules, but one of them MUST be called "Savage Weapons" and make them stubborn/3dices ld test and discard the highest/can't be destroyed in sweeping advances because they faced anything the galaxy had to throw against them and they don't really care anymore.

That would be so cool to make me dance.

Yeah I forgot to add the stubborn special to all Legion Astartes: Dark Angels. I will rename it in your honor :D I think it might be more fitting as FW gave either that or furious charge as an option to not done legions (my theory is for that to mean DAs and UM for Stubborn and BAs and WSs have furious charge).

 

I like the idea of not getting swept, but would that be adding to many rules at this point? :) I don't mind extra rules but it's a lot to remember and I always try to keep balance between buff/debuff.

 

 

Oath Sworn - no. Just no. You do not force the opponent to choose who his warlord is. Maybe just gain +1 VP if your Warlord kills the enemy Warlord in a challenge, but force you to challenge. Maybe a special character like Alajos or Corswain who can force an enemy to accept a Challenge.

 

Oath sworn doesn't say anything about choosing who your opponent's warlord is... It only specifies that YOU( as a DA player) MUST choose either a Praetor or Champion as warlord and that your army MUST include at least one of the two.

Yes marine was correct.

 

However I like the idea you have for Alajos/Corswain :)

[Sevatar]

Hmmm. I like the penalty for oath sworn, but I disagree with the Monster Hunter rule - far too situational if not playing AdMech.

 

The Inner Circle: Dark Angels gain +1 WS when outnumbered in assault.

Weapons of a Bygone Age

Oath Sworn - with harsher penalties.

[Hesh Kadesh]

Eh, sorry about the misunderstanding for the Oathsworn special rule. Looking back i'm not sure how I misunderstood. As a Word Bearers player, the Chaplain requisite is a huge annoyance. Admittedly, it is a better 'tax' than what Word Bearers have to put up with. Might want to ensure that the Primarch requisite to become a Warlord doesn't clash.

[depthcharge12]

Thanks again for all the input guys :) when I get a moment I will adjust everything.

[Saphrael]

Hmmm. I like the penalty for oath sworn, but I disagree with the Monster Hunter rule - far too situational if not playing AdMech.

 

The Inner Circle: Dark Angels gain +1 WS when outnumbered in assault.

 

I agree. Monster Hunter sounds good, but would so rarely get used it essentially takes up space for a more flavourful, impactful rule.

 

At the risk of seeming like a douche for quoting myself, I've already made my thoughts clear in another of depthcharge's threads and I see no reason to have changed my mind:

 

 

 

I'd rather something that reflects our tactical genius and co-ordinated approach to warfare as well as our knightly/honourable approach to personal combat.

 

Inspired tacticians - may reroll any reserve roll, whether it is successful or not. Second roll counts.

 

Honour of Caliban - Dark Angels who are outnumbered in clost combat count as having one higher Weapon Skill and may reroll failed morale tests.

 

For me this reflects the stoic nature of the DA while hearkening back to way the knights of The Order fought in shrinking circles when in melee. It also provides a nice reflection for the NL's 'talent for murder' rule.

 

I'm also in favour of calling the +1WS when outnumbered rule something other than 'Inner Circle' because that has organisational structure implications.

[Athrawes]

Saphrael- I really like your ideas for 1st legion traits. They seem very fluffy and situationally helpful.

[depthcharge12]

Here's idea 2.1 from everyone's contributions:

 

"Weapons of a Bygone Age"

Vast and deep are the armories of the First due to their lineage and birthright. Many esoteric and archaic weapons, once lovingly hand made by individual tech-priest, now find home in the hand of the Dark Angels. These weapons were deadly in the extreme, both to the target and the user. All volkite weapons (whether carried by infantry, dreadnoughts, or tanks) may reroll failed deflagrate wounds. Additionally, all plasma weapons (same as above) may reroll 1's to hit which are successful now on a 4+. However, if a 1 is rolled again, the model instantly suffers a wound (or hull point) with no saves allowed.

 

"Oath-Sworn"

Knight-Lords are expected to lead from the front and take on the Enemy's greatest leader and threat. Whether he chooses to dispatch said leader with tactical acumen or personal bladesmanship is left to him. Dark Angels armies must contain either/both a Praetor or Champion. One of these must then elect to become the warlord, he must then accept and issue all challenges and gets rerolls to hit and wound in close combat in challenges.*

 

*Additionally, the warlord may elect an enemy independent character. The enemy player gains 2 VPs if this model is remaining at the end of the match. The Dark Angel player gains 1 VP if this model is killed or 2 VPs if the DA warlord kills him in close combat.

 

"Walk the Circle"

Calibanite knights were taught to fight in ever shrinking circles; likewise, their 1st legion founders fought in a similar manner against the manifold creatures of the void with few numbers and little support. Dark Angels units outnumbered in close combat gain +1 WS. Rules for bulky models in terminator armor do not count as 2 models for the purposes of determining if they gain this benefit.

 

"Savage Weapons"

The First Legion has had nearly anything the galaxy could throw at it from its inception, whether that be a foe from without or within. Resolute against the fiercest foes, the Emperor entrusted his Angels of Death to fight alone and unsupported. All units with the Legion Astartes: Dark Angels special rule gain stubborn.

 

 

Special Wargear:

 

Storm shields -

Any unit in terminator armor may swap their storm bolter for a storm shield for +5 points.

 

Ryza pattern plasma cannon-

Any terminator unit may upgrade to carry a plasma cannon for +15 points. 1 in 5 terminators may trade their storm bolter for one instead of a special weapon.

 

 

What are your thoughts? I was considering adding another rule but it might be better as a rite of war. It would allow one support squad armed with either volkite chargers or calivers to count as a compulsory troops choice.

 

 

Edit: rules derp

[Athrawes]

Those are all great and fluffy but I think you might have too many different benefits. Comparing your list of Legion traits to those created by forge world, you have a lot more, the only legion with close to as many benefits is Imperial Fists, and even they only grant stubborn to units behind cover. 

 

I'm not sure what the best option would be, maybe pick two or three of the ones you have listed? That would be similar to the alpha legion Mutable tactics which would allow you to tailor your list from game to game. 

 

Like I said, I think they all sound fun, I'm just not sure using all four would be balanced compared to the other Legion Traits.

[depthcharge12]

I think it's getting unwieldy too.

 

I might just limit it to the +1 WS and stubborn. The others can be used for a rite if war or something.

[Saphrael]

I think it's getting unwieldy too.

 

I might just limit it to the +1 WS and stubborn. The others can be used for a rite if war or something.

 

Agreed that there's too many rules and I agree that the keepers are the +1 WS and stubborn. I think stubborn in all situations is too powerful for 30k though, situational would be better. Normally I'd say keep it with the 'outnumbered in CC' part, but I'd like to find a way to make it work outside of combat. Maybe have it based on the HQ to tie back to your Oath Sworn rule: DA re-roll failed morale checks if their detachment is led by a Praetor/Champion. Or maybe if the Praetor/Champion has killed someone in CC.

 

Think you also need to re-write your 'Weapons of a Bygone Age' rule, it's too cumbersome now, GW/FW don't write rules like that. I'd suggest simply letting them re-roll failed armour saves that result from 'Gets Hot' to represent their plasma weapon malfunctions are quite as bad. That being said, I'm not keen on this part of our fluff being emphasised in 30k (or in 40k for that matter).

[Raktra]

Two small upsides and one thick downside or one massive upside and two lesser downsides. That's the typical pattern with LA rules.

[TheForgottenAngel]

I think instead of plasma terminators have volkite ones!

[Saphrael]

Two small upsides and one thick downside or one massive upside and two lesser downsides. That's the typical pattern with LA rules.

 

This is actually a very good point. So far we haven't come up with any relevant or characterful downsides and to be honest, I'm at a bit of a loss.

 

I don't think the Praetor/Champion restriction suggested by depthcharge is the best way to go, but in typical 'critic' fashion, I don't have any alternative ideas.

[depthcharge12]

 

 

Two small upsides and one thick downside or one massive upside and two lesser downsides. That's the typical pattern with LA rules.

This is actually a very good point. So far we haven't come up with any relevant or characterful downsides and to be honest, I'm at a bit of a loss.

 

I don't think the Praetor/Champion restriction suggested by depthcharge is the best way to go, but in typical 'critic' fashion, I don't have any alternative ideas.

Unfortunately I'm in the same boat.

 

I'd make a champion tax (i.e. you must take a champion similar to charismatic leadership) but he gets some benefits as a "paladin".

 

It would come down to two semi minor buffs in the form of stubborn and +1 WS when outnumbered and a debuff by having to take a champion - which is not an optimal choice.

[Raktra]

Pride of the First (or whatever): Models with LA:DA have Stubborn. However, they may not voluntarily fail a morale check or go to ground.

Same as 40k, fair enough there?

[Atia]

I think instead of plasma terminators have volkite ones!

nope, plasma is the dark angels thing, like graviton is the iron hands', helfrost is the space wovles' and flamers+meltaguns are the salamanders' thing ;)

[Slips]

I think instead of plasma terminators have volkite ones!

nope, plasma is the dark angels thing, like graviton is the iron hands', helfrost is the space wovles' and flamers+meltaguns are the salamanders' thing

Then who gets Volkites? Blood Angels? Thousand Sons? Both I'm very much ok with....

[Hesh Kadesh]

Alpha Legion, according to the Lernaean Terminators.