Skitarii and Mechanicum HARD DATA review

[Seathal]

So I've been test-fielding my Skitarii and Mechanicum units allied with Space Marine Raptors and by themselves. Here's a very brief breakdown of what I feel (with just a few matches) and experienced with each unit:

SKITARII:

Vanguard:
Surprisingly good for such a cheap unit. They put a hurt on heavy and light infantry by sheer dice saturation. The extra wounds the rad carbines put out really make a difference and they're ideal as a screen unit because they can go faster than normal infantry to block and fill up holes in your formation, put out a surprising ammount of firepower and charge 2D6+3 inches to surprise enemy assault units to deny them the +1 assault attack (they usually don't expect you to be able to do that) and get them stuck in a combat with a unit 3 times cheaper than themselves. They'll end up dying but you might get surprised by how much damage they can take and deliver back (thanks in no small part to their -1T to enemy unit in close combat). My only grip is that their special weapons are uber-expensive to be relying on a T3 4+ platform. If you equip them with plasma calivers you turn them into a "glass-cannon" type unit. If they get the chance to hit, they'll do it hard (with some help with imperative doctrines to avoid overheating), but if they don't you'll pay 60-90 points for weapons you won't get the chance to use. In my humble opinion they can be used in small squads with arc rifles or plasma calivers (keep them in cover or out of sight then come out at your turn to get those precious AP2 wounds or hull points off an enemy unit) or 10x barebones as screen for your more expensive and dedicated troops. They do that particularly well.

Rangers:
They get Move Through Cover on top of their scout movement to get those first mid-ground tactical objectives at turn 1 easily. They do well in general. A good unit to move up to some cover and support your vanguards from a safer distance, although still expendable if they don't take too many expensive toys. I found them particularly useful for urban fire fights (where both parties are under cover) when equipping them with an omnispex. They take advantage of having Arc weaponry because they can get closer under cover when fighting vehicles, albeit they are a bit more expensive. The arquebus is a tricky one. 25 points for a weapon that will only wound less than 50% of the time is a bit crap, but every now and then you'll get a 6 when shooting a marine squad and then you'll be glad to have that Sargent with fist or Tac marine with a melta removed from play although that's rare enough. You may consider assigning your warlordship to a ranger alpha with 3 arquebuses to maximise the number of hits, precision shots and rending hits you get from them.

Both of these squads improve massively when using the Mechanicum War Congregation because they get free upgrades and no gets hot (yay, plasma calivers everywhere!), along with free relics for the Alphas. I still have to try that but sounds like fun.

Rustalkers Infiltrators:
Just used them once with disastrous outcome. They are best kept behind your vanguards and under cover and use them as counter-attack units. I'm sure you can get their full potential that way thanks to the radiation of the vanguards. Best used as a deterrent/counter attack/support unit than a spearhead.

Rustalkers Sicarians:
Similar uses to the Infiltrators. Don't try tun run them across the field unless you bring them in with the Killclade formation (even then, stay in cover and out of sight until you can charge with your awesome reach). Better with Infiltrators close by. I still have to field them more to extract further conclusions.

Ironstrider Ballistari:
It's an ok unit. For 55 points you get a mobile twin-linked auto cannon that overwatches with 5s. Not bad, but a high profile target. It will attract enemy fire. Then again, just 55 points. A good force multiplier for your foot troops.

Sydonian Dragoon:
Hugely disappointing experiences with him. Mainly because I forgot to not scout with it and couldn't charge first turn when I had the chance. Ok against small units and light vehicles. Its effectiveness depends on charging first and getting a good roll. Then it will die. Again, for 45 points you get an annoying unit that can screen a more important unit in your army (like an IK or your infantry/mech blob) and assault before being assaulted if you're wise. The phosphor serpenta will rarely hit, wound and go past the opponents save for you to get the cover and charge bonus.

Onagers:
It's tempting to take 3 of them in a unit to get the 4 invul. But then you get 3 F10 FP1 blasts on only ONE enemy unit. Kind of a waste for a unit that goes past 300 points. It lacks tactical flexibility and can get nullified by being charged by anything with more than 3 miniatures/wounds. If you want to take them do it separately. I can definitely see how a dedicated anti-air onager would be useful if you lack of flyers tho. The AA onager is the nightmare of any Dark Eldar and Eldar mechanized army.

MECHANICUS
I only tried one unit here, will be uploading as I field others.

Kastelan Robots:
The psychological terror that two T7 W3 3+/pseudo-5++ creatures create on the heart of your enemy is priceless. Sit them back with the double-shooting doctrine and watch enemy MEQ melt to dust by the dozens each turn or walk them forward to create a danger bubble around them that the rest of your army can use. Even without fists they put out 2 S7 FP2 attacks each at BS3 and Hammer of Wrath and the Datasmith two S8 FP2 and one S4 at I10. The bots can trade their attacks for a S10 FP1 smash attack each. The lastest game they purged around 20 khorne assault marines by shooting before getting destroyed by a khorne chaos paladin and some daemons, but the datasmith struck back killing the paladin and the daemons with his fist in two assault phases. Crazy stuff. The fisted ones are good for hunting vehicles and deterring a direct assault to your frontline but I still prefer the sheer crazyness of 18 S6 FP3 shooting attacks (that have the possibility to shoot at HP4 and have Ignore cover with the Elimination formation.... just crazy).

I'm eager to try the rest of the units. The next ones will be the Kataphrones along the Kastelan on the Elimination formation, which promises to be bat:cuss crazy. 32 Grav shots, 18 phosphor and up to 18 heavy Phosphor cannon shots at HP4 that ignore cover is prone to strike fear in your enemies.

Please feel free to sheer your own experiences with these or other units of the Omnissiah you try in your games.

[Vash]

The Sicarian units I have had good results my self. 

Star players if I do dare say so. 

On paper they look like they won't do any good, but if you give them a chance and actually use them right, they do a lot of good. The infiltrators debuff is really helpful, and once they decide to charge, they throw out so many hits its unbelievable. 

Weaker armies, wich is the most common nowadays where I play (i.e not space marines/3+ saves), do not like the sicarian units. 

But if we insist on only comparing with our brothers in power armours, yes there are better choices we can chose from :)

[Tiger9gamer]

ummm, brother I think you may have had a mistake. unless it was FAQ'd to let them have it, vanguard do not have the extra 3" (dunestrider) special rule.

[Scurvydog]

Kastellans will rarely get BS4 and ignore cover from elimination protocols, at least not unless you got 2 units of them. Units from the formation get BS4 and ignore cover when shooting at an enemy unit, which has been wounded/glanced/penned by a kastellan unit from the formation with luminagen. I can see many scenarios where you would rather shoot 1 target with the kastellans weapons and another with the destroyers, since they are somewhat differently specialized in what to target and shoot at. 

 

With the WD formation Skitarii will be bonkers, doctrinas and imperatives is a scary thought, with the str canticle vanguards could get WS6 and S6, while still reducing the toughness of the enemy by 1... These guys at the size of guardsmen would have a shot at punching a wraithknight silly.

 

Your dragoon didn't really get a fair shot at his review then with the scout thing, but I doubt many will use them besides true enthusiasts, they are just really expensive to purchase in real cash. I would have to be a whole lot more sure about them to invest in that. 

[heron]

You have missed the value of the dragoons i think. I have used two of them (as single model units) in several battles and they have each time never failed to 1) draw fire that should have been directed to a higher value target and 2) either tied up or completely destroyed a target that was worth more than twice their value. They are 45'points of fast moving distraction. Also great for last minute objectives if they are still on the table.

[Charlo]

I'd love to see how a full unit of Jezzial Dragoons does as a mobile sniper platform, it's pretty resilient with the 5++ and could screen a lot of your advance.

 

It's also dirt cheap at what, 250ish points?

 

It's a real shame the Onager rule isn't cross unit, that would've been a lot more reasonable. Currently, like you say there isn't much reason to take them in squads due to the potential overkill!

[Vel'Cona]

I'm inclined to agree with the majority of this consensus. A few sticking points:

Infiltrators need to be (duh) Infiltrated, and cover will have a huge impact on how they can be deployed. You can't afford for them to get focused early, so finding a good copse of trees or line of walls or the like is very important.

Ruststalkers want to be in large units, but honestly they need to be screened by Ironstriders (of some flavor) so they can get cover saves before getting to charge range. It's quite a point investment, but if you can get them to melee combat they'll be much safer and they can handle nearly anything.

Dragoons really REALLY want to be in big units (3+) and take advantage of either the Cavalier formation (for Outflank) or simply using Scout to set up second-turn charges. They'll take a bit of attention if you go for big units, but you only need a few to get there to do serious damage. Solo Dragoons are doomed to failure, and honestly the Jezzail is a trap; if you want shooty walkers, Ballistarii are 10 points more and can do nearly everything better in the shooting phase (though the Jezzail does look really cool).

As for squadding Onagers, I think the only time you would want to do this is if you're going for Heavy Phosphor. These weapons need the torrent of fire to do their damage, as a full squadron setup (with obligatory pintle cognis heavy stubbers) can easily wipe out MEQ squads in a turn of shooting. They'll also need to get a bit closer, so camping that 4+ invul is a huge help. That said, now that Kastelans are starting to gain some traction (as I expected they would) I think this build of Onager will start to fall by the wayside. Time will tell, of course.

[heron]

I have run my onagers as a pair. 5++ is pretty good and they form the anchor for my central advance. I actually have run them stock with the beamers and paying for stubbers and manipulators with decent success. More often than not they get stuck into combat, so i have preferred to spend the upgrade points on the assault phase, rather than guns.

[Seathal]

Indeed. Vanguard doesn't get dunestrider.

Ruststalkers seem to be excellent counter charge units in my humble oppinion. Get your first line (usually Vanguards) charged (it could work with onagers because they're resiliant enough) and counter-assault with Infiltrators and Sicarians for a messy bloodbath.

I agree with Dragoons just not being worth it individually. Could really work in groups of 2,3 and up to hunt creatures and light tanks and those units who are better tied up with an AV11 walker than your squishy infantry (I'm thinking stuff with power weapons/claws, blood angels and the like).

I'm eager for the Codex Mechanicum to come out and try both Skitarii and Mechanicus at their full potential (I'm thinking Congregation Formation with add-ons).

[marshall Egregorius]

Would you all recommend full squads of 10 on the base troops?

[Marshal Ommadon]

One thing to be careful of (it's burned me once before) is when you Infiltrate your Infiltrators and you are going first.  Be VERY mindful of the Infiltrator's placement/movement in relation to being assaulted on your enemy's turn (you can't assault turn one when going first but your enemy can).

 

Burning that high BS Doctrina going for that Alpha strike (+3BS and -2WS) can devastate your Infiltrators if your opponent manages to charge your Infiltrators on their turn.

 

It hurts bad when they are swinging with WS2. 

[CommodusXIII]

I played two 750-point matches against Khorne Daemonkin over the weekend. My list for both:

• 10 Vanguard, 3x plasma caliver, Alpha with power sword, conversion field, Phosphoenix (Warlord)
• 10 Vanguard, 3x arc rifles, Alpha with power sword, conversion field and arc pistol
• 10 Rangers, 3x transuranic arquebus
• 2 Ironstriders with TL autocannon

We played on my industrial table, which is packed with cover and LOS-blocking terrain. I've played a few 500 point games with a cut-down version of the above, so few of my experiences were surprises:

• Plasma calivers in the Warlord's unit (Preferred Enemy) is a deadly combination. At first, I though that PE would be a waste alongside the Doctrina Imperatives but in fact the two work for a very synergistic effect. I also thought that the calivers were an overexpensive option but again it turned out that they are well-worth the investment. I'd hesitate about taking more, though, as without PE there's a real danger of your Vanguards frying themselves.
• This increases to ridiculous levels if you get the BS4 Overwatch trait. I'm no heretic, but I might consider offering sacrifices to whatever dark god will listen to ensure this result.
• Rad carbines by themselves are excellent. Besides the calivers, most successful shooting phases were the result of massed armor save rolls. This is especially apparent during overwatch.
• Transuranic aquebuses are literally hit-or-miss. In the first game, my Rangers erased a squad of Bikers in the first turn and continued to pick off Champions. In the second game, they kept failing the 4+ to-wound rolls. It's a gamble that pays off well when it works and frustrates the out of you when it doesn't.
• The arc rifles, so far, have been very lackluster as well. I blame my meta for this - there's just not that much armor anymore.
• The Ironstriders were surprisingly fun. I put them in the list just to bulk it out - I had some models around that fit the bill - but they ended up being the MVP. They're decent at shooting, being able to reposition far quicker than the Vanguard or rush to objectives, while still pumping out autocannon shots to whittle down infantry or light vehicles. They're also better than I expected in combat and serve as excellent tarpits, as long as you keep them away from power fists. Their armor value is low enough that Explosion! results are fairly common. In my second game they served as effective suicide bombers.

I was so impressed by the Ironstriders, in fact, that I'm planning on picking up a ton of Sentinels to properly convert into Dragoons and Ballistari. Their kit doesn't appeal to me at all but kitbashed IG walkers will continue the overall theme of my army.

[Jarl of Wulfen]

I've played three 1850 point games so far with this list against friends:

Knight Crusader

10 Skitarii Rangers-3 Transuranic Arquebuses

10 Skitarii Rangers-3 Plasma Calivers

10 Skitarii Rangers-3 Arc Rifles

5 Sicarian Infiltrators-Power Swords, Stubcarbines

5 Sicarian Infiltrators-Taser Goads, Flechette Blasters

2 Ironstrider Ballistarii-Autocannons (squad)

(squad) Onager Dunecrawlers- 2 Neutron Lasers and Cognis Heavy Stubbers, 1 Twin-Linked Heavy Phosphor Blaster, 3 Cognis Heavy Stubbers, 3 smoke launchers

 

Brief recap: vs Tau, Tau only deployed 3 units on the board, I deployed everything. I killed all but one of his models in the first turn. The lone model made a save and a morale check so Tau got a turn 2. Half his reserves came in on 2. Killed some of my stuff, I killed more of his stuff turn 2. Turn 3, the rest of his stuff came in and it was AP 4 missiles to the goggles. Turn 4 saw him wipe more of my stuff out.  At that point we ran out of time.  He most likely would have killed the rest of my army.

 

Vs. Chaos. Chaos deployed, I deployed. He killed nothing his first turn. I killed a forgefiend, rhino, the rhino occupants,immobilized a maulerfiend, a bike squad in the first shoot/assualt phase. He promptly quit in disgust.  This one I feel bad about as my friend just doesn't have luck running chaos marines.

 

Vs. necrons. I threw a lot of shots, he made a ridulous amount of saves/reaminations/reanimation rerolls. By turn 3 a lot of my stuff was dead from weight of fire.  He would have had me tabled if we went a 4th turn.

[Vel'Cona]

But how did your individual units do? That's the intent of this thread, IIRC.

[Jarl of Wulfen]

Oh, hehe, sorry.  I guess I should mention the necron and chaos games were purge and the tau game was the new explorator scenario in the WD.

 

Plasma ranger-  Did pretty good.  Killed some crisis suits vs tau, then blew themselves up.  Vs. necrons, did a lot of damage, he just made amazing saves, managed not to kill themselves.

 

Arquebus rangers- Did a whole lot of nothing.  I would hit my target, then fail to wound....all three games

 

Arc Rangers- stripped hull points from the maulerfiend and the necron ghost ark.  Put wounds on broadsides.

 

Infiltrator squads-Infiltrated them in aall games.  They worked as good distraction units.  Taser squad charged a squad of fire warriors and wiped them out.  The same squad killed the chaos bikers.  The swords never got the chance for melee, were shot to pieces first.

 

Ironstriders-did well, popped the chaos rhino, were mobile enough to grab objectives vs tau and put shot on his crisis suits and riptides.  Pulled a couple hull points from the necron fliers.

 

Onagars-they were actually my best performers.  They killed a lot of the tau until the riptides showed up.  The 4+ invul saved them for a while vs the necron gauss but eventually fell due to weight of fire.  I probably didn't need the smoke launchers on them, oh well.  I think they killed the rhino occupants after I popped it

 

The knight was the shooty knight.  It was killy, except against the necrons.  Damn RP rolls.

[Scurvydog]

I am always careful with onagers in squads, with the crawler rule they can often get into good cover and hull down and wont need it, this also gives a lot more potential targets and general flexibility to them.

 

Why did your plasma rangers blew themselves up? Would plasma not fit better with vanguards and I see no reason in your list to not make the alpha of the plasma squad warlord for preferred enemy to reroll 1's. Going pure skit and bringing 3 calivers in a unit begs to bring a warlord alpha to drastically reduce risk, although rerolling 1's can also be done at least 2 turns with doctrines to get bs 6-7.

 

Ironstriders doing surprisingly well seems to be a theme, might have to buy some myself some day...

 

I think I will have to playtest sicarians more myself to really judge how best to use them, they are really tricky but do have potential and most opponents find them too scary to ignore (with good reason).

[Jarl of Wulfen]

I modeled my guys as rangers because I like the look better than the look of vanguards. For craps and giggles I made the Knight the warlord each time. The blowing themselves up was just unlucky rolling on my part.

[Scurvydog]

I modeled my guys as rangers because I like the look better than the look of vanguards. For craps and giggles I made the Knight the warlord each time. The blowing themselves up was just unlucky rolling on my part.

 

Hmm as far as I know the knight from an oathsworn detachment can't be the warlord, since it can never be the primary detachment, and all alphas from your primary are characters which means one of them must be the warlord.

 

I know what you mean with the ranger look, I did that myself, but just play them as vanguards mostly, they perform better for me, but I guess not enough to loose sleep over if you only play wysiwyg ;)

[Jarl of Wulfen]

Hrm...I'll have to look at the Knight detachment stuff again, I may have been playing it wrong. I was thinking it as 2 detachments, one skit, one Knight. Both being CADs. Oh well. Yeah, I play my armies pretty wysiwyg.

[Vel'Cona]

I felt bad for a while because I built and painted my first Skitarii as Rangers and the consensus is that Vanguard are just better.  I feel less bad now since they're a requirement for the War Convocation.

 

That said, good analysis overall!  I think the Onagers will probably be crowd pleasers for a while with the reasonable cost and high-powered weaponry, especially with the excellence that is Doctrina Imperatives.  I really want to get some Ironstriders now, but I have a battery of CultMech stuff to paint through, first.  As for the Infiltrators, I think they're a solid unit that really needs care in use but can yield stellar results when applied correctly.  In either case, looking forward to more field analysis vs. the new Astartes when they land!

[heron]

I felt bad for a while because I built and painted my first Skitarii as Rangers and the consensus is that Vanguard are just better.  I feel less bad now since they're a requirement for the War Convocation.

 

That said, good analysis overall!  I think the Onagers will probably be crowd pleasers for a while with the reasonable cost and high-powered weaponry, especially with the excellence that is Doctrina Imperatives.  I really want to get some Ironstriders now, but I have a battery of CultMech stuff to paint through, first.  As for the Infiltrators, I think they're a solid unit that really needs care in use but can yield stellar results when applied correctly.  In either case, looking forward to more field analysis vs. the new Astartes when they land!

 

I wouldn't feel too bad about it whether you use the war convocation or not. For one thing, the whole internet love affair with Vanguard seems to be based on a very specific tournament list that pairs them with a bunch of drop pods from a fleshtearers detachment and goes for a huge alpha strike. If you aren't working with that specific style of list or don't want to ally that way, then the rangers are much more solid.

 

In my case, I ally the Skitarii with my Sororitas, and the rangers are a great support unit for the main Sororitas gunline.. they move up the flanks and grab objectives and harass enemy units while the main advance hold the center. In my case the central advance is Battle Sisters on foot and mounted advancing behind a pair of Onagers, with sicarian infiltrators and dragoons nearby for counterchargein and a squad of seraphim and an avenger held in reserve.

 

I cou;d also see rangers being a great background support unit for a Imperial Knights army

[Terminus]

I'm inclined to agree with the majority of this consensus. A few sticking points:

Dragoons really REALLY want to be in big units (3+) and take advantage of either the Cavalier formation (for Outflank) or simply using Scout to set up second-turn charges. They'll take a bit of attention if you go for big units, but you only need a few to get there to do serious damage. Solo Dragoons are doomed to failure, and honestly the Jezzail is a trap; if you want shooty walkers, Ballistarii are 10 points more and can do nearly everything better in the shooting phase (though the Jezzail does look really cool).

As for squadding Onagers, I think the only time you would want to do this is if you're going for Heavy Phosphor. These weapons need the torrent of fire to do their damage, as a full squadron setup (with obligatory pintle cognis heavy stubbers) can easily wipe out MEQ squads in a turn of shooting. They'll also need to get a bit closer, so camping that 4+ invul is a huge help. That said, now that Kastelans are starting to gain some traction (as I expected they would) I think this build of Onager will start to fall by the wayside. Time will tell, of course.

Regarding the Jessails, I really wish they were available to Vanguard/Skitarii, and the Dragoons could take the Arquebus. It would probably still suck like all non-Vindicare sniper rifles, but the re-roll to wound from the Cavalier formation may be more useful. I tried to make the Jessail unit work, and they did have one lucky game where I scored 3 precise shots against a Tibby+Centurion unit, and he promptly made all his LOS rolls.

I have six, I'll probably make 4 Dragoons and 2 Balistarii, so I can run the formation when needed.

I modeled my guys as rangers because I like the look better than the look of vanguards. For craps and giggles I made the Knight the warlord each time. The blowing themselves up was just unlucky rolling on my part.

Hmm as far as I know the knight from an oathsworn detachment can't be the warlord, since it can never be the primary detachment, and all alphas from your primary are characters which means one of them must be the warlord.

I know what you mean with the ranger look, I did that myself, but just play them as vanguards mostly, they perform better for me, but I guess not enough to loose sleep over if you only play wysiwyg

The base gun on the Rangers is very good if you don't have a way to immediately get in their face with Vanguard. Regarding the look, nothing says your Vanguard have to have the silly helmets, does it? What if they decide to put their hoods on? The only part that should matter is the weapons. I have three boxes, and I'm tempted to assemble all of them with hoods on.

[Vel'Cona]

You guys make good points on the Rangers; I guess I'm as susceptible to Internet hype as anyone else. More than likely they'll remain my compulsory of choice alongside Plasma Vanguard since I'm not planning on running Skitarii heavy in my general lists. That said, I don't think I'll go beyond the single unit of Rangers for further Skitarii units, simply because I need to save the points for CultMech/IK toys.

[CommodusXIII]

Hrm...I'll have to look at the Knight detachment stuff again, I may have been playing it wrong. I was thinking it as 2 detachments, one skit, one Knight. Both being CADs. Oh well. Yeah, I play my armies pretty wysiwyg.

 

I'm afraid that doesn't work for either - Skitarii don't have an HQ option, so you can never take them as a CAD.  The Skitarii Maniple Detachment is pretty close, though, exchanging ObSec for PE on your Warlord and Scout and Crusader army-wide.

[Jarl of Wulfen]

Yeah, I meant the Skitarii maniple detachment and a knight detachment.  Calling it CAD was wrong on my part.