BNG1991 Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 I always wonder what happened if the Orks managed to dominate the galaxy. At least, endless WAAAGH! without too much interference of Warp denizens would be the answer. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4246243 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarKnight Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 I always wonder what happened if the Orks managed to dominate the galaxy. At least, endless WAAAGH! without too much interference of Warp denizens would be the answer. As the dominant psychic lifeform, I guess Chaos starts making them promises too *shrugs* Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4247649 Share on other sites More sharing options...
helterskelter Posted December 9, 2015 Share Posted December 9, 2015 Random question. Given that we know sigismund basically waited 1000 years to have a pop at abaddon, are there any fists in the novel that have been alive long enough to have known him/fought beside him/seen him in combat. Just a random thought that I might hope be squeezed in somewhere Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4247654 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sulemain Posted December 12, 2015 Share Posted December 12, 2015 yeah fair enough, hell for a second I was like WUUUUUUUUUUUUT and then the next sentence came and I was like even more WUUUUUUUUT then I reread the whole thing It makes sense though. Kaiser/Tsar come from Caesar; a name became a title. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4249950 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDF Posted December 12, 2015 Share Posted December 12, 2015 Random question. Given that we know sigismund basically waited 1000 years to have a pop at abaddon, are there any fists in the novel that have been alive long enough to have known him/fought beside him/seen him in combat. Just a random thought that I might hope be squeezed in somewhereNope. It's not explicitly denied but there's no indication at all that any Imperial Fist had memories of the Crusade/Heresy/Scouring era. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4250376 Share on other sites More sharing options...
helterskelter Posted December 12, 2015 Share Posted December 12, 2015 Ah shame, given this is 1500 years later, I assumed at least one fist may have been in the region of 550 years old. I may buy into this given how slow the heresy has gotten Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4250505 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reldn Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Sooo...Let me guess from what I've been reading on here: The Fists get completely walked over again? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4251131 Share on other sites More sharing options...
HamsterExAstris Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Sooo...Let me guess from what I've been reading on here: The Fists get completely walked over again? That's perhaps understating things a bit. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4251317 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reldn Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 EDIT: Sorry, bad night I guess. Just tired of seeing my favourite legion/chapter constantly getting kicked around like they were nothing. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4251420 Share on other sites More sharing options...
HaSY Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Actually, this story makes me enjoy Imperial Fists more, given the fact that we have yet to have IF-focused Heresy novel so far.They are professional and flawed to a fault. The fluff for this Chapter has always been stubborn defence and come back from the ashes consistently. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4251475 Share on other sites More sharing options...
veterannoob Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Understood, we all nave bad days. But as a IF fan your boys in Yellow are getting quite the attention this series but are not the only legions, we, chapters. The Orks get real and murder Terra in the face but we have 11 books to go, one called the Search for Vulkan, plus cover art, I think it's safe to say they'll have some help defending Terra.it really is worth the read buy if you are in no hurry maybe read novels 1&2 in January so the story continues. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4251609 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karthak Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Well, anyone trying to claim that the Fists aren't Black Library's whipping boys won't stand a chance now... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4251954 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDF Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Admittedly though, it's not as if any other Chapter would have fared better. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4252055 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reldn Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Admittedly though, it's not as if any other Chapter would have fared better. While very true, it'd just be nice if for once it was any other chapter getting treated like a speedbump and not the Imperial Fists. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4252157 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jareddm Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Would it have been better if it had been a completely new chapter that was created simply to be destroyed? Like what happened with the Obsidian Glaives, the Crimson Castellans, the Crimson Consuls, the Warhawks, and the Venerators? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4252195 Share on other sites More sharing options...
caladancid Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 It seems to me like it HAD to be the Imperial Fists who got destroyed. They had to be removed from Terra somehow for the plot to make any sense if Vangorich is able to kill the rest of the High Lords. It also shows the power of the High Lords to just order a FF chapter off the walls of Terra and into a random battle. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4252208 Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDF Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Would it have been better if it had been a completely new chapter that was created simply to be destroyed? Like what happened with the Obsidian Glaives, the Crimson Castellans, the Crimson Consuls, the Warhawks, and the Venerators?I think in this instance using the Fists makes sense. It strips Terra of her most high profile defenders and establishes the huge danger the Imperium is in. The problem is that Fists have been used as the "people who get massacred to prove how bad the enemy is" for a long time. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4252213 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sete Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 Its that old worf effect again. Ill wait for a day when I see the same happening Ultras or SW. Calgar held a gate alone for 9 days vs a waaagh, sicarius defeated thousands of orks with sticks. Even the nids only managed to maul ultras 1st company. Wolves even against a daemon primarch seem to escape pretty unscathed, still going to war with the GK and Inq. IF? They dont last half the book. Blatant favouritism. The book was pretty poor. Same old thing. I was expecting something better. Rant over. Disclaimer: my desciptions of other chapters "achivements" might not be correct but you see the point. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4254096 Share on other sites More sharing options...
augustmanifesto Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 Its that old worf effect again. Ill wait for a day when I see the same happening Ultras or SW. Calgar held a gate alone for 9 days vs a waaagh, sicarius defeated thousands of orks with sticks. Even the nids only managed to maul ultras 1st company. Wolves even against a daemon primarch seem to escape pretty unscathed, still going to war with the GK and Inq. IF? They dont last half the book. Blatant favouritism. The book was pretty poor. Same old thing. I was expecting something better. Rant over. Disclaimer: my desciptions of other chapters "achivements" might not be correct but you see the point. I think think goes to the heart of the character and theme of the Imperial Fists. Yes, they suffer grievous losses, but this is broadly consistent with their stubbornness and predilection for self-sacrifice[1]. But, by the same token, they have their share of glories -- perhaps the most of any loyalist Chapter given that as of the Horus Heresy, they were the second most decorated legion next to the Luna Wolves. More to the point, by virtue of their grievous losses, the Chapter demonstrates time and time again it's relentless nature by rebuilding under conditions that would permanently destroy any other Chapter. And that's a characteristic that no other Chapter can match -- and allows them to make sacrifices no other Chapter can follow. Besides, the Imperial Fists have gotten plenty of bad-ass attention. Sigismund is undefeated. in the Black Templar he just straight up owned Khârn while barely trying. Lysander made the Tyranids give up after escaping from an Iron Warriors prison world with his bare hands. Etc. In any case, the greatest glory of the Imperial Fists has yet to be written about, namely the Siege of Terra. If this is done with proper respect for the Legion, I think it would more than equalize whatever poor treatment one can perceive from the Black Library. [1] Broadly, being stubborn results in taking losses. In the actual narratives made, sometimes the particulars don't connect up this way. So, for example, in Beast Arises, it doesn't seem that the Chapter's "stubbornness" is really a contributing factor to their demise at all -- it's just that they get trapped on a planet surrounded by millions of enemy-things. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4254127 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reldn Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 Aye, I'll grant that they may have their share of glories under their belts, but, perhaps we could actually hear about those for once instead of: "The Fists get crushed, AGAIN!". I understand that they're stubborn as anything, but, that shouldn't mean that they're stupid and ineffectual either. Also, on the flip side of what you said regarding Sigismund and Lysander? It seems more that with the way a lot of things have been going, an Imperial Fist is only a badass if he's named Sigismund or Lysander. Aside from those two? They're just red-shirts painted yellow. Sad to say for me, I should be really excited for the Siege of Terra, but, I doubt they get any respect there either. All the glory will go to the Blood Angels and White Scars, leaving the Fists to get slaughtered early on and basically do nothing except die in droves. I honestly hope that I'm wrong on that one. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4254249 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sete Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 I can already see Khârn slaughtering half IF legion... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4254252 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Half Goat Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 I must say I wasn't very impressed with I Am Slaughter. It didn't really feel like Dans heart was in it, lacking a lot of the expertly tuned detail and concepts found in the rest of the 'Daniverse'.It was poor bolter porn with little fleshing of the IF although I did like the wall names. Don't get me wrong the parts that followed the high Lords were very abnett and worked well with his talent for political intrigue and I looked forward to these parts, but the rest was just a bit underwhelming which is disheartening as I've never felt this way with a book by abnett before. Perhaps there was just too much to fit in to get the series started that certain things couldn't be explored. I'll continue to snap up anything by him, but won't be coming back to this one. Let's hope book 2 is better Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4254342 Share on other sites More sharing options...
b1soul Posted December 17, 2015 Share Posted December 17, 2015 I think it being only 200+ pages has something to do with it. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4254725 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bulwyf Posted December 18, 2015 Share Posted December 18, 2015 So after reading this a week ago, I just have to ask: how the heck are there any IF left to continue the Chapter? I know they have geneseed stored somewhere but it seems unfathomable to me that an entire Chapter is basically wiped out and just replaced en mass with new geneseed replacements. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4255460 Share on other sites More sharing options...
God-Potato of Mankind Posted December 18, 2015 Share Posted December 18, 2015 I'd imagine an un-mentioned detachment remained on Terra, as a contigency to the total loss of the Chapter's fighting forces. The Phalanx may always have a detachment, though why they'd not take this with them seems strange as I'm sure they'd sacrifice it in a heartbeat to save Terra. Or mayhap the successors band together to reform them, as a tribute. They seem to be close knit with their successors. Perhaps that is why the 40k fists are so different to the 31k Fists, they get reformed every few thousand years by senior officers of successors, who bring their own temperament and style to the fists? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/314634-the-beast-arises/page/6/#findComment-4255575 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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